Praxiteles
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- December 17, 2007 at 8:15 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770919
Praxiteles
ParticipantThe shrine of the Nativity in the Basilica as engraved by Roumargue in 1852.
December 17, 2007 at 8:13 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770917Praxiteles
ParticipantThis is our friend WIlliam Bartlett’s engraving of the interior oft he Basilica of the Nativity in Bethlehem.
The present Basilica, and it should come as no surprise, was erected by the Emperor Justinian 527-567. It has a long and tortured history.
The Basilica is architecturally more or less as it was at the time of construction, though little remains of either the original or medieval decorations. Fragments of 12th-century Byzantine mosaics can still be seen on the upper walls of the nave. Traces of Crusader decoration are also visible on the pillars separating the aisles in the main body of the church. The upper portions of these pillars are painted with images of various saints of the Western and Eastern churches (among those depicted are St. Sabas, St. Euthymius, St. Olav of Norway, St. Canute of Denmark and St. Cathal of Ireland).
The roof of the Basilica dates from the 14th century.
Since the Crusades, portions of the church have come into the possession of the Greek Orthodox, Armenian Orthodox and Roman Catholic communities. The rights, privileges and possessions of these communities are protected by the Status Quo of the Holy Places (1852), as guaranteed in Article LXII of the Treaty of Berlin (1878).
The main body of the Basilica, including the nave, aisles, katholicon (choir and sanctuary), south transept, and the Altar of the Nativity in the Grotto are in the possession of the Greek Orthodox.
The Armenian Orthodox have possession of the north transept and the altar there. They also have use, on occasion, of the Greek Orthodox altar in the Grotto.
The (Roman Catholic) Latins have exclusive possession of the Altar of the Adoration of the Magi in the area of the Grotto of the Nativity known as the “Grotto of the Manger”. The Latins also possess the silver star beneath the adjacent Altar of the Nativity that is inscribed, “Hic de Virgine Maria Jesus Christus Natus Est.”
Both the Armenians and the Latins have rights of passage and procession in the Nave
December 17, 2007 at 8:09 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770916Praxiteles
ParticipantYes an improvement but those two chairs look ridiculous at either side of the sanctuary. It is truly a wnder that the altar ended up being raised off the floor by at least one step.
I take it that the latar here has been salvaged from somewhere else?
December 16, 2007 at 10:31 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770914Praxiteles
ParticipantHere is the central panel of the Portinari altar piece. Following the tradition of Northern European art, vand der Goes painted his nativity scene in a ruined building indicating taht he, unlike contemporary Italian painters of the subject, had not fallen under the influence of the visions of St. Brigidet of Sweden which portrayed the nativity in a cave, with St. Joseph holding a candle or lantern. Here, van der Goes paints St. Joseph in prayerful adoration of the Christ child.
Our two friends in the background are evidently related to the Isaiah text given the ox’s acknowledgement of his owner and the ass’s interest in his master’s manger.
Here is the text of Isaiah, chapter 1, verse 3 as it is given in the Septuaginta:
εγνω βους τον κτησαμενον και ονος την φατνην του κυριου
αυτου Ισραηλ δε με ουκ εγνω και ο λαος με
ου συνηκενDecember 16, 2007 at 9:54 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770913Praxiteles
ParticipantSomeone asked Praxiteles recently why the figures of the ox and the ass appear in the Crib. Well, the short answer to taht is because they were put there by St. Francis of Assisi -who invented the Crib- when he firest set up one in 1223 at
However, the Poverello did not put both figures into the Crib merelyfor decorative purposes: he had a fairly trenchant message to deliver to those who gazed upon the chirl in the manger, namely would they be able to recognise that the child in the Crib was indeed the Saviour and Redeemer?
The source for ther eference tot he ox and the ass is to be found at the evry beginning of the Prophet Isaiah:
“cognovit bos possessorem suum et asinus praesepe domini sui Israhel non cognovit populus meus non intellexit”
Roughly translated: the ox knows its owner and the ass its master’s manger but Isael does not, and my people do not understand”.
The Crib here is that of Hugo van der Goes aka the adoration of the Shepherds, painted in Brouges in 1475. The ox and the ass are to be seen peering from behind the figure of Our Lady. The picture was commissioned by Antonio Portinari, a Florentine banker in Bruges, and was eventually taken back to Florence by him and set up in the Church of Sant’Egidio dell’archispedale of Santa Maria Nuova. To.day, it is in the Uffizi Gallery.
December 16, 2007 at 8:58 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770912Praxiteles
ParticipantThe rood and its figures of Our Lady and St John are interesting. Clearly, it was placed in the position in the photograph when it was removed from its original position on the screen acorss the chancel. his is likely to have happened some time in the late 16 early 17th century. The rood figures were generally conserved and re-erected on the South wall of the nave near the chancel. The feature is to be seen in many churches throughout Germany and Austria. Praxiteles doe not know if the the figures are still in the church but wll attempt to find out.
December 16, 2007 at 12:26 am in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770910Praxiteles
ParticipantThe new altar in this church seems rather our of proportion to the rest of theSanctuary – which then becomes nothing more than a store room for rubbish.
