Metro…….. if only….

I just compared the Copenhagen metro train with the Luas tram.
From what I can see a Copenhagen train set (consisting of 3 cars) can carry 300 people and a Luas tram (one car) can carry 235 people????????

Maybe you’re just counting seats on the Copenhagen one. The Luas capacity involves an awful lot of standing room and only about 100 seats or maybe less. Are you sure the capacity for the Luas is just one car? Other then that I can’t think of an explanation.

Just checked, here’s what they say>>>

Copenhagen Metro

‘The Metro consists of three cars with wide passages. The train is designed for many short trips. There are six wide doors on each side of the train and there are seats for about 100 of the total capacity of 300 passengers, with the rest standing’

Luas
‘The basic 30 metre tram can carry up to approximately 235 persons – 60 of whom will be seated’

I hope they open the exit doors on the Luas when it stops unlike the middle exit doors on Dublin buses. Why is it that our buses are the only buses in the known world that as deliberate policy fail to open the exit doors at bus stops and all have to enter and exit adjacent to the bus driver ??? Is it the undisciplined nature of Dublin bus’s passengers with more bunking on then fare paying passengers alighting ??

Papworth if you look, it is now only the older buses with middle doors. The new buses all have wider front doors and kneeling facilities as well as a wider gangway. Allows for more standing as well as wheelchairs and prams.

It is a disgrace that Dublin ( the capital of the 3rd richest country in the world ) has no decent transport options.

I’ve recently been to Singapore. Their MRT is exceptional. It runs underground inner city and surfaces further out. There are only 4 main lines, but they run exactly on time. We should strive to get something of this calibre in Dublin.

As for Dublin Bus…Booooo!!!! Terrible vehicles and staff. The bus service in Fiji ( a third world nation with a reputation for bad time keeping) would knock spots off Dublin Bus’ time keeping and staff.

‘3rd richest country in the world’…where are you getting that from John!? Dublin isnt THAT badly served by transport although there is a long way to go to create the infrastructure that befits a true 21st century city.
I agree with Singapore….its is beacon in terms of transport provision.
I think the interchanges on the lines (City Hall etc) in particular can teach us a lot about efficiency and good design… Tara/ Conolly Stations take note.
I dont fully agree with your Dublin Bus comments. I think the fleet is excellent, its just not managed very well. Terrible staff? When have you ever met a nice bus driver on any busy network? time keeping is the big issue but its complex and involves the creation of a lots more QBC – but then thats a huge bone of contention for the drive-loving public.

3rd highest gdp per capita, which is different from richest, lots of coutries with lower incomes have had high incomes for much longer. anyone who thinks that dublin transport in exceptional either way should live somewhere else for a while, there are worse, there are better.

I see the Copenhagen trains are 40m long. The luas on the tallaght to abbey street line will hold 235 passengers and is 30m long. It is to my knowledge that the trams on the sandyford line will be 40m long, as it runs on the old railway alignment, so I presume they will hold a similar amount to the copenhagen metros.

From the website the Copenhagen Metro trains look very similar to the Docklands light rail trains in London and they are driverless too! (Am I trying to convince myself that the Luas might amount to something.) I think the really big problem with the LUAS now is that we have lost the vital link between the North and South of the city. I remember in the original montages we could see a LUAS making its way around College Green. With hindsight it might have been as well to build this section and then the Metro afterwards. In the long term a tram and Metro would complement each other. (Especially with the good work the City Council have done to reduce traffic levels in the City Centre.)

FYI fact fans – appearently the reason that they did away with the centre door of the buses was due to union grumblings about one driver having to deal with two doors, so a compromise was reached in terms of having one less door for the poor dears to deal with.

This really is a joke of a country isn’t it – just came back from Croatia where the solitary driver has three doors to deal with – and they have no problems with that – why are we so different over here?

Interesting, although I don’t recall them opening the centre doors even when conductors were still around. Surely with a conducter and a driver this wouldn’t be that hard to manage….

And all the busses were full this morning (becasuse it rained). Full busses are certainly the best advert for driving into work.

fjp

Try full trains – they recently introduced less seating in the new carriages on the Drogheda/Dundalk line – so you now end up standing for over an hour on they way to work – puts you in a fantastic mood!

has there been any further movement or news on the metro system being proposed for dublin.the line from broadstone to the airport is going to be built on a right of way from the old line but how far out does this line go. it would be great to have an underground system in the city. the copenhagen tunnels look amazing and dublin is in dire need of a metro. but i guess we will just have to wait to wait and see what the govt approves in terms of the lines and if it will be done at all

Here again our woefully incompetent transport dept. have announced another delay in construction of the Luas.

On a related matter, what are the stops/shelters going to look like? Was in Strasbourg recently and was very impressed with the design of their terminals/tram stops.

