Gianlorenzo

@Praxiteles wrote:

Well, well, I think the the bold bishop has scored an own goal here. Sending presss releases around just before Christmas is a tricky business and he dpes not seem to have the hang of it. Here we have a clear example of the bold bishop serving up and own goal. He tell us that the Pope wishes him to preserve the interior of the Cobh Cathedral and at the same time he is ttrying to tell us that the present interior does not meet “liturgical requirements”. But, the forgetful bishop has forgotten the letter published in the Carow Nationalist from the Joseph Ratzinger from which we can see quite clearly that the nonsense push forward by the bold bishop is nowhere required by the Second Vatican Council nor by the current liturgical legislation of the Church. Just what do you need that get that point into a thick head? I agree with Sam! He seems to have been given a fairly sharp instruction to leave St. Colman’s as it is: This is what to-day’s Irish Independent has to say and the FOSCC are bound to have a glory day on this one:

Papal call to preserve cathedral

‘Beautiful’ building should be protected, Benedict tells local bishop

THE Pope has urged the preservation of an Irish cathedral that has been at the centre of a bitter planning wrangle for almost a decade.

The Bishop of Cloyne, Dr John Magee, revealed Pope Benedict’s plea that St Colman’s Cathedral in Cobh, Co Cork would be preserved as he dismissed suggestions that there would be any attempt to force through controversial changes to the church’s interior.

Last summer, An Bord Pleanala rejected plans for a ‘re-ordering’ of the interior of the cathedral, which is one of Ireland’s most famous neo-Gothic structures.

The board warned that the changes could jeopardise the entire ethos of the 19th century building.

Dr Magee has now said that the current situation “needs to be resolved” – and that the Pope told him, in a private audience earlier this year, that he too wants to see the beauty of St Colman’s preserved. “(The Pope said) it is a beautiful cathedral and I have not seen its interior but I can only imagine that it is beautiful.

“I encourage you to do what you can to preserve the beauty of that cathedral for the generations to come,” Dr Magee said.

The bishop insisted that while he would like to see the refurbishment of St Colman’s completed with the interior re-ordering, any works will be conducted in consultation with the planning board.

Earlier this year, the diocese ruled out a judicial challenge to the planning board’s decision which was taken by a six-to-two majority – and came after An Bord Plealala rejected the recommendation of their own inspector.

Following a two-day oral hearing in Midleton last March, he ruled that the board did not have the right to reject the changes to the cathedral on the basis it would be an interference with liturgical matters.

However, the board rejected that recommendation – insisting that they did have the right to rule on the interior changes to St Colman’s.

The changes were rejected as unduly interfering with the character and historical significance of the cathedral.

St Colman’s – which boasts breathtaking views over Cork harbour -is regarded by many as a masterpiece by the Victorian architect, AW Pugin.

The interior redesign proposed removing a number of the cathedral’s front aisles, lifting floor mosaics and extending the altar. The existing rails would be removed and the Bishop’s Chair would be located forward, towards the congregation.

Dr Magee, and the Diocese of Cloyne insisted the changes would not alter the ethos of the cathedral but, rather, would bring it into line with Vatican II guidelines.

Critics, however, claim that the proposed changes threatened the very fabric of the cathedral – and local opponents warned that, if the changes went ahead despite opposition, the diocese could face a boycott.

Ralph Riegel

While I am delighted with the tone of this article I have to say I find it astounding that journalist are so ignorant. They seen to write off the top of their heads without checking anything.
“masterpiece of AW Pugin” – is he confusing Cobh with Killarney? (E.W. Pugin and G. Ashlin were the architects in Cobh.)
“removing a number of the cathedrals front aisles” ??????
What the hell does that mean?
I could go on but no matter.
As I say the tone was in the right vein, so why quibble.

A thorough profession cleaning, much as it might be needed, is not going to happen in the short term.
What I was speaking about was a dusting down and cleaning of the Baptistry and Mortuary Chapels (which do not seem to be included in the regular cleaning rota) for Christmas, i.e. getting rid of some of the junk.
We have done similar work in the other chapels in the Cathedral over the years. The administrator has no problems with us undertaking this work.
The only reason I mentioned it at all is that I was somewhat taken aback with the reaction I got from some of the most supportive and loyal members of the congregation when we asked for help in this undertaking.
It really is a minor point, but disheartening in that even though there is great support for the campaign to preserve the Cathedral, that doesn’t necessarily translate in willingness to do anything positive.

