GrahamH
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GrahamH
ParticipantA picture in the paper this morning 😮

Heheh – went looking for one on the internet, and found this 😀
http://images.google.ie/images?hl=en&q=conference%20centre%20citywest&sa=N&tab=wi
GrahamH
ParticipantO’Neill’s of Pearse Street looking delightfully Victorian this afternoon:


All those exotic plants brought back from the furtherest flung garden centres of the M50 🙂
The two most extreme left-hand bays in the first pic appear to be a replica extension…
GrahamH
ParticipantThe new ‘Moss Hall’ at 49-51 Parnell Square:

…to be finished in a few weeks. Here’s hoping the misspelling isn’t an indication of the level of design standards with this project – it does seem to be a very faithful reconstruction though.
The Sacred Heart statue in more recent times:

You gotta love it – modern Ireland encapsulated. We even smother religious icons in PVC.
The concrete base was painted day-glo green in its final incarnation before the chop.
GrahamH
ParticipantIt is to be incorporated into a kiosk kefu as far as we know, clad in timber just as you suggest.
Just waiting for that part of the IAP to happen – hopefully in the next month or two.GrahamH
ParticipantThis statue isn’t the only thing to have conveniently been removed under the guise of the IAP works – the four protected Victorian bollards have also disappeared, with no sign of them going back in, having been replaced with a raft of traffic signal poles.
As for the Jesus statue… (here it is in 1978, since encased in PVC)

…I can see the CC’s point in removing it. While I agree with opinions expressed here before that it shouldn’t be removed for movement’s sake, there’s no doubting how completely incongruous, not to mention ugly, it would have been left standing exposed in the middle of the taxi rank, by that, also referring to the horrendous concrete base. It’d almost be akin to reerecting it on the median of O’Connell Bridge. The context has changed completely.
It could be moved a little further up the street, but that defeats the purpose of retaining it – it was something of little significance in a physical sense, that just developed organically on site; it was equally eh, ‘organically’ removed with the road works – which is largely true.The story about being salvaged from the Gresham has always sounded a bit odd – what would a large religious statue be doing in a hotel? Surely the Catholic Commerical Club across the road would be more likely?
Agreed with much you say jimg – though while it is right to criticise the lack of action on side streets, to be fair this should not cloud over what has happened on O’Connell Street itself. What do you mean the side streets reinforce its ‘facadish’ nature?
But yes, the amount of clutter is quite extraordinary in places, nearly all of it generated by the median. Indeed this is crux of the matter for me with the new look O’Connell Street: it has two conflicting parts. The new side pavements and their trees are magnificent, as is the Plaza, really lovely spaces, but what pulls the whole scheme down is the median. It’s become an unresolved space, forced into being by the monuments, but not wide enough to comfortably accommodate café seating, while arguably too wide in its attracting of motorcycles and bicycle parking, not to mention the host of urban clutter the IAP has foisted on it.
It is also trapped between two busy traffic lanes, making its use as an alternative pedestrian space decidedly unpleasant at certain times of the day, even more so without the lovely mature tree cover that was there before which combined with a wider median at the time ironically made it ideal for café-style seating!Also I feel the new median trees dilute the effect of the side pavement ones; they’re not ordered enough in their own right to form anything distinctive, while negating the impact of the highly ordered side pavements in the process. You get the feeling it should have been all or nothing with trees on the median. Perhaps this will resolve itself as the trees mature, the side ones especially. And as mentioned before, the bland expanses of paving either side of the Plaza, mainly the Larkin side, do nothing to consolidate the linear nature of the street.

Although it looks nice from air, at the end of the day the 1970s promises of travelling to work via spacepod never quite materialised, so it’s the on-street impression that still matters. As such the roadway should run right up to the Plaza – the Larkin area confusingly feels like a plaza in its own right.
But most definitely J. Seerski, if there’s one thing I’d change, and as you’ve mentioned a few times now ;), is those feckin side lampposts – hate them with a passion! Their design is so utilitarian and crude, with their dull matt grey surfaces giving the impression they were never finished off. They simply lack the distinction, finesse and plain quality O’Connell St has been accustomed to over the decades, and of what one would expect of the lampposts of a country’s main street. They ought to be flagship designs, to the extent that a national competition should have been held to this end. They are that important.
And yes yes yes, those stupid, finicky, parochial, Super Valuesque, ‘lets all join in the fun’ permanent banners on the lampposts – how tacky, how lacking in distinction and grace, how small town Ireland, how patronising to citizens, how expensive if nothing else to maintain all year round – these yokes must cost a fortune to produce, pasted the whole way down the street, not to mention the quays and elsewhere.
The whole design concept of these lampposts is flawed – the impact these crucial structures can have in generating identity for an urban space just wasn’t realised here; it’s such a shame. The same can be said of the median posts – they ought to have been custom-designed, not plucked from page 13 of the urban regen handbook on every city architect’s desk in western Europe.Some pictures definitely need to be posted to try and sum up what has mostly been a very good job done though – in particular it cannot be emphasised enough the attention that’s been paid to all of the new paving, really the finest masonry skills have been employed on this project and it shines. Very attractive paving design too.
As an aside, this picture shows the Eddie Rocket’s building in all its original (though watercoloured) glory, with expansive glazing inserted between the stone piers:

