GrahamH
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GrahamH
ParticipantIndeed. In fact I don’t think there has been a single political figure since that has promoted the urban regeneration or architectural cause in such an active way, nor the restoration of state buildings.
Then again it is very easy to spend other people’s money (and not just taxpayers’) on grandiose projects that simply needed doing anyway. None all of the often touted projects were solely the result of Haughey’s work.
Dublin Castle’s State Apartments required an overhaul for the 1990 EU Presidency regardless of his aspirations, along with the Castle’s Conference Centre development.
Government Buildings equally needed refurbishment as a result of the final moving out of UCD in 1989 – a pleasant coincidence for Haughey moving in.
And IMMA also needed a new home, with the Royal Hospital being on the cards for such an exhibition space since the 70s.Colm Tobin summed him up very well on radio today, noting that everything you say about him is true: his appreciation of heritage, of architecture and the wider arts scene – and yet isn’t true.
He was a crony of those who tore down 40% of Georgian Dublin. He had a hand in the demolition of one of the key buildings that formed part of a master stroke of 18th century urban planning in Ireland, and the construction of probably the single-most devastatingly impactful structures in the capital.
He lauded the urban ideal in the rejuvenation of Temple Bar, the instigation of the IFSC, and the restoration of many state buildings in Dublin, yet colluded with those developing some of the most shameful residential schemes on the outskirts of the city, on a par with the worst planning in Europe, committing hundreds of thousands of people to misery and social exclusion, and the country on a wider level to urban sprawl and car dependence.
And he splashed out on a Gandon mansion, extolling its virtues and filling it with fine art, while simultaneously his friends were demolishing a plethora of historic and architecturally significant buildings in the city he escaped from every evening.It would seem difficult to like the man for all that he did and failed to do on an architectural level, and yet personally I’ve frustratingly have always liked the man. He was and still is one of the few people in Irish political life that could hold themselves with decorum and dignity, and that was articulate and a person one could be proud of representing Ireland on an international level.
Not that he wasn’t as full as much bluster of the best of Bertie – he most certainly was looking back on footage from the 70s and 80s: often using a strange 1950s-Ireland patronising type of language too – just he did it in a more pompous way 🙂Above all, what he has done to Irish political life is unforgivable – he did such an injustice to his colleagues and the wider political life in Ireland.
GrahamH
Participant@Frank Taylor wrote:
while architecture is art, at least a poor painting can be left in the basement while some poor bastard has to live in Bachelors Walk.
lol :D. This must the new Archiseek catchline, to be placed on the page title bar of every webpage 😀
Dublin’s comparisons with Paris are very much so valid. From a skyline perspective they are very similar places: developed, western European cities with a fundamentally low-rise historic character relative to other international conurbations, that both face modern-day planning challenges.
Paris has by and large faced up to this very well. If anything, the convention of building eight storeys as standard seems to have stimied the need for taller buildings anyway, or more pointedly has prevented developers from using low density as an excuse for building tall – they simply don’t have that card to play with, unlike in Dublin. Not that this should still be an excuse in Dublin either – frankly I cannot believe the density issue is still raising its head in 2006 when everyone with half a brain in their head knows damn well that even a conservative six storeys, let alone eight, can deliver most what Dublin needs within the existing city core.
8-9 is a nice height to rise up to though in the centre of developments, with the outer fringes coming down to respect the height of surrounding streets. This whole south-western corner of the city is one that has been bypassed by the boom years, and is likely to see a lot of investment in the near future, obviously encompassing the SOHO plan too. If the scale of this project is a sign of what’s to come, then we’re in for a rocky ride.
I have to laugh in a way at this project, as it matches exactly what I expected would happen the second Heuston Gate and was passed. Just like PVC windows, the second an element of height is introduced to virgin territory, it catches on like wildfire and soon everyone’s clambering on ship. That’s all you need – that single spark of leniency, or perhaps even appeasement, in permitting height in an area, and off the train goes on its merry way.
I’d like to read the height survey commissioned by the CC – is it included in the city dev plan, or is it a separate entity? In spite of it, there still doesn’t seem to be a clearly defined vision for the skyline of Dublin. The goalposts keep changing.
GrahamH
ParticipantThis is all very tiresome. If the site wasn’t identified as suitable for tall buildings in the height survey comissioned by DCC (which I don’t think it is anyway, being at neither extremity of the city) then it shouldn’t be built. Plain and simple. The eight storey blocks pushing into Thomas St sound particularly intrusive.
Also, why it is being hailed as a 47 storey scheme when it is clearly 51 is nothing but blatent obfuscation in avoiding mentioning the war: the 50 mark.Alas I fear these scheme has legs given the ambitiousness of the project, the level of detail and amount of effort exerted, and the fact that such a project wouldn’t be proposed were it not to have a decent chance of getting approval, even if at 60-70% of the proposed scale.
GrahamH
ParticipantIndeed. That ever-astute man who sells literature and paintings etc on Lower Grafton St had one of his notorious signs up observing: ‘Dublin is covered in Mars wrappers’ – a reference to the Mars Ice Cream freebies being handed out all last week (managed to scoff seven of them over 3 days 😮 :D).
It’s unbelievable people just take something like that, peel the wrapper and just ditch it as they walk along. They were scattered all over Lower Grafton St, as well as on College Green and O’Connell Street and Bridge where they were also handed out.
There’s a heck of a lot of ignorant beggars in our midst – and Grafton St not exactly being the regular haunt of those that Dublin’s litter problem usually gets dumped on.GrahamH
ParticipantIt seems to be 12 storeys, however each is relatively low at around 2.5 metres/9 feet, bringing the building up to a height of 30m or around 105 feet. Plus a bit more probably.
GrahamH
ParticipantHow many apartments are in it do you know?
@Peter FitzPatrick wrote:
Think the National Conference Centre is to fill that spot just to the left of your picture
Doh! And there was me thinking a few minutes previously ‘hmmm, I wonder where the NCC fits into all of this – the site seems to be taken’ :rolleyes:
GrahamH
ParticipantSo did I – most surprised not to find any reference to them on the Record. Even under the guise of a surrounding street name, still nothing.
Given the steel windows it probably dates from 1920 to 1950, but sure we knew that anyway 🙂
Indeed they could be iron, completely throwing things off.
The late 40s seems about right,It must have been the tallest building ever built in Ireland when constructed surely?
(spires and chimneys aside).
When did it close does anyone know, and who owned it since?GrahamH
ParticipantThe Gasworks has yet to be pictured on Archiseek post-development. This is what it looks like:

