Cut Stone Buildings in Cork

Cork’s GPO occupies an unusual intersection (Oliver Plunkett St, Pembroke Street, & Winthrop Street). The building underwent some renovation a few years ago and the exterior was cleaned. All in all, they did a pretty good job.
The laneway pictured (Pembroke Street) has beeing partially pedestrianised. In the photo, you can just make out the street barriers….these jack up at 11am thus closing off the street to deliveries and other traffic. This has been replicated on some of the other lanes leading onto Oliver Plunkett Street and has made life rather more enjoyable for the pedestrian.

Cork’s City Hall….after the burning of Cork by the Black & Tans, this building, together with Cashs (now Brown Thomas), and Roches Stores (soon to be Debenhams) were the signature buildings that defined Cork’s rebirth. The City Hall is currently undergoing some extensions and these have been mentioned elsewhere. You can just about make out the extension to the rear of one of the photos (together with the unusual “fin” on the roof of the extension…one of two).

Brilliant pictures and brilliant thread. Keep it going.

Agreed. Good to see some images of existing buildings in Cork again.

@corcaighboy wrote:

Hi there, I had some shots of some of Cork’s more interesting cut stone buildings and was not too sure where to post them given there is no specific thread on cut stone buildings. So I started this thread. First one up is the AIB bank on Cork’s South Mall. The old Munster & Leinster Bank is one beautiful building and is as nice inside as outside.

Hi Corcaighboy!

As you have started a thread on cut stone buildings in Cork, it migth be useful to indicate an endless source of lore on their construction]Stone Mad[/I] first published in 1966 when the stone cutting business was on its last legs. The book has been recently reprinted and is published by Routledge and Kegan Paul; London. The ISBN is 0 7100 1872 X. I give you a few specimen pages below in compensation for the disruption of your quiet coffee yesterday morning:

http://www.amazon.com/Stone-Mad-Seamus-Murphy/dp/1903464811/sr=1-1/qid=1157996568/ref=pd_bbs_1/103-0677851-9871816?ie=UTF8&s=books

Here are two shots of the Cork Savings Bank on Lapp’s Quay. I particularly like this building, and will forever lament the fact that they built Connolly Hall next to it! 🙁

Cork Court House

St. Patrick’s, Lower Glanmire Road, Cork (Geroge Pain, 1836)

St. Mary’s, Pope’s Quay, Cork (Kearns Dean, 1832-1839)

BT’s…

Holy Trinity

The Cork Butter Exchange

The New Custom House aka The Cork Harbour Commission (1818) by WIlliam Hargrave

St. Patrick’s Bridge (1859-1861)

Designed by Sir John Benson and built by Joshua Hargrave

The bridge is 60 feet and 6 inches wide spanning 168 feet.

Obviously, guff is not restricted to the liturgical moguls. I would love to know who put this specimen togeher. The original building was destroyed by fire, we are told. You would never realize from that that we are talking of mass arson!

http://www.buildingsofireland.com/niah/search.jsp?county=CO&regno=20513082&type=record

But, it does show Egans. And, if they are interested, some of the gutted fittings are in the foyer ofChristies hotel in Blarney. So much for conservation.

@Praxiteles wrote:

The Cork Butter Exchange

That is a nice image you posted above Praxiteles. I think this is one of the nicest parts of Cork City.

unfortiunately, I could not get an arial image of the Firkin Crane to show off just how interesting the building is. Can you do something about it? We should not forget that in the older parts of the city, whose glory was already faded by the 19th. century, there are good examples of stone cut buildings.

Parliament Bridge, Cork (1808)

Are there any more recent examples around the city?

Some of the new building in UCC perhaps?

@Praxiteles wrote:

The Cork Butter Exchange

taken from here
http://www.irish-architecture.com/buildings_ireland/cork/cork/index.html

The Pavillion Cinema, Patrick’s Street, Cork

Well known for its splendid tea-rooms on the first floor behind the venetian windows!

@Praxiteles wrote:

Parliament Bridge, Cork (1808)

Haven’t been to Cork for a while but I can’t belive that that building above the bridge is still vacant. Such a prominent site! I’m assuming that this picture is recent of course..