GrahamH
Participant3/4 engaged, 1/4 exposed?!
What the heck does that look like?!1/4 engaged are more common than some might often think; columns that appear to be freestanding are in fact 1/4 engaged in many cases, probably more often than not.
GrahamH
ParticipantThe appeal could be viewed as a token gesture, but it’s the store’s own fault for having ploughed ahead with the development before even getting permission. What do they expect?
A pair of dodgy repro sash windows doesn’t make up for it.GrahamH
ParticipantBut it’s cheaper than having to restore the bridge Stephen – have you not learned the system at this stage?
GrahamH
ParticipantEddie Rocket’s next door is housed in a fine, sturdy Victorian that badly needs cleaning:

All but one of the original windows are intact.
And as shown before, here you can see it being built c1895! 🙂

The chain’s standard shopfront insert is an affront to the fine and seemingly original limestone frame of the ground floor, which come to think of it would make it the oldest shopfront on O’Connell Street!

The acres of flat polished granite are such a cop out – the shopfront should come right up to the top of the corbles, where a limestone panel should then be inserted across the top, with lettering attached. What a fine property this could be once again.
GrahamH
ParticipantBut the biggest problem with the fast food outlets is really their concentration on Lower west, rather than any individual presence, as they present the most appalling vista at the entrance to the street, especially combined with the horrible plastic Footlocker sign. I don’t know why that was permitted recently. All the very worst first impression of a street you could give.
Both McDonald’s and Burger King here require substantial work to their facades and shopfronts.
McDonald’s need to rip off the nasty granite-clad ground floor and start afresh – and no plastic signage this time.
Needless to say the early 90s PVCs most go: horrifying to think a couple of these may even have replaced Wide Streets Commission sashes (though at least some were Victorian two-over-twos).

It’s highly likely the upper brickwork here is Georgian – you can see the stucco surrounds have merely been applied over the decorative over-window detail – which if the case would make it the sole surviving WSC facade on all of O’Connell Street, the last fragment of a scheme that made it one of the finest streets of its age anywhere in the world. Note the modern replacement brickwork in the parapet too – there used to be an elaborate Victorian frieze and cornice up there, evident in a picture below. Probably became structurally unsound balanced up there on Georgian brickwork.
It would be nice for this facade to be restored to its original WSC state down to the first floor, though I imagine they’d be exceptionally reluctant to give up that picture window somehow! But this would restore the elegant vertical profile of each building, allowing them to sit comfortably on top of a new unified shopfront spanning the two properties, instead of the current messy arrangement.

The lower facade of the left-hand building is equally unpleasant, with nasty replacement brick pasting over what used to be a rusticated arch, again evident in a picture further below.

If a better brick base for the upper pilasters could be inserted, and the rather garish white bay windows toned down a bit, this could be a very pleasant property. Some decorative glazing in the upper panes could also work wonders.
Burger King have a potentially attractive fa
GrahamH
ParticipantIt is a terrible shame the taxis got their way on this one – the rank upsets the whole rhythm of the Upper street, the very part of the thoroughfare that would have had a straight run, given the broken up nature of the Lower street with the Plaza and Abbey/Luas junction. It is infuriating that this median space has been commandeered for use as a glorified car park – I particularly hate having to walk down between two rows of cars with 20 sets of eyes suspiciously scanning you, also having to watch for opening car doors. This is a pedestrian space full stop, and should have been kept as such. One could say what is being ignored in any criticism is that a convenient, easily accessed service is now offered to these very pedestrians in the heart of O’Cll St – well it would have been just as handy in Cathal Brugha Street or Sackville Place, only not destructive of a major urban set-piece.
Regarding uses on the street, agreed that O’Connell Street also serves the surrounding community as it does the city and country at large. This is part of its charm, as well as its downfall though; I’m not sure you can buy multipacks of toilet roll on the Champs
GrahamH
ParticipantArguably there’s two lanes more than is required on D’Olier Street, though I haven’t examined it closely. Certainly there always seems to be way too much space devoted to road on this thoroughfare – one lane most definitely.
And yes, widened pavements are the way to go for here and Westmoreland. Medians only tend to generate dead space if dividing busy roads – in an ideal world O’Connell Street wouldn’t have one either were it not for the monuments that line its length.
The Irish Times moving out offers great potential for poor old D’Olier/Dogeared St. Describing it in its most basic form as little more than a four lane road with a stack of bus stops alongside, one might be excused for thinking it to be the Stillorgan Road – albeit a magnificent brooding Georgian streetscape in substantial part. All it needs is a couple of flyovers.
Residential use seems the most likely for most of the upper floors, whether this be in domestic or hotel form. The nature of the street frontage and fenestration lends itself to it. Are there any Georgian domestic interiors/features left in any of the upper floors does anyone know?
The nasty red brick part of the terrace with ‘bungalow’ on top, though not in possession of the IT, ought also to be rebuilt to WSC specifications.It’d be great to see the shop units along here once again fulfilling their original function – they’re not a bad size either. Strange that retailing has changed so little in 200 years!
GrahamH
ParticipantExcellent to hear – more of this please! Proposals were also lodged in the run up to Christmas for interventions to the facade of the former BoI a little further down; didn’t see what was proposed…
On this very terrace, was just thinking there – isn’t it a shame in a way the manner in which this part of the street was rebuilt after 1916. Of course it’s been mentioned a few times before how the four storey Ann Summers terrace punches an unfortunate hole in the parapet level of the five storey street, but also think how impressive the centre of the street could have been if this terrace of ruined buildings was compulsorily purchased, and Clerys shifted northwards to face the GPO head on, with the acquired buildings being moved further south to the current site of Clerys, essentially swopping places.
It could have created a distinguished centrepiece to the street, also allowing for a square to be built that would address the Pillar, the GPO, and the street and city at large. Instead, everything was predictably rebuilt as once was, even down to the bizarre height of the old BoI which replicates the height of former building on the site.
And so the centre of the street was also lost, to be taken over as a giant car park, stuffed with the usual clutter to boot.Not sure what impact Clerys would have had on the GPO – stealing its thunder or whatever you want to call it – but an idea…
Either way, the off-centre siting of Clerys on the current Plaza isn’t the most desirable of circumstances.GrahamH
ParticipantNationwide will be coming from the newly opened Eyre Square tonight at 7pm on RT
GrahamH
ParticipantA Steinway arch perhaps?
GrahamH
ParticipantCould you relink the decision altotude? It doesn’t seem to be working.
I have jigged publicrealm’s pictures about – hope you don’t mind:





Almost by definition this house is quite rare, being a substantial early 20th century residence of distinctive design and character. Whether it is worthy of protection is for somebody who knows what they’re talking about to decide, but certainly it seems to have an element of architectural merit – or should that be historical merit, I’m not sure. Both it seems.
Why anybody would want to substantially alter such a time capsule of a building, of a certain architectural character if not quite distinction, let alone demolish it, I do not know.
What a shame 🙁GrahamH
ParticipantWhile on the matter of terminology, does anyone know of a term that describes the rear wall of a portico – essentially the part of the facade of a building trapped behind the columns, often adorned with pilasters etc?
GrahamH
ParticipantNo. Presuming there is no direct name for it, simple carriage arch is the most appropriate to be honest.
Other than ceremonial gateways, there’s few (if any) other arches that permit the passage of carriages other than those leading into quadrangles.Two examples of the more common interpretation of a porte cochere are those at Belfast City Hall:

And Lissadell House in Sligo:


GrahamH
ParticipantMeanwhile after dark, the GPO is looking magnificent 🙂

The statues have yet to be illuminated, and perhaps the rear of the columns could do with some light treatment too.

Also a wing of the building – note the intrusive impact the Plaza lighting poles have on the scheme.

This is not because of their proximity to the building, but as Stephan C mentioned recently, the lamps have never been directed to light their intended subject: the Plaza! Instead, nearly every single one on each of the four poles is ponting directly downwards, illuminating the footprint of the pole!

Here they are going up in April 2004, but it was only the bulbs that were attended to – the lamps were never moved!


Maybe because it was only realised afterwards that they’d flare into oncoming traffic…
GrahamH
ParticipantHideous yokes, though it’s more their clunky bases that make them look so awful:

(the motorcyles have arrived already :rolleyes:)

This one is fun 😀

Well the taxi lobby got their way and now have a brand spanking new soulless rank commandering a third of the median of the Upper street, also creating a further needless crossing for the pedestrian further south:


The street lamppost line has also been disrupted, being reduced down from pairs to single file:


(though ironically does help in reducing the clutter)
And suffice to say all tree planting has been chucked out the window.As Alek was describing, the taxis have to pull out onto the carriageway upon reaching a jutting out island which seperates the rank from the right-turn queuing position a little further up which provides access to Cathal Brugha Street for all traffic.

The pulling out isn’t that tight, but certainly undesirable, along with the rank at large. It simply shouldn’t be here, and one suspects the O’Connell Street team in DCC are not too happy about it either. They have done their best to integrate it though – it is very well designed and the finish is superb, save the usual questionable manhole covers pockmarking the granite surfaces.
Needless to say the median has finally been opened over the past few days and all major works on the Upper street have been completed. All that is left is the ‘dressing’ as it were, furniture to be installed, signs to be attached to every conceivable pole in the place : ), streetlamp heads to be attached etc.
And seating! There still isn’t a single public seat on all of O’Connell Street – hopefully this will be addressed shortly. Hopefully what will not be addressed is more bicycle parking – they can feck off onto Cathal Brugha Street.
Once the final touches are added, I hope to have lots of before and after images, and more details of the rest of the Upper scheme.- AuthorPosts
