The Velibs are coming?

Just passed a row of these being installed near Portobello bridge, just at the paved area beside the college and the Lower Deck there.

Is this anything to do with those JC Decaux bikes or am I getting confused?

just in time for summer

@DjangoD wrote:

Is this anything to do with those JC Decaux bikes or am I getting confused?

No- you’re spot on. Not sure they’re being called Velib, though.

Theres an unusual installation taking place at the meeting of Nassau Street & Leinster Street South…im thinking it could be these bike stands also

Will the lord mayor or the minister for transport be the first one to ride it across Carlisle Bridge at peak hour? 😀

And what a surprise we are getting different ones to Paris

So this means either:

-we are getting a new improved version; or (and the more likely scenario)
-we are getting a crapier version because our city council is so inept.

The Parisian ones certainly look better and seems to have display and function buttons on each individual unit. We get the box standard straight up dum version.

What are the chances that the Dublin bikes are sh1t too when compared to Paris?

different ones to paris but same as sevilla and lyon it seems… cant imagine they’ll be that different. Where there might be a problem is numbers… I heard that there was only going to be 450 bikes!! the sevici in sevilla has 2000. Both cities are comparable in size and population… we need to flood the place with them.

any word on a name for them… Rothar??

@arch77 wrote:

any word on a name for them… Rothar??

Forty pieces of silver.

I asked one of the lads installing the terminal things up at Portobello when they were expected to be functioning and he reckons within six to seven weeks.

How long until they all end up at the bottom of the canals or Liffey is another thing though. Maybe seven to eight weeks.

@DjangoD wrote:

I asked one of the lads installing the terminal things up at Portobello when they were expected to be functioning and he reckons within six to seven weeks.

How long until they all end up at the bottom of the canals or Liffey is another thing though. Maybe seven to eight weeks.

that mindset baffles me. something appears in your city and all you thing to do with it is steal it, thrash it and throw it into the nearest ditch or body of water. the world would be a more beautiful place if every single thing didn’t have to be designed to be vandal-proof and scumbag-proof.

There is an installation of the Velib bikes under construction along Fitzwilliam Square West as well. Looking forward to seeing them finished with working bikes in order.

bamboo bikes! kinda?

http://www.gizmag.com/bamboo-bicycle-range-released/11733/

Are there any maps of where the stations will be? I’m paranoidly assuming there won’t be any anywhere that will be of any use to me…

The stations look like the ones set up in Toulouse a couple of years ago now, and they are good quality bikes from what I’ve seen.

Laytown? 😉

They’re all inside the canals, mostly east of a north-south axis that runs through the Four Courts. I’ve seen a map, but not online. If I turn one up, I’ll post it.

Hah, nah, I was thinking more in the “getting from the station to work” perspective 😀 Putting them anywhere near a Dart station would probably be far too smart and efficient, of course…

And free to use? I’ll definitely use them if there pick-up/set-down stations are scattered frequently enough throughout the city. Then again… if there were twenty stations, there’d only be twenty bikes or so at each if we’re getting a scant four hundred or so. You really do need about two thousand for these to have enough saturation to work.

Love all the spin about ‘free’ bikes

Not free: 50c an hour plus a joining fee.
Not free: €185m in lost revenue to the city
Not free: The amenity cost of looking at the poxy metropoles
Not free: The human cost of someone getting seriously hurt or injured by walking out from behind the dangerous footpath ‘metropanels’
Not free: The precendent of the planning authority looking the other way on breaches of planning conditions

😡

@Smithfield Resi wrote:

Love all the spin about ‘free’ bikes

Not free: 50c an hour plus a joining fee.
Not free: €185m in lost revenue to the city
Not free: The amenity cost of looking at the poxy metropoles
Not free: The human cost of someone getting seriously hurt or injured by walking out from behind the dangerous footpath ‘metropanels’
Not free: The precendent of the planning authority looking the other way on breaches of planning conditions

😡

😡

Not a huge amount on the internet about it.

The scheme is called dublinbikes and here’s the list of locations.

http://www.labour.ie/oisinquinn/news/12411305531725943.html

Won’t be up and running till September. Sigh.

http://www.dublinbikes.ie/misc/construction.html

Seems we’re not the only louts in Europe.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article5697094.ece

36. St. Stephens Green East
37. St. Stephens Green South

um are they assuming they will move them in 6 years?

no Heuston or Connolly? i’m not seeing a map or clear integration

@missarchi wrote:

no Heuston or Connolly? i’m not seeing a map or clear integration

They probably need all available space there for more hideous advertising.
Integration and sensible siting of the stations would pre-suppose that the bicycles and getting people cycling was the point of this debacle.

So far five people have been killed on the bikes…

I wonder how? It would be an interesting condition for the interconnector and metro north…

@Smithfield Resi wrote:

Not free: The human cost of someone getting seriously hurt or injured by walking out from behind the dangerous footpath ‘metropanels’
😡

@missarchi wrote:

So far five people have been killed on the bikes…
I wonder how?

The same way people are killed on every other kind of bike… I just love that there’s always a comment about how dangerous new things are, especially when they are strictly as dangerous as the identical things they are derived from… Riding a bike in a city is hardly a danger-free thing to do in the best of cases, in fact walking in the street is a pretty risky thing to do too, “metropanels” aren’t going to change that, in fact, they could even be handy shields to protect people from golf umbrellas 😀

@Smithfield Resi wrote:

Love all the spin about ‘free’ bikes

Not free: 50c an hour plus a joining fee.
Not free: €185m in lost revenue to the city

This kind of bike system has never been free to use, as far as I know. I’m wondering if the whole “free” thing isn’t just a mistranslation of the French name “Velib”, the Lib(re) bit meaning Free as in freedom, not as in free of charge… In Paris, it’s 1€ per half hour, so 50c an hour looks pretty good to me.
Where does the “€185m in lost revenue to the city” come from? :confused:

map of all bike locations here :

http://www.aaireland.ie/download/bikescheme.pdf

@missarchi wrote:

36. St. Stephens Green East
37. St. Stephens Green South

um are they assuming they will move them in 6 years?

no Heuston or Connolly? i’m not seeing a map or clear integration

Looks like Connolly is served on Amiens street

option 2 prelim?

I would follow the footfall? Dublin Tourism office? and the rest…

I disagree that the Dublin hosting unit is of cheap design – it is almost identical to the Lyon model, only even better detailed and of a more muted dark grey. Spot on.

Here is one of the installations on Exchequer Street outside Fallon & Byrne. I’ll leave to it others to raise remarks involving organic humous and its new ease of access from Portobello of a Sunday morning.

Another installation on South Leinster Street just east of the Alliance Française.

The siting of many of these units highlights just how much of the city is consumed by bloody on-street parking, from which DCC generates a fortune and has no incentive to remove. More of its eradication in this way and for the benefit of pedestrians please.

I must say I’m delighted at how regular, even sculptural, the installations look in their ordered layout, appealing greatly to my Germanic sense of efficiency. Not remotely cluttering. Some real elegance could emerge if they were laid out in crescents where appropriate.

Where is the official map and who behind it?

I noticed these poles being installed in town over the w/e and should have twigged it.

Good to see this happening, though I agree with all the reservations people have expressed – yes there are nowhere near enough of them, and yes they unfortunately will suffer from a certain level of vandalism. Tough shit on Decaux they’ll just have to grin and bear it. They’ve certainly taken a lot from our pushover council so far – I object to the advertisements being in place a full year (is that how long it’s been?) in advance of the bikes being installed. It’s supposed to be bikes in exchange for ads, not loads of ads and then finally some bikes ages later.

Maybe the favourable deal to JCD is an Irish solution to an Irish problem – i.e. it’s in our interests to vandalise them to get our money’s worth.

@GrahamH wrote:

Another installation on South Leinster Street just east of the Alliance Française.

I’m not following the logic in this location… there are a few students around though…

paris is burning… (does any one recognise the car scenes from a famous movie?)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gTZNZ4pLIQ

wont be long now ….
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ac1976: At a guess, I’d say most of the damage in the photos you’ve posted was as a result of cars, not ignorant citizens.

@DjangoD wrote:

I asked one of the lads installing the terminal things up at Portobello when they were expected to be functioning and he reckons within six to seven weeks.

How long until they all end up at the bottom of the canals or Liffey is another thing though. Maybe seven to eight weeks.

@sw101 wrote:

that mindset baffles me. something appears in your city and all you thing to do with it is steal it, thrash it and throw it into the nearest ditch or body of water. the world would be a more beautiful place if every single thing didn’t have to be designed to be vandal-proof and scumbag-proof.

I have to say, I find the type of comment below equally negative.

@GrahamH wrote:

Here is one of the installations on Exchequer Street outside Fallon & Byrne. I’ll leave to it others to raise remarks involving organic humous and its new ease of access from Portobello of a Sunday morning.

My reservations about this scheme don’t need rehearsing, but I haven’t commented before on one aspect of the siting. It’s great to see on-street car parking being replaced with these, but it’s disappointing to note that some existing cycle parking has been removed to accommodate them. This is NOT the answer. Cycle parking in Dublin City is already inadequate, and we need more of it in addition to the bike hire stations, not less of it by virtue of the arrival of the scheme.

Well that’s pretty preposterous if the case alright. Give with one hand and take with the other?

As regards Fallon & Byrne, the jibe was half targeted at ctesiphon in the first place, in expectation of a irritated retort ;). I’m not one that subscribes to inverse snobbery.

If there is one concern about the bikes and their potential danger, it is that people who rarely if ever cycle will subscribe to them with carefree abandon in the scheme’s infancy. Of course the concept will mature on the populace pretty quickly, but there is a lingering element of doubt about the effect of handing over the not dissimilar equivalent of 450 sets of keys to provisional licence-holders – from all roadusers’ perspective.

Nice idea and all that but I recken they will be vandalised and robbed. Too many scumbags about, especially at St.Audeons where the junkies congregate. BTW, was it a Green Party idea? Kinda naive not to take stock of the more rougher and ‘anti social’ elements of Irish society when considering this.

@GregF wrote:

Nice idea and all that but I recken they will be vandalised and robbed. Too many scumbags about, especially at St.Audeons where the junkies congregate. BTW, was it a Green Party idea? Kinda naive not to take stock of the more rougher and ‘anti social’ elements of Irish society when considering this.

No it was not a green party idea. They have these schemes in loads of cities in Europe. They also have junkies and knackers in Europe too.

@ctesiphon wrote:

ac1976: At a guess, I’d say most of the damage in the photos you’ve posted was as a result of cars, not ignorant citizens.

I have to say, I find the type of comment below equally negative.

My reservations about this scheme don’t need rehearsing, but I haven’t commented before on one aspect of the siting. It’s great to see on-street car parking being replaced with these, but it’s disappointing to note that some existing cycle parking has been removed to accommodate them. This is NOT the answer. Cycle parking in Dublin City is already inadequate, and we need more of it in addition to the bike hire stations, not less of it by virtue of the arrival of the scheme.

From what I have seen existing cycle parking has been replaced near where these new Bad Boys have been installed. Some Velib stands were put in next to DIT Bolton Street where an existing bike rack once stood, but the bike rails were re-installed a few metres up the street as part of the same operation. Hope that sensisble approach persists across the city.

My worry about this scheme is whether it will be undermined by the rising levels of Bicycle snobbery that I’m witnessing everyday. There are some folk who wouldn’t be caught dead riding anything other than a fixey, and will Velib riders now be considered members of the lowest Caste? (Just above taxi drivers, of course, who are mainly sub-human) 😀

@ctesiphon wrote:

ac1976: At a guess, I’d say most of the damage in the photos you’ve posted was as a result of cars, not ignorant citizens.

I don’t think so, there is a culture of Velib Vandalisme à Paris as well as some physical design flaws of the bikes. I hope JC Decaux/DCC have made some effort to avoid this in Dublin. I think we might need CCTV installed at all the stations to try and prevent it….
What do you think?

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But is that representative, ac1976? And where is it? I can’t imagine it was the 16th arrondissement. You would expect a certain amount of that in any big city. But from that post and your previous post the scheme looks like a complete write off.