It’s not vacant insofar as it’s undergoing redevelopment after 40 yrs of dereliction, however what going in is a uPVC and cheap builders aggregate nightmare. I think one of the other Cork threads has pictures of recent movement on site.

Here are some more imeages of Brown Thomas on Patrick Street. In my view, the most graceful building on Cork’s main street. Looks classy and refined, even compared to the Roches Stores building next to it.

And opposite Brown Thomas, the old Cudmore’s fruit/sweet store, now a Vodafone outlet. This building has two very graceful curved glass windows in front. Lost a bit of its charm now that it is no longer a kid’s emporium of delight!

First up is a shot of Penny’s shop on Patrick Street. Forgive my photography skills…I really have to learn how to take proper photos!

And here is a shot of the old Egan’s shop, now River Island or some such clothing outlet. Egan’s is the building to the left of the photo. Obviously, if anyone can shed more light on the architects or builders, then fire away. Thankfully, in most of the buildings mentioned here (Custom House, Brown Thomas, Cudmores), the old wooden window frames have not been replaced by PVC equivalents 😮

@corcaighboy wrote:

Here are some more imeages of Brown Thomas on Patrick Street. In my view, the most graceful building on Cork’s main street. Looks classy and refined, even compared to the Roches Stores building next to it.

And opposite Brown Thomas, the old Cosgroves fruit/sweet store (I think!), now a Vodafone outlet. This building has two very graceful curved glass windows in front. Lost a bit of its charm now that it is no longer a kid’s emporium of delight!

I think it used to be Cudmore’s sweet shop!

Penneys first Cork shop was in the Queens Old Castle – there is/ was a cell-like room in it that the Sheares brothers were reputed to have been held in. I remember the present shop as the Munster Arcade; I recall Cudmore’s shop as being out of picture to the right???
KB

Correct re the Queen’s old castle; correct re. Penny’s present location being the Munster arcade; but the buikding next to it is William Egan’s, goldrsmiths. Im fully certain that the shop on the corner of Wintrop St. was a sweet shop. Who could have forgotten those acres of temptation posted in the rounded windows?

Apologies…you are right…it was Cudmores Shop. Either I have been out of Cork too long or the memory is fading…or perhaps both;)

@Praxiteles wrote:

Who could have forgotten those acres of temptation posted in the rounded windows?

😀 only bettered by the shop on MacCurtain St that sold stink-bombs, Airfix, Dinkys, Corgis and fireworks…. was it HC Stores?

The ground floor of Woolworths in Patrick’s St. was not bad either!

The map below gives a fairly detailed overwiew of the situation in the centre of Cork after the arsonist incendiarism of the Black and Tans unleashed to terrorize the general punlic on 11 December 1920.

The image below shows the east side of Patrick’s Street in 1907. Mangan’s jeweller’s shop can be identified for the clock is outside the door.

The general markets on the Coal Quay in 1893. We hear that the building is about to be restored.

Praxiteles – Did Mangan’s become Ryans, the Blackthorn House? I seem to recall it along there somewhere…
Thanks
KB

Not as far as I am aware. WHile not certain, I think Mangan’s continued practically up tot he time the whole bloc was demolished to make room for the red brick-crazed monstrosity from around the corner on the quay. Maybe Corcaighboy or Phil might be able to help?

@Praxiteles wrote:

Maybe Corcaighboy or Phil might be able to help?

Interesting thread, but I don’t think I can be of any help.

@KerryBog2 wrote:

Praxiteles – Did Mangan’s become Ryans, the Blackthorn House? I seem to recall it along there somewhere…
Thanks
KB

I think the Blackthorn House was down where Clarkes shoe shop is now, almost on the corner of Princes Street.

I’m not trying to make anyone feel old, but when was it that Woolworths closed down? All my life I’ve been hearing about all the auld ones buying toffee in Wolleys in like… the thirties or there abouts. How long were they open and what forced them to leave? Also, corcaighboy, tell me mind me own business if you want, but have you moved to Singapore from HK?

Not at all boy! Woolworths was there up to 80s, I would say.

@lawyer wrote:

I think the Blackthorn House was down where Clarkes shoe shop is now, almost on the corner of Princes Street.

