GrahamH

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  • in reply to: O’ Connell Street, Dublin #730527
    GrahamH
    Participant

    @lostexpectation wrote:

    how much of that substantial building is the GPO?

    The entire structure lostexpectation.
    Obviously only the front part is the 1818 original, with the enormous side wings stretching down Henry Street and Princes Street constructed from scratch following 1916. Henry Street was the first side to be developed in 1924-26, followed by Princes Street and then the public office completed in 1929. However basement parts of the original building appear to still extend underneath parts of the rebuilt structure and out under Princes Street

    The GPO Arcade is not the major cross-block in the middle as initial impressions may suggest, but rather the lower glazed block further west near the end of the building. See how Arnotts now feeds into it too. The top-lighting of all the 1920s stores is also evident.

    in reply to: O’ Connell Street, Dublin #730523
    GrahamH
    Participant

    lol – brilliant Morlan ๐Ÿ˜€

    At least the Londis one is temporary – we’ll only have to endure it for two and a half years.

    What a ridiculous article – I can’t believe even the Indo decided to run with the ‘shopping centre’ line. And I thought the Mail were stooping to a new low with their shock and awe spin on the story :rolleyes:

    Where and when exactly has the GPO ever been ‘generally considered’ to have a ‘deadening’ effect on the area? This is the second busiest pedestrian intersection in the entire country after Grafton Street, with the GPO being a major player in drawing the crowds. Have any journalists ever actually used the GPO? Or indeed government ministers for that matter? It is constantly thronged with people for every hour of its trading. The sole deadening effect, if it could even be described as such, is the access-blind facade under the portico with no entranceway; it is illogical and ridiculous that the most grandiose portico in the city heralds a blank wall to the intending patron. It’s a pity this wasn’t reopened in the recent refurbishment.

    And what rubbish about post-1916 fabric: this entire building is protected, including most of the late 1920s interior fixtures and fittings – it is no more a simple matter ridding the building of these as it would be of 19th century originals. Indeed the fact that they are so central to the building’s use makes it doubly so. Indeed have the Government considered that, in light of ABP’s recent (and proper) landmark ruling regarding Bewleys of Westmoreland Street, that the conversion of such a landmark building as the GPO to an alternate use when its existing use is inherent to its heritage, character, location and purpose is simply not permissible?

    Personally I’ve no objection to the redevelopment of the enormous rear of the building and courtyards, and fully agree that it is a wasted behemoth in the centre of the city in terms of so much of an historic building and location being devoted to administration space, sorting rooms and service yards.


    http://www.fantasyjackpalance.com

    And there’s no reason why a small retail and restaurant element should not be included as an aside to the main museum, perhaps with an elegantly glazed arcade extension to the existing one, leading into the adjoining courtyard, but the public postal office must remain central to the principal facade on O’Connell Street.

    It must also be remembered that the newly reconfigured Princes Street (as part of the Arnotts scheme) is going to open up the enormous side elevation of the building to the public, becoming almost as important as the O’Connell Street frontage itself, easily accommodating a secondary grandiose entrance to the redeveloped complex – it doesn’t have to smash through the public office.

    Leave the grand old lady on O’Connell Street alone.

    in reply to: How well do you know Dublin? #766191
    GrahamH
    Participant

    Hmmm – all these development lifestyle blurbs just blur into one. Not Altro Vetro is is? Or the RHK?

    Nope the corbel isn’t near Trinity/Andrew Street alas. If you look closely, you can see where iron armatures or pins once embedded the side of it into a shopfront fascia or similar – a chunk appears to have been cut off underneath that area too. Not that I know why either!

    in reply to: How well do you know Dublin? #766188
    GrahamH
    Participant

    And indeed the only Ashtons the idirline cares to mention.

    In which case, nope.

    in reply to: How well do you know Dublin? #766186
    GrahamH
    Participant

    Who, where and/or what is Ashtons?

    I sense an ‘ah back in the day’ shpiel coming on here…

    in reply to: How well do you know Dublin? #766183
    GrahamH
    Participant

    So no one’s got it yet ๐Ÿ™

    Well here’s another in the meantime – one of the curiosities of the city that both the location and an explanation for would be welcome! I’d like to know more about it.

    in reply to: kildare place #737577
    GrahamH
    Participant

    Thanks for that Hiivaladan. Interesting view from what seems to be 1956/57 – just look at that ‘rubble’ shoot coming out the window :(. Strangly agricultural gates to the left too.

