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@browser wrote:
We have heard in recent months about “imminent” planning applications for:
Kent stationKent station and surrounds is considered in 2 parts,
a) the railway station redevelopment and b) manor park homes application for Horgans QuayThe Manor Park application was for 276 residential units, 8 retail units, 2 commercial units, 3 showroom units, a crèche , a gym , open space , two levels basement car parking, all in 7 development blocks, range in height from 4 to 10 storeys, with a Landmark Building being 20 & 24 storeys in height.
This was despite the Cork Area Strategic Plan released by the City previous to this application, which stated the Horgans Quay area needed to be considered in a planning application in conjunction with a railway station redevelopment (promised originally by M Cullen that it would be complete by end 2007) and also the plan included landmark buildings in specific places in Cork but landmark buildings dont necessarily mean tall ones, it can be ones of architectural merit. The Manor Park plan also didnt seem to consider that the Water St site, immediately adjacent, was refused planning for 17 storeys so why Horgans Quay would be granted planning for 24 was beyond me.
The CASP stated that the development of the North Docks area, being the location of Kent railway station, in close proximity to the City’s bus station and capable of higher residential densities than suburban locations thus becomes a critical part of the implementation of the CASP strategy.
Following 33 objections and their own considerations, the City planners promptly refused the Manor Park plans outright for 14 reasons, one being the fact that the plan didnt include the railway station redevelopment – Manor Park brought it to Bord Pleanala who are due to decide on it by start October. In the meantime CIE have hinted at a station redevelopment (pictures somewhere on this forum – might be Cork docklands or transport thread) but no idea as to when that will happen – the picture of the possible new station remarkably resembles the proposed station redevelopment at Waterford also.
Its unknown now as to how concrete the various development plans created are, because one specific objective of the North Docks Local Area plan was to have a 5000 seater event centre at Kent Station – whereas the event centre will now be located in the South docklands following a recent behind closed doors meeting of the council to choose the developer for the event centre.
Anyone know the story re the breastcheck clinic by South Terrace? has gone up at a rate of knots but now theres a massive gap between the building and the maternity hospital – if thats for parking its a bit of a waste I think – the building itself looks ok from looking back to it on south terrace but from the side its awful – distinct lack of windows(yes i know its a breastcheck but the windows could be frosted) and red brick, again not a fan – a well needed resource though
CIE can apply all they want for their part of the site but the planners when they applied originally stated “Any application for the site MUST be accompanied by a detailed and agreed MASTERPLAN in order to demonstrate how the Kent Station / Horgan’s Quay precinct will be developed in a comprehensive fashion. “
Is CIE now giving us the Masterplan?
@jungle wrote:
The most important thing is to overprovide for rail activities inside it. Once the station has been built around, it can never be expanded again.
an extremely valid point
Just a personal opinion as well but NO to red brick – glass and stone all the way – cant wait to find out what the beehive shaped building in the left of the picture will be
I’ll believe it when i see it – makes you wonder why they couldnt do that first day – also makes you wonder why they now think they will get planning for that tower that looks like about 20 storeys when an application for Werdna not too far away for 17 was denied
too good to be true
i can understand trying to keep the facades (in the same way as the facades at parnell place were kind of kept until they fell down) but why would the planners request that the whole Central Shoes stores be kept? surely it will be brought into the retail part of the development anyway and the whole point of increasing the size is to get retailers in who want a bigger footprint? planners cant have it both ways
Might be fine too to scale back the height but wouldnt / shouldnt all that have been discussed in pre planning?
On a different note, Councillor Chris O’ Leary has proposed a motion that Cork City Council meetings be available as webcasts – would have been interesting for the event centre decision – what are the odds of them agreeing to that ?
you would think it might get scaled back but who knows in terms of pre planning talks etc- I think An Taisce want to keep the Central Shoe Stores facade – its due for decision today anyway
was there any more updates on what ACTUALLY happened in the cpuncil chambers when they decided on granting the event centre? Maybe a Freedom of Information act query might help if the council minutes dont when they are published
Certainly the city manager has managed to get movement in Cork alright but its not all down to him – there is an element to the property boom/developers having the cash to buy massive sites and do them up – I dont think there was anything special in getting a library built in to the plans on grand parade, the developer already owned the site and are more than happy i would think to put it in which makes them look very good for any future applications
certainly the docklands has been sitting idle for years – i dont agree its because its privately owned, eg when you see the council must have known about the Seveso sites for how long? Nothing much can happen until they are moved as per the Health & Safety Authorities constant objections in the area –
its the private developers who have the money to develop it so i wouldnt be giving too much credit to the city – as shown by a closed doors decision to give 8.25 million of our taxes and permission for an event centre to a major developer whereas another developer offers to build a multi discipline stadium and gets no look in – thats pretty poor
the docklands master plan was done in conjunction with the developers so at least the city&developers are moving on it now – from the quick look i had at the docklands plans it looks really good to be fair – the shining jewel should have been a multi dicsipline sprts stadium&concert venue
meanwhile we have to wait on idiotic CIE/Manor Park to go through the appeals process on their grossly out of place plans for Horgans Quay – which is another long wait for a half decent railway station thats holding up the north docklands
very pertinent questions which you are entitled to send to your local councillors to ask them? why not email or write or phone them? they serve us the public after all.I will also be asking why the gallery was reputedly cleared.
i’m with theblimp on this one, i dont think its sour grapes on blimps behalf, i too am more than delighted that there will be an events centre, there should have been a concert venue years ago since the time someone had the guts to bring in michael jackson and the likes of oasis/prodigy at their height.
I would question the process of its choosing also and remain sceptical that 8 million of the public purse is spent by councillors, most of whom have no experience in these matters and therefore as was pointed out feel obliged to take the recommendations of a committee that may also not have any experience in these matters . An event centre should have been proposed and a public ocnsultation (e.g. hand out survey at the Marquee gigs) should have been conducted.
You wouldnt have had to use all of pairc ui chaoimh for a concert, surely an area could have been cordoned off or one end been designed to hold 6-10,000 person venue.
Doesnt matter now anyway!
on a separate note, Manor Park and CIe had appealed to ABP the outright refusal of their plans for Horgans Quay by CCC at end Feb 2007 – i thought it was due for ABP decision 5 months later, i.e. around now but looks as if a decision now wont happen until start October 07 – and the midleton railway now wont be done until 2009 – what a joke
Spinal Tap wrote:However, they were unhappy with the amount of information they were given beforehand and they cleared City Hall’]I’d certainly believe that this was NOTa choice of the 4 best proposals for the city with the best one being selected – i’d be interested to know the make up of the committee that chose it and why the public and the media were cleared from the gallery for a decision which involves spending 8 million of the public money
Maybe the other proposals werent as good but how do we know that? And why cant pairc ui chaoimh be fully redeveloped into a sports and event centre? Former councillor and now TD Ciaran Lynchs proposal for a feasibility study to do same is with teh councillors sports and recreation committee, where is that motion at?
i’m delighted at the docklands kicking off and some form of event centre for regular excellent concerts but its the way its chosen is a bit irritating
at last!! – venue and conference centre much needed – i’m curious to see what it will be like now – i am assuming of course that if there is seats for 4200, there is stnading room for another 4,000. I dont know of many concerts such as those that were held in the Marquee that people would sit down for – cant see people politely clapping along to Slayer in their seats
I still am not sure why a concert venue cant be worked in with a complete revamp of Pairc Ui Chaoimh – i’d rather sink the 8.25 million into that
might be the definition of irony but the Corbett Bros have applied to change the use of their long vacant office development on Copley St to educational use on 3 floors to become UCC’s new School of Architecture
have been in germany looking at property and all the building thats currently going on , bringing the old east germany type buildings to former west germany standards, there is usually a huge poster/banner type thing, sometimes the size of the building, showing what its going to be like when finished – some developments do have posters up around Cork to be fair – its just they might say something like “Development until 2007” and the building hasnt even started
surely its viable to build with that number of apartments on the site – i think its more of a waiting game, the developers surely wouldnt have gone through the dragged out process they were subjected to with various revisions if they didnt think they would get some sort of planning – they had to know a break even point somewhere – they might wait for the bridge to be built or even more scary, they might wait for Kent station to be developed! Dont forget, M CUllen said the 20 million redevelopment would be finished in 2007. Only a few months left to get started.
i imagine that werdna were waiting for the aouth docks plan to come out and confirm that there will be a bridge from their site across to the south docks – the plan is out at the moment for consultation
i thought clontarf st got the nod for the final storey on the top, maybe its at abp
o flynns got the nod from ccc for a big extension to Ballincollig Shopping centre incl 444 space mutistorey car park