Also, Praxiteles is not sure that the introduction of modern benches here is an improvement on the traditional French chaise d’église.
December 14, 2007 at 2:27 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770908Praxiteles
ParticipantA view of the exterior East elevation:
December 14, 2007 at 2:25 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770907Praxiteles
ParticipantA closer view of the window:
December 14, 2007 at 2:23 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770906Praxiteles
ParticipantThe present interior:
Note that the statues at either side of the windoe have been replaced with silly looking angels
December 14, 2007 at 2:09 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770905Praxiteles
ParticipantThe magnificent interior of the Eglise des Carmes (1383-1414) at Pont-L’Abbé in Finistere, Britany:
Unfortunately it has been hacked: the present interior
December 13, 2007 at 11:32 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770904Praxiteles
ParticipantHere is something Praxiteles came across recently: the online project of the Frenc Minsitry for Culture which will eventually have the entire inventry of historical monuments and all information/pictures etc about them available on line.
The database for Britany (Finistere) seem to be complete and has an enormous amount of information on it, the Charante Maratime also seem finished with other regions at various stages of evolution..
This approach really shows up the pterry pathetic efforts of many County Council in Ireland who cannot even manage to maintain a list let alone a database of information of listed monuments.
http://www.culture.gouv.fr/culture/regions/drac.html
Just click a region on the map and choose Sdap and patrimoine
December 13, 2007 at 7:16 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770903Praxiteles
Participant@ake wrote:
it’s wonderful. Pity about the playschool paint scheme.
That could be dealt with fairly easily!
December 13, 2007 at 7:54 am in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770901Praxiteles
ParticipantSome pictures of the interior of Pugin and Ashlin’s St. Kevin’s Church, Harrington Street, Dublin.
Fortunately, most of the interior has survived more ro less intact and we have a picture of the rare sight of a pulpit in regular use.
December 12, 2007 at 11:18 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770899Praxiteles
Participant@Antipodes wrote:
Pugin’s original 1838 plan was probably always way beyond the realities of what could be achieved at that time given the financial realities for poor Catholics. His 1839 design, the one constructed except for the huge tower and spire, was totally different from the previous one. It was of the triple-gabled genre, also used by him for: St Mary’s Cathedral, Newcastle upom Tyne (1841); St Benedict’s, Broadway, NSW (1842); Ss Mary and Joseph’s, Guernsey (1845); St Thomas of Canterbury’s, Fulham (1847); and an unexecuted design for St Mary’s Cathedral, Hobart, Tas (1847). Its nave trusses were of a kind widely used by Pugin even for such small churches as St Paul’s, Oatlands, Tas (designed 1843), and it had a glorious rood screen. Quite early on this was removed to the nave west end leaving only the crucifix suspended beneath the chancel arch.
The few surviving Pugin furnishings such as the Blessed Sacrament chapel altar and the Petre chantry chapel can only give a tantalising feeling for what was a very beautiful interior, the Lady chapel with its glorious carved stone altar and reredos and its elegant parclose screen being just one tragic loss from the 1841 bombing that reduced the building to a smouldering ruin.
The subsequent re-design and 1950s rebuilding by architect Romilly Craze really created in effect a new structure, with its clerestoried nave, transepts, new columns, roof and so on. Then the wreckovation of the chancel in the early 1980s left the chancel itself as a vacant allotment with a bland set of liturgical furnishings that would have Pugin turning in his grave at 1000rpm placed at the crossing created by Craze. If you want to appreciate a Pugin interior in its full integrity go to St Giles’, Cheadle. Sadly, there are precious few other alternatives.
Nomen est omen!
The effects of Craze on the sanctuary of Southwark Cathedral well reflect Craze.
December 11, 2007 at 10:25 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770897Praxiteles
ParticipantLack of cash caused restrictions on the on the original plan.
December 11, 2007 at 9:46 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770895Praxiteles
ParticipantSt. George’s Cathedral, Southwak
1. Showing a drawing by A.W.N. Pugin of 1838 for the interior of the building;
2. The sanctuary as built by Pugin and before bombing in 1941.
December 11, 2007 at 7:42 am in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770894Praxiteles
ParticipantSome further information on St. George’s Cathedral, Southwark
December 10, 2007 at 10:36 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770893Praxiteles
Participant@ake wrote:
Have you ever seen any critical mention of the vast destruction wrought on churches in the last decades in this or any Catholic newspaper?
It would be far too much to expect criticism of what should be cirticized from the Catholic Herald which has been up a remote shunt for years. It is not in any demographic way representative of critical Catholic opinion for it is firmly in the hands of a set of dim old fogies who have not noticed that the social utopia of the 30s just did not inexorably evolve into the promised land.
As for most of the rest, you can forget about those as well. What is much more interesting is the phenomenon of free Catholic newspapers which are independent of the dead hand of ideology and go some way to reflecting what is going on in the Church in an intelligent way.
To be fair, the Irish Catholic was very sympathetic to the FOSCC cause and those running it at the time certainly wriggled as much as they could within the ideological straight-jacket gagging them.
December 10, 2007 at 8:16 pm in reply to: reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches #770892Praxiteles
ParticipantAhe the potted history tour:
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