B…B…Bertie’s Bowl looks like unmaterializing

The GAA should be forced to open the stadium especially if they want funding.

[This message has been edited by Paul Clerkin (edited 15 October 2001).]

Yep and wouldnt we all be better off if they renovated Lansdowne Road instead. No rugby fan in their right mind wants a stadium in one of the most inaccessable parts of Dublin. Lansdowne is a perfect site – just like Murrayfield – 25 minutes walk from the centre of town, DART access – sure you may not be able to park close to the place but maybe the 10 minute walk will do you good.

In today’s Guardian…even the english like Landsdowne…..
http://sport.guardian.co.uk/columnists/story/0,10260,574019,00.html

http://www.mapflow.com/webdemo/demomap.asp?click=zoomout&map=transform&x=MzE4MDYy&y=MjMzMTE2&z=MTI%3D&hnme=&hadd=TEFORFNET1dORSBURVJSQUNFLCBCQUxMU0JSSURHRSwgRFVCTElO&hclss=U2VsZWN0

Just look at this arial picture of Landsdowne Road stadium – I think it is quite evident that even an 80,000 seat stadium could be built on the space available here – the stadium would have to be built perpendicular to the present one. It would be a fantastic stadium in the perfect location and with a retractable roof it would proof to be very popular with all sorts of events.
[This message has been edited by PaulC (edited 15 October 2001).]

[This message has been edited by PaulC (edited 15 October 2001).]

[This message has been edited by PaulC (edited 15 October 2001).]

[This message has been edited by PaulC (edited 15 October 2001).]

right enuff…. lots of space there… is it all theirs?

Yes it is – I think the pitch at the side of the stadium is used by the Landsdowne Club for training and small club matches.

Yep – lansdowne own all the land around and there was the plan to turn the Stadium 90 degrees a few years ago. If they go to Blanchardstown with the stadium all the pagentry and tradition will be lost. As the Guardian says one of the best pleasures is the journey to the game – the fact that you can walk from St Stephens green and there are pubs along the way. If you have to drive to the stadium you (a) will have huge jams to sit in (b) will not have a drink because you are driving – this in turn will lead to a loss of the good natured cameraderie and will make the entire event sterile and bland.

We are not like English Soccer Fans, we don’t get legless and start a fight – part of the tradition of going to a match is to have a few drinks before and after with your friends (a lot of whom you do not get the chance to meet otherwise). If this is the case its yet another sign of the world becoming more anti social.

Sorry about the rant but I really feel that this is important.

I dont think you are ranting at all – I agree entirely and I think a lot of poeple would be of the same opinion. I think I might write a letter into the Irish Times on this.

so you think Bertie is giving up? I would not be so sure

Did you read the piece on the archeire frontpage written by the P45 soccer correspondant?

What’s going on with the stadium, deepnote? You’re usually well informed with the latest gossip!

WELL.. infacta…. stall the ball.
So much effort seems to have gone into this project at the start… and apartemtly little thought about the logistics issue.
Anywhere else a fast and efficient public transport (both rail and bus) would have been the first thing to go in, rather than here (if we were lucky) the other-way -round kind of thing.
Seems funny to me, I thought this obvious issue would have brought the project down…. seems now it didnt even need that.

not forgetting the curling! check out the irish curling association’s fixture list
http://freespace.virgin.net/christine.furey/events.htm

Originally posted by ro_G:
not forgetting the curling! check out the irish curling association’s fixture list

you and your curling

there is also the need for ancillary sports that were going to be catered for by bertiebowl. e.g. an ice rink.

It’s fairly difficult skating on the carpet in Des Kelly’s Ice Rink on the NCR and the horses grazing in Dolphin’s Barn Rink make it very difficult for associations like the Irish Ice Hockey Association or the Irish Curling Association to organize any events.

The Oddyssey in Belfast is something we should be looking to in any Bertie’s Bowels discussions. They are maintaing regular crowds at the Ice Hockey and Southern Ireland is well overdue some investment on non Soccer/Gaa/Rugby spectator sports.

and i want to go to the winter olympics in 2006 so….
http://www.odysseyarena.com/technicalinformation-sportsplans.asp

I agree, would love to see a proper ice hockey arena so Dublin can have the franchise for the UK hockey league that is reportedly there for the city, if we get our act together.