I think that the Blackthorn House was one up from Clarkes shop towards Prince’s Street.

Also great photo of the Coal Quay, especially the general markets building on the left, I believe a restoration is in progress. A fantastic building. Cork should be proud of her heritage.

Guy’s 1925 Directory for Cork tells us that the Blackthorn House, M. A. Ryan, was situated at no. 46 Patrick Street.

Praxiteles – I think you are right…I remember Mangans being open into the early 80’s. I think they may have relocated for a while. Don’t forget, most of Merchants Quay lay derelict while they were consolidating the site. Alas, the Merchants Quay shopping center which replaced the buildings on the quay and the corner fronting onto Patrick Street is a distressingly ugly piece of work, although at the time it was the only development in the city center and was thus welcomed, warts and all.

Aha – Woolworths closed in 1982/3 I believe. At the time, it was big news (even getting the headline in the Echo :rolleyes: . Everything was doom and gloom back then as Dunlops, Fords, and the dockyard all shut within the space of two years. Re your question: Yes, I moved from Hong Kong to Singapore around a year ago but simply forgot to change my location details on Archiseek. Singapore may be a Disneyworld with the death penalty, but they sure know how to do town planning, urban transport, and public housing. Certainly alot we could learn from them.

MacLeinin – Here are some recent shots I took of the Coal Quay. There is alot of redevelopment going on there at present, particularly on the old Guys site. One of the buildings is now a popular bar/restaruant called Bodegas.

@Praxiteles wrote:

Guy’s 1925 Directory for Cork tells us that the Blackthorn House, M. A. Ryan, was situated at no. 46 Patrick Street.

I know it is wandering from Cork Cut Stone Buildings but this link provides directories of Patrick Street, which may be of interest
http://www.corkpastandpresent.ie/places/patrick_directory.shtml

@lawyer wrote:

I know it is wandering from Cork Cut Stone Buildings but this link provides directories of Patrick Street, which may be of interest
http://www.corkpastandpresent.ie/places/patrick_directory.shtml

Thanks for the link, Lawyer. It would be interesting to see what has disappeared from Patrick Street bewteen the 1976 and 1997 editions of the street directory. Has it even been published since 1997? Typical problem to be seen in the mainthorougfares of many cities: decline of the traditional businesses and their substitutionn with rag shops!

Lawyer – Many thanks for posting that link. Never saw it before but it is indeed a treasure trove of info on Cork’s past. Love the listing of business names down the years…Newsom’s Cafe de Paris in particular sounds like they had some nice cakes to go with the coffee 🙂
And on the subject of old business and commercial names down the years, attached is a photo of a floor mosaic which is at the main entrance of the Imperial Hotel, which thankfully has been retained down the years.

@Praxiteles wrote:

Thanks for the link, Lawyer. It would be interesting to see what has disappeared from Patrick Street bewteen the 1976 and 1997 editions of the street directory. Has it even been published since 1997? Typical problem to be seen in the mainthorougfares of many cities: decline of the traditional businesses and their substitutionn with rag shops!

As you can see, it is an extract from Thom’s Commercial Directory which is published each year [at a cost of €142.50 plus VAT] Maybe the info. has to be a few years old before Cork City Council can publish on a site like this – free of charge.
I’m afraid that Patrick Street is now no better than a typical U.K. ‘High Street’ and will be worse when Roche’s Stores goes.

@corcaighboy wrote:

Aha – Woolworths closed in 1982/3 I believe. At the time, it was big news (even getting the headline in the Echo :rolleyes: . Everything was doom and gloom back then as Dunlops, Fords, and the dockyard all shut within the space of two years. Re your question: Yes, I moved from Hong Kong to Singapore around a year ago but simply forgot to change my location details on Archiseek. Singapore may be a Disneyworld with the death penalty, but they sure know how to do town planning, urban transport, and public housing. Certainly alot we could learn from them.

Thanks and yes, I suppose it’s no wonder Woolworths left Cork at that particular time. Urban transport keeps coming up again and again when it comes to Cork. I’ve seen villages with better transport links than what we have. Fingers crossed it will improve over the next few years.

@lawyer wrote:

I’m afraid that Patrick Street is now no better than a typical U.K. ‘High Street’ and will be worse when Roche’s Stores goes.

