Rubbish

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  • #759784
    Daragh
    Participant

    The main reason why Dublin city is so dirty, and will remain so for the distant future, is quite simply because its citizens don’t give a shit.
    I’m always amazed at how little Dubliners care for the city in which they live. Whereas littering would be something that would be grossly frowned upon in almost every other European country (bar the U.K. perhaps), it seems an entirely exceptable thing for people here to do. Whether it be throwing away your McDonald’s bag, spitting out your chewing gum, or even urinating on the streets, it’s all an O.K. thing for people in Dublin to do. And with regards to the debate surrounding the problem of chewing gum, I think the stuff should simply be banned. The Environment Minister’s response to the problem was simply a joke, and a perfect example of politicians bowing to corporate interests.
    However, it’s not really just a Dublin problem, it’s a country-wide problem. I don’t think there’s really a single town or city in the entire country that could be called clean by European standards.
    Nevertheless, I do think Dublin City Council could clean up its act a bit (excuse the pun lol). Bins should be cleaned and emptied far more regularly, and the actual street pavements themselves should be cleaned with high-pressure steam hoses at least once a week to get rid of the dirt, as opposed to simply the litter, on the streets.
    Also, all those Buscar Bruscar bins all over the city should be replaced with the stainless steel onces that are currently on O’Connell Street. They’re bigger and they don’t smell as bad! Seriously, the smell which is coming from those bins on Grafton Street these days is just ridiculous! Indeed, the smell on Grafton Street itself is pretty bad! I think the street is really in need of repair. Perhaps now that the final stage of the O’Connell Street improvement works is about to begin, the Council will consider improving our main thoroughfare south of the Liffey?

    #759785
    dowlingm
    Participant

    Well, it seems everyone back home has those camera phones – if there was a website for uploading piccies shaming people who won’t pick up their dogpoo or gum or fagbutts (can’t say that here – means something completely different) and promoted via LiveWhine or PrimeWhine they might do some good!

    #759786
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    Its interesting that Daragh should mention the bins smelling, as it reminds that offically every bin in Dublin is bleeched once a week (something I find very hard to believe). So what is the problem there, man power or will power ?

    Whats the deal with litter wardens. I’m in town regularly and could the number of times in the last ten years that I have seen litter wardens, on one hand. Where are they ? Having siad that I remember a disgracfull episode in the Four Gold Mines (four courts) when the city council lost there case because they did’nt bring the actual peice of litter to court.

    #759787
    MT
    Participant

    I agree with what people are saying about the need for a change in attitude. However, I still believe that the state of the built environment also contributes to such lax attitudes towards littering.

    If streets are well finished and kept clean then they’ll invite less litter. I mean, most people have few doubts about dropping rubbish on waste ground – so the less streets look dilapidated and decrepit the greater the chance people won’t behave as if they were on a derelict building site.

    In this respect, I feel the state of footpaths leaves something to be desired down south. In most cases they’re finished in unmatched chunks of concrete which then proceed to crack and chip as well as collecting a brownish grime in our damp climate. The end result is hideous. I was in Howth recently and this nice little place is really let down by the acres of grime coloured concrete footpaths everywhere. If tarmac or good paving had been used the appearance of the streetscape would have been transformed. Tarmac due to its dark finish doesn’t show up dirt half as much giving an area a cleaner feel.

    Having said that, even where tarmac is used down there the choice of material is inadequate. Southern councils seem to use the fragile stuff which unless driven on frequently allows weeds to sprout up through it. Pavements need to be in many ways even more durable as there’s no traffic to press the surface down. The result in many cases is a fairly recent footpath cracking up due to weeds coming up. Again, it creates such an unkempt appearance. And that’s another thing, many councils in the south could do with getting out the weed killer more often – weeds and tufts of grass seem to have taken over many public spaces.

    In general I’d say the look of streetscapes would be greatly improved if far less concrete was used for footpaths and the ubiquitous walls that seem to barricade everything. Where fancy paving materials are too costly – such as in residential areas – the solution in NI now seems to be to use robust and high quality tarmac. This and more weeding would work wonders down there.

    It won’t change the behaviour of the worst litter lout but surely a well finished and well maintained street environment will cause many to think twice before treating it as a bin.

    #759788
    MT
    Participant

    On the issue of street cleaning, I have noticed one striking difference. Both the pavements around the city hall in Belfast and St Stephen’s green in Dublin were finished in granite(?) paving not too long ago. But the Belfast city council seems to have done a much better job than its Dublin counterpart in keeping the granite in its attractive original state. The last time I saw the pavement around the green it had collected so much dirt it had begun to ressemble bog standard concrete slabs.

    What’s the point in spending the extra sum on an attractive finish if through lack of cleaning it loses the qualities it was chosen for in the first place?

    #759789
    Rory W
    Participant

    I’ve said this before but the best way to deal with the litter problem is the way that they did it in primary school – litter duty! If you are caught you have to spend a week picking up rubbish/cleaning graffiti – if you have to take the week off work to do so all the better as it means you will miss out on a week’s holidays – rest assured after a week you’ll never do it again!

    Creative punishment

    #759790
    kefu
    Participant

    In America, they send minor criminal offenders out on litter duty and cut their sentences in return.
    If you had a purely voluntary system like that here, it might be something that could be looked at.
    Of course, the usual suspects would be up-in-arms at the notion.

    #759791
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    It might however disarm the argument that prison is used too quickly in particular cases and often against individuals that have little appreciation for civic values.

    #759792
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    Only problem, is that some people would feel it was alright to litter as criminals would be picking it up

    #759793
    Rory W
    Participant

    Not saying get crims to do it – get ordinary litterers to do it and enforece it properly.

    Best advert for how fucking useless some people are – 2 years ago saw Joe Skanger sitting on a bin on Talbot St drinking a coke, finishes can, fucks it on the ground not even into the bin he is sitting on!!! Would have said something except he looked like he would kill me when I went to do so…

    Wouldn’t you love to see the likes of that having to collect rubbish for a week

    #759794
    GrahamH
    Participant

    On the issue of pavement surfaces, the Dublinspirations report highlights very well the problem MT points out – the fact that unlike the robust rough Wicklow and Dalkey granite used to pave the capital’s streets in the past, this new white Portuguese and Chinese granite being put down everywhere needs to be constantly cleaned or else it quickly assumes a dull concrete appearance.

    Notable particularly around the Green after a long spell of neglect – it looks awful, made more so by the levels of water running off the overhanging trees combining with city dust, or the huge amount of leaves in autumn that stain the surface.
    O’Connell St is being regularly pressure washed at least, one night I passed it was being done at about 11.30!
    As to the impact of all this washing on the stone I don’t know…

    Contrast this paving with the rust-tinged antique paving and kerbstones about the city centre – they never need cleaning save some litter clearing, and always look fantastic.
    We need a hardline approach to littering in this country – community service should be doled out much more often as punishments. We also need more wardens; I’ve often seen litter wardens in regional towns, but never ever in Dublin!
    Are they undercover or something?!

    #759795
    Daragh
    Participant

    Actually, I think the whole issue of paving in general needs to be looked at properly by the Council. While the new paving they’ve used in places like O’Connell Street and around Stephen’s Green is a welcome improvement, it does need to be cleaned regularly in order to maintain its original appearance. However, this is something which the Council seems totally unprepared to do.
    What I can’t understand though, is that even in places where the Council is putting down new paving, they’re doing it with ugly, old, cheap, grey stones that look dirty and worn even before they’ve been put down! The paving put down around the entrance to the new Bank of Scotland (Ireland) premises on Stephen’s Green is a perfect example, as is the paving that was put down the entire length of Camden Street and George’s Street around 3 years ago! Here, the paving looks as if it’s been there for over 20 years! I really wonder about the Council…

    #759796
    gregos
    Participant

    It’s an issue of personal responsibility but also a municipal issue. On the one hand, we now have a significant subculture of people who have absolutely no respect for anything. But on the other hand, we have indolent, lethargic and indifferent public authorities, in strong contrast to places already mentioned, such as Sweden, or even the Wee North! We also have zero enforcement of laws that relate to quality of life. To make a comparison, if some skanger flings his KFC wrappers into my garden, I’ll curse him, but I’ll also clean it up. Of course I will. What am I going to do? Wait till it goes away? We need to understand that we have to clean up , AND prosecute the offenders. As a matter of interest, how many people here routinely take the initiative and pick up litter on the street as they walk by? That would make a difference too, and it’s something we’d all do if we really felt our cities belonged to us.

    #759797
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    Dose anyone known why we stoped using Wicklow granite. Is there none left or is it to expensive to extract ?
    I would have to agree with Graham on this one. The way the new paving marks due to ‘juice’ is awful

    #759798
    GrahamH
    Participant

    It is prohibitively expensive compared with the vast quanities of stone (especially granite and slate) being extracted and exported from China, India and lower-paid European economies.

    So much so that Irish stone, particularly marble from the west, now has to be marketed as something as a ‘niche’ product which is a shame.

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