Richard Rogers likes to relate a conversation he had not so long ago with the man in charge of the Madrid underground. Rogers is building the city’s new airport and the two men had met to discuss the extension of the subway system to serve the airport. “The meeting,” he says, “went something like this:

‘We need to link the airport to the tube.’

‘How many kilometres?’

‘Ten kilometres.’

‘Ten kilometres? We guarantee one kilometre per month – 10 months.’

‘We need two new stations.’

‘One month each – 12 months. If you want to be kind, give me 14 months.’ “

Rogers talks a lot about Spain these days. It’s Europe’s architectural hothouse, he says, what France was in the 80s. . . Just take his airport in Madrid: “It is the biggest infrastructure project in Europe. It’s three times the size of [Heathrow’s] Terminal Five which is our biggest airport in Britain. We won T5 as a competition 14 years ago and work hasn’t started yet; we won Madrid four years ago and it’s halfway up.”

It is hard not to find the comparisons a little depressing.

Full story: http://www.guardian.co.uk/Print/0,3858,4534221,00.html

Quote from yesterday’s Sunday Tribune – “The metro project for Dublin has been consigned to the bin” – can anyone confirm or deny this

Ah well …… thank God they started the Port Tunnel .. they have to finish it…they can’t stop now… especially with our minister in a hurry !!

I thought we were rolling in it? Didnt McCreevy say we were one of the wealthiest countries ever in the whole history of the world all because of his excellent management of the ecomony and that all those gobshites in Europe who didnt know a good thing when they saw it could take a jump….

I wonder what happened….

Still at least we’ll have the Port Tunnel – thats true. And a lovely new terminal at Dublin Airport courtsey of that great Irish philanthropist, Michael O’Leary. Oh and a C ring road around Dublin (never mind that auld castle)

Well if they ditch plans for the Metro then looks like we’ll all continue to complain about the transport problem for the next 20years…

Living in Stockholm now, a city with a pretty decent transport system and stats show that during peak periods 7 out of 10 passengers use public transport to the inner city !! And the Metro is central to this – in fact all the other bus and suburban trains work off it, ie connect to it at relevant points…

From personal experience, I’ve found out that you just cannot beat the Metro when going from A to B even when taking the bus on a similar route in quiet traffic…

A metro is the only way to move numbers in mass in the city centre quickly and efficiently… Why can’t they see this !!

Just to add, the company in charge of the transport system in Stockholm proudly claim that “almost” half of its costs are paid for via income from ticket sales !! Almost Half !! So expecting CIE/Dublin to make a profit every year is just a joke…

While stuck in Dublin’s gridlocked floodlocked traffic for 3 hours yesterday evening and only trying to travel less than 4 miles I tried to amuse myself by surfing the radio stations. All I could hear at home was Mc Creevey and his cutbacks and in particular the news that the Luas will be late and may not run (with passengers) until 2004 into 2005 never mind the fact that Metro is in the bin. I switched to BBC Radio 4s PM news programme for a break from Mc Creevey and Brennan’s excuses only to hear a news item on New Delhi’s Metro system which was “progressing at a furious rate” it makes an interesting read.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/2264358.stm

I can only presume that they just don’t care. The only hope for Dublin transport is if terrorists take Bertie hostage and threaten to kill him unless he actually makes a meaningful effort to sort this out. If only terrorists were that thoughtful…

So once again – if they’re not going to build a metro, QBC’s everywhere, frequent busses all the time. Let the traffic sit there and work it out while the busses roll by in complete freedom. They won’t make money but we’ll all be really happy.

fjp

(these opinions my own etc)

Actually looking at ther book of estimates (sounds biblical doesn’t it) and given our financial situation the country could and should borrow a few billion to invest in infrastructure -not wages, health, social welfare etc – infrastructure alone. Theres should be an infrastructure agency created as well. Although this would involve thing beyond the next five minutes…

I even hear Kabul is finishing a metro…:eek:

Also, I have to ask, what was the point if all these DTO’s, CIE’s DEPT. Transport etc. etc., yadi yah, blah, blah. Do they go on like: “Oh, I’m a transport consultant, I think we should build a metro from Donegal to Bantry. Cost? Billions! But just for telling you this I will charge you €500 million. Great! You’re not building it then?! Told you so!” GRRRRR…..:mad: 😡 😡

No government has the balls to do anything with infrastructure – they just keep farming it out to cosultants to look at whilst the price skyrockets. Any fool could tell you you need to bypass bottlenecks on roads, its just common sense. What do the palanning department of the Department of Transport do all day?

To the government I challenge you – come on build the motorways – build the rail lines you have a fucking 20 seat majority what more do you want???

” QBC’s everywhere, frequent busses all the time.”

And 24 hour bus lanes served with buses only in daytime, such as the airport road.
Oh, we have that already.

Been in Prgue recently, World War II, 40 years of Communism, a Hundred Year flood and still better public transport now than Dublin has. Still a 9% increase in fares will take the commuter out of the car.