Praxiteles

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  • Praxiteles
    Participant

    @Rhabanus wrote:

    EUREKA! I have found it:

    Vert, Claude de, 1645-1708.:
    Explication simple, litterale et historique des cérémonies de l’Église /
    Westmead : Gregg Interational, 1970.
    4 v. : plans (1 fold.)

    Who’s Caluse??? an acquaintance perhaps in the calabooze of the rue Toulouse?
    Rhabanus has enough to do looking up his recherche topics without chasing after a wild goose or a red herring.

    Should be a snap to find a copy of this 4-volume reprint.

    Sorry, Caluse was a typo for Claude!

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    Rhabanus!

    Any idea of where one moght find a copy (perhaps electronic) of Caluse de Vert’s Explication des Ceremonies de L’Eglise?

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    Sorry about that Rhabanus!

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    Was this a Vosko job?

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    Someone mentioned to Praxiteles that a new door has been installed in St. Joseph’s Church,Liscarroll. Does anyone know if planning permissionn was granted for his? I understood that it was to be part of the unspecified “ancilliary” works for which unspecified blanket permission was being sought. Now, however, it appears as thouigh the developer has gone right ahead nd installed the door WITHOUT waiting for a planning permission decision by Cork County Council.

    Does anyne know if the door is a replica of the original one, made of the same material and to the same design and following the same mehods as the original door? I hope it is not like the new one installed at the Church of the Immaculate Conception in Kanturk. It is an utter disgrace and a shambles. It a completely modern door held togethe by galvanized nails and of a type usually found on sheds and outhouses.

    I hope that someone will take this up with the planning authorities in Cork County Council and does it soon for it looks as though the whole place is about to be PAINTED with or without planning permission. Rumour has it that the paint has already been bought!

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    There is a higly contentious account of the attemped wreckage of St Colman’s Cathedral, Cobh, Co. Cork in a book recently published by Veritas. It is called Hand to Plough and claims to be memoir of the life of Denis O’Callaghan, the Vicar General of the dioces of Cloyne. [Curiously, the cover featurees the author in a boat with no sight of a plough}. Accurate recollection distinguishes a memoir from mere ramblings or, worse still, rantings. In this, the book is sorely lacking. For example O’C claims that 40,000 persons signed a petition against the reordering. The FOSCC claimed that 24,000 signed. O,C claims that the Midleton Oral Hearing was personally presided over by the Chief Planning Officer. In fact it was conducted by an official of An Bord Pleqnala called Tom Rabbit. O’C claims that opposition to the reordering emerged in the wake of the Oral Heraing. In fact it was already vey well manifested and orgaised long before any Oral Hearing. O’C claims that he cannot understand the rationale of An Bord Pleanala and its decision to deny planning permission for the destruction of the sanctuary of Cobh Cathedral. He never mentions that every major heritage body in the country opposed the plan prepared by Professor O’Neill: An Taisce, The Georgian Society, The Department of the Envoronment, the Cork County Conservation Officer, the Pugin Society and of course the FOSCC. It takes some pretty thik skin not to have even a slight inkling that something maight be wrong with all these bodies opposing the scheme. While the book has quite a lot of crap about lay participation in the Church, O’C never once mentions asking anyone in Cobh or Cloyne diocese about plans or even mentioning the word “consultation”. Information sessions are mentioned but O’C forgets to mention that these took place AFTER the famous planning application was made and when no meaingful contribution could be made to a proper but non existent consultation process. O’C pretends that only the best professional advice was sought by the developers involved oin this project and conveniently omits mentioning that some of the best conservation and legal experts in Ireland were employed by the FOSCC and international experts were imported from Britain and Rome to give evidence on liturgical matters. O’C is heavily peddling the business of oiturgical gathering around the altar and physical proximity to the congregation. He may have to adjust his opinions in this respect after the publication of Summorum Pontificum – much as his 1966 artice in Woman’s Way on contraception was substantially improved upon in other section os the book. Then there are the three occasions on which we are told that Bishop Magee is very disappointed with the outcome of the whole debacle – as well he should since he was well warned as to the consequences of failure for him. Surely, is it not the business of a Vocar General to tell a bishop what he needs to her rather than what he thinks he would like to hear? Working that way, he will ensure that his bishop does not land in the huge embarrassment the bishop of Cloyne now suffers. One could go on about this book and about its account of the Cobh reordering. In short, it is a crappy book written by someone who wishes to reassures us that hge is really a very ordinary guy without realizing that none of us ever had reason to regard him as anything other!!!