Ther will of course be some vandalism of the bikes in Dublin cos we have plenty of shitheads. The question is how much.

has anyone else noticed that some of them may have been positioned incorrectly.. The exchequer st ones are quite far out from the path… and the bikes will project another 1.2m approx into the street. Also one of the first photos on this thread show’s the post tight against the kerb. the bike wont be able to fit in. I won’t be at all surprised if they have to amend half of them! port tunnel etc etc.

@arch77 wrote:

has anyone else noticed that some of them may have been positioned incorrectly.. The exchequer st ones are quite far out from the path… and the bikes will project another 1.2m approx into the street. Also one of the first photos on this thread show’s the post tight against the kerb. the bike wont be able to fit in. I won’t be at all surprised if they have to amend half of them! port tunnel etc etc.

The ones you refer to in that photo are down by the Luas at Charlemont and are off the road. Also, that pic was taken before the docks were properly set into the ground, so I don’t think there will actually be a kerb there once they’re finished, at least judging by other ones around town.

Perhaps the bikes on Exchequer Street will go on the path side rather than the road side?

Don’t mention the Port Tunnel ‘debacle’ on this site by the way, you’ll get certain people very irate! In short, there never was a problem with it, as it was not designed to take supertrucks – they don’t come over here in the first place apparently.

has to be the worst?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/23288838@N05/2268464648/sizes/o/

DCC have posted information to boards .ie regarding the operation of the scheme in Dublin. (Maybe the should have got JC Decaux to post the info on the billboards?)
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055571493&page=2

Official DublinBike
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Posted on 26/5/09 by DCC Cycling person:

We’re working on a new cycling web site for Dublin City at the moment but thought this information may be valuable to pop up as the new site won’t be live for 2-3 weeks. When it is we’ll post the address here too.

http://www.dublinbikes.ie is JCDecaux’s web site specifically for the City Bikes scheme itself.

---

CityBikes scheme
The scheme will provide 40 public bike stations around the city with 450 bikes available for general public use! The network of stations will extend from the Mater Hospital in the north to the Grand Canal in the south and from Smithfield in the west to the IFSC and North Docklands in the east.

City-goers will be able to collect a bike from any station and return it to any station on the network e.g. you could collect a bike from a station on Talbot Street and return it to a station at Stephens Green or vice versa. The cost of installation, management and maintenance of the bikes and their stations (including replacing and repairing the bikes) will be covered by JC Decaux. JC Decaux have agreed to provide the bikes as part of an Outdoor Advertising and public Amenities contract with Dublin City Council.

The dublinbikes scheme will operate between 5am and 12.30am, 7 days a week. An automated card machine will be located at each station where users can either use a smartcard (members) or a credit card (non-members) to take out a bike. Bikers who wish to sign up for a smartcard will pay an annual subscription fee of just €10, while occasional dublinbike users may prefer to pay a small charge (€2 for 3 days) for the use of the bikes. Once removed from any station, the bikes can be used for up to 30 minutes free of charge, with a relatively low charge per hour of rental thereafter (e.g. 0-30mins = free, 30-60mins = €0.50, 60-90mins = €1, etc). The bikes cannot be taken out using cash.

Locations of the ‘dublinbike’ stations:

You can see a mockup here
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1. Chatham Street
2. Blessington Street
3. Bolton Street
4. Greek Street
5. Charlemont Place
6. Christchurch Place
7. High Street
8. Custom House Quay
9. Exchequer Street
10. Dame Street
11. Earlsfort Terrace
12. Eccles Street
13. Fitzwilliam Square West
14. Fownes Street Upper
15. Hardwiche Street
16. Georges Quay
17. Golden Lane
18. Grantham Street
19. Herbert Place
20. James Street East
21. Leinster Street South
22. Townsend Street
23. Custom House
24. Cathal Brugha Street
25. Merrion Square East
26. Merrion Square West
27. Molesworth Street
28. Mountjoy Square West
29. Ormond Quay Upper
30. Parnell Square North
31. Parnell Street
32. Pearse Street
33. Princes Street North/ O’ Connell Street
34. Portobello Harbour
35. Smithfield
36. St. Stephens Green East
37. St. Stephens Green South
38. Talbot Street
39. Wilton Terrace
40. Jervis Street

FAQs

Do I have to return my bike to the same station I got it from?
No. The bikes can be taken from/returned to any station on the network.

Can I pay by cash?
Unfortunately no. The cards offer security so that if a situation arises whereby a user does not return their bike after use they will be charged. Cash does not offer the same security and could lead to a small percentage of users abusing the scheme.

How much does the scheme cost?
10 euro per year for membership or 2 euro for 3 days. It is then free to use the bikes for the first half hour, 0.50 euro for the next half hour(i.e. 0.50 euro for an hour), 1 euro from 60-90 mins(i.e. 1.50 euro for an hour and a half), and 2 euro from 90-120 mins(i.e. 3.50 euro for 2 hours)

Why is it more expensive for longer durations?
We wish to encourage short-term use of the bikes so that there will be more bikes available to as many people as possible. In other cities there has been a high turnover of bike usage e.g each bike in the velib scheme (in Paris) is used on average 8 times a day.

What’s to stop somebody else taking a bike using my details while I’m still at the ticket machine?
Each bike stand will be numbered. Once you have selected your bike there will be a time delay before the bike is released from its stand. This will give you a chance to walk from the ticket machine to the bike before the bike is unlocked.

Why is there no bike station at Heuston Station?
In order for the scheme to work, the bike stations must be ideally no further than 300m apart. This will ensure that in the unlikely event of a bike station being full, users will not have far to travel to the next nearest station. Heuston station serves many commuters and therefore it is likely many users would arrive at the station at approximately the same time (evening rush hour peak) on bikes taken out from a number of different stations. If the bike station at Heuston were full and there wasn’t a sufficient number of bike stations nearby to accommodate the user, users would be likely to miss their train. This would put many people off using the service.

It is predicted that the usage of the service at Heuston would be such that a high concentration of stations would be required in the vicinity and furthermore on the approach from the city centre (every 300m) for the scheme to work effectively. Given that there are 450 bikes overall, this would spread the scheme quite finely, with core areas in the city centre suffering as a result.

If the scheme proves to be a success, it is likely the scheme will be extended to a ‘phase 2’ which will include Heuston station and other areas outside the city centre core.

What should I do if I get a puncture en route?
Don’t worry – punctures happen from general wear and tear and you won’t be charged if your bike gets a puncture. Just drop the bike back to the nearest station. A number of service vehicles will travel to and from each station regularly with staff carrying out general repairs on the bikes.

oh they finish at 12:30 less drunken people taking them out for a spin…

I’m not a fan of that green… that bronze colour would have been better

@missarchi wrote:

no Heuston or Connolly? i’m not seeing a map or clear integration

@DCC wrote:

Why is there no bike station at Heuston Station?
In order for the scheme to work, the bike stations must be ideally no further than 300m apart. This will ensure that in the unlikely event of a bike station being full, users will not have far to travel to the next nearest station. Heuston station serves many commuters and therefore it is likely many users would arrive at the station at approximately the same time (evening rush hour peak) on bikes taken out from a number of different stations. If the bike station at Heuston were full and there wasn’t a sufficient number of bike stations nearby to accommodate the user, users would be likely to miss their train. This would put many people off using the service.

It is predicted that the usage of the service at Heuston would be such that a high concentration of stations would be required in the vicinity and furthermore on the approach from the city centre (every 300m) for the scheme to work effectively. Given that there are 450 bikes overall, this would spread the scheme quite finely, with core areas in the city centre suffering as a result.

If the scheme proves to be a success, it is likely the scheme will be extended to a ‘phase 2’ which will include Heuston station and other areas outside the city centre core.

Fair enough. I suppose there’s no point building 200 bike stands at Heuston if there’s a possibilty that the whole scheme will fail.

I agree Morlan but im still not convinced the locations are fully optimised …

I want to see the formula…

I’m not convinced about the locations either.
It strikes me that there is no bike station at the Guinness Storehouse, which must be approx 300M from the station at Christchurch. This is the most visited (paid for) tourist attraction on the country.

It is also close to IMMA (which itseld it about 300M from Heuston Station) and James Hospital and Meath Street, these are ideal locations for the bikes.

I guess DCC are in an indirect way admitting that the number of bikes and stations is inedaquate to serve the city so they have selectively chosen to exclude a whole section fo the city.

I can understand why they have done that, but it is not very public spirited to make decisions without public consulation and without explaining the reasoning for the decisions.
More transparancy is needed here and a better decision making model for Bike Transport decisions.
They (DCC) have already wasted millions of euros painting pretend bike lanes all over the city.

I wonder if the decision to do that was taken by someone who cycles in the city?

Much as I’d like to rant against these, I have to admit liking the design of the bike stations. It grates ‘though that DCC have never put a fraction of this effort into providing bike parking for privately owned bicycles in the city.

However, the logic given for not having a stand at Heuston is absolute nonsense. They are designing the system to ensure that some of the most useful trips (between public transport hubs) will not be feasible – because they’d be too popular? You really haven’t thought about things fully if popularity and demand are seen as threats to the successful operation of the scheme and need to be prevented by design.

I think it stems from a confusion; these bike schemes are NOT about being greener as the small asymmetries in usage patterns leads to bikes bunching up in particular spots. All such schemes require a dedicated vehicle or fleet to redistribute the bikes among the stations in order to function efficiently. This is fundamental to operating a shared bike scheme – they simply do not and cannot work without this constant redistribution. So why would you not just have it as part of the evening routine to do a couple of rounds of picking up bikes from Hueston and redistributing them? I mean, this is a very limited scheme – you are only talking about 10s of bikes an hour.

The small scale of the Dublin scheme will make this aspect of operating the scheme very expensive indeed. Just to pay for a single van/driver is likely to add over 100 euro per year per bike and I suspect more than one man-with-a-van will be required. And that’s just the start; looking at the Parisian experience, you can expect that half the bikes will disappear or be vandalised beyond repair within a year and a half. When you add in the capital cost of the stations and the expense of providing bicycle and station maintenance, I suspect this scheme is likely to end up requiring a subsidy of at least a 1000 euro a year per bicycle. This scheme would never stand up to any sort of cost benefit analysis even if the social and green benefits are given a massive weighting but of course DCC views it as “free money” as they grabbed at the shiney trinkets being offered JCD in exchange for a bag of the family silver.

The implosion of the ill-conceived affordable housing scheme is looking likely to wipe out many councils financially and with rates collapsing as a result of the economic contraction, DCC are facing having to slash spending on a scale last seen during the 80s or face bankruptcy. I wonder what people will think in 5 years time – as your eye wanders from a shiney JCD metropole advertising panel and a nicely maintained “free bike” stand to the litter blowing around the place (after cutbacks in the street cleaning budget) and the rest of the public realm falling apart (maintenance budget slashed). Will the financial illiteracy of the the council finally be apparent?

Unfortunately I think not. Cost/benefit analysis is seen as a PR exercise in Ireland, a bit like an EIS – a bit of inconvenient bureaucracy to be dispensed with once the decision has been made. In fact, it’s regarded even less than an EIS because of a weirdly anti-quantitative ethos when it comes to public decision making in the country. It’s almost as if using numeracy, GASP – THE HORROR!, as a tool to try to assist making decisions on public spending is morally suspect; or that there is something wrong with putting a value on what spending will actually deliver for society and making decisions on that basis. Charlie McGreevy actually captured the mood when he expressed his belief in a “spend it when we have it” philosophy – naive in the extreme but I guess since we (as a country) never “had it” before, it seemed like as good an approach as any. Unfortunately this historically and economically ignorant approach is only exposed as being a way to impoverish future generations when the money starts to dry up.

The contrast with the city in which I currently find myself could not be more extreme. Here, not only are project costs very carefully analysed before making any decisions, many big capital spending decisions are subject to plebiscite. A key part of this process is that required tax increases must be stated. For example the public get to chose whether to pay an extra 2% income tax for 10 years in exchange for a metro line. Not surprisingly, the level of public discourse makes the Irish equivalent look like pre-school babbling. I could imagine a referendum in Ireland proposing to give every citizen of the state a million euro in cash being wildly popular.