    The left-hand house is quite similar to the Georgian still standing across the road, now the Shelbourne car park, currently undergoing restoration. It’s of similar mid-century date, given how tiny the windows are, and of course the Venetian. I wonder if there were further houses to the left forming a terrace, prior to the construction of the National Musuem? Lovely little turreted curiousity to the right there too ๐Ÿ™‚

    As has been mentioned a few times on the site, the great sandstone Italinate chimney looming to the rear of the houses was formerly located on Earlsfort Terrace, built principally as the ventilation shaft and secondly as the campanile of the newly converted Royal University/UCD around 1885.

    Interestingly, the clock and bells installed were the GPO’s 1818 originals.

    In an extraordinary example of make-do-and-mend, the entire tower was dismantled around 1915 and re-erected behind the RUI’s city centre colleague’s premises: the Royal College of Science on Merrion Street. There it acted as a chimney stack for the complex’s new-fangled turf-fired heating system (though what they had used since the college’s completion in 1911 is open to question). Its rooftop was rather crudely converted from lofty pinnacle to industrial chimney pot, as can be seen in Hiivaladan’s picture.

    The tower was finally dismantled in the early 1970s, probably as it posed a security risk to the Leinster House complex in the newly troubled North. The bells and clock faces remained dumped in the grounds of Earlsfort Terrace for about twenty years after the tower was moved – anyone any idea where they are now?

    Interestingly, Kildare Place has another connection to Dublin Castle other than the fireplaces salvaged from Number 3 in the above picture – and indeed to the Italinate chimney. When Tracton House – a fine 1740’s house on the site of the red brick Bank of Ireland premises on the corner of Merrion Row beside the Shelbourne – was demolished in 1912, its magnificent Apollo Room or back drawing room was donated by the bank to the State. Curiously for so early in the 20th century, the National Museum built a seperate annex onto its complex in Kildare Place to house the room, and furnished it as an example of 18th century Irish craftsmanship. Here it remained until about 1939, when it was dismantled after the outbreak of war to provide extra space for storage of turf for the very central heating station pictured above! It was not without public outcry, with numerous mentions in contemporary newspapers.

    The room, including its magnificent stucco ceiling and panelling was then put in storage, being shifted between the back of Iveagh House and the Royal Hospital (why was the RHK such a dumping ground over the years?!). Eventually, after the disasterous fire in the Castle in 1941, it was decided to incorporate it into the State Apartments, partially as compensation for the loss of the extraordinarily bizzare Presence Chamber that was completely destroyed. However, as the panelling, frieze and cornice had been hacked about so much over the years, there was no option but to reproduce in fascimile all but the ceiling of the room.

    So hence the odd connection between the three places and structures ๐Ÿ™‚

    in reply to: woodlawn house, galway #778119
    GrahamH
    Participant

    Great stuff alexaia – thanks for posting. What a place! What’s interesting about Victorian piles like this is the sheer scale of the places. Whereas Georgian mansions accommodated a small amount of large rooms, Victorian houses featured a large amount of small rooms! – in many ways the precurser of the modern-day detached house with its myriad ill-proportioned boxy rooms. Woodlawn is just unbeliveably large – as if built just for the sake of holding as many rooms as possible! It seems even the ancillary buildings far outstrip the grandeur of the house.

    The extent to which the house is mass-produced is wonderful – a monument to the pattern books and off-the-shelf products of the Victorian age. This extraordinary image says it all ๐Ÿ™‚

    Interesting that Georgian sashes were used to the rear as late as 1885 – nice little cost-cutting measure. Plate glass may still have been quite expensive in rural/western areas. The plate sashes to the front are also quite small. I love this little addition to the rear ๐Ÿ™‚

    What bizarre proportions to the portico columns too!

    The interior in many ways is reminiscent of the great neoclassical mansions of America from the late 19th and early 20th centuries. This hallway could be taken straight out of the house in Jumanji ๐Ÿ™‚

    Some very strange design concepts going on there…

    Surely this would cost at least €3 million to restore?

    in reply to: Dublin Historic Stone Paving disbelief #764144
    GrahamH
    Participant

    3/7/2007

    Well, like clockwork, poor old Parks and Planters have been called out to save the day yet again in the case of the City Hall Plaza – only even their usual sensitive works aren’t safe from the blight of meagre resources. We now have bloated leafy wedding cakes fashioned from recycled 1980’s McDonald’s chairs dumped about the space in an attempt to enliven this sterile ‘civic amenity’.

    The finesse and consideration for the historic setting is striking.

    They’re utterly awful. Whereas I’d welcome any softening of the space, these just hammer home the point of how this area has been appalling designed from the outset. Can you just imagine a similar, supposedly tailor-made, architect-designed space in any other European city being scattered with frumpy floral planters? It’s akin to labouring over designs for a Meisian-inspired house and then putting up net curtains. And even the type of planter chosen here speaks volumes: I’ve seen better local authority models in regional towns! Not even half-decent timber or stone models used.

    Meanwhile on the historic granite paving fronting the plaza, further incisions have been made in the stone to accommodate more of these ghasty yokes generously termed litter bins.

    So not only are they hideous in their own right and in the historic setting, they also damage the paving on which they’re sited, are located in the wrong place for users of the plaza seating to avail of, and are plonked right in the way of pedestrians on this often crowded pavement! And why three in a row – in case you don’t see the first two?!

    What a mess: even after all the controversy over Robocop and the sterile square they still can’t get it right. And the place isn’t even finished yet either – the railings are still there shielding the sticks that were planted ages ago.

    Just as an aisde, as some consolation, there’s been a lovely job done with the planters on the Boardwalk. They’ve all been stained a more elegant dark shade, and have attractive architectural ferns with floral displays planted in them.

    A faintly exotic, Victorian whiff has been added to the Boardwalk. Nice job Parks Dept.

    in reply to: National Wax Monstrosity #745742
    GrahamH
    Participant

    A pile of pastiche by the sounds of it – and a seven-storey pile at that; they only got six in the end.

    Two more views of it nearing completion. It’s even worse that previously could be made out; the ground floor elevation is simply appalling.

    And the delightful view looking north.

    Clearly they’re the same architects responsible for Jurys on Parnell Street. The blacked out grey-framed glazing, red brick and general box-like treatment is identical. A completely blank facade is now presented to Dorset Street, with no entrance, no windows addressing the thoroughfare, and no design treatment whatever to suggest that it is even the principal elevation – all combining to reinforce Dorset Street’s status as a dual carriageway ploughing its way through the north inner city: it has turned its back on it.

    A monstrous blank face, soon to be peppered with air vents and a token pair of uplighters.

    And a classic DCC detail outside too. New granite paving is being laid, complete with brushed steel traffic signal poles. Only, given the new pole is already in place beside the old galvanised one…

    …then eh, ummm…

    And the new pavement is also miserably wide to cater for the left turn onto Granby Row. As can be seen, it gets narrower and tighter as it approaches the corner, an unpleasant sticking point for pedestrians at this busy junction.

    in reply to: Dublin Historic Stone Paving disbelief #764143
    GrahamH
    Participant

    :p

    What a shame – they sound most interesting publicrealm.

    Curiously, around the corner the setts outside City Hall/Castle gate are also being relaid now, over a month after they were first dug up. Why the delay? And why the questionable manner of relaying?

    As can be seen from before, the whole roadway leading up to the gate is laid with typically dodgy widely-spaced setts, instead of attractively (and more comfortably for both pedestrian and driver) knitted tightly together. While not a major breach – heck we’re lucky to have setts here at all – it nonetheless demonstrates the usual lack of attention to detail and appreciation of a traditional craft, as per granite paving pointing and bollardism. Many of the gaps are also just filled with rough dirt, poured tar and concrete. Indeed the sham of these setts is also shown by the fact of their termination in a ridiculous straight line at the top of the hill along the edge of the Castle entrance – they don’t even continue into Castle Street to give a bit of visual breathing space. It’s embarrassingly cheap, half-hearted and visually incoherent.

    Cork Hill really has been fecked over in the past five years, and all details – from pavements, to roadway surface, to yellow lines, to lampposts, to bollards – now need attention. The fact that it’s all on the doorstep of City Hall says it all really. And seperately, the Castle gate piers have also sadly lost their lamps in the past few years; they nicely terminated the vista up the hill and created something of a dramatic entrance.

    in reply to: Henrietta Street #775302
    GrahamH
    Participant

    Some lumps of city.

    Bit of rustication, a classical plinth or two, some railing – what more do you need?

    No crown glass – tsk ๐Ÿ˜‰

    And how classical doorcases tie in with medieval streets is anyone’s guess…

    Amazing though how this…

    Creates this.

    The bare minimum required is done for maximum impact on screen.

    Bit of atmospheric smoke to cover the dodgy bits and you’re flying.

    in reply to: Henrietta Street #775301
    GrahamH
    Participant

    Henrietta Street was the scene of a period drama last week – probably the historically dubious ‘The Tudors’ which is being shot around Dublin at the moment. They commandeered the Chapel Royal this week with enormous lights melting all the Viceroys’ coats of arms as they blasted through the windows, and folk in medieval dress strutting about the Toyotas and Volvos in the Lower Yard.

    Henrietta Street was quite the odd juxtaposition.

    Wonderfully evocative street scenes.

    Some Tudor pigeons.

    But The Yoke making its presence felt as ever.

    in reply to: National Wax Monstrosity #745739
    GrahamH
    Participant

    Well at least some good has come out of it: namely a funny thread. Had a good guffaw reading through all of the above ๐Ÿ˜€

    Two relatively minor tweaks alone could have converted this into a more palatable box: the replacement of the render with a crisp white brick, and the ditching of the red ‘towers’ in favour of a grey brick or a matt limestone cladding. At least add some texture to the darn thing – really, what a disaster. As for these window infill panels, they are the curse of the modern city. Any developer from hereonin proposing their use must to be forced to have them installed in place of the plastic Georgian grids in their own piles in Malahide. A worthy addition to the next City Development Plan methinks.

    GrahamH
    Participant

    I agree: all of those square precast units repeated over and over are oddly attractive – they must appeal in a logical, Duplo building block kind of way. And for such an enormous building, including a considerable height, it’s remarkably unobtrusive. It would appear to achieve this by having little or no service layer between the floors – I suspect it might not have air conditioning given all of those hundreds of windows open (in contrast to some of Stephenson’s other work), and it’s quite a shallow building with windows on all elevations. Its monolithic scale is also greatly reduced because there’s no principal facade; indeed most of the building is pretty much hidden in one way or another!

    Yes the sneaky intrusion of its upper floor over the parapet of Government Buildings is one of the little-often mentioned planning mistakes of the 1960s. Without question this ought to be rectified before/when the Department ever move out.

    It’s much worse once you’re inside the gates.

    In a way it’s interesting how times have changed, both in terms of Government Buildings itself and how underestimated it was at the time (partly to do with its condition), and in how planning applications are compiled and processed. Renderings of sightlines and visual impact assessments would be central to a modern-day development application of this kind.

    Not that air con plant and water tanks aren’t still slipping through the net…

    in reply to: St. Stephen’s Green, Dublin #739872
    GrahamH
    Participant

    @Peter FitzPatrick wrote:

    Not sufficient space outside luas on Stephen’s Green west from what i understand. I’d be quite happy if the works could be confined to the roadway.

    Surely the Luas platform could just be temporarily shifted southwards? There’s a huge tract of track here (outside Eircom), much longer than the existing stop that could be used to temporaily terminate the Luas instead of its current location. Unfortunately, going by the earlier picture, it seems they still won’t have the width in the roadway that’s required – though I can’t see why three traffic lanes plus the substantial width of the Green pavement isn’t sufficient…

    Agreed the impact on the Green must be minimised; this is arguably the most scenic part of the park, with that delightfiul winding path leading up to the picturesque keeper’s house, and the huge rolling lawn facing it with magnificent mature feature specimens strategically placed about. It’d be shameful for this to be destroyed.

    in reply to: D’Olier & Westmoreland St. #713940
    GrahamH
    Participant

    Doubt it ๐Ÿ™‚

    A nursing home in my local paper was recently referred to, in quotation marks which just added to the fun of it all. as “The Bitches”. After the tree, you’ll understand.

    @sw101 wrote:

    you’re famous, graham

    Ah, highrisers got the better deal. All mine needs is a ‘like’ and a questioning tone; with a toss of the hair it’s straight from the Miriam O’Callaghan phrasebook.

    in reply to: National Wax Monstrosity #745724
    GrahamH
    Participant

    So which is better? ๐Ÿ˜ฎ

    Now, I know ‘budget’ hotel refers to modest accommodation, but this appears to have mixed this up with the standard of the structure itself. For a 3-star hotel, this is simply appalling elevational treatment. I can’t believe this was allowed through in an area of future regeneration.

    Given it’s a flagship public building for the area, is this the high water mark of design DCC are setting for the environs of Dorset Street for the next ten years?

    It’s Arran Quay 2007.

    in reply