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@kite wrote:
After more than a year in appeal Barry O’Connor and Robert Kennedy’s Crows Nest site has been approved by ABP.
The board has insisted as a condition that the height of the building fronting onto the Straight Road should be reduced further to 5 storeys, the original application was for a 15 storey “landmark towerâ€.
In hindsight, and in fairness, I for one feel that the new proposal submitted to the board in March 2006 following a request from ABP is a far superior design to the larger Victoria Mills version submitted at the start of this process.my gut reaction is disappointment that it was reduced to that low, there may be more to it, i dont know – the county hall seems to set a hieght precedent but no other tall building will be allowed there – might be the views of county hall that they want to keep but the only thing I can see coming up the straight road into town is that appaling victoria mills
@kite wrote:
16 for rezoning, 13 against.
A two thirds majority was required.sounds like a tough one – werent they essentially voting on rezoning it for a school? where now do they put the school though?
@Spinal Tap wrote:
Among the stations earmarked for possible closure are Tarbert, Poolbeg, North Wall, Marina in Cork and Great Island in Wexford.
.as per the South Docks masterplan, the ESB wont be moving out of the MArina for the forseeable future
Navigation House up for sale through DTZ, 1 acre site, expected to get 15-20 million, OCP own the site next door
@kite wrote:
I this road ripe for high density developments lends me to the opinion that the CSD were right all along and that planning in Cork is now nothing more that a sick joke.
we all know planning could be better done – i think there is an attitude that a decision is made by the local authority and all they have in mind sometimes is that Bord Pleanala will sort it out – then ABP inspectors seem to make somewhat informed decisions, all the reports I read from them are mostly logical but then they themselves can be over ruled for no real valid reason
i can see why the CSD dont like some of the planning but to object to high rise constantly is a bit much – I dont think they have a leg to stand on re the Carrigrohane Straight anyway as you have county hall, the approved 6 storey new motor tax office and the Crows nest will get the height (or most of it) its just being tweaked to look better I think
of all the places where you surely cannot object against high rise, its out there given the precedence set by oh, i dont know, some building thats been around for a few years now, 16 storeys in height, i think its called County Hall?
refer to well written article some time ago on this site http://ireland.archiseek.com/news/2005/000214.html
How they can object to anything over 3 storeys is beyond me, by all means object to something if its hideous (Victoria Mills) but just because its over 3 storeys isnt a valid reason. Germanys citys have 4/5 storey residential and are done really well
Oyster Devts have applied to build 120 apts over 5 storeys + shop and creche on the former Coca Cola bottling plant on carrigrohane rd
slightly off topic but bord pleanalas website finally left the 1980’s and looks very modern and usable
@kite wrote:
Fri
Multiple applications indicate that the original proposal was flawed and justifies the existence of anti apartment groups such as CSDgroups like teh CSD are entitled to their opinion of course but i agree in that their referring to 3-5 storeys as high rise is plain silly. I am not sure if they are anti high rise or just anti silly development (as the planners in Cork do constantly get over ruled by Bord PLeanala for making silly conditions and granting silly planning with no consistency).
One of the people who has some vague say in the running of the city Cllr Jerry Buttimer is associated I think with the CSD and he is anti urban sprawl but also anti high rise. Go figure.
If the CSD offer alternatives to the developments then fair enough but if we keep stopping developments being over 3 storeys then the city sprawl will continue and the green green grass of home will no longer exist.
Docklands represents a superb opportunity for a precedent of 6 storey tastefully done buildings. Just like many other major capitals in Europe, Germany being a perfecct example.
http://www.corkcity.ie/docklands/planning/southdocks.shtml
link to the south docks plan, submissions to be made by 24 aug 2007, prob the one and only chance to have your say to the local council so get cracking! I’ll be mooting things like, start and finish the movement of kent station, integrate the intercity buses into that station, have integrated ticketing for all transport, have ferries collecting and dropping off up and down harbour pulling into monkstown, cobh, crosshaven,have half decent looking waterfront apartments etc etc
MArtin Cullen gone from Transport ministry!! hurrah !! Noel Dempsey is new minister, at least its a change.
(off topic but dick roche also gone from cabinet excellent)
its a great idea in fairness to put in the family size units – all they need to do now is move the seveso sites so the children wont be merrily playing with the local chemicals
various people seem to have access to extracts of the new South Docklands Area Plan, would anyone have a link to it yet? I assume its not yet on general release.
@who_me wrote:
The principal problem is the initial risk.
An apartment in the docklands might be very attractive, but would you want to buy (even a luxury) apartment on Centre Park Rd. as it currently stands? Driving through an industrial area to and from work. Heavy trucks rolling by day in, day out (I assume). No shops or any kind of residential facilities nearby. I’ve no idea what the air quality is like but I can’t imagine it’s the best.
If potential residents are thinking that, you can bet the developer who’s sitting on a site in the Docklands is going to keep sitting on it until they can maximise the return on their investment.
i agree with Mr X earlier, the closeness of the docklands to cork mitigates the risk hugely – the risk for the buyer, buy now, endure some trucks and construction going up and down, absolutely true, but if you wait until the place is pristine (and you will be waiting i would say) then the prices will have gone up a good bit I would say.
I dont think the developer will sit on it too long, if one goes the others will
theres always an element of risk but i dont agree that its as much as you think – this is prime prime property with tax breaks and the key is just once it happens to get everyone agreed to what they want there and getting things built in a reasonable timeframe – apartments down there so near city centre? I’d buy one if I had any money. If the mix of the area is done right and not made sterile, it could be great. Just a shame reports and preparing of plans took so long.
I heard conflicting reports about Amgen, that they didnt realise the whole area around there is apparently caves and holes and if they come in at all, it will be on a much smaller scale.
@kite wrote:
Cork South Docks LAP Infrastructure Strategy. (Draft, June 2007)
3.2.3 Public Transport .
The opportunity for the creation of a Multi-Modal Transportation Interchange at Kent Station, to which the LRT/BRT may provide a link, is desirable not only for the South Docks but for the entirety of Cork City in promoting sustainable commuting and travel.
i applaud the re iteration of the obvious but what are they physically going to do about it? neither CIE nor MArtin Cullen nor the government give a hoot about Kent Station, given that 20 odd million was promised to change the station around fully in 2007 and instead we got the equivalent of a lick of paint – no news on whether this is the start of the development, what else will be done to the station, when it will be done, when will the turning around of the station start let alone be completed
it needs urgent movement and significant constant lobbying of public representatives until they finally cop on and get moving on it
@kite wrote:
South Docks Local Area Plan (Draft, June 2007)
5.3 With regard to ground contamination, landowners are responsible for remediation of their own sites. ?
ok – so CCC could surely hint strongly that no planning to be granted to the landowners on any other sites they own in the docklands until they lodge a satisfactory application to start moving the sites? I mean, the CCC arent going to grant planning for anything other than clean up to those sites anyway so why should they affect the landowners around them?
well the Examiner has obviously seen it, if I were a local councillor I wouldnt be thrilled with that in the first place
Much seems to be stating the already stated, Seveso sites need to be moved, possibilituy of landmark towers, what worries me is Damien Wallace coming out with how they now need to have a business implementation plan. How long will that take? why hasnt it been done all the way along? The CCC must have a fair idea of what they want to build there, the only variable is what developers want to build there.
Hopefully the plan states how they actually plan to move the Seveso sites, what resources it will take, how long, what cost and then they go and do it.
I’m not sure about keeping Fords, maybe something about industrial heritage but a waterfront site with the possibility of putting a cafe/restaurant/amenity development there? would be a waste leaving those warehouses there in my opinion. Custom house quays and bonded warehouses certainly should be kept.
within the article itself its called
a) a Luas styled bus service
b)Bus Rapid Transit
c) streetcar
d) tram on rubber wheelsI will go with bus.
It will have to result in the N28 being at least six lanes wide anyway, on each side there will be
one driving lane for cars and the Bus Rapid Transit, ,
an overtaking lane
and the lane for the light rail on the N28 as recently elected Michael McGraths main promise was the feasibility study of a light rail from Carrigaline to Cork.I imagine if they bring this in the light rail will go out the window.
i didnt realise they dont need dedicated lanes – whats all the fuss so about Cork being brilliant at bus lanes?
why not go back to double deckers? less long, more people and have a fleet of smaller buses like the Dublin IMP’s for off peaks?
Make no mistake, if the thing works I’ll be the first to use it but I the routes they are talking about are generally filled with traffic so the bus lanes would want to be really good and given the suburbs of Cork cant really have the roads widened, any new bus lanes would compress traffic wouldnt they?
Looking forward to seeing them in action though in Carrigaline
BUS ÉIREANN is hoping to offer commuters free rides on a new Luas-style bus system that will be tested in Cork within months.
The company confirmed yesterday its consultants have selected three routes that would be suitable for its new Bus Rapid Transit system.
Canadian transport experts MRC Hazel McClean consultants said the street car — a tram on rubber wheels — would be best suited to run on the following routes:
* From Ballincollig to the city, via the town’s bypass, serving Cork Institute of Technology, Cork University Hospital, and University College Cork;
* From Carrigaline to the city via the N28;
* From Mahon Point, to the city, via Páirc Uà Chaoimh, through the Docklands, crossing over two planned bridges at Water Street or Tivoli, and serving Kent Railway Station and the Parnell Place bus station.
The company hopes to introduce the BRT on one of these routes on a short trial basis in the coming months, with passengers probably being allowed to travel for free. Company spokesperson Erica Roseingrave said the trials will be next stage of a major feasibility study being conducted by MRC ahead of the BRT’s planned introduction.
The system will be tested in Cork first given the city’s success in developing green bus routes (???)
They also met with senior Department of Transport officials before the weekend to help secure funding under Transport 21. It is understood the department is ready to release funding as soon as the study is complete.
The BRT needs little infrastructural work and could be rolling on the city’s streets within months of funding being released, Ms Roseingrave said.Running on dedicated green bus routes, the BRT would operate every eight minutes throughout the day.
Each 18 metre articulated vehicle can carry 149 passengers — three times the average bus load.
High-quality stops with shelters, ticket kiosks and real-time passenger information systems, using GPS to transmit the vehicle’s estimated time of arrival to waiting passengers, will be constructed.
The trams are biofuel compatible, wheelchair friendly and offer an extremely smooth journey thanks to deep rubber wheels.
The system is already in operation in Las Vegas, York and Leeds in England, in Brisbane, Australia, and in Eindhoven, Holland.
The system could be in Cork within three years.
Comments-
Cork expert in green routes? I dont know about that.Department of Transport will release funding very quickly one the study is complete they said and the company can have it rolling out within months of that. Then at the end of the article it says it will take 3 years? does that mean the study will take 3 years?
N28 to Carrigaline due to be completely redeveloped in about 3/4 years so will the trams have to wait until then? I assume they wont draw up lanes for the tram and then redevelop the N28 afterwards?