As a result of this brutal public disection of proposed big public projects, the infrastructure, particularly public transport, is simply top class. The public – when presented with a bill for the things they demand from the state – become far more selective and value conscious. A typical example was Zurich’s decision in the 80s NOT to build some metro lines but instead to build a couple of Interconnectors for the existing heavy rail infrastructure and expand the tram network; the metro option was far more expensive and the public voted accordingly. In Ireland public money is always seen as “coming out of someone else’s pocket” so you are invariably presented with the undignified image of overfed special interests jostling for position trying to gobble as much from the tough of public money as they can before they’re elbowed out of the way by a greedier pig.

Hmm… seems I drifted completely off topic there. 😮

I think the biggest trip generators would have to be O’connell St, Westmoreland , College Green, Star Bucks, Dame Street, Dublin Tourism Office, St Stephens Green main entrance, and Trinity South Entrance, and outside Head Honcho of Trinity , Dame St Great George intersection

You might throw in some bus/train stations aswell afterwards…

I would allocate 300 spaces to the above
and have other stations of 10-5 bikes in size so say 20 other stations….

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/ireland/article6727865.ece

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JCDecaux to gain €63m from bike scheme
French advertiser to earn €9m more than Dublin city council from “bikes-for-billboards” project

Colin Coyle and Ruadhan MacEoin
It was christened the “free bike scheme” but JCDecaux, the French advertiser chosen to run a “bikes-for-billboards” project in Dublin, actually stands to earn €9m more than the city council from the project.

The contract signed by the council and the advertising company, which has been released to The Sunday Times after a ruling by the Information Commissioner, reveals that JCDecaux is due to make €63.38m in advertising revenue over 15 years from the 72 advertising billboards it has been allowed to erect.

By contrast, the council will receive benefits estimated to be worth €54.36m over 15 years, including 450 bicycles, 40 bicycle “stations”, €23.4m worth of advertising on the billboards, and a “wayfinding” system of 100 “fingerpost” signs directing tourists to attractions in the city.

The council has said JCDecaux was chosen to operate the scheme because its proposal was “costneutral”. Originally due to start two years ago, the scheme will now begin in mid-September. Bikes will be free to hire for the first 30 minutes, and are then paid for.

The city council had refused to release details of the contract, citing a confidentiality agreement with JCDecaux. Emily O’Reilly, the Information Commissioner, ruled, however, that “the public had not been given sufficient information on which to assess the council’s handling of the matter and to understand what the city might stand to gain or lose”.

O’Reilly also criticised the council for not releasing all the records relating to the deal to her office until a late stage in her investigation. The council apologised, saying it had “inadvertently omitted” some documents due to an oversight. She said that “the very existence of secrecy [with the process] carries with it the scope for abuse”.

Based on JCDecaux’s advertising rate card for the billboards, the company could have made in excess of €170m had every one of its “metropole” units and smaller “metropanel” advertising stands been rented continuously over 15 years.

But a spokesman for the council defended the deal, saying that the projected net revenue of €63.38m had been agreed almost three years ago, before an advertising downturn took hold.

“My understanding is that, based on the current market, the company is not achieving the projected rates agreed in 2006. The deal has worked out well for the city, and our advertising campaigns, particularly the anti-litter campaign and a drive to get people to visit their local library, have been a huge success,” he said.

In an internal council report conducted on 32 of the advertising units, it was found that only eight were free from “road-user infringements”, with some blocking drivers’ sightlines and causing “blind spots”.

JCDecaux agreed to remove 50 of its existing advertising hoardings to reduce “visual clutter” in the city. Details of the negotiations reveal that the council originally planned to give JCDecaux permission for 170 advertising units, in exchange for 500 bicycles and a number of public lavatories. Under that agreement, Decaux would have made €125m in advertising revenue over 15 years, while the council would have recouped €101m in benefits. This deal was later renegotiated to give JCDecaux permission to erect 120 advertising hoardings, but only 72 were granted planning permission following appeals to An Bord Pleanala from locals and An Taisce.

Ian Lumley of An Taisce said: “Dubliners appear to have got a poor deal. There should have been an environmental impact assessment, and new units built close to historic buildings should have been referred to us.”

The only bikes that are referred to as “Velibs” are the ones in Paris. In Dublin the bikes will be called ‘Dublin Bikes’ (how imaginative) and will presumably have the logo ‘dbs’ (http://www.dublinbikes.ie/misc/construction.html)

Does anyone know what the pricing stucture will be? I know that in Lyon – where the bike scheme has had a profoundly positive impact on the culture of cycling in the city – the bikes are incredibly easy to use, always in plentiful supply, and very affordable (provided you have a bank account with a laser/credit card). There it costs any tourist 1 euro per day if you use the bike for a maximum of 30 minutes at a time. Otherwise its an additional 1 euro per hour. There is such an abundance of stations around the city though that there is never any need to go over the 30 minutes. You simply use the bikes to get (cruise) from A to B. The inner suburbs are all generally within walking distance of a station. Residents of Lyon can pay a flat rate of 15 euro per year. Once you sign up with your card at the machine (takes two minutes) you get a pin number which you use every time you want to pick up a new one. No worries about having a decent lock for your bike, no worries about having proper lights at night, no maintenance costs and a big basket to put your shopping / football boots / schoolboks etc into while you cycle. The phrase ‘quality of life’ kept coming to me when I observed how incredibly popular they were with all sorts of characters using them in Lyon. My big hope is that we don’t stuff it up here in Dublin with an inflated pricing structure (like the Luas) or with an off-putting overly bulky/heavy design.

Tried to upload a few images but they failed (even though their under 100kb each) ??

I have to presume that they gave them such a stupid name just so they’d have the initials “db” which might resemble the wheels of a bike. So why the F*** don’t they have each letter representing a wheel? It’s completely idiotic!!!

Perhaps it’s just my disturbed mind, but that logo has a rather strong resemblance to an elderly person with a stick attempting to clamber onto a commode.

Graham, nope not just you….

Phew. Well as there’s at least two of us in it, I might add that that’s the charitable description.

Looks like someone waiting for the proctologist to “glove up”.

@jimg wrote:

Looks like someone waiting for the proctologist to “glove up”.

I did not know what a proctologist was before. Now I do 🙁

I much prefer Graham’s version, my first reaction was closer to jimg’s, although South Park has a lot to answer for for that… 😀

Another biker fiend site nearly ready, outside the European Parliament building in Molesworth Street.

Is this “On your Bike” for Europe or for use of the Veliberals?

I thought there would have been a station in the docklands..

There is one right next to the Sean O’Casey bridge, north side.

@jesus_o_murchu wrote:

The only bikes that are referred to as “Velibs” are the ones in Paris. In Dublin the bikes will be called ‘Dublin Bikes’ (how imaginative) and will presumably have the logo ‘dbs’ (http://www.dublinbikes.ie/misc/construction.html)
??

they could always call em dikes.

i presume they think most people won’t use for more then 30 mins here either thus being able to continue the notion that they’re free.

you can use an atm card too to rent them not just a credit card right?

New biker site spotted today.

Just opposite the long standing “temporary” Oireachtas car park on Merrion Square, almost under the gaze of Mr Wilde. A good site for a statue to Myles.

” J C Decaux, the world’s second-largest seller of outdoor ads, said first-half profit plummeted 96 per cent as advertising on billboards, buses and other vehicles fell……..”

😮

Another site for the bikers who dig architecture, neatly wrapped in fashionable black plastic, has appeared just across from the architectural archive on Merrion Square.

Very handy for those coming out bemused by study of ecclesiastical adaptation or of obscure Georgians. You will soon be able to cross the road and pedal off into the distance.

@jesus_o_murchu wrote:

The only bikes that are referred to as “Velibs” are the ones in Paris. In Dublin the bikes will be called ‘Dublin Bikes’ (how imaginative) and will presumably have the logo ‘dbs’ (http://www.dublinbikes.ie/misc/construction.html)

Does anyone know what the pricing stucture will be? I know that in Lyon – where the bike scheme has had a profoundly positive impact on the culture of cycling in the city – the bikes are incredibly easy to use, always in plentiful supply, and very affordable (provided you have a bank account with a laser/credit card). There it costs any tourist 1 euro per day if you use the bike for a maximum of 30 minutes at a time. Otherwise its an additional 1 euro per hour. There is such an abundance of stations around the city though that there is never any need to go over the 30 minutes. You simply use the bikes to get (cruise) from A to B. The inner suburbs are all generally within walking distance of a station. Residents of Lyon can pay a flat rate of 15 euro per year. Once you sign up with your card at the machine (takes two minutes) you get a pin number which you use every time you want to pick up a new one. No worries about having a decent lock for your bike, no worries about having proper lights at night, no maintenance costs and a big basket to put your shopping / football boots / schoolboks etc into while you cycle. The phrase ‘quality of life’ kept coming to me when I observed how incredibly popular they were with all sorts of characters using them in Lyon. My big hope is that we don’t stuff it up here in Dublin with an inflated pricing structure (like the Luas) or with an off-putting overly bulky/heavy design.

Tried to upload a few images but they failed (even though their under 100kb each) ??

We have been told that for us residents, it will be a €10 yearly fee, joining online and getting a card/pass thingy. and then every time you use the bikes,
0-30mins are free,
30-60mins – 50c
60-90mins – €1

and so on and on and on…..
but as posted above, most useage will be 30mins or less, you park it back up and then grab another one when you need it. prices may change, as i have nothing in writting im afraid.
the planning drawing office have nothing to do with the logo’s either.
as fair as im aware, JC Decaux designed them, with some input from the planners involved directly.
i asked the planner, why theres no bike stations at the train stations and i was told that these are designed as commuting bikes and small distance travel within the city, not a tourists attraction as such. tourists will still use cycleways and the rent a place at the pheonix park etc etc.

Why would you think a planner would design the logo? Clearly the operator of the service (ie JC Decaux) are responsible for the design.

@kceire wrote:

i asked the planner, why theres no bike stations at the train stations and i was told that these are designed as commuting bikes and small distance travel within the city, not a tourists attraction as such. tourists will still use cycleways and the rent a place at the pheonix park etc etc.

If they’re “commuting bikes” then surely train stations might be a convenient place to put them…? I get the DART to Connolly often enough to appreciate how useful a bike stand there would be. Maybe not Tara because people would end up under the wheels of a lorry on the quays of Heuston, which no-one approaches without luggage, but Connolly would work. Until pikeys nick all the bikes.

@kceire wrote:

i asked the planner, why theres no bike stations at the train stations and i was told that these are designed as commuting bikes and small distance travel within the city, not a tourists attraction as such. tourists will still use cycleways and the rent a place at the pheonix park etc etc.

Maybe if they get used less they make more money? (less wear n tear)
Why would you put an advert at st stephens green? with 20,000 people an hour?
The more people that see them will use them… foot fall/high rents/transport hubs is were all advertising wants to be and that’s where the bikes should be…

not for 40 people a day on some back lane street that nobody but locals know about.
The one at St Stephens green would take you 5 minutes to walk to from the station…
You could ride one metro station stop in that time on a bike almost.

JCDecaux have pulled out an overseas tender for 600 bikes with 50 stations saying the scheme was to small and the council where opposed to more outdoor advertising.

Is it to hard for it to be funded out of the transport budget with no advertising?

http://www.dublinbikes.ie
the website is up now:

“Cosmopolitan cities such as Paris, Lyon, Vienna, and Montreal all offer a public bike scheme. Dublin now joins this elite list. On 13th September 2009 dublinbikes will offer locals and visitors a non-polluting, traffic jam-beating form of transport to get around our capital city”

WOW

I can’t believe only” 14 of the 40 terminals have credit card facilities enabling you to purchase a 3 Day Ticket (Please note that Laser Maestro, VISA Electron debit card and cash are not accepted)”.