Mary Harney’s waistline has very little to do with this debate. Libelling a government minister is a surefire way of attracting the wrong sort of attention for any website, especially one seeking funding from arts council or other government bodies.

GregF said wasteline, not waistline. Clearly, there’s a difference. Frankly, I’m intrigued.

the BB should be built but they have gone about this all wrong. It should be a phased development with different components added to it over time. Frankly I think it would be a huge mistake to redevelop Landsdowne Road simply because a residential area should not haver to deal the huge influxes of people these stadia generate. The same applies to Croke Park – although that is hallowed turf. Look at the problems Wembley causes. Best build out of down in a dedicated area.

From John Burns, runs the Irish Curling Association, currently based in Scotland

The Olympic Gold Medal has changed everyone’s vision of curling. Dundonald International Ice Bowl has now offered us ice time in September and thereafter and we will be basing a Development Officer there for two months. We would be delighted to have a party up from Dublin for the day then, and hope they would later be prime movers in curling at Abbotstown when that facility opens.
I’ll keep your name on file and contact you nearer September- if you can be patient till then! Best wishes- John Burns

hopefully the recent ice hockey and curling focus will revitalise the ‘peripheral’ activities the BB promised.

anyone interested in the curling trip to Dundonald leave your name with the barman

[This message has been edited by ro_G (edited 24 February 2002).]

there is such oppostion to te b b bertie bowl ecause ppl are not happy for us to be sucsefull it is a bad impression for ppl to come and see are stadium (landsdown road )probaley the wrong spelling other countrys such as wales have fine stadium millenium stadium Rember good work presented badly is still bad work p.s sorry about apling spelling

Greg, O’Connell Street redeveloped by 2008, you say…….more like 2108, at the present rate!

Whatever happens with this Euro 2008 bid and Croke Park, I think a new stadium will have to be built anyway. I just can’t see the FAI and particularly the IRFU playing their fixtures long-term in a GAA ground. Why would they want to pay rent to the GAA which would then be used to take players away from their respective sports at grass-roots level and towards the GAA?

The IRFU own their own stadium (crap and all as it is), there’s no way they’d want to become tenants of one of their major rivals. In all this furore over Croke Park and Stadium Ireland, nobody seems to have asked either of these associations what they’d loke to do.

By the way, I don’t think an Ireland/Scotland bid would win the championships anyway, purely because 5 of the eight stadia are in just two cities, which would cause enormous crowd control/hooliganism problems.

Looking at the sport pages in the Times today, and I came across the stadiums that could host Euro 2008. Scotland has three football stadiums with over 50,000 capacity. Presently, we have zero. And would it be so bad if football was played at Croke park, even just for Euro 2008.

And another thing, does anyone know of any Irish football league teams stadium’s capacites? And who has the biggest?

yes Blain, I agree, we probobly wound not be chosen, anyway.

As far as Eircom League grounds go, Shelbournes ground, Tolka Park, is probably the biggest – about 10k all-seated, but getting a bit old. Dalymount has had a new stand built and seats put on the old terraces, making it about a 6 or 7k ground, excluding standing.

Longfords ground is actually one of the best in the league. Its about 6k all seater, recently rebuilt and a benchmark for all other regional grounds. Turners Cross in Cork has about the same number of seats but is very constrained development wise by houses all around. None of the rest are really worth talking about as yet.

For all ye who are just interested in english football, the league here is improving, and so what if its not a great standard – if you like football you should support your local team anyway, as well as your english team. If you don’t like football disregard all that.

Dont rule us out, i doubt Turkey/Greece will be successful, due to the violent nature of Turkish supporters, i reckon the main competition is from the Scandinavian countries…

Croke Park will soon be able to hold 80,000+ (pending revised planning permission to allow standing on Hill 16) and it seems likely to me that its only a matter of time before the GAA opens up Croker to “other codes” – the motion last year was only defeated by a tiny majority. The GAA owe the government, and the people; grant aid for Croke Park was very generous, and they know it too.