@samuel j wrote:

I don’t agree, for more years than i wish to remember, the weekly collections are gathered and correct me if i’m wrong, were well supported or at least until the congregation learned of the non listening bishops intentions.

If the bishop is up to his arse in debt due to his grandiose schemes and now has little will or funds left for maintenance, cleaning and lighting… you cannot blame the people of Cobh.

do you now want people to pay or have paid willingly to the upkeep of the church and now by way of no harm clean it themselves too…… no it is not the prients job, but it is his job to manage it and administer publically donated funds correctly.

Don’t come blaming the people of Cobh, blame the management. If they can’t manage move on…piss or get off the pot……

No argument. The people of Cobh have been outstanding in their moral and financial support for the campaign against the re-ordering.
My point was that when it comes to the simple things like tidying up the Cathedral and taking the initiative re. cleaning etc. then it is hard to find volunteers.
The problem is that the Steering Committee took a decision in 2001 to defer any further payments for restoration/maintenance until the ‘great’ re-ordering was in progress (they were so sure that they would win the day). And now we have a buiding in desperate need of major repair.
My quibble was with the small minded attitude as reiterated above which says that it is always someone elses job.
There are things that those who care can undertake in the Cathedral without recourse to architects; planners;
conservations experts; etc.
I love St. Colman’s and I will be cleaning it and getting rid of the extraneous debrit before Christmas.

He can hardly be worse than the last incumbent.

Ciao BELLO 😀

@Praxiteles wrote:

The other significant problem with St. Colman’s Catheral, Cobh, Co. Cork, is the internal mosaic work. When the timber floor was recently replaced in the nave, no proper edging was installed to protect the edges of the mosaic on the walkways. The result of this has been an alarming decay of the mosaics, especially their edges which are constantly chipped by bences which have been place on to of the mosaic edges. Professor Cathal O’Neill proposed resolving the mosaic problem by ripping out about 50% of it -after which the remaining 50% would not be that noticeable.

What you are looking at on the floor are not the original mosaic tiles. The dark brown/red tiles which framed the original wooden floor in the Cathedral were lifted at the time of the installation of the underfloor heating. The original floor was a wood block floor made of oak, I think. This was claimed by the builder, who mounted a guard on it until he could take it away – it now graces some pubs in Kerry I think. A new floor of much inferior quality was then laid.

The original framing tiles were also thrown out. New tiles were laid and it is these which are now lifting all over the Cathedral.

This vandalism was carried out before the 2000 Planning Act and therefore no permission was needed. Unfortunately nothing will be done about the floor now as I would think that the cost of replacing the wood block floor with a modern equivalent would be prohibitive and this would be well down on the list of what needs to be done.

Regarding the mosaic on the floor, there must be experts somewhere you can lay mosaic flooring that will stay in place. They managed it all over the world for thousands of years.

Re. Scull – Whatever about the exterior, the interior is an unbalanced mess.:eek:

Do you know who is responsible for this travesty?

“At the AGM of the St. Colman’s Cathedral Restoration Project Steering Committee held on 24th October 2001, a decision was taken not to proceed with any further cleaning and restoration of the interior [of the Cathedral] until a budget cost for the re-ordering was available to it for the re-ordering and any other outstanding works” – Chairman’s Report for St. Colman’s Roman Catholic Trust Ltd. 31st December 2001

To the best of my knowledge this decision still stands and the results can be seen in St. Colman’s today. The exterior doors are in a disgraceful condition; mosaic tiles are lifting all over the nave; two marble pillers are missing from the Baptistry rails; and much more. It is now six months since An Bord Pleanala rejected the plans for the re-ordering and still nothing has happened. Will they wait another five years in case the Trustees manage to get another plan accepted before they will consider spending money on the upkeep and restoration of the Cathedral? Money that was donated in good faith by the people of Cobh and Cloyne Diocese for just that purpose.

@samuel j wrote:

Whats the term so often used in Dail Eireann…”disingenuous”

By any chance were you able to earwig any snippets of what the New plan might entail….

There is no information as yet about any plans or who drew them up. The local council knows nothing about ‘new plans’ or ‘meetings’ – it is all very odd. Likewise the Heritage office of Cork Co. Council.

Great photos, Paul, Thanks.
G.