It seems the system is designed not to be used by tourists as well as commuters!

Its really odd that there are no stations around The Guinness Storehouse (the most visited, paid for, tourist attraction in the country) and Kilmainham Jail/ IMMA, not to mention our National Museum at Collins barricks, all of which are ideal for them. I guess this was because of the limited number of bikes available.

@ac1976 wrote:

I can’t believe only” 14 of the 40 terminals have credit card facilities enabling you to purchase a 3 Day Ticket (Please note that Laser Maestro, VISA Electron debit card and cash are not accepted)”.

It seems the system is designed not to be used by tourists as well as commuters!

Its really odd that there are no stations around The Guinness Storehouse (the most visited, paid for, tourist attraction in the country) and Kilmainham Jail/ IMMA, not to mention our National Museum at Collins barricks, all of which are ideal for them. I guess this was because of the limited number of bikes available.

Ah You see that might be because Dublin got… Ripped Off 😡

– Still less than 1/2 the amount of bikes-per-billboard that Paris got: why did City Council officials agree such a shite deal? Why is there no accountability of decisions made by public sector officials made on our behalf – only a (failed) determination to have tried to have kept the contract away from public sight?

Why, oh why, oh why are there still so many questions as to the lousy deal that the council got for Dubliners? 😡

Dublin tourist office 0
Dublin bikes 1

3 on O’Connell st?
One on the bridge as part of the bus stop
2 in westmoreland st
2 in college green

anyway I digress… at least you guys got some bikes…;)

Minor niggles aside, I think this is really great that this is happening. If its subscribed to properly it could change how we use the city quite a lot.

I’d like to see it extended out to the aforementioned IMMA / Pheonix park/collins barracks etc. which really suffer from lack of connection with the city.

@what? wrote:

Minor niggles aside, I think this is really great that this is happening. If its subscribed to properly it could change how we use the city quite a lot.

I’d like to see it extended out to the aforementioned IMMA / Pheonix park/collins barracks etc. which really suffer from lack of connection with the city.

Fare point Mr What?
The scheme itself is a good idea and its sucess is dependant on its support from Dubliners. I will definitely support it and subscribe.

But I do also think DCC need their asses kicked a lot more before they can even begin to plan the next phase of this or else they will make a mess of that too.

@what? wrote:

I’d like to see it extended out to the aforementioned IMMA / Pheonix park/collins barracks etc. which really suffer from lack of connection with the city.

Agreed, Phoenix Park really needs to be brought into the city. Will there be a metro stop there?

i like the idea of all this – just one question – apologies if answered already:

if I take one to a destination and / or back where I started and the nearest drop off point is full presumably I have to go to the next one and so on and so on. Presumably there will be a map telling me where the nearest one is but I also presume that there’s no way of knowing if there’s any spaces on that on either? what if they’re all full – do I have to stand there until one becomes available?

@wearnicehats wrote:

i like the idea of all this – just one question – apologies if answered already:

if I take one to a destination and / or back where I started and the nearest drop off point is full presumably I have to go to the next one and so on and so on. Presumably there will be a map telling me where the nearest one is but I also presume that there’s no way of knowing if there’s any spaces on that on either? what if they’re all full – do I have to stand there until one becomes available?

According to the website:
Terminals at all stations allow you to:
select a db
consult your account
view availability of dbs and stands at other stations
check the station map
Locate a credit card enabled terminal

All sounds very sensible! I hope it actually works!

@ac1976 wrote:

According to the website:
Terminals at all stations allow you to:
select a db
consult your account
view availability of dbs and stands at other stations
check the station map
Locate a credit card enabled terminal

All sounds very sensible! I hope it actually works!

could set up a series of mini tours de dub as velib users descend en masse upon the nearest free spot only to find it taken when they arrive. It could spawn a whole new orienteering spin-off. Either that or something akin to the opening scenes of Die-Hard

Maybe they’ll double the number if this takes off well.

@fergalr wrote:

Maybe they’ll double the number if this takes off well.

Who will? JC Decaux? why would they do that?

the problem with extending the scheme is that you would need the same operator for the whole scheme which is JC Decaux and they would need to be payed or given even more intrusive prime advertising space in the city in return. At the meoment advertising revenue is way down and JC Decaux are making a loss so its very unlikely to happen anytime soon. Unless of course DCC pay the estimated EUR5,000 cost per bike to extend it and pay the operator a fee.

One question, if the service was genuinely uselful and served commuters wouldn’t commuters be prepared to pay a little more for a greater service? Say a monthly subscription or something? Or would that destroy the essence of the Free Bike Scheme?

The attached article from Figaro has some interesting points to make, in particular the possible link between the introduction of Velibs and the notable deterioration of safe cycling behavior, with increasing prosecutions. One cyclist in two is reported as behaving illegally. Jumping the lights being the most common fault, using mobile phones another.

Note also the very low share of cycle movements in Paris transport, despite the Velibs.

http://www.lefigaro.fr/actualite-france/2009/08/12/01016-20090812ARTFIG00004-velo-dans-les-villes-les-infractions-explosent-.php

A deterioration in safe cycling behaviour is the one concern I’d have about this scheme, not least in how it attracts people who have barely ever cycled in their lives.

Many of the bikes are arriving in the city centre this morning.

It’s not what you have got it’s how you use it…

The question you have to ask your self is what is the main destination? i.e. where is the most footfall… Are they afraid of people coming out of pubs at 2am and going loony tunes… But… There is still the destination issue in my head…

website is up and running should any of you wish to subscribe…

http://www.dublinbikes.ie

Decent site, phew.

A story from the London Times today concerning the “Borris Bikes” aka Velibs.
Similar issues re provision of bikes at rail stations are addressed here, just as in earlier postings in this thread, and a possible explanation is suggested.

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/columnists/article6794001.ece

It almost seems that the powers that be want these schemes to fail.
They want to design them to be unpopular and hard to reach.
They want them to be low maintenance and out of reach and out of range.
That’s free urban planning on wheels for you…

Its just a bit of a gimmick, and The Times are right, investment in proper cycling infrastructure is more important.

I know the Green Party published a cycling policy proposing secure bike parking at major rail stations.
I think this would work very well in Dublin.
http://www.bikescheme.ie/green-party-cycle-plan-dublin

City’s new bike scheme is promoted by cyclists without helmets
http://www.herald.ie/national-news/city-news/citys-new-bike-scheme-is-promoted-by-cyclists-without-helmets-1858979.html

The Herald are giving out about this, however it is actually a very controversial issue, some experts say that injuries are not reduced by wearing cycle helmets others say they are!
In 1998 the European Cyclists’ Federation adopted a position paper rejecting compulsory helmet laws as being likely to have greater negative rather than positive health effects.

I dont wear a helmet myself when cycling, but I do think the Herald should have touched on the controversy of this issue. I think they did when then pictured Trevor Sargent (and Peaches Geldof) cycling to work (or for Peaches to a club perhaps) helmetless.

The Helmet or not issue seems to be an irresolvable debate, at least going by the vast amount of online fora and articles on the topic.

Some psychologists suggest that not wearing a helmet makes it less likely for one to be struck by a vehicle, as the driver will show more caution because he sees the cyclist as being more vulnerable.

I would suggest, however, that there are far more dangers out there for cyclists than being struck by a vehicle that has seen them. Any close encounters that I have had on my bike have been with cars that haven’t seen me at all, especially at left turns. Indeed it is probable that most accidents occur when one party doesn’t see the other at all, making the study of driver’s actions upon seeing a helmeted/unhelmeted cyclist a bit of a damp squib.

Personally, I would much rather have my helmet absorb an impact than my skull, I’m not sure that even cycleways could supply me with a replacement for the latter.

I’ve been cycling round Dublin helmetless and hi-vis less almost every day for many a year, and I have no intention of changing my ways; my only two minor falls have been my completely my own fault, and the majority of near misses have been with pedestrians who don’t bother to check for cyclists when they are crossing the road. That’s not to say that I have never had a close call with a car, but in my experience it was usually not that the driver didn’t see me, but that they choose to cut across me anyway, making left turns, and the worst offenders, taxi drivers pulling in to stop for a passanger. In these instances, the most important safety feature was not a helmet, but working brakes. Poor or non-existant brakes, are a far more widespread problem as many people choose (and particularly students) to keep old and broken bikes to make them less attractive to thiefs.

I did say this debate was not easily resolved.

I’ve cycled around Dublin for many years too, with a helmet, and thankfully I’ve never needed it.
Just as I’ve driven a car for many years, and to date have never required use of the seatbelt, but I still wear that.

Chances are you’ll never need a helmet spoil_sport, as well I might not, but I’d much rather err on the side of caution.

That is of course a fair point, however, there is a level of risk assessment involved in most activities, in a car, you are travelling fast enough that you could, in the event of an accident be launched through the car window, in that case it is prudent to wear a seatbelt. When walking there is a chance of tripping on a crack, but one generally doesn’t wear knee pads, or bring a full first aid kit for that eventuality. The question then is where does cycling fall between these, personally, I don’t see cycling as a dangerous event.
But, untill someone decides to make it law, the wearing of helmets is a matter of choice, which is why it gets on my tits then when people start finger wagging over a photo of someone without a helmet.

@spoil_sport wrote:

That is of course a fair point, however, there is a level of risk assessment involved in most activities, in a car, you are travelling fast enough that you could, in the event of an accident be launched through the car window, in that case it is prudent to wear a seatbelt. When walking there is a chance of tripping on a crack, but one generally doesn’t wear knee pads, or bring a full first aid kit for that eventuality. The question then is where does cycling fall between these, personally, I don’t see cycling as a dangerous event.
But, untill someone decides to make it law, the wearing of helmets is a matter of choice, which is why it gets on my tits then when people start finger wagging over a photo of someone without a helmet.

I have to say I think that it’s probably more prudent to bring a helmet all the time. But frankly they look stupid and I don’t want to be carrying one around, so I don’t! And I’ll bet that’s the reason most people don’t.

They do feel a bit silly to wear at the start, especially if you wear argos’ finest cheapest helmet like I do, but it does become second nature after a while and it feels strange to me on the odd occasion that i don’t wear it.

spoil_sport’s argument about walking and knee pads is leaky at best, given that one generally doesn’t spend the majority of one’s time walking amongst traffic. I feel that I would find it difficult to do myself a serious injury on the bike purely from my own steam, it’s when those big, fast, four-wheeled vehicles become involved that I feel the need to give myself a sporting chance.

I’m not sure if helmet wearing should be made compulsory, at least not yet.
The general thought is that legislating the wearing of helmets could have a negative effect on the promotion of taking up cycling as an alternative mode of transport.

I think it comes down to a matter of perception, and not actual safety. This is my main problem with the helmet, it portrays cycling as something dangerous.
I would like to see current stats on how many pedestrians are killed or injured vs cyclists, and a more detailed breadown, but of what I can find:

In 2005, out of the total of 399 deaths on Irish roads, 71 (18%) were pedestrians while 11 (2%) were cyclists.
From the National Safety Council website.

@spoil_sport wrote:

I think it comes down to a matter of perception, and not actual safety. This is my main problem with the helmet, it portrays cycling as something dangerous.
I would like to see current stats on how many pedestrians are killed or injured vs cyclists, and a more detailed breadown, but of what I can find:

In 2005, out of the total of 399 deaths on Irish roads, 71 (18%) were pedestrians while 11 (2%) were cyclists.
From the National Safety Council website.

In order to be relevant to this debate, we’d have to know:
1. the proportion of pedestrians to cyclists in general, and
2. how many of those cyclists were wearing helmets.

I’d imagine that the pedestrians:cyclists is far more than 7:1.

Also, helmets apparently protect you from impacts of about 14mph. So they won’t protect you if a truck drives over your head.

I think the statistics you’re looking for would be too malleable spoil_sport, and could be manipulated to suit either side of the argument.
Just look at the ones you just used: 18% vs. 2%, sure on face value you could read from that that pedestrians are more in danger than cyclists, but is it not inconceivable that there are at least 9 times more pedestrians on the streets than there are cyclists?