I think it works well, if the intense glazing too corporate and faceless.

The concept overall is effective though – both structures retain their independence but still connect nicely together to form a whole.



Typical Victorian industriousness:

And from a distance – classic Fair City 🙂

Rather aptly with Dublin’s unsightly but charming television cable network in view; we’re one of the most cabled countries in Europe.
GrahamH
ParticipantOn the right-hand side of this building in the first picture, you can just make out an Edwardian redbrick warehouse building – it’s got a magnificent 1901 interior:

Didn’t manage to get any further east. But looking across northwards, this is what’s happening where it all started:

…i.e, nothing much bar Spencer Dock bloatedly emerging out onto the quay front:


This should be resolved if there’s something proposed for the left of this building on the site above. Anyone know?
It has a very impressive atrium running through the centre. Is it residential?

It relates well to the neighbouring Victorian:

…and you know who 🙂

Back on the southside, and all of the development taking place is really going in cheek by jowl in relation to the existing housing stock. It’s a refreshing contrast, but I can certainly see how those of the North Wall gave out about the initial Spencer Dock!

Quite extraordinary:

GrahamH
Participant8th June 2006
Well most of Morlan’s pictured developments are now nearing completion. Quite a number of smart new residential streets are being unwrapped round about now, linking Sir John Rogerson’s Quay to the Basin. Most are about four storeys in height, and rather bizarrely reminiscent of Mosney’s 1950s flat blocks – the design is somewhat better however 🙂
I don’t have a picture of those developments as the contractors wouldn’t have been best pleased at being photographed, but here’s a different street:

Back out on the Liffey, here’s what’s happening:

Flat.
Very flat.
Taller than the northern Docklands, but still – flat.
Certainly the U2 Tower in the distance will help things greatly at least.Some individual buildings now:

Very nice, with The Ferryman sympathetically addressed. The circular part on the roof has already become something of a landmark, being so close to the Se
GrahamH
ParticipantNothing’s changed since the ’60s so 😉
A list of Protected Structures in the complex:
Grand Canal Dock, Dublin 4:
a) Boland’s warehouse/mill at lifting bridge, Ringsend Road: six-storey stone warehouse
b) Boland’s warehouse/mill to south and east of concrete silos fronting quay: six-storey, stone warehouse
c) Two-storey brick gables of warehouses fronting at (b) above, i.e. Boland’s Ltd: warehouse
d) Four-storey brick warehouses/mill parallel to quayside to rere of 38-40 Barrow Street 3307
e) Five-storey warehouse/mill gable end to quay, north of (d) above
f) Three-storey warehouse with oriel window adjoining north side of (d) aboveIt seems the two houses are also protected:
Barrow Street, Dublin 4:No 33 House/offices including railings and steps
No 34 House/offices including railings and stepsGrahamH
ParticipantCan’t help with that, though I think their name is up about the site at the moment on various signs, probably including the big planning applications that are everywhere too.
Is is an office development that’s planned then d d dallas?
I wonder what the future is for this lovely Regency house on the site – it generates a fantastic, if bizarre, juxtaposition:
It doesn’t look good however 😡

The mill holds such a dominance over the area. I love how it towers over the little streets below:

GrahamH
ParticipantMadness! It looks like a photo of the location including the crane in the foreground, and the background replaced with an artist’s impression!
You’ve some very weird light down there…
GrahamH
ParticipantIndeed – a lovely building. It is curiosities like these that make urban spaces all the more interesting.
Is this a rendering or a photograph d d dallas?
Bizarre image!https://archiseek.com/content/attachment.php?attachmentid=2379&stc=1&d=1149451566
GrahamH
ParticipantClearly I
GrahamH
ParticipantDoes ‘other road users’ also include pedestrians I wonder?
It’s pretty obvious in the first picture picture that parking up on that dead space of pavement between the (nice early electric :)) lamppost and the tree would be ‘tak[ing] into account the safety of other road users’, and not the set-up depicted. On the balance of things, was a guardian of the law rushing off to save a baby’s life, or was an ignorant Garda not bothered about the consequences of where they parked while dropping off a bit of paperwork?
It might have had something to do with the Australian delegation who were all still in Dublin a week after Howard’s visit, given the calvalcade of particularly vulgar hired silver mercs and vans that swept through the city centre on Wednesday – lead by about six Garda motorbikes. Much smaller than most State visits it seemed…
GrahamH
ParticipantThat advertisment you posted above Devin is truly unbelievable – before and after indeed! :rolleyes: 😮
That single little square from a newspaper captures in a nutshell what is contained in nearly ten pages of material here, and what is happening across the country to our older building stock.
Living breathing heritage replaced with an idealised, synthetic version of what is deemed to be ‘traditional’.
This in particular is the sickest example yet come across:
I noted this exact phenomenon you mention of derelict buildings in towns and villages in Ballymore Eustace recently. The townland surrounding the village of course coming down with new development (though seemingly more controlled than other parts of the country), while there’s about six derelict 19th century houses and buildings coming into the village and in the village itself. The largest of which, a two storey house with extensive frontage near the village centre (about the size of the two buildings above), is proposed to be demolished and replaced with a humdrum two storey development, to include a medical/doctor’s surgery.
No doubt ‘what about the children’ tactics are being thrown about as we speak.There is way too much focus in the media on getting people back into Dublin city to live. Getting developers to build family units in the capital is bad enough, but in regional towns and villages it’s almost non-existant – especially villages. This should be the real focus of environmental and planning journalism. It’s a massive problem. Dublin is just constantly used as a token example, which in itself is damaging as it reinforces the widespread perception that Dublin is the only urban area in Ireland – everywhere else is just ‘the countryside’, even with major regional towns and villages.
And so these places are left to crumble as the estates and one-offs capture new territory elsewhere. The doughnut effect could not be more apt a description for what is happen in regional urban Ireland, only the part that is most often forgotton about, the hole, is particularly relevant to many Irish urban centres. There’s nothing in the middle.
GrahamH
ParticipantIsn’t he just – never been a fan either.

As an ensemble the two parts work well, and fountain element and figures a delight – but the statue is so very clunky and lacking in stature.
And his head looks like it’s been transplanted.GrahamH
ParticipantUndoubtedly what has made the restoration is the installation of a fantastic LED lighting scheme. Both parts of the memorial are going to look spectacular at night:

No less than about 30 of these dinky little fittings have been installed, as well as others underneath the water.

Similarly around the base of the statue:

What’s very impressive, and I’m glad to see the CC have finally taken the concept on board, is the idea of sinking powerful lamps into the pavement underneath a sheet of glass. Just look at these fancy LED floods!


Very swanky! And yes, the question everyone’s about to say in chorus is……..why wasn’t this done on O’Connell Street?!
Larkin obviously stands out for treatment similar to the LEDs surrounding the base at the very least. Perhaps an indication then that the CC definitely intend to light the monuments from the buildings?The removal of the hoardings was very timely for the fine weather – this being the only street water feature in all of Dublin city centre, a state of affairs that has to change. There’s nothing like sitting near water on a hot dusty day in the city – everyone’s just drawn like magnets to the fountains in the Green when really it’s on a city street that you want it: at the south end of Grafton Street, or the centre of College Green. Cleanliness shouldn’t be an issue anymore – nearly every capital in the world probably has such a feature, but Dublin has nothing.
Not that it isn’t pleasant to sit on the grass – Stephen’s Green was packed as usual today:


Lovely Continental air about the place too : )



(yawn)GrahamH
ParticipantThat would impinge on the grand avenue-style streetscape that could be created here – though yes, they do have to be accommodated somehow…
Stupid buses – always have to spoil everything!Well as Greg F mentioned on the O’Connell Street thread, the Thomas Davis Memorial on College Green has been unveiled this week after months of blue hoarding surrounding it, and after years of the water element not working. It looks great.

Doesn’t look over-restored – just right.

Don’t think these glass screens were here before were they? They’re topped in what seems to be brushed brass.


Just like O’Connell Monument, Davis looks crisp and clean, with the bronze matt finish very striking:





Sorry I’ve no pic of the fountains – cameras don’t like getting wet.
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