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    Here is a fairly comprehensive summary of Moyra Doorly’s book, No place for God
    http://www.latin-mass-society.org/ouch.htm

    Personally, I think the OUCH campaign was launched here on archiseek two years ago!

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    I came across this recent publication from Ignatius Oress in San Francisco. It formulates clearily some of the principles I ahve been harping on about for the past two years

    http://www.ignatius.com/ViewProduct.aspx?SID=1&Product_ID=3064&SKU=NPFG-P&ReturnURL=search.aspx%3f%3fSID%3d1%26SearchCriteria%3dno+place+for+god:

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    Ah, Ake! There is the thing wherein we catach the conscience of the king!

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    @Rhabanus wrote:

    Some histrionic Italian bishop is going on and on about the motu proprio Summorum pontificum. A full report appears on Inside the Vatican Magazine newsflash@insidethevatican.com made available below.

    Sounds as though an acorn just landed on Chicken Little’s head and now he’s proclaiming the end of the world: “The sky is falling!!” Now watch him circulate around the barnyard stirring up panic among Henny Penny, Ducky Lucky, Turkey Lurkey, and all the rest. I think it’s high time that Foxy Loxy had dinner: Squab Lorraine.

    Just get a load of these juicy tidbits:

    “This day is for me a day of grief. I have a lump in my
    throat and I do not manage to hold back my tears. But, I will obey the
    Holy Father, because I am a bishop and because I care for him. However,
    I cannot hide my sadness for the putting aside of one of the most
    important reforms of the Second Vatican Council.” In fact, Monsignor
    Luca Brandolini, Bishop of Sora-Aquino-Pontecorvo and member of the
    Liturgical Committee of the Cei (Italian Episcopal Conference), hardly
    holds back his tears when he is asked for a comment on the
    reintroduction of the Tridentine Latin Mass: “Please, do not ask me
    anything, I do not wish to speak [about it], for I am living the
    saddest
    day of my life as a priest, as a bishop, and as a man.”

    Q: Monsignor Brandolini, why [are you] so upset?

    A: “It is a day of grief, not only for me, but for many who lived and
    worked in the Second Vatican Council. Today, a reform for which so many
    labored, at the cost of great sacrifices, animated solely by the wish
    to
    renew the Church, has been canceled.”

    Q: The optional return to the Tridentine Rite represents thus a danger
    for the Church?

    A: “We hope not. It remains to be seen in the future, but today an
    important reform of the Council was undermined.”

    Q: Why are you so touched by the decision taken by Pope Ratzinger?

    A: “The episcopal ring which I carry on my finger belonged to
    archbishop Annibale Bugnini, the father of the Conciliar liturgical
    reform. I was, at the time of the Council, a disciple of his and a
    close
    co-worker. I was close to him when he worked in that reform and I
    always
    recall with how much passion he worked for liturgical renewal. Now, his
    work has been canceled.”

    Q: You will not accept the “motu proprio” of Benedict XVI, then?

    A: “I will obey, because I care for the Holy Father. I have for him the
    same sentiment that a son has for his father. And then, as a bishop, I
    am bound to obedience. Yet, in my heart, I suffer deeply. I feel as if
    wounded in my heart, and I cannot help saying it. Nonetheless, if
    anyone
    in my diocese will ask me to follow the Tridentine rite, I will not be
    able to say no. But I do not believe this will happen, because ever
    since I have been the bishop of Sora-Aquino-Pontecorvo, there has never
    been anyone who has expressed a similar desire. I am certain that it
    will always be like this in the future.”

    *** NEW SUBSCRIBERS ONLY! Subscribe to Inside the Vatican Magazine for
    Only $34.95! Buy Now and Save
    $15.00!http://www.insidethevatican.com/offers/new-subscriber-offer.htm

    This is Brandolini, the Bishop of Sora. It is all explained by the fact that he was Annibale Bugnini’s secretary. Readers of the thread will be familiar with this name since he fetures on our notable iconocalsts page. I do not thing it matters too much. Brandolini is now 72 and will soon be sailing into the great oblivion before too long.