You’re correct in suggesting that it comes down to a matter of perception of danger, probably more on a personal level than a general one.
I would never suggest that cycling is a dangerous activity, personally I feel safer and more in control on a bike than I do in a car, but it is not without its risks.
Carelessness, inexperience and inadequate equipment probably make up the majority of these risks, everything else is perhaps purely a matter of chance and circumstance.

Because of this I can understand why many people choose not to wear a helmet, and why it is difficult to convince them to change their ways.

Possibly the only thing that would alter this situation is legislation, but that doesn’t seem to be a neccessity at the moment.

Maybe someone could devise a trendy helmet?
The ‘Fixie’ of the helmet world. That’d get people wearing them! 😀

From the Evening Herald yeaterday:

Our cycle-unfriendly city is not ready for free bikes
By LORRAINE COURTNEY
Monday August 17 2009

In 2006, Dublin City Council announced that a deal had been made with outdoor advertising company JCDecaux: free bikes for the city, in exchange for free advertising space. It’s finally happening this September.

The city council stands to get 450 bicycles, 40 bicycle stations, billboard advertising and a series of fingerposts directing tourists to city attractions. JCDecaux will earn millions from the scheme.

The French company cut its teeth on such bikes-for-posters deals in Lyon.

The Velo’v scheme was later renamed and rolled out in Paris in 2007. The Parisian Velib (its name is a contraction of velo and libre) scheme has had some success. There are more than 20,000 bikes on the streets, a rank every 300 metres and more than two million journeys made every month. Parking spaces are being taken over by Velib rental ranks, commuters can pay for their bike journeys with their integrated transport swipe card and hundreds of kilometres of cycle lanes are being built.

Dublin is only getting a small fleet of 450 bikes. And while the council didn’t pay for the bikes, the public will have to pay to use them.

Before you can take a bike, you must first either buy a Smart Card for €10 on the new website or alternatively put a charge of €150 on your credit card. This registration will activate your account.

The first 30 minutes usage is free, and thereafter, it costs 50 cent per half hour.

You can deposit the bikes at any other station around the city, providing there is a free space for it. If you don’t return the bike, your time clocks up, as does the money you are charged for the rental.

Utopia

Is the self-service bicycle the perfect solution to congestion on our streets? It seems too good to be true. Dublin City Council don’t need to cough up a cent. Traffic jams will disappear. Carbon emissions will drop and we’ll become a utopia of peddling commuters. Anyone who’s tried to negotiate the city centre recently knows that it lacks a dedicated bike-lane system to safely support existing, let alone additional, cyclists. There are simply not enough cycle lanes and cycle paths.

Some of the space dedicated to cyclists on busy thoroughfares is so limited as to be of little value to the inexperienced or people well used to cycling. And because of poor enforcement, even these narrow lanes can often be blocked by carelessly parked cars.

When the Velib cycling scheme was introduced in Paris a few years ago, the city authorities made sure to allocate more space on the streets for cyclists. But there is no indication that there will be a corresponding increase in the number or width of cycle lanes in the capital.

Hung from lampposts, drowning in the Seine, broken and torched to pieces, the Parisian bikes are proving expensive to maintain.

JCDecaux must be struggling to fund a system with such a rapid turnover. The most common vandalism reported by the repair personnel is tyre-slashing, but bikes are also being stolen and are very rarely recovered.

There are reports of the specially made models turning up in Eastern European locations and even in Africa.

More worryingly, the Parisian bikes have fallen victim to a new craze dubbed Velib Extreme.

Young riders are stealing and pushing the bikes to the extreme on BMX courses and fast descents down the long stairs of the Montmartre hill and jumps.

Daredevil stunts are filmed and then posted on YouTube. A scheme that intends making urban travel more civilised might end up increasing anti-social behaviour and bringing about more accidents.

There is one upside to it all though. The tipsy will have an alternative to queuing for a taxi home on Friday nights.

– LORRAINE COURTNEY

I dont think that the bikes will be an alternative to taxis at all, apart from the system not being available late at night, to avoid drunken cyclists, unless you live within a 10-15 min walk of the center of the city you wont have a place to park it. And you’re hardly going to get a taxi (or bus for that matter) such a short distance.
If you live outside of the city center then the bikes are not suitable for travelling to/from home anyway.

It’s a very good point about cycle lanes and safety. If we are breaking with the French Velib system by not bothering to provide adequate cycle lanes and enhance safety there is a genuine risk that there will be serious accidents as a result of the new bikes on the streets. DCC surely have a duty of care to manage this risk and will, in perhaps a short time, as soon as the first serious accident happens have no choice but to shut down the system.

Afterall the bikes are designed for tourists and city cycling novices to jump on and have a go!

‘You can deposit the bikes at any other station around the city, providing there is a free space for it. If you don’t return the bike, your time clocks up, as does the money you are charged for the rental.’

She fails to mention that if you bring the bike back and there are no spaces available, it extends the time by 15 mins which can be annoying if you have to be somewhere but you certainly won’t get charged.

‘Before you can take a bike, you must first either buy a Smart Card for €10 on the new website or alternatively put a charge of €150 on your credit card. This registration will activate your account.’

You have to agree to a pre-authorisation FINE of €150 when buying your yearly card whereby IF the bike is not returned back after a 24 hour period. What’s she going on about alternative charge?

I just signed up via the website, quite an easy process. Looking forward to my subscription pack in the post 🙂

Another fine piece of journalism from the herald. All nonsense… you don’t get charged 150 euro. There is alot of banter about not being able to find a space to park it… I’ve used the system in 3 different cities on busy weekends and never had a problem. there’s nearly double the parking space for them as bikes, and they get re-distributed.

There is also simply no point in comparing city with city and what’s going to happen to them. The only way to know is to introduce it. Dublin is a flat city, and despite what people think, its not that dangerous to cycle around. Cars and buses generally take alot of care when they see a cyclist, if your breaking lights, cycling down one way streets as some cyclists do [im guilty of the former!], then the risk increases. There will be accidents but that’s life. looking forward to it all i must say.

Hopefully they won’t be cycling them on the footpaths for fear of crashing into a JC Decaux monstrosity.

All nonsense… you don’t get charged 150 euro.

If you choose to subscribe by direct debit you will need to:

Send proof of address (original utility bill within the last 3 months)

Include a debit authority which will be used for the subscription (€10), monthly service charges, and a €150 deposit* if the db is not returned within any 24 hour period

http://www.dublinbikes.ie/subscription/long_term_hire_card__1/long_term_card_holder

I’m wondering what the monthly ‘service’ charges might be??

One thing I would like to see attempted is billing DCC or someone if a bike gets a puncture from glass on the road… That could set a great precedent.

I still think this scheme is designed not to be attractive or easily accessible.
So I’m putting the challenge out to Dublin Bikes…

Put one rack near St Stephens Green Luas stop and leave your one at St Stephens Green South and we will see which one gets used more (oh wait we will never get the data anyway) …

@Smithfield Resi wrote:

All nonsense… you don’t get charged 150 euro.

http://www.dublinbikes.ie/subscription/long_term_hire_card__1/long_term_card_holder

I’m wondering what the monthly ‘service’ charges might be??

the monthly service charges are any time you spend on the bike over and above the free 30 mins.

so if you use it for the 30 mins every day for a month, you get no monthly service charge.
but remember you can take the bike for 30 mins for free, park it back up and 5 mins later take it again for 30 mins for free.

once you keep within the free 30 mins, then you will get No monthly service charges.

@missarchi wrote:

Put one rack near St Stephens Green Luas stop and leave your one at St Stephens Green South and we will see which one gets used more (oh wait we will never get the data anyway) …

Actually they seem to have an XML interface which shows the number of bikes / empty spaces available at each location. It wouldn’t be too difficult to graph the relative popularity of each station based on that.

Example:
http://www.dublinbikes.ie/service/stationdetails/36 (Stephen’s Green East)

Ok thanks its helpful but I will put it more bluntly…

Why not put the bikes near the advertisement at Grafton st junction?
What is the footfall for St Stephens green east?
These two items could not be more contradictory they want to sell things and they want people to impulse use a product being the bike… The location is one and the same thing…
However the more the product is used the more it costs in maintenance a clear conflict.
You can have all the bikes you want but it will mean nothing if they are not in the right position and you miss out on 15,000 pedestrians an hour seeing them at peak times in one location alone.

Well well….it couldn’t last forever. In typical Dublin style things all started out so well…but…
I mean the free bike stands of course. The bikes havent arrived yet, but by now all the stands are in place and ready for action. I was initially pleased to see the high quality work being done by Wallace to install the stands, all nice neat paving and clean lines. But then the traffic engineers got their hands on them and out popped our old friend the DoTs Roads Manual. So add to your bike stand a plethora of signs and road marking, bollards and the like.

Some are positively hideous..such as Smithfield. Lets ignore the dreadful state of this part of the “civic space” for a while and just focus on all that pour concrete, reflective bollards and orange signage. Yuk!
And Capel Street….heres a wide section of pavement recently completed to match the repaving of the rest of the street. It was the perfect opportunity for some joined up thinkiing to create a functional pedestrian space with information, bikes and the like…. not much chance of that.

Still at least we will all know where theses stands are…having said that some fingerpost signs randomly dotted around the city on ugly poles would do wonders,,,,maybe we can add some to College Green!

More printed opinion about the ‘Yokes on spokes'”
This scheme is really not impressing anyone, there is little benefit from it to the city I guess.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2009/0828/1224253399047.html

Is there a point you’d like to make missarchi?

It’s all a bit pointless isn’t it!

@StephenC wrote:

Is there a point you’d like to make missarchi?

trying to get to her 1000th post. Pity it’s only the 100th relevant one.

@ac1976 wrote:

It’s all a bit pointless isn’t it!

I was looking at the dublinbikes site again and, in particular, the map of the bike locations

As a taxi-driver hating, bus dodging car free townie who is scared of the two wheeled devil it occured to me that a great deal of the sites are a not very taxing hoof away from each other.

@wearnicehats wrote:

a great deal of the sites are a not very taxing hoof away from each other.

True true, and the type of person who would get a bus or taxi from say Jervis Street to Stephens Green is not the type of person who is going to cycle.

They will make as much (even if) contribution to public transport in Dublin as the free eco-cab trike thingy’s

Who here has been on one? http://www.ecocabs.ie/
I’ve always wanted to try just for the laugh but no one will go with me 🙁

To add some balance to the debate, the following Letter appeares in todays Irish Times
He does not address any of the real issues such as there being too few bikes and stations to make the scheme any use.

---

Madam, – I refer to the article by Orna Mulcahy (“Decaux runs rings around council in Tour of Dublin”, August 28th) regarding the Dublin bikes scheme.

I wish to correct some of the facts as outlined by Ms Mulcahy, as follows: 1. The headline completely misrepresents the entire project. 2 The deal was not secretive, it followed on from a public procurement process in a very open and transparent way. 3. It was announced earlier this year that the infrastructural works would commence in April and would take 10 weeks to complete. This is exactly what happened. The system is based on a state-of-the-art IT system and this had to be fully tested prior to the opening of the scheme. All fee income from the bikes comes to the City Council. 4. The cost of the card and the fee per half hour were included in the press release some weeks ago. These details are also on http://www.dublinbikes.ie since August 10th. 5. The charges in Dublin are the cheapest of all of these schemes in Europe and a two-hour spin will cost exactly €1.50, with the first 30 minutes at no charge. 6. JCDecaux has planning permission for advertising sites throughout the city. The City is getting use of 38 of the advertising faces each month, with all of the cost being picked up by JCDecaux. This has allowed the City to have advertising campaigns in a time when the council has reduced the spend on advertising by 50 per cent (in line with Government instructions). 7. Ms Mulcahy’s comments in relation to bikes being vandalised in other cities read almost as if she is setting a challenge to have the Dublin bikes vandalised. 8. Dublin is the first city in Ireland to use the public domain to fund schemes such as the bikes. – Yours, etc,

MICHAEL SANDS,

Communications Manager,

Corporate Services

Department,

Dublin City Council,

Wood Quay,

Dublin 8.
http://www.irishtimes.com/letters/index.html#1224253510084

@missarchi wrote:

just in time for summer

Not quite,

Now that the facility is up and wheeling so to speak, whats the verdict from Dublin.
Has anyone on this forum used if yet ?