You make it sound as if U.K. High Streets are bad. Yes I think it will be a terribly sad day when Roches closes its doors, but when it comes to it, people want those British stores that are popping up everywhere, without having to go to London for the day shopping. Next, Debenhams, River Island, Argos…. what city doesn’t want to attract these? I think the crime of it is, is that they are all located on Patrick St. They would be far more suited to out of town shopping centres and leave home grown stores to Pana (excluding Dunnes and their manky green signage, those I’m just plain sick of). Oliver Plunkett St. is my favourite street in Cork. It’s one local shop after another and they are all thriving. It’s sort of a Catch 22 though, because if you take the popular stores out of Patrick St……. then who will shop there?

@A-ha wrote:

Thanks and yes, I suppose it’s no wonder Woolworths left Cork at that particular time. Urban transport keeps coming up again and again when it comes to Cork. I’ve seen villages with better transport links than what we have. Fingers crossed it will improve over the next few years.

You make it sound as if U.K. High Streets are bad. Yes I think it will be a terribly sad day when Roches closes its doors, but when it comes to it, people want those British stores that are popping up everywhere, without having to go to London for the day shopping. Next, Debenhams, River Island, Argos…. what city doesn’t want to attract these? I think the crime of it is, is that they are all located on Patrick St. They would be far more suited to out of town shopping centres and leave home grown stores to Pana (excluding Dunnes and their manky green signage, those I’m just plain sick of). Oliver Plunkett St. is my favourite street in Cork. It’s one local shop after another and they are all thriving. It’s sort of a Catch 22 though, because if you take the popular stores out of Patrick St……. then who will shop there?

Its great to have the local stores thriving in Cork but the neglect of the upper storys of their buildings all over the city is adding to their unnattractivness as a shop as one thing that the UK stores do is at least re-paint the facades.
Whats the storey with the 1200mmhigh steel bollards on Oliver Plunkett Street ? They have been left there for 18 months and are terrible.

The M A Ryan at Blackthorn House was the grandfather of the Arbutus Lodge Ryans.
On the other side of the street I remember a chemist named McSweeney that developed my photos before I saved enough pocket-money to buy my own developing tank! (B & W of course, in those days colour required 23 chemicals and numerous washes!)
Woolworths ran into difficulties worldwide – the Irish operations were among the first to be wound down; by the 1970s the shops were very tired and even by the standard of the day were outmoded and incapable of moving with the times. Their HQ in Downtown Manhattan is a beautiful old building. In the mid 1990s they had changed into a weird cross between food, hardware and toy retailer. In about 1998/9 they sold off the remaining Manhattan retail properties, FootLocker bought most of them.
Corcaighboy -la, the comparisons between Singapore and Ireland (people, economy and attitude) were much closer and more real in the 1990s, remember they had Orchard Rd long before we had Dundrum! Bugis Street was real and not a covered shopping centre, a place to go if you could put up with the smell from the durian vendors. The Asian Tiger back then was called a 12345 economy, (one wife, two kids, 3 roomed house, 4 good wheels and a high 5-figure salary to maintain it all.)
KB

Here is another one for the list of stone cut building in Cork: William Murray’s Provincial Bank (now the headquarters of the quondam Cork Examiner.

For further information see here: http://www.irish-architecture.com/buildings_ireland/cork/cork/aib.html

@Spinal Tap wrote:

Its great to have the local stores thriving in Cork but the neglect of the upper storys of their buildings all over the city is adding to their unnattractivness as a shop as one thing that the UK stores do is at least re-paint the facades.

Agreed, but at least the old stone buildings have been cleaned up enormously. Thinking back even just five years, I remember the dirt that was on some of the buildings from traffic and the like, but they must have cleaned them all for Cork 2005, because the majority of them are clean(ish) at this stage.

Here is a shot of the Old Albert Quay railway terminus building (the West Cork line). Behind was the station platform…which was recently demolished and re-developed into enterprise units for Enterprise Ireland. The terminus building was extensively refurbished and looks quite well. Given its prominent position next to City Hall and its complimentary style, I always thought it would have made a good ‘Mansion House’ equivalent for the Mayor of Cork.

