National Conf Centre
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Marriott group eyes Docklands site
Irish Independent, 26 February 2003“Top US hotel group Marriott is in negotiations with the Spencer Dock Development Company that could lead to the construction of a five star, 300-bed hotel, in Dublin’s dockside. The deal would be pending government approval of a National Conference Centre at the site.Property sources told the Irish Independent that while negotiations involved a number of top hotel groups, the Marriott is the one expected to go ahead at the development if the Government gives the conference centre the green light.”
if the Government gives the conference centre the green light??? I thought the conference centre was the only part of Spencer dock that did get the go ahead – or are we on the consultancy merry-go-round again?
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Hmmm – This could just be Treasury Holdings talking… I thought the NCC went bye bye with the rest of the old spencer dock – hence the questions above.
They could be bulding a hotel *anyway* on the site and are in talks to attract Marriott.
Their college green hotel was originally suposed to be Hilton – but the dev got scaled back (usual suspects) and Hilton said they couldn’t make money on X no. of rooms, so Westin stepped in.Maybe Mariott will only go in if the NCC goes ahead – but a hotel is going in anyway???
Ouch – my head hurts! -
That’s a confusing article alright.
As far as I know the development can go ahead from a planning point of view as defined in the area plan, which was approved by the minister of environment ages ago (N.Dempsey).
The developers/owners can go ahead and build either a conference center or a park on that site without having to reapply for planning. The government does not have to “approve” a conference center in any planning sense.
What the article refers to is that the developers want the government to cough up some of (all?) the cash. That is the green light they mean.
If there isn’t a significant profit available then the park will likely go ahead instead, some time. Maybe. Must surely be a particular concern to owners of the yet to be built Spencer dock apartments. -
Why the hell would they need a park on this prime bit of quayside – they are already going to build a linear park alongside the royal canal so why have a big park tacked on to the side of it. It’s quite windswept already in this area we need buildings not parks – to build a park would be an awful waste
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Ah the once proposed NCC ……alas now only a figment……what a wasted economic opportunity for the city and aesthetic opportunity for the dockside.
Roches once proposed glass tumbola beside Calatrava’s proposed harp like bridge with Bono’s and Gehrys proposed tower across the Liffey.
Lit up at night it could all look so wonderful too.
Alas we will get a space filler – a park …..trees and grass; which became prolific throughtout the city in the impoverished eighties making use of derelict land..or else we’ll get another hum drum concoction by Scott Tallon & Walker……..the Stock, Aiken & Waterman of Irish architecture today. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz. Forever shame on that tax exile Dermot Desmond and the Green Party et all for throwing the big spanner in the works of Spencer Dock. -
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Tom McEaney’s article in Sunday Times shed some light on whats happening here. Spencer Dock Development Company (private company, main shareholders are CIE and Treasury Holdings (Ronan, Barett et al.)) holds the development rights to the NCC site for 10 years but the site still belongs to CIE.
John O’Donoghue (minister of arts, sport, tourism (fun)) is expected to bring plans for NCC before dail this week. His department are still negotiating to obtain the site for free, presumably that would suit the SDDC too.
2 obstacles would then remain – building cost (150m) and running costs (ppp?). -
€150m… Hmmm – sounds like a Bertie Jet.
Conference Centres are notorious money losers (the centres themselves) – but benefit the city on a wider scale in terms of increased visitor numbers etc. So I’d say the running costs are going to be a big sticking point here. Maybe tack a few hotels/offices and apartments on the site too to subsidise the place – isn’t that Spencer Dock anyway?!? So Treasury will benefit from the taxpayers building the centre – and will not have to bear any burden for running it. class.
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How are these deals negotiated. PPP, more like taken for a ride! Read in papers today, that Kilcock to Kinnegad Bypass will cost EUR320 and government will fork out 170 million plus 100 million in land costs and the Private sector get to keep all the tolls for 30 years……..Nice work if you can get it!
What I cant understand is why not insist the same company build the bloody road all the way to Galway, talk about starting and stopping. Land costs must be controlled. A special court should be set up to settle them quickly;. Better accountability has to be enshrined in all these deals, or I fear more bloody tribunals
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Think of the poor barristers – when Charlie croaks, and we all forget about Rambo Burke… what will they do to maintain the lifestlye they’ve (we’ve provided) become accustomed to?!?
Niall, the only thing I’ll say in defence of the PPP deal above is at least after 30 years the taxpayer get the road back.
How many times over has the East Link been paid for by commuters??? -
PPP was my own speculation by the way, rather than a direct quote from any source. Info about current and future PPPs can be found at http://www.ppp.gov.ie/
They are, in the words of George Monbiot “an off-balance sheet fiddle” and as you said Nice work if you can get it!
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