Rhabanus

@ake wrote:

Dropped into St.Nicolas, CARRICK ON Suir today. Once upon a time it looked like this

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later it regressed to this

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This year it was repainted again. What colour? You guessed it.

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Look at the north side altar; and what’s behind the screen!;

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Really beyond a joke at this stage. And look at the south altar;

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what are those benches doing there?! Benches go in the nave and aisles for people to sit on them! They don’t go in the sanctuary! How can they do this? It’s like someone with absolutely zero knowledge of what a church is or what goes on in it and which different parts are for what different things, is put in charge of arranging the furniture inside, and then just goes about placing different things in this spot and that spot, wherever it seems to look pleasant!

ake, Thanks for exposing the latest abominations! This exhibit is perhaps the most damning of all the atrocities posted on this thread. (And no sanctimonious finger-wagging here, if you please johnglas, about how this thread is dedicated to architecture and we must bray on about the higher things and that this particular thread is too negative. Enough, already!) TWO Bernadettes in the Lourdes grotto!!! Add five more and we can have Snow White and the Seven Dwarves. “Heigh-ho, heigh-ho, it’s off our nut we’ll go!”

Note the shepherd who strayed from the manger scene (from the Sacred Heart storage space in Cobh Cathedral??) now making eyes at that cow? The prostrate sheep in the foreground looks utterly depressed – who wouldn’t in that menage? Don’t you think a few live chickens and a rooster would liven things up in the grotto garden?

The string attaching this monstrous screen to the toe of the marble Infant Christ is the most disgusting of all the sacrileges in St Nicholas, Carrick on Suir. Where is the episkopos (Greek) episcopus (Latin) “overseer” or “supervisor”? Even a dean could conduct a public dismantling of this shocking display.

Who in his right mind could oversee or even allow the construction of such an abomination? This does no credit to anyone even remotely associated with the promotion of religion.

@Praxiteles wrote:

Just take a look at what the pussy-cat has just dragged in:

TKB-Southgate Associates work on historic Neo-Gothic Cathedral, Cork

St. Coleman’s Cathedral, Cobh, Cork is a landmark neo-gothic building in the early French Decorated Gothic style overlooking Cork harbour. Described as the most ambitious and costly ecclesiastical building of the Victorian era. Began in 1868 it was the work of E.W. Pugin, G. Ashilin and T. Coleman and was not completed until 1915. It is the Roman Catholic Cathedral for the Diocese of Cloyne. TKB Southgate Associates are involved in the conservation of the building from mosaic restoration to addressing falling damp issues.

The “falling damp issues, as are they are sweetly called, refer to the collapse of part of the south arcade last Christmas eve – an incident denied by the “patients” populating the Cloyne diocesan Zauberberg.

However, netting has now been installed on the south arcade as a safety precaution, we are told.

It appears that TKB Southgarte Associates will be dealing with disintegrating mosaic work, the delapidated doors, and what is described as works to the Cathedral doors. I seem to recall having mentioned much of this at least two years ago and note the absence of any mention of an intention to address the deplorable state of the Cathedral baptistery.

I hope TKB South Gate Associates realize that they are in for a rough ride unless the FOSCC is satisfied that what they propose to do is up to best conservation satndards. Otherwise, we will be looking forward to Midleton II.

Hope there’s enough netting to cover all the “patients” in the Zauberberg. This has the makings of a good Father Brown detective novel ala Chesterton.

As for the double-edged sword of conservation and planning new development, Rhabanus is reserving judgement. In the words of Laocoon (via Vergil): Quidquid id est timeo Danaos – et dona ferentis!

Thanks, ake, for the photos of Thomastown, Kilkenny.
Too bad about the conversion of the venerable old font into a jardiniere before the garishly painted Sacred Heart.
Does anyone know what happened to the silver crowns that once adorned the Madonna and Child?
How odd that the carved wooden statue of the Blessed Virgin stands off to the side, while the gaudy statue of the Sacred Heart dominates the Greenhouse.
All those electric cords constitute a safety hazard.
Was that side chapel once decorated by stencilling? Must have been a pleasant space before its redevelopment as a botanical garden.