And this is a shot looking at the building from behind. The new Enterprise Ireland building is very much a Scott Tallon Walker design. A bit too gray for some, and I still can’t decide whether I like it or not. The Eglinton Street tower (The Elysian!) is being constructed behind the EI building.

What is going to happen if someone decides that it would be a good thing to re-open the West Cork line?

@corcaighboy wrote:

Here is a shot of the Old Albert Quay railway terminus building (the West Cork line). Behind was the station platform…which was recently demolished and re-developed into enterprise units for Enterprise Ireland. The terminus building was extensively refurbished and looks quite well. Given its prominent position next to City Hall and its complimentary style, I always thought it would have made a good ‘Mansion House’ equivalent for the Mayor of Cork.

A beautiful little building indeed – a pity it doesn’t have some sort of civic function.

@Praxiteles wrote:

What is going to happen if someone decides that it would be a good thing to re-open the West Cork line?

Well, there is unfortunately no possibility of them using the old rail allignment, which was converted and widened into what is now known as the South Link Road in 1984 (all the way to the ‘magic’ Kinsale roundabout). In fact, just to the west of the ‘magic roundabout’ one could until recently still view the old stone railway bridge. It was demolished during construction of the roundabout flyover.

This is what you have with the “quality” planning that leads to the Kinsale roundabout. The new northern approach road into the city was built with no shunts to the left or to the right: result – chaos as people turning right just had no other option but to hold up the entire place. Plenty of “quality” planning in Cork!!

@Praxiteles wrote:

What is going to happen if someone decides that it would be a good thing to re-open the West Cork line?

😉 you will never get a job with Cork City Council Praxiteles, not with that type of forward thinking.

Just as a matter of interest, is the cut-stone pier on the extreme left of the picture still there? The gate appears to have been widened. Should it not be still in position, I am afraid the symmetry of the composition will have been displaced. And, I am not sure that the gate on the far left of the picture is symmetrical with the one on the right of the picture.

@corcaighboy wrote:

Well, there is unfortunately no possibility of them using the old rail allignment, which was converted and widened into what is now known as the South Link Road in 1984 (all the way to the ‘magic’ Kinsale roundabout). In fact, just to the west of the ‘magic roundabout’ one could until recently still view the old stone railway bridge. It was demolished during construction of the roundabout flyover.

I should probably put this in the Cork Transport thread, but…

Technically, it wouldn’t be too difficult to cut and cover along the South Link road. Of course, it would cause major disruption during construction and cost-wise should have been done when the road was built, but on a technical level, it’s definitely feasible.

@jungle wrote:

I should probably put this in the Cork Transport thread, but…

Technically, it wouldn’t be too difficult to cut and cover along the South Link road. Of course, it would cause major disruption during construction and cost-wise should have been done when the road was built, but on a technical level, it’s definitely feasible.

I cannot imagine the disruption being any more noticeable than it is at present on the way to the merry-go-round that is the Kinsale roundabout.

Ok, not too sure these buildings qualify as ‘cut-stone’ but they are impressive regardless. First up are these two on Emmet Place (opposite the Crawford Gallery).

Next up is the Bridewell Garda Station on the Coal Quay (Cornmarket Street). The ‘four faced liar’ (Shandon) is on the hill behind. No matter where you go in Cork City, Shandon is visible from almost everywhere. A pretty impressive structure!

And lastly, these three shots are of the old Cork Model School (opposite City Hall). Restored several years ago and now used as a courthouse.

and nice detail in the entrance

and the tower

@corcaighboy wrote:

Ok, not too sure these buildings qualify as ‘cut-stone’ but they are impressive regardless. First up are these two on Daunt Square (opposite the Crawford Gallery).

Next up is the Bridewell Garda Station on the Coal Quay (Cornmarket Street). The ‘four faced liar’ (Shandon) is on the hill behind. No matter where you go in Cork City, Shandon is visible from almost everywhere. A pretty impressive structure!

And lastly, these three shots are of the old Cork Model School (opposite City Hall). Restored several years ago and now used as a courthouse.

and nice detail in the entrance

and the tower

Yes, you’re right they don’t qualify as cut stone buildings, brick I’m sure you will agree. Another thing that’s not Daunt Square, it’s Emmet Place. Daunt Square is the area near the Former Woodford Bourne Store (McDonald’s now). Correct me if I’m wrong.