Also, should Bertie still be Taoiseach in a few months, and it seems likely that he will be, Stadium Ireland will go ahead – support for same has grown considerably (as soon as people copped on that their was a possible bid for a major championships in the pipeline.)
Has anybody looked at the Sports Campus website (http://www.csid.ie) the plan is enormous, no wonder it was costed at €1bn +, there is no reason why we cant start with the stadium itself and then construct the other facilities as finance permits 🙂

been laying low, taking cover more like it…don’t want to be hit in the crossfire

so Bertie gets elected and the stadium comes to pass after all, OPW runs the show, no one remembers Paddy or Laura, no more fast and loose, or fast and dear

now how to keep the consortia who have submitted proposals interested and not reaching for the phone to call the lawyers????

why do things the easy way when the Irish way is so much more entertaining?

the fun is just beginning – again

i love this country

Peter, there will be no standing on Hill 16 – it’s all seated now.

Well as one who like Blain has an interest in LOI football and can see the huge potential for two top stadia and teams in Dublin if only Irish business types would invest in the home game. A huge audience and business return awaits the inevitable development of the home game. No reason why Dublin can’t support two top teams and stadia ala Glasgow and in domestic football terms once little Norway.

Norwegian domestic football never had to compete with GAA, Rugby and the deliberate discrimination (Government, Christian Brothers & Gaelgoeries et.all) against Irish domestic soccer that existed here well into the late 70s , this is the main reason we are so lacking in stadia and facilities.

By the way well done Dundalk and to a great club (Shells) football must be won on the pitch. Roll on the World Cup.

[This message has been edited by Papworth (edited 08 April 2002).]

i agree that irish football is not widely followed but with this new campus there may be a renewed interest in all sport and might spur on the interest…it would be nice to see all the stadiums around the country being improved so that maybe in all the major cities we have at least some quality stadiums…as regards the gaa, they are dragging there heels this morning on the issue of playing all sports on there pitches as they are worried about their local pitches being invaded…i say let them off because they are being f**kers about it build a state of the art campus and exclude them from all facilities. why does it need them to be on board?
i don’t see the reason why…they have their own stadium… as a football player and an avid fan i don’t understand the rugby aspect either as it will just make the pitch be like lansdowne…it was disgraceful for the last friendly…with a new stadium we can maybe get a champions league final,uefa cup final or something equally massive and the amount of revenue would be enormous…hopefully the pd’s will drop their small minded objections and like peter said earlier build it in phases to settle out the cost.

[This message has been edited by FIN (edited 09 April 2002).]

Paul, is there any chance of chancing the title of this topic? I really think it’s unfair to insult someone about a stammer.

The whole Euro 2008 bid was a bit half-assed to he honest, and while you’ll probably find that most of the rival bids are similarly half-assed, ours was particularly bad. Apart from at this end having no stadiums, the Scots are proposing to use three stadiums in Glasgow, thats like sending out a written invitation to hooligans because there’ll be several groups based around the same city.

On the issue of the National Stadium, its obvious to all that its badly needed. The Croke Park thing is a feeble cop-out used by the anti-sport lobby such as Mary Hungry and her soon to be much smaller in number shower. The only people who want to see football or Rugby at Croke Park are know-nothing politicians, the FAI and IRFU are not even interested in playing there and quite rightly so. Who wants to be the GAA’s tenant and be at the mercy of their whims?

Just look at the state of the Lansdowne pitch during the USA game, never mind the state of the rest of the stadium. A stadium on a greenfield site is preferable to rebuilding Lansdowne, because we could still play at lansdowne while its being built rather than having no option but to play our games in a different country, say Liverpool otherwise. That would be a huge embarassment to the country, even more of a national embarassment than the state of Lansdowne, or the state of Mary Harney.

The GAA was only helping Bertie out with the National Stadium. It looks like it will go ahead after all. It will be interesting to see how the process will be managed with the recent changes at CSID. Any speculations?

[This message has been edited by deepnote (edited 24 April 2002).]