@ake wrote:

Here’s a look at the parish church in Thomastown, Kilkenny

It’s interior has many of the features you’ll find the Puginesque churches of the South East; but here rather than granite columns we’re treated to beautiful Kilkenny Marble piers;

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The North side chapel/parish arboretum has two interesting features;

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First this;

“All the post-Reformation chapels down to 1867 stood within Thomastown chapel graveyard. The venerable old chapel of the penal times was taken down about 1770 after the late parish chapel, in use until 1867 had been built over and around it. A prominent place in both these chapels was held by beautifully carved oak statue of the virgin and child, said to have been brought from Spain by Patrick Lincoln a wine merchant of Thomastown who died in 1666. Mr Lincoln’s widow Mrs Mary Lincoln otherwise Dobbin who died in 1709 presented the statue with crowns of silver in 1705… The statue has always held a place of prominence in the churches since 1705.”

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And then this; what looks to be an old font, rehabilitated for use as an indoor garden water feature.

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Here’s the altar with a good plaster reredos.

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And some lovely glass

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Large version; http://www.flickr.com/photos/58086761@N00/2442210149/sizes/l/in/photostream/

Looks like every window has protective glazing

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@Praxiteles wrote:

That pink colour is most unfortunate.

Would one be correct in saying that the windows are by Watsons of Youghal and date from the 1950s/1960s?

Unfortunate, too, is the style of the light fixtures or globes. Domestic rather than ecclesiastical.

Note the statue standing forlornly on the table beneath the sanctuary lamp, just outside the sanctuary. Is it the Immaculata?

What are the green squares on the wall of the Epistle side of the sanctuary?

What might have been in the three arches above the window in the south transept?

Any photos of the church “in younger and happier days”? Ireland was particularly good about recording the glory of her churches.

Milan boasts the largest Gothic cathedral in the world. One of its more unusual attractions, aside from its impressive Gothic facade, is the Nivola, a mechanical cloud in which the archbishop or another prelate ascends to heaven in order to bring down to earth the relic of the Holy Nail now ensconced in a cruciform reliquary.

These links explain the tradition of the Nivola and give the viewer an excellent picture of what the machine is, how it functions, and what the cathedral looks like from the Nivola.

Should the FOSCC order one for St Colman’s, Cobh – to be installed in the south transept once the roof of the south aisle ever gets repaired? A collection ought to be taken up in order to send a Nivola to Bogota – that theatre by Bonillo certainly could stand a Deus ex machina.

http://events.skyteam.com/sisp/skyteam/?fx=event&event_id=29881

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tltSKwNUjYc&feature=user

Rhabanus wishes all prelates a safe and happy landing in the Nivola.

@Praxiteles wrote:

And another by the same architect at La Calera, Bogota, Colombia

http://cubeme.com/blog/2008/01/02/chapel-of-porciuncula-de-la-milagrosa-in-la-calera-bogota-colombia-by-daniel-bonilla-architects/

http://www.archphoto.it/images/bonilla/bonillach.htm

It looks as though our friend Bonilla studied in DUblin!

http://www.archphoto.it/images/bonilla/bonilla.htm

Hope they use plenty of incense in Bogota, because they’ll need it to keep away the insects. Rhabanus is aware of the uses of incense as a demonifuge as well as a purificatory agent. One supposes, or at least hopes, that it may have a similar effect on “those pesky little devils.”

Note the title of the second church: Portiuncula – a “little portion” named after the humble rural chapel of St Mary of the Angels which served as the headquarters of St Francis of Assisi in the valley below the town. Built sometime in the tenth or eleventh century, the church belonged originally to the Benedictines, but after it fell into disuse in the twelfth century, St Francis restored it in 1207 and acquired it in 1210 from the monks for the foundation of his order of friars. It was in this chapel that his vocation was confirmed, that the Order of Friars Minor was established, and where St Clare took the veil from the hands of St Francis himself. Francis died in a tiny cell adjacent to the chapel.

That little chapel is now surrounded by a much bigger church built in the sixteenth century (1569-1578) in the style then favoured in Renaissance Italy. Since 1270 the “Portiuncula” was granted special privileges by the Holy See, most particularly the “Pardon of Assisi” or “Portiuncula Indulgence”, a full remission of temporal punishment due to sin, which may be obtained annually (under the usual conditions of sacramental confession and Communion, prayers for the intentions of the Holy Father, and detachment from all sin – even venial sin) by the faithful who visit the Portiuncula chapel from noon on1 August until Compline on 2 August.

In 1622, Pope Gregory XV extended the indulgence or pardon to all Franciscan churches. It now extends to all parish churches on 2 August.

Could the reason the walls of Bonilla’s church open up on a field be to accommodate the countless pilgrims who throng to the church seeking the Portiuncula Indulgence in the early August heat? Or does he, like good St Francis himself, like to have the animals close about him?

Bonillo’s models seem to be theatres rather than Dublin churches. Was Praxiteles referring by any chance to the Abbey Theatre in Dublin? More like the Barbican in London.

@Praxiteles wrote:

Apparently, the series of cardboard columns is supposed to be an assonanance of St. Peter’s Square in Rome.

Apparently so are the chairs.

Likewise, the works of art hanging on the columns are a nod to the Vatican museum.

Gee, it’s just like being in Rome!! Why would Japanese Christians bother making a pilgrimage to St Peter’s-in- the-Vatican, when they have it all in this church? Just add one pope and a seventh candlestick and you’re off to the races!

@Praxiteles wrote:

Some more views of that church by Alvao Siza:

http://www.arcspace.com/architects/siza/Santa_Maria_Church/

“Siza’s signature is on every detail.”

That’s clear! But this is only a poor man’s Le Corbousier.

Did you ever read more trite cliches? Fatuous mewlings about signifying the divine by light. Read St Augustine; study a Cistercian monsastic church from the twelfth century; look at a rose window.

So what’s new here?

The tiles in the “baptistery” (stretching to the ceiling – ooohhh!!!) give the impression of a French Vespasien.

The elongated doors at the entrance fulfill the Lord’s description of the narrow gate. But what kind of proportion here? The camel easily gets through.

Where is the human scale? Is God the great Dollhouse-Maker in the Sky? A celestial Giapetto?

And who gets to play Pinocchio strutting and fretting on the stage of this pathetic pastiche of a Marionette-Theater-of-the-Absurd?

At least Stroik’s historicist confections refer to a transcendent Deity, not to the Friendly Giant of CBC fame! Rememebr him in Vancouver, helloinsane? And even good ol’ Friendly had better taste — A Gothic Castle! Oh, I think I hear Rusty the Rooster and Jerome the Giraffe… Let’s pull up the baptismal font for two more to curl up in! And for those of you who like to rock, here’s a rocking chair!!

Back to the drawing board … before the draw-bridge closes – on the twentieth-century imagination.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF8V9g61n9s

@Praxiteles wrote:

Lawyer!

Here is an example of the use of the seventh candle to denote jurisdiction. It is from the Papal Mass of Wednesday April 2, 2008 on the third aanivesary of Pope John Paul II’s death.

Note the candle immediately behind the crucifix. This is what was missing in CObh on 25 March last.

OK!

Was the candle on the Epistle side of the Altar during the Mass in Cobh on 25 March ’08, then, the bugia (Fr. “bougie”)?

I thought that the bugia is always supposed to be held to the right of the book. The point of it, after all, is to cast light on the text of the missal. I did not notice that the stray candle was inserted into a bugia on the altar, hence I assumed that it was the seventh candle inserted into a large candlestick and lowered behind the freestanding altar for lack of space on the mensa. Perhaps the angle of the camera accounts for some of the confusion.

In either case, that candle between the first and second candlestick on the Epistle side seems to be in the wrong place. These ceremonial objects ought to be positioned correctly if they are going to be used at all; and for the record, Rhabanus supports the use of both the bugia and the seventh candlestick whenever and wherever appropriate.

It needs an Olympic-size pool/baptismal tank.
A labyrinth would also be a nice addition.