Funny how directions in Cork are always qualified with Opposite such and such, near the GPO etc. Street signage down there is hopeless!

Nice Pictures though! 🙂

anto – You are right, they are not cut stone, but they were the last of the pictures I took and they probably seemed more relevant to this thread than some of the others such as Developments in Cork, etc. And you are spot on re signage and my knowledge of place names….have been out of Cork too long that I have forgotten all the names of the secondary streets and squares, hence the ‘opposite to’, etc. If anything else, it gives any non-local some idea of where things are. You are also correct re the name of the square….have changed it to Emmet Place. And speaking of Woodford Bourne, I have some nice shots of that building, but it is one that certainly does not qualify as cut stone or red-brick:o Cheers, CB

And just in case we overlook the obvious: St Anne’s, Shandon, built in 1750:

Speaking of St. Anne’s in Shandon, does anybody know what happened to the classical urns that used to grace the corners of each level of the tower? Who took them off?

@Praxiteles wrote:

Just as a matter of interest, is the cut-stone pier on the extreme left of the picture still there? The gate appears to have been widened. Should it not be still in position, I am afraid the symmetry of the composition will have been displaced. And, I am not sure that the gate on the far left of the picture is symmetrical with the one on the right of the picture.

That’s some extension! Farly overwhelms the original building!

I agree…and I would love to get my hands on the clowns that left that go through. At the very least, it should not have obscured the roof line of the original building, nor projected beyond its sides. But, is the pier there?

@Praxiteles wrote:

I agree…and I would love to get my hands on the clowns that left that go through. At the very least, it should not have obscured the roof line of the original building, nor projected beyond its sides. But, is the pier there?

😡 City Manager, Joe Gavin put a proposel before CCC to Dispose of this house and the site behind for 2.5 million euro. Councillors refused to allow the sale but agreed a compromise to dispose of the site now built on for 2.25 million.
Joe Gavin value on Albert Quay house therefore seems to be 250,000 euro, any takers??? :rolleyes:
See CCC minutes item 4 below
http://www.corkcorp.ie/citycouncil/minutes/290305.pdf

@kite wrote:

😡 City Manager, Joe Gavin put a proposel before CCC to Dispose of this house and the site behind for 2.5 million euro. Councillors refused to allow the sale but agreed a compromise to dispose of the site now built on for 2.25 million.
Joe Gavin value on Albert Quay house therefore seems to be 250,000 euro, any takers??? :rolleyes:
See CCC minutes item 4 below
http://www.corkcorp.ie/citycouncil/minutes/290305.pdf

Joe Gavin, obviously, is working himself up to a few neat stitches on his Bayeux Tapestery, aka The knitted Map of Cork, on this one. The forward palnning here has been a tour de force -first, disactivate the railway line, then disactivate the railway station, then sell-off the raiway platforms, then devalue the price of the railway station building by ensuring that it does not even have a back yard and then note everything in the Corporation minutes!!

And here is what must be the last cut-stone church built in Cork: St. Augustine’s in Washington Street. The building is not yet finished. the facade was supposed to have been built onto the Grand Parade but progress seem to be rather slow:

@Praxiteles wrote:

Speaking of St. Anne’s in Shandon, does anybody know what happened to the classical urns that used to grace the corners of each level of the tower? Who took them off?

The “Pineapples” that graced the corners are back in position for over a year now as they wer removed during restoration works.

Correct, all of the pineapples were removed a few years ago for restoration and 8 new concrete replicas have been put in position in the last year or so. The four at the viewing platform have yet to be replaced. I don’t understand why.

Were the originals concrete or cut-stone?

Here are some images of the Cork School of Commerce. Cut stone facade, although concrete was used extensively elsewhere in the buildling. First image is of the building from the side. The top floor was added a few years ago and works pretty well with the rest of the building.

I like the stonework on the front entrance. Nothing too spectacular, but impressive all the same. I love the doors, which I imagine are teak.

Cork coat of arms

Courtesy of Alan from Cobh a study of St. Patrick’s, Glanmire Road, Cork