I was indeed using them like a madman on Sunday 😉 Great bikes and kinda cool with the baskets haha my bell was working overtime!

Even today I had to head into town and FORGOT my card and it was painful to walk by a stand of bikes which would have taken me right to the dawson/molesworth street area that I was heading.. doh!

+1

1 week in jail regardless? There should be a 666 euro fine for going within 1 metre of a cyclist.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2009/0915/breaking21.html?via=mr

Was looking wistfully at the serried ranks of bikes up the top of South William street. Gotta get that perma-ticket.

Does anyone else think these bikes are cool enought to forego EUR150 for?
Seems good value to me for an almost new bike 🙂 (with lock lights and a basket thrown in)

I want my own dublinbike, beats the piece of crap I have which also cost EUR150 (without lights lock or basket or pannier)

Do they have a pnnier?

@ac1976 wrote:

Does anyone else think these bikes are cool enought to forego EUR150 for?
Seems good value to me for an almost new bike 🙂 (with lock lights and a basket thrown in)

I want my own dublinbike, beats the piece of crap I have which also cost EUR150 (without lights lock or basket or pannier)

Do they have a pnnier?

you don’t forego 150 for this scheme

@alonso wrote:

you don’t forego 150 for this scheme

Well I was exploring the idea of keeping one of the bikes forever Alonso
Seems good value for EUR150.

oh yeh sorry – well free lightt, free bell, y’know factor it all in like

I wonder will you be pursued though

All the bikes are microchipped so they can be located.

@StephenC wrote:

All the bikes are microchipped so they can be located.

really so they can trace your movements

Not only that you think they can record voices and build up bicycle facial recognition. I think most the data will be used for research into marketing ect.:D
But the information would be great for transport planning but wait there’s no bikes at college green…

Wait until they can identify you and as you pass the beautiful JC Decaux erections (which soon enough will have TV screen style displays, as they have in other countries), they can deliver you targetted advertising. What joy.

TV’s is going a bit mad but I’ve seen it done… Was there no condition in the boards decision?
Sound will be next… We even have McDonald’s in metro stations just wait for the vending machines and retail integration in about 10 years…

Was there no condition in the boards decision?

The board rejected all those that were appealed, problem was that DCC/Decaux put them is a seperate planning applications, so cost a fortune to appeal all of them. There is no condition as to the nature of the display, so in theory they could have LED/LCD TV type displays fitted to them.

2 years + after the grant of permission there has STILL been no Stage 3 road safety audit done on the signage as was conditioned to be done.

iv) The proposed structure shall be the subject of a Stage 3 Road Safety Audit at the applicants expense. This will be done by an approved auditor through a public procurement procedure, which shall audit the entire permitted signage. Any failure shall be removed.

Note: the amount of cyclists being killed on Irish roads is very high. There was another victim just there last Tuesday on Wellington Quay. A lorry was involved as usual. RIP

Dublin Bikes iphone app pulled after legal threats from J.C. Decaux
http://fusio.net/dublinbikesapp/

@Paul Clerkin wrote:

Dublin Bikes iphone app pulled after legal threats from J.C. Decaux
http://fusio.net/dublinbikesapp/

Thata a bummer, its a great app
mine still works for now anyway

@ac1976 wrote:

Thata a bummer, its a great app
mine still works for now anyway

Too right its a bummer.
What was the reason for the legal threat ?

maybe you can assess shortage of supply?
Any way bicycle tracking would also be cool on google maps maybe that’s a project for the UCD people intercepting the free broadcast signal… and mapping bike usage over time

we don’t want tracking on bikes, the oyster card system in london is orwellian, check out eirtext app vs O2, for similar story re legal threat that could have been sorted by a phone call.

Once again the downsides of this deal only become apparent after the the fact.

Why is it that JC Decaux are now apparently trying to deter the beneficial aspect of a remarkably poor deal from functioning to its full potential?

Why is it JC Decaux are able to float kites such as recently touting the bikes themselves would be available to rent as advertising space?

Who has the right to potentially useful information from use of the bikes and the stations – seemingly – once again – not the city.

Where has it ever been explained the origins of the dodgy rezoning map, entitled “zones of advertising control”, which was used by DCC officials at BP hearings – although no councillor had ever voted on the same?

Why did the city agree a deal where JC Decaux projected an income of €63m from the new advert units?

Moreover why did the city accept the €63m figure when the potential revenue from just one of the larger units is €3.9m?

Where is the Independent Road Safety Audit that was to be conducted on the new billboard units?

Why was there deliberate suppression of the contract until the Ombusdman forced it into the open?

Has there been any attempt to make accountable the city officials and certain councillors who got such a prize bum deal for the city?

What enforcement has there been of the removal of 100 existing billboards has there been, that was part of the deal?

What enforcement is there of JC Decaux’s continued development and use of unauthorised structures – see the new trivision structure at the junction of Killeen and Nangor Roads, or at Newcomen Bridge in the North Strand for more.

Where is Minister for the Environment John Gormley in all of this – what if any action has he taken to get answers?

So many questions. So few answers. 😡

Still its nice to the city council’s commercial partner issue such heavy-handed legal threats to a non-commercial initiative that was only seeking to assist Dubliners get use of the scheme.

For the record while Dublin got a rotten deal from this – trying to allow 120 billboards for 450 bikes, whereas Paris got 13 bikes in exchange for each billboard allowed, if it hadn’t been for this site and the scrutiny given to the matter, according to city planner Jim Keoghan the original intention was to allow 170 billboards. Ultimately Decaux have gotten away with only 70 approx. Boo-hoo for Decaux.

Free iPhone application for bike scheme withdrawn

CHARLIE TAYLOR

A FREE iPhone application for users of Dublin’s bicycle rental scheme has been withdrawn after the software firm which developed it was threatened with legal action by the advertising agency backing the new initiative.

The real-time application allows users of the scheme to find their nearest Dublinbikes station and see how many bicycles and spaces are available at it.

Fusio, the company behind the application, was sent a cease and desist letter from JC Decaux earlier this week in which it was told that legal action would be considered if it continued to offer the mobile application for download.

The application, which was only released at the end of August, has proven to be highly successful, with some 3,000 downloads over the past three weeks, making it one of the most popular Irish applications available at the iTunes AppStore.

More than 6,000 people have subscribed to the Dublinbikes scheme, which was introduced on September 15th. The initiative is being funded by JC Decaux in exchange for advertising space in the capital.

Fusio’s application uses data which is freely available on the Dublinbikes website. This is then plotted on to Google Maps. The application uses the iPhone’s built-in GPS to allow users to get up-to-the minute information on the availability of bikes. Additional data used in the application was provided by Dublin City Council.

Fusio insists it sought permission to use data from JC Decaux prior to releasing the application.

Diarmaid Mac Aonghusa, Fusio managing director, said the company had decided to produce the application solely as a development project to draw attention to its ability to develop similar applications for clients.

“We were offering the application for free and had received a number of phone calls from members of the public congratulating us on it, which is something that rarely happens in the IT world. So we’d obviously developed an application which was proving to be popular. However, when we were advised that legal action was possible, we felt we had no option to withdraw the application.”

Although iPhone users who have already downloaded the application will still be able to use it, it is no longer available for download at the AppStore and no updates will be provided in future.

A spokesperson for JC Decaux said the company had no comment to make regarding the cease and desist letter.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2009/0923/1224255060614.html

There is also a website doing the same thing as the app although not as useful as an iPhone app.

http://www.dublinbikes.mobi/

I guess they haven’t received their Cease & Desist letter yet!

Love the Bikes
Hate the Process

I would be very interested in enforcment action against those unauthorised signs. Is there a list of their locations for the average NIMBYist?

For sure the scrolling ads on the construction at Newcomen Bridge should have been removed by JC Decaux.

Instead of doing so, they had the hard neck to apply for not one, but two of those hideous Metropoles, having been refused one on the other side of the bridge following an appeal to An Bord Pleanala.

DCC in an outstanding display of cretinism, even by their own high standards, opted to allow one of the Metropoles at the Newcomen Bridge site – a decision which I have appealed to APB (result due mid-October).

I shouldn’t have to do this though.
I shouldn’t have to root out 220 euro of my money and spend my time keeping these things out of my area. ABP gave many clear reasons why these things should be refused permission in the decisions on those Metropoles that were appealed, one of them located on Newcomen Bridge and then the munchkins in DCC go and try to allow one not thirty metres away???

Good for you Pascal!
http://examiner.ie/business/donohoe-intervenes-in-iphone-dispute-101663.html

Donohoe intervenes in iPhone dispute

Thursday, September 24, 2009

PASCHAL DONOHOE, iPhone user and Seanad transport spokesman, has called on Dublin City Council to intervene in a dispute over an iPhone application that shows Dubliners where their nearest Dublin bike is located.

Senator Donohoe said that the removal of this application due to the threat of legal action “just doesn’t make sense”.

Stationstops app… New yorkshire

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2009/0925/1224255203440.html

AN EXPERT on information technology law has said that the advertising agency JC Decaux would be unlikely to win a case against a web design firm over a free iPhone application it developed for the Dublinbikes scheme.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2009/0925/1224255203440.html

@StephenC wrote:

All the bikes are microchipped so they can be located.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2009/0929/breaking26.htm

Interestingly…

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2009/0930/breaking45.htm

All’s well that ends well!

I can’t explain right now how liberating these bikes are for pedestrians. They’re just fantastic. Stephen’s Green to Parnell Square North in ten minutes. O’Connell Street to Smithfield in four minutes.Can’t be beaten. The quays are a no-go, though. Buses are incredibly dangerous to be around.

@fergalr wrote:

I can’t explain right now how liberating these bikes are for pedestrians. They’re just fantastic. Stephen’s Green to Parnell Square North in ten minutes. O’Connell Street to Smithfield in four minutes.Can’t be beaten. The quays are a no-go, though. Buses are incredibly dangerous to be around.

Agreed about the buses. Some bus drivers take care and are courteous but most appear to have a problem with cyclists. We could do better ourselves – breaking pedestrian lights when there are no pedestrians is understandable (IMO)- but why do so many feel they have to break main lights?

I make a habit of acknowledging courteous behaviour from and car drivers (common) and bus drivers (happens!) and maybe this could help change the culture if widely adopted- plus obeying the more important rules of the road?

Marvellous the the Velibs seem to be working out on the vandalism front – have to say I was a Class A sceptic – delighted to be proven wrong.

/

@publicrealm wrote:

Agreed about the buses. Some bus drivers take care and are courteous but most appear to have a problem with cyclists. We could do better ourselves – breaking pedestrian lights when there are no pedestrians is understandable (IMO)- but why do so many feel they have to break main lights?

I make a habit of acknowledging courteous behaviour from and car drivers (common) and bus drivers (happens!) and maybe this could help change the culture if widely adopted- plus obeying the more important rules of the road?

Marvellous the the Velibs seem to be working out on the vandalism front – have to say I was a Class A sceptic – delighted to be proven wrong.

/

I’ve found car drivers to be courteous and very responsive to simple indicating from my wobbly bike. Buses are the problem because they weave between lanes and crowd into the pavement. Westmoreland Street is an absolute joke in that regard. Sometimes cycling beside the pavement is the absolute worst place to be in the roadway.

In a way I’m pleased but not surprised to see that the bikes have yet to be nicked en masse. The locking mechanism is pretty theft-proof. Proper and cumbersome.

Generally have no complaints about bus drivers. Rookie cyclists are a severe hindrance on the road to all, other cyclists included (undertaking, stopping short at the lights or blocking the left lane at the lights when proceeding straight ahead, braking suddenly without looking etc) so I wouldn’t be complaining. if you don’t have the confidence or experience to negotiate a slowing or turning bus in traffic then stop until it is safe to proceed. Velibs dont look like they are built for the necessary acceleration to get around or away from a manouevering Bus (which don’t forget is bigger than a HGV and as difficult to handle) anyway. Enjoy your perambulations on the velibs by all means but they are not urban thoroughbreds for fighting the good fight with the general traffic melee!

And always use hand signals and acknowledge courteous drivers as stated above.

@fergalr wrote:

Westmoreland Street is an absolute joke in that regard. Sometimes cycling beside the pavement is the absolute worst place to be in the roadway.

People who have been cycling for years will tell you that beside the footpath is the worst place to be on Westmoreland. Most cyclists use lanes 2 and 3 (left to right) for safety. D’Olier St is much the same.

Exactly. anywhere on Westmoreland or College Green//St get out in the middle of the road and command your road space. It’s not a place for novices.

Re Westmorland / D’Olier Streets and cycling, Bus Gate was part sold on the basis of being improvements to the public domain.

This has not been the case. Footpaths have been left at a miserable width, the streets have been left as multi-lane one-ways (5 lanes wide) – with the result that traffic (mostly taxis/ buses) can really speed along here – none of which is any benefit whatsoever to cyclists. No new cycle-lanes, despite the space being clearly present 😡

The primary accomplishments of Bus Gate from what I can see are that trade has been driven out of the city centre, ugly large motorway-standard has been inserted in a manner that blocks facades of the city’s best buildings while also damaging antique pavements, and Westmorland Street has been left exposed as what it has become, ie a stretch of dereliction, vacancy, and urban failure.

It couldn’t be any worse – really, you just couldn’t make it up. In my opinion the planners/ officials responsible for presiding over and implementing this mess should be released of their duties on grounds of incompetency.

There is one question in all of this, which is the more dogma-driven tokenistic supposed “green” measure – bikes provided by a firm that makes maybe €200m out of badly-planned new adverts in poor areas, or a Bus Gate that has succeed in driving trade out to the out-of-town shopping malls, making “edge city” more viable?

I note neither of these supposed “green” schemes had Environmental Impact Assessments – well done to gobshites in the Green Party who have been in government while these template examples of bad planning have been allowed to damage the city… You could get away with building a concentration camp in Ireland these days – as long as you put the word “eco” in front of it, and provide a bicycle rack for the guards.

Bus Gate should have the letter “t” added into its title, Bust Gate – as that’s the primary effect its having on the city centre.

So what do people make of the scheme and its workings so far?

On the design front, it has to be said that it’s been an outstanding success. The bikes themselves, the stands, the electronic display units, the associated marketing – all spot on. Extremely smart and well co-ordinated. Aside from the odd crude island unit with garish bollard courtesy of the Roads Department, the scheme has integrated itself remarkably well into the city. If anything, they actually improve the appearance of many host locations, with visually pleasing ranks of bicycles injecting some civility into Cathal Brugha Street, Christchurch Place and their ilk.

The on-screen interface is a little confusing for first-timers, i.e. mainly tourists, with the none-too-obvious requirement to press the green V every time to progress the registration. Otherwise a nice and simple process.

Who on earth are all these long-legged people though?! Every single bike I’ve used thus far has had to have its seat adjusted down to earthling level (promptly cutting my hand in the process today). Very odd. If there’s a single fault with the bikes, which are extremely sturdy and comfortable, it is that the seats can be a bit dodgy in the stability stakes. I can only imagine this will get worse with time…

LOL I was complaining the other day that I had to adjust the seat UP each time I was using one. I wondering who all the short arses were!

J’adore mon db!!!!!!!

Haha – well yet again, the one I got this morning was higher that Bosco’s Tounge Twisters in their final stages of elevation. And I’m not small! How on earth somebody could even reach up that high, never mind operate the yoke, is beyond me.

At least we know who to blame now 😉

I for one think the dbs are such a civilising factor in the city. All these genteel cyclists criss crossing the city. The only downside is that it has highlighted just how cycle unfriendly the city streets are, in particular the various traffic cells and one ways which may wrok well for funnelling cars about but frustrate the average db-er wanting to get from A to B. As a cyclist I should be used to this but perhaps I havent been paying enough attention.

There is a problem with a lack of cycles available at some stations. The IT picked up on this the weekend before last and reported that DCC are proposing to increase capacity at a number of stations such as Portabello and Smithfield and rolling out the bikes farther afield such as Heuston.

A great sucess!

Foget about the velibs…2010 is going to all about the Autolibs!!

Exciting news reported in today’s IT that they are testing out the rental concept for electrical cars:

…

…Modelled on the vélib and inspired by a similar scheme running in Lyon, the autolib will further burnish the city’s green credentials by providing thousands of electric cars that drivers can pick up and drop off anywhere in the city.

The first electric car project of its kind in a capital city, autolib will consist of 1,000 stations – 700 within the city limits and the rest beyond the péripherique ring road – each holding three cars.

Drivers will be able to pick up either a two- or four-seater at any rental stand by simply swiping a credit card through a reader at any time of day or night.

Although rates haven’t yet been set, city officials say a half-hour will cost between €4 and €5.

The socialist mayor Bertrand Delanoë, who believes the project could “revolutionise transport”, hopes to put the scheme out to tender by the end of the year and for work to begin on the service in 2010.

Not everyone is enamoured of the idea, though. Some green politicians are uneasy with the notion of encouraging people to use any type of car instead of providing incentives to stick with bikes, metros and buses.

And then there’s the question of security. How to prevent the cars suffering the same fate as the bikes and save them from ending up in a watery grave in the Seine?

“It’s a subject we’re particularly conscious of,” a spokeswoman for Mr Delanoë says.

Why would we want more cars in the city centre?

Ireland=drunk drivers=bad idea unfortunately unless they limited hours of operation

The rows of bikes really do add further lustre to Dublin’s gleam on a good day 🙂 A nice civic touch and those blue fenders look great.

🙂

So here’s my multi-million dollar idea for a tiny feature that should have been employed on every bicycle. What’s the most annoying thing about taking out a db? (aside from cracking your fingers off trying to manipulate stubborn saddle adjustment levers). Well, trying to guage the correct saddle level for your height. Indeed this can take the best part of half a minute if you get it wrong once or twice, as is regularly the case, often all the while stressing over whizzing passing traffic and/or trying to hold the bicycle up straight in the cumbersome process.

The solution? A simple incising of the steel saddle pole (to use strict engineering parlance) with numbered notches, or alternatively (and probably more expensively) coloured rings, which would enable the user to instantly adjust the seat, to say, a ‘4’ or a green or blue level. The first option would surely cost extremely little, while making the user experience a lot more efficient.

@GrahamH wrote:

🙂

So here’s my multi-million dollar idea for a tiny feature that should have been employed on every bicycle. What’s the most annoying thing about taking out a db? (aside from cracking your fingers off trying to manipulate stubborn saddle adjustment levers). Well, trying to guage the correct saddle level for your height. Indeed this can take the best part of half a minute if you get it wrong once or twice, as is regularly the case, often all the while stressing over whizzing passing traffic and/or trying to hold the bicycle up straight in the cumbersome process.

The solution? A simple incising of the steel saddle pole (to use strict engineering parlance) with numbered notches, or alternatively (and probably more expensively) coloured rings, which would enable the user to instantly adjust the seat, to say, a ‘4’ or a green or blue level. The first option would surely cost extremely little, while making the user experience a lot more efficient.

You should suggest it to them. Given that they take a couple in every day to repair, they could add your suggested improvement to them while they maintain them. Over time all of the bikes would have the feature you propose.

@fergalr wrote:

The rows of bikes really do add further lustre to Dublin’s gleam on a good day 🙂 A nice civic touch and those blue fenders look great.

True.
They’re much nicer than these…..

these things seem to be victims of their success – critical mass appears to have been reached. I pass 3 of these stands on my walk to / from work depending on the route I take and i see the same thing every morning – empty stands and a queue of people staring into the distance for a blue bike. The opposite is seen in the evening with cyclists milling about waiting for a slot to become free – anxiously looking because their free 30 mins is coming to an end.

I’d imagine that DB are still taking subscriptions though……….

Yes, we don’t give credit where credit is due sometimes. This has been an outstanding success. The Corpo guys who drove this through, despite all the negativity, deserve a second cookie with their morning coffee.

Even the quid pro quo of all the freestanding advertising signs across the city deserves to be reassessed on the basis that at least they begin to break the age-old parasitic relationship between billboard advertising and the side walls of city buildings.

P.S. There’s a flat-back thruck comes round about 8.30 every morning to replenish the bikes on the stand near me.

It has been a marvellous success on virtually every level, from operation, to maintenance, to design, to location choice. If there is one irritant, it is how the db user figures are now being thrown in with those who ‘cycle’ in Dublin, massively inflating the 2009/10 figures over previous years. Whereas this trend must be welcomed in terms of promoting a wider cycling culture, for the majority, hopping on a db to dawdle down Dame Street on a route they previous walked could well be termed laziness. In fact, it is. And it produces more carbon emissions.

@wearnicehats wrote:

these things seem to be victims of their success – critical mass appears to have been reached. I pass 3 of these stands on my walk to / from work depending on the route I take and i see the same thing every morning – empty stands and a queue of people staring into the distance for a blue bike. The opposite is seen in the evening with cyclists milling about waiting for a slot to become free – anxiously looking because their free 30 mins is coming to an end.

Yes this is by far the biggest problem with the operation of the system. The worst affected stations are commuter-related points and those in peripheral locations. The former are stations like Prince’s Street, where a single bus arriving on O’Connell Street has the potential to clear out the entire station (never mind 500), while the latter are stations like Mountjoy Square, Smithfield and Merrion Square East, which by their isolated nature experience excessive one-way traffic at peak periods.

It is interesting to note the same trends in operation at lunch hour. Every day, the Christchurch Place station empties of bicycles by 1.10pm and often remains empty until 1.50pm or so. By 2.15 it is often full. The destinations these bicycles are destined for in turn become clogged, namely the likes of Chatham Street, Molesworth Street and South Leinster Street, where people go for lunch.

Stations with a consistently excellent turnover of bicycles are those with a perfect equilibrium of supply and demand, such as Exchequer Street outside Fallon & Byrne, Jervis Street at Wolf Tone Park, Cathal Brugha Street, and St. Stephen’s Green with its high volume of varied traffic flows.

@gunter wrote:

Yes, we don’t give credit where credit is due sometimes. This has been an outstanding success. The Corpo guys who drove this through, despite all the negativity, deserve a second cookie with their morning coffee.

Even the quid pro quo of all the freestanding advertising signs across the city deserves to be reassessed on the basis that at least they begin to break the age-old parasitic relationship between billboard advertising and the side walls of city buildings.

P.S. There’s a flat-back thruck comes round about 8.30 every morning to replenish the bikes on the stand near me.

I disagree. The main objection was not to the bikes, but to the fact that so much advertising space – essentially a public asset – was sold for a fraction of its value. There should have been ten times as many bikes.

No question there rumpel. And the proposed expansion of the system seems rather half-hearted from what I’ve read. Indeed, extra points should have been installed at busy stations within months, if not weeks, of the success of the scheme being noted. We still have nothing in that regard. Pretty much half of Prince’s Street could be consumed with such a facility.

@gunter wrote:

.

P.S. There’s a flat-back thruck comes round about 8.30 every morning to replenish the bikes on the stand near me.

I’m always disappointed that the truck in question isn’t electrically powered – kind of a contradiction that all these bikes are supported by a deisel truck that drives around dublin almost constantly all day

anyway – I bumped into a recently redundant colleague beside one of these ranks the other morning just as the truck was leaving. we had a brief, mostly awkward, chat, but in that time 14 of the 20 bikes had gone again. I suppose they’ll find an equilibrium but I do know at least one person who has stopped using them due to continuing problems dropping them off in the evening

They should probably open new DB stations around Town to balance supply and demand. This way the people looking for bikes and those looking to drop them off would have more options. Now that the scheme is so successful, it should be relatively easy to arrange this expansion of the network.

The maps on each of the stations are also very useful, Too often Ireland seems determined to keep itself a secret from itself. With maps being provided at each of these stations, it will be easier for tourists to navigate our Fair City. That will improve their experience of Dublin.

@gunter wrote:

Yes, we don’t give credit where credit is due sometimes. This has been an outstanding success. The Corpo guys who drove this through, despite all the negativity, deserve a second cookie with their morning coffee.

Even the quid pro quo of all the freestanding advertising signs across the city deserves to be reassessed on the basis that at least they begin to break the age-old parasitic relationship between billboard advertising and the side walls of city buildings.

Have to disagree entirely.

The bikes are the fringe benefit of a much bigger grubbier scheme.

€350 million worth of advertising potential revenue was being foregone by DCC for 450 bikes – until a ruckus saw 1/2 the billboards scrapped

It was done on by way of a secret rezoning map

Most insideously of all, the billboards were dumped on lower-income areas, while the majority of the bikes went into leafy Dublin 2

Of course when the scheme is bedeviled by under-capacity at the outset, it looks like a “victim of its own success”. Paris got almost 13 bikes in exchange for each billboard – we got less than half that.

If this scheme was driven by bikes as the primary agenda, why is it that DCC are so half-hearted in extending or upgrading the (bike aspect) of the scheme?

I am all up for more cycling in the city as many of you know, but it is total bullshit to ignore that the DB bikes were not just damn greenwash masking a dodgy grubby deal.

@fergalr wrote:

The rows of bikes really do add further lustre to Dublin’s gleam on a good day 🙂 A nice civic touch and those blue fenders look great.

Oh you mean the blue fenders that they also tried to sell off as advertising space, but were unable to in the recession :rolleyes:

@hutton wrote:

Oh you mean the blue fenders that they also tried to sell off as advertising space, but were unable to in the recession :rolleyes:

Seriously?? :confused:

@fergalr wrote:

Seriously?? :confused:

Yep, I remember reading media reports about it at the time – might be a copy posted on the other JC Decaux thread

http://allirelandtravel.blogspot.com/2009/07/company-seeks-to-raise-15m-in-bike.html

€1.5m….

I think it’s fair to say that the concept of the Velibs has been a good success, and there were plenty of commentators who took the attitude that this scheme could not work in Ireland, the bikes would be destroyed in the first week, etc. (same sort of stuff that was said about smoking ban).

But Hutton is right, we shouldn’t forget that relative to Paris we got a bad deal. We gave away too much for too little.

Who negotiated the deal? Was it Dublin City Manager John Tierney?

It’s a pretty fluffy article, but the following will be in the June issue of Cheers Magazine, in the Tried and Tested column. Thought I’d preview it to Archiseekers 😉 Just don’t tell the editor.

Dublin might be one of the most pedestrian and cyclist friendly capitals in the world. There are no monumental avenues to cross as there are in Paris or New York. Motorists have mostly been beaten into submission by thousands upon thousands of jaywalkers unlike Rome, the vehicular homicide capital of Europe. The entire city centre slopes gently towards a thin river with a frankly excessive number of bridges. And if the main thoroughfares are packed too tightly with traffic and crowds, a pedestrianised side street is never far away. We actually have it so good that Dubliners have lost all sense of proportion when it comes to distance. It might be an arrow straight road from Cineworld on Parnell St down to Temple Bar but many’s the time that friends and I have ducked into TP Smyths on Jervis St because of “the distance” we would otherwise have to travel from the cinema to a decent pint.

Cheers secret headquarters, a hollowed-out volcano near St. Stephen’s Green, is inconveniently located for northsiders such as myself. Its location was especially inconvenient when I got off the DART at Tara St one evening in May to find an entire month of belated April showers bucketing down. With the usual half-hour walk from the Liffey completely out of the question, the solitary thought that ran through my mind as I pedalled soddenly along Dame St like a starfish on the run was, “thank God for Dublin Bikes.” I was still dripping dolefully when I arrived at the staff meeting, but at least my exposure to the Irish climate had only lasted for ten minutes and not thirty.

Dublin Bikes is a cycling scheme that was launched in September of last year to massive acclaim. The city resounds these days to a gentle trill from the bells of over four hundred rent-a-bikes provided by Dublin City Council and advertisers JC Decaux. From forty stations across the city centre, handsome blue-fendered bicycles are available to revolutionise the Dubliner’s relationship with his city’s streets.

I am a long-time pedestrian and now first-time urban cyclist. Living out on the city’s fringe, where the postcodes meet the county, cycling into town has never been a realistic option for me. My poor bike has been looking at me reproachfully for years now, all too aware of the big, cycle-tracked world that it has long been denied because of the bus stop right outside my front door. In any event, I came to the Dublin Bike scheme with no knowledge of transporting myself by wheel along hectic traffic arteries.

I still remember my first time and that youthful flush of nervous anticipation that I felt as I sidled up to the station beside the GPO. Perpetuating the usual gung-ho enthusiasm that I reserve for stupid notions that enter my head, I had paid the €10 fee for the annual Long Term hire card. I climbed onto a bike and wobbled embarrassingly too and fro until my feet had a grip of the pedals and I of long repressed memories of how to actually cycle. And then, with a beseeching prayer to the Creator, I swung out into traffic with the world, as a friend once unforgettably put it, as my lobster.

It was a revelation on that short initial trip up to the Bull & Castle by Christchurch (I didn’t cycle for my supper so much as for a session) and it remains so today. Dublin is a fantastic city for cycling. With a good pair of legs under you and the bike in the third of its three gears, you’ll find yourself moving at roughly the same speed as most motorised traffic as you curve around Parliament House on College Green and shoot down the middle of Westmoreland St, like an interplanetary space probe breaking orbit. No longer the drudge of the trudge from one end of the city centre to the other when you can freewheel down the long, southside hill from Camden St to the Liffey and then cycle up to the top of Capel St within ten to fifteen minutes. If DIT’s student body cops onto the benefits of these bikes for travelling from one faculty building to another, there’ll be none left for the rest of us. Dublin Bikes bring the points of an already compact city centre even closer together. What has been for decades referred to as “town” now truly feels like one.

I know I’m babbling but these bicycles are an absolute joy. In the week that I wrote this article, I found myself spending a pleasant afternoon criss-crossing the city centre on Dublin Bikes, conducting interviews. Build up speed on the little plateau in the Liberties from High Street to Christchurch and then down little Castle St and Dame Lane, avoiding as many traffic-strewn main roads as possible. A quick turn up South Great George’s St and then a left onto Wicklow St, where the cars were outnumbered by tourists. Then an intrusion onto Grafton St, the mecca of pedestrian Dublin, where my wheels and bell were not appreciated, and a right turn to Nassau St, where the buses could be outpaced and the smart cyclist raises his rear from the saddle, so as to avoid losing a filling from the full-body shocks and vibrations that the potholed surface throws up. And finally to the Georgian serenity of Merrion Square, where I could lazily pedal under the dappled leaves and almost forget that my journey had a destination.

If you haven’t tried Dublin Bikes, then I urge you to pony up the price of a small coffee and buy a three day ticket for €2. Experience the convenience of cycling around town in a bike that you can leave behind at the end of your travels. In the sun, it beats walking. In the rain, it replaces it.

Rail passengers heading for the city are being encouraged to get on their bike rather than take a taxi or hire a car, with a cycle rental and storage scheme being copied from the Netherlands.

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/transport/article7134513.ece

Abellio Group, whose parent company runs the Dutch railway, is behind the first such facility, which will open in Leeds in July. Passengers will be able to rent bikes by the day from the Cyclepoint, as well as lock up their own machines, have repairs done and buy cycling accessories or bikes. The Leeds Cyclepoint is funded with a £500,000 grant from the Department for Transport, through Network Rail, which is being spent on the new two storey building.

Evans Cycles has been contracted to run the facility and will supply 350 bikes for rent at £8 per day. The charge for storage is likely to be £1 a day, with discounts for season ticket holders.

Plans are in place to introduce radial cycling routes from the suburbs into the centre by 2011, aimed at people living three or four miles outside the city centre. It is also proposed that satellite cycle points at other nearby Northern Rail stations, such as Bradford, Harrogate and Skipton, could be created so that passengers could start and finish their rail journeys by cycling.

Abellio’s parent company NedRail found that the provision of extra cycle parking and bike storage had substantially boosted the number of passengers it carries. However, in the Netherlands, a third of all trips to and from the station are undertaken by bicycle, whereas in Britain only 2 per cent of rail passengers arrive by bike. At the moment about 100 passengers a day leave their bikes at Leeds station.

Anton Valk, the chief executive of Abellio, believes that the number of rail passengers beginning and ending their journeys by bike could increase substantially if the facilities that his company runs for the Dutch state railway are adopted in Britain. In the Netherlands, cycle hubs can be found at 40 stations and have between 500 and 3,000 cycles per station.

Mr Valk, who cycles daily from Marylebone to his Central London office on the fringes of the City, said that if the Leeds Cyclepoint pilot proved successful, his company would like to introduce others. The Department for Transport and Network Rail have earmarked Liverpool Lime Street, where Abellio operates Merseyrail; London’s St Pancras, Victoria and Waterloo stations; Grimsby; Hull; Scunthorpe, Sheffield and York in the next two years.

The Leeds Cyclepoint will be situated directly in front of the station, next to the taxi rank. The development will start small but storage can be increased as demand grows.

Capital idea, Mr Mayor

Behind the story: Alex Spence

Thousands of new cyclists will be encouraged to take to Central London streets after the launch of a £140 million bicycle hire scheme on July 30.

The brainchild of Boris Johnson, London’s Mayor, the scheme will allow the public access to 6,000 Canadian-made bikes from 400 docking stations across the city. The Mayor claims the scheme will generate an additional 40,000 cycle journeys each day and revolutionise transport in Central London.

The fleet, which will be maintained by Serco, the services group, is based on a scheme in Montreal that had more than a million users in its first year. Other cities have similar schemes. Paris’s Vélib, below, has become a favourite of tourists since it was launched in 2007 and now has 20,000 bikes at almost 1,700 locations. In Hangzhou, China, a scheme is said to have 40,000 bikes. Other cities with bike-sharing schemes include Berlin, Barcelona and Mexico City.

Merging this type of scheme onto an annual season ticket accross all modes would be a leap forward.

PVC, The Green Party has a dublin cycle plan plan which includes a commitment to do this
http://www.bikescheme.ie/green-party-cycle-plan-dublin

A Multi-Storey Bicycle park at Heuston Station
The Central Station at Amsterdam has a multi-storey floating bicycle park for 2,500 bicycles designed by an Irish architect. We’ll provide something similar on the River Liffey at Hesuton Station so that commuters can bike and train with ease to and from the city centre

I dont know if it will every be built but I believe the general idea has made it into the Dublin City Draft Development Plan there is an item in there Chapter 5.1.4.4
Basically meaning that such a facility could be in line with the Dev Plan and ease the planning app process but not much of a commitment form the council to built it. The Dept Transport will need to cough up the money and champion this project if it is ever to happen.

A new cycle parking strategy to provide guidance on the nature, quantum and
location of cycling parking facilities in the city to address cycle parking needs at public transport stops and interchange and other key destinations and attractions

Its great that the Green party have it in their policy; but is it in the programme for Government and is it funded?

Why I find this article very pertinent is that Montague by not tendering this could very easily have led the public to believe that JC Deceaux was the only operator in the market for the Velib scheme. Now we discover that the Dutch Railway company have run a supply and that a seperate services company are getting the nod from Boris who knows only too well that none of the London Corporations and City Councils would allow a mass cluttering of the city centre with permanent advertising installations and I’m sure they were offered significant sums by more than one party to get same installed.

I’d suggest someone in the Dept of Transport just ring Amsterdam to see what the costs are and ascertain what the charges would need to be; to make the proposal cost neutral to the exchequer; failing that granting Brompton a concession at the main stations to market fold up bikes would also help; apparently they are now so popular that there was a ‘World Championship’ for them last year.

next stop free public transport! just lease a tv station…