tommyt

@Graham Hickey wrote:

Is there any example of this kind of development, the conversion/removal of housing estates, elsewhere – in the UK or Europe?
Surely something along these lines has been attempted somewhere to offer us some indication as to how this problem may be dealt with.

happening in the Netherlands at the moment in areas within 10 mins of a train station, but it is apts replacing already high density duplex developments. I can definitely see the day coming though when the semi-D is an exotic species. The english are very focused on developing what they call ‘marginal open space’ in urban areas and god knows there’s a lots of that in Dublin.

@asdasd wrote:

I cleary said “racist or zenophobic” as a way to curtail debate on the issue.

Another way to curtail debate on the issue is to be “funny”, and to not deal with the issue at hand, but to see gristle of meat on you plate. HaHa.

There is hardly any doubt that immigration benefits the elites of Irish society ( the Capitalist classes and Dublin 4, for instance) at the benefit of the poor. That is why the Boss classes and their representatives in IBEC are in favour, as are the organs of elite opinion – the Irish Times and the indo, and third level institutionsm and even the Unions who represent State workers ( whose jobsa re not at risk) . And you, of course. Please disclose your class background, by the way. I am from the inner city, although my parents were lower middle class, my extened family is working class.

It is quite easy to do a thought experiment on this. Lets say that 300,000 people come to Dublin next year ( this is a thought experiment. I agree it is unlikely to happen at that level )

who benefits?

1) Capitalists can employ more labour cheaper. Supply and Demand.They already admit this happens, a recent IBEC whinge was that they could not employ Irish people at the rates they emply foreigners. Part time female workers in the Inner city are getting screwed as it is.So wages fall as labour supply increases. Economics 101.
2) Housing prices goes through the roof as demand for beds accelerate. Rent too. Supply and demand again. This advances the class interests of the rich, property owning Middle class, rentier classes, and speculators. It is not the only reason why prices go up, but is a major factor. Immigration works against the interests of everyone hoping to buy a home, and is a major reason prices are now rising – since we are building plenty of houses.
3) Beyond that everyone who drives to work, or who takes public transport suffers,as the resources ( roads and rail) remain static and the demand increases.

Feel free to answer that argument rationally.

You may also want to ponder why you expect working class communities to work in your class interests, it is in their class interests to have controlled immigration (and I certainly do not support none), and your class interests to have unlimited migration, since whatever class you belong too probably has barriers to entry not available to the under skilled working class ( and if your answer here is that you do not believe in unlimited migration then name the figure you are happy with, and the issue between us is one of numbers.)

The present rise in Dublin city houses prices is 10% a year. Houses are built at the rate of 80,000 a year, yet that does not meet demand. Immigration must be a factor.

The price increase means anyone with more than 300K in equity ( and there are people with far more than that ) sees a net worth gain greater than the average industrial wage, and, of course, no one on that wage, and more, can expect to buy a house. That screws half the population, and more.

If we are to have mass migration, then we should immediately impose a massive property tax on people with 400K, or more, equity in their houses, to fund the resources needed to rezone land, and to fund public transport.

Now tell me why you think the elites are not the main beneficiaries of mass immigration, looking at gristle on your plate will not do.

(And while we are at it, name a property speculator opposed to mass immigration)

take your national socialist viewpoints off to stormfront.org herr asdasd. Equating class politics with immigrant phobia will get a much better reception there. :rolleyes:

Can’t help but think it was just a stick to beat ABP with.Now it has done that job and the bord are kow-towed there is no reason for it to exist.

Can’t argue with any of those points.Potential objectors take note! that’s enough points to get the development turned down as it stands imho.

it’s a clever fudge on the part of TCD.They get rightful stick for killing Pearse st so any naysayers to the development are on a sticky wicket .Ultimately I reckon the corpo will turn it down cuz they won’t want to set a precedent after years of trying to get conservation taken seriously. The knee jerk An Taisce response is getting tiring at this stage,It’s unfortunate there isn’t some kind of provision for a conservation expert to adjudicate on this one

that exchq st./drury st route would cost at least €100m in c.p.o.’s and thats never gonna wash with the RPA.Yeah eircom own that whole block(including the shops on that section of exchq st and the offices above) and it is huge, you can get a good look at it from the eircom (not the public) car park entrance beside Andrew’s lane theatre.Have often wondered what eircom plan to do with the site….The Pearse st. idea is a good one,TCD and the corpo have been running that neighbourhood down for years

Originally posted by kefu
Not when you have to go out during the day on jobs, usually down the country. Only takes twenty minutes because I work slightly off-peak hours.

ah fair enough,I’d say you’re praying a congestion charge isn’t introduced any time soon though!

Originally posted by burge_eye
I think I remember one of the news articles saying that he did use an architect but I’ve never seen them mentioned.

Quite a disparaging piece on this in yesterdays sunday indo

well written article in the tribune also on sunday about the “petulant posturer”, as the journo in question put it. Is he being shafted? no, but he is being treated according to proper planning procedure,something that rarely happens in rural Ireland. However I should imagine he would be a schoo-in for retention so hiring two senior counsel, a BL and a firm of solicitors makes him look even more like the bully he comes across as in the media.He is the very vision of the unequal society he holds in such intellectual regard. I would not be suprised if he was assassinated by some nutter ala Pim Fortyn in the Netherlands…

it’s probably come up here before but I’m new to this board .I reckon a major part of the unattractiveness of College green/st. & westmoreland st. is the ugly trees that obscure the neo- classical elevations, considering the hullabaloo over the O’Connel st. trees (glad to see them go)wil they ever be got rid of and return the area to its original hard landscaped styling?.whoever got the impression that Dick Gleeson forsees the area pedestianised from his interview in Ron Black’s I thought he was suggesting it couldn’t be done myself from what he said…