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    The most significant one would be St Audeons in Dublin. The old Rite is akso celebrated in St. Peter and Paul’s in Cork. While most dioceses in Irelans have made some accomodation for the 1962 Missal, 5 dioceses have consistently refused even the most minimal and restrictive use of the old Rite. Perhaps not insignifitantly, one of those is Cloyne where Bishio Magee displayed none of the generosity asked for by Pope John Paul II in Ecclesia Dei adflicta to accomodate traditionalist Catholics. It comes as no surprise that the matter has now been completely taken out of his hands. Indeed, as recently as three weeks ago permission for the use of the old Rite was refused to a group of people – politically this must have been one of the most stupid decisions ever made since what was refused three weeks ago MUST now be conceded.

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    I am inclined to think that the statues in Sts Peter and Paul’s require something more sophisticated. There are still craftsmen working in the Tyrol who do this sort of stuff and fixing a pair of hands shouod be no bother to them.

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    St. Joseph’s Church, Liscarroll, Co. Cork

    Latest update:

    1. Some 13 objections have been lodged against a planning application to wreck the interior of the church made on 3 April 2007. The due date for a decision on this application was 28 May 2007.

    2. Cork County Council wrote to the developer on 24 May 2007 requesting further information. In their letter addressed to Kevin o’Keeffe, Annabella, Mallow (acting for Fr. Stephen O’Mahony), the Cork County Council made the following observations:

    a. “The supporting information contained in the application is totally inadequate to enable the Planning Authority to consider the proposed works in the light of the protected status of the overall building.”. Two copies of an heritage impact assessment were requested contaoining a written description of of the existing and proposed development, appropriately illustrated through the use of scaled drawings and photigraphic material. The developer has also been asked to address the impact of the proposed development on the architectual heritage of the building and to “provide appropriate mitigations for this where necessary”. It also seems that Cork County Council thought of asking the developer to provide a specific list of repair works that are intended for the building.

    b. Curiously, the Cork County Council have asked the developer to provide evidence of legal title to the property. I cnnot figure out the reasoning beind nthat one.

    Clearly, Cork County Council has not bought the drivil supplied to them by the Cloyne HACK and it is encouraging to note that the Planning Aiuthority regards their work in relation to St. Joseph’s Liscarroll as “totally inadequate”. This should be further reason for the members of that august body to start penning their letters of resignation. Not having had the decency to go quietly after the debacle they caused in relation to St. Colman’s Cathedral, they now have the gall to treat us (and the Planning Authority) to another dose of their astounding ignorance in the case of St. Joseph’s Liscarroll. Should the people of the HACK be unable to read or write, I am sure we will be able to arrange a charitable person to help them do the needful and draw up the necessary letters of resignation. Otherwise……well…we shall ahve to give them each a presant and point them to where the forest is and explain to them what “the decent thing” is in military terms!!!

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    Another excellent resource for research on Irish church decoration in the 19 and 20th century is the Capuchin Annual, especially its advertisment sections and many interesting articles on artists and ecclesiastical commissions.

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    Looking through a series of the Catholic Directory (which began publication in c. 1829), it strikes me that this is a prime source fro the identification of craftsmen and artists involved in the decoration of 19 and 20 th century churches in nIreland. The advertisments placed in the Catholic Directory by these often contain lists of works done by them. Has anyone done any research on these sources.

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    @ake wrote:

    Any chance of a scan of that article?

    Unfortunately, have not access to it at present.

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    And here is a little something destined to sort out the liturgical guffers:

    http://212.77.1.245/news_services/bulletin/news/20558.php?index=20558&lang=en

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    @Gregory wrote:

    I’ve been following this discussion with interest for some months. I recently came across a poor quality image of Armagh Cathedral’s sanctuary in 1977 – hopefully I’ve attached it correctly!

    Thank s for that Gregory. Interesting to see a more recent view of Armsgh brfore the deluge.

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    @GregF wrote:

    That looks absolutely superb!

    It is. But that did not stop its being hacked to bits

    Praxiteles
    Participant

    I posted some pictures of the Pro Cathedral in Dublin taken c. 1900 showing the stencil work there. I would suggest that a similar scheme probably existed in Thurles. Certainly, the approach here is better than the bland acres of pink pastels nopw so common in churches in nIrelsnd but at the same time I think that the stenciling work is too plain and far too reduced for the proportions of a building such as Thurles.

Viewing 20 posts - 3,601 through 3,620 (of 5,386 total)