Luke Gardiner (Lord Mountjoy).
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I reckon Luke Gardiner deserves a thread to himself. In answer to your question Greg, yes a portrait of Luke Gardiner (Lord Mountjoy) Dublin’s greatest planner does exist. He is depicted in the National Gallery as a character to the left and mounted on a grey horse in “The Dublin Volunteers on College Green 4th November 1779†This large scene (3230 x 1750) painted by Francis Wheatley was denoted to the National Gallery by the 5th Duke of Leinster in 1891. Yes its sad to see that this remarkable man has been airbrushed largely out of the history of the Capital he positively planned to such a large extent. Any one else any further info or views on Luke ?
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http://www.irish-architecture.com/buildings_ireland/dublin/city_development/gardiner.htm
There were 2 Luke Gardiners by the way …..
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if you are looking for information on the gardiners, the best source for this(or any other aspect of architecture, planning etc) is in a book titled ‘Dublin 1660 – 1860’ by maurice craig. The book is no longer in print but there is one copy of this book in the dublin library system (currently in my bedsit…it will be back with them in the next few days.) The book is incredibly well researched and has everything you need to know about the gardiners, their estate and ultimate downfall.
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Just onthe side, it’s a facinating painting, with Richard Cassel’s ill-fated belltower looming over the facade of Trinity, and some of the older 17th century Dutch-gabled houses on College Green, which Gardiner undoubtedly would have abhored!
It’s spectacular to see in ‘real life’ , ITS HUGE!, & is in the Millenium Wing. -
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The best of the two Lukes was undoubtedly the first. His construction of Henrietta Street set the standard from which the rest of the Georgian City took its measure. He also instigated the constuction of Sackville street, which, in its own right, is a landmark development in town planning worldwide. His Grandson, Luke II, went further, though the impact was less ground-breaking. He built more, but was not as ingenious as his grandfather.
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snip>>Has anyone heard of the Royal Circus????
J. Seerski<<snipyeah ive heard of it. its on one of the old maps of dublin i think. I thought that was something to do with mountjoy?? it was supposed to go at the end of the vista from st. george’s church to the matter hospital and was going to be a circular square (if you like) with many a mansion sorrounding it!!! but instead they built mountjoy jail there a few years later after someone got killed in a rebillion in dublin at the time and so it was abandoned. that was my patchy understanding of it anyway. anyone know the real truth to the story?
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Nah, thesis only in print format –
But the conclusion is quite unambiguous. The decline of the Northside was NOT due to the 1800 Act of Union (which many say it was). The city’s development as a whole collapsed from that point. The reason for the acute decline of the Northside was the absence of effective estate management, which resulted from the death of Luke Gardiner II in 1798. After that point, the estate fell into the hands of a minor, whose guardians could not give a damn about the estate.
Significantly, no new projects were concieved for the Gardiner Estate after his death, and many that were planned were either abandoned or incomplete.
If Luke Gardiner had survived, Dublin would not be as we know it now. The Northside would still be the most fashionable part of Dublin…… Just another “what if?”…..
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The northside went into decline esp during the mid-19th century, with the influx of peasants from the country because of the Famine. Naturally, as the northside had become significantly cheaper than the southside, landlords cashed in big time in converting Gardiner’s houses into firstly respectable ‘apartments’ and later tenements.
What did either of the Gardiners have planned for the southern end of Gardiner St, the current site of the Custom House? Did they plan the Crescent, part of which Gandon executed?
It’s such a pity a circus was never built, an Irish brown stock brick version of Bath’s would have been spectacular, esp if the ground floors were rusticated in granite, or rendered into blocks.
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Its interesting the rat race that has always prevailed in Dublin, first the wealthy lived on the southside around Christchurch, 17th/early 18th century, then Gardiner came along and they fled across to the north, as far away from the poor & disease as possible, to the heights of Mountjoy Sq in the mid-18th C, then Fitzgerald and his bragging created the fashionable southside, & the wealthy began drifting back southwards. Landlords with an eye for a quick buck snapped up their northside dwellings, the poor swept across the river to the north, causing any respectability left to boot it southwards, and hence bye bye north Dublin. Then the wealthy Victorians continued their journey southwards to the Pembroke estate, and latterly the Edwardians to Foxrock and beyond…
Gardiner must be rolling in his grave.
(Well, both of them)
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So is there any hope for the Northside? Despite the destruction, there are still potentially magnificent Georgian streets: Lower Gardiner Street, Denmark Street, Belvidere Place, North Great Georges Street, Henrietta Street etc.
As for the O’Connell Street regeneration, is it plausible that it can be restored to fashionability, when, as someone else on this board has mentioned, within 200 metres of the Parnell Monument exist some of the city’s most deprived living quarters? I´d be very interested in hearing what people think about the future of the northside. -
Hands off the Northside!!
There have been some really positive things happening there….. as mentioned already here there is the whole O’Connell Street IAP (which involves the adjoining areas don’t forget), HARP, the North East Inner City rejuvenation scheme (granted this will invlove a LOT of work), the redevelopment around North King Street, an improvement scheme around the Royal Canal. Lots happening and I think in a few year we’ll reap the benefits. As the core city expands the northside will start to look much more like a part of city centre and less like the slum land t is at the moment.
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Suffice to say the two Lukes left a legacy that could be the making of a great architectural tour of Georgian Dublin if it was promoted and marketed by Dublin Tourism but after the Ceol museum fiasco in Smithfield I would not hold much hope – its time the Gardiners were recognised by some feature or monument in the city I mean if they had blown up Georgian Dublin rather then build most of it it there would be commerative marches and unveiling of plaques every year. Well done the Gardiners.
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As much as I’d like to say otherwise, I simply cannot see O’ Connell St ever becoming fashionable, most current developments, including Paddy Power moving in, point in the opposite direction. Even supposedly positive developments like the proposals to turn the Fingal offices into a hotel, will alienate consumers/activity from the street. Whereas the existance of staple banks and hotels suggests positive development at first, they attract little, if any people to the area and commercial activity.
What the street needs is lots of cafes that open out onto the street, with tables etc outside, quality retailers like the House of Ireland etc, but mixed with less upmarket, but nonetheless quality stores. The problem with O’ Connell St is that it’s units are too small, hence detracting interest from large quality retailers, and moreover, attracting discount/’low-brow’ development.
Dispite the CC’s plans, it is still very much so commercial interests that are dictating the fate of O’ Connell St, and whereas the CC hope that their physical improvements to the st will spark a new lease of life to the area, it’s going to take a lot more than a few granite slabs and symmetrically places lime trees to attract quality to the Street. -
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What O’Connell Street needs is some positive pulls on the street so the thing doesn’t die after 6pm in the evening, cafes, restaurants, decent bars, places where people can feel safe. I saw an article on Brendan Grace in the Sunday Times decrying the fact that the money was spent on the Spire, he said it should have been spent on 6 squad cars to patrol the street – pleb that he is, we cant live in fear of our lives for visiting the Savoy. Best of luck to the City Council, get out McDonalds etc.
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To Go if O’Connell Street is to get anywhere..
1. McDonalds et. al.
2. Eircom Building
3. Royal Dublin Hotel
4. Amusement Arcades
5. Centra-Spar etc.In their place if O’Connell Street is to get anywhere…
1. National Theatre at the Carlton
2. Indigenous non-chain-store type shops
3. Uniform Shopfronts like that of Regent St. London.
4. Decent Restaraunts – again no chains!What is not needed…
1. “sure it will do” attitude.
2. half-baked effort in implementing the rejuvination plan.
3. CUTBACKS!I read with interest that cash-starved Russia has four extensions planned for its metro, yet we can even get one started!
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on the basis of ‘step by step’ progress I’d suggest that Moore street become an anchor for the HARP area. It could be transformed into a defacto multi-ethnic epicurian centre for the city. It’s basically a blank (but manky) canvas at present, and would be affordably turned into a serious anchor for the area. No need for a grand scheme; let the Ilac sort itself out. Just provide grant aid for restoring the other side of the street on the basis of them housing only specialist foodstuffs etc.
It’d help enormously in changing attitudes to the north city centre (especially if the Abbey moved into the Carlton/Dr Quirkeys site)
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That would be an eradication of all late 20th century facades….leaving only what was rebuilt after 1916 which was in a more nineteenth century style. That would be strange.
After all, the upgrading of O’Connell Street will be in a comtemporary style, ie like Henry Street. The lighting (the retro Victorian lampstandards are going) the seating , booths, etc……….are all to tie in with the Spire, giving a more modern air of design to the street.
It would be ludicrous to lose all 20th century ‘Modernist’ style buildings ….after all O’Connell Street could have been rebuilt in a Bauhaus style following the uprising. -
I completely disagree, considering the absolute minority of ‘modernist’ buildings on the street, and the otherwise dignified ‘historic’ and classical character of it, it is in the street’s interests to fully restore it to a uniform style.
I’m not being typically sentimental, revisionist and blah, blah. Most buildings on O’ C St are nothing spectacular, but as a whole, combine to create a sense of scale, and most importantly, character and history. To break up these uniform terraces with the likes of the shoeshop building and Fingal etc, grossly undermines the effect the other buildings create.
To have starkly modern street furniture and paving will contrast spectacularly with older buildings, and to have that effect the whole way down the street would be truly fantastic. In my view, it is imperitive that the current modern buildings on the street (only about 5% of the bldg stock) be refaced in a traditional way with appropriate Victorian brickwork and stone dressings, no watered down 80s crap and uPVC. This can be achieved through simply mirror imaging the building next door, or building individually.
Again, I’m don’t wear rose-tinted glasses(indeed no glasses at all), it is simply in the street’s, and the city’s interests to rebuild appropriatly. Faithful replicas are laughed at due to the inundation of pastiche, and architects obbsession with post-modern, and is simply immature. (Not that I’m saying you are Greg!. Heaven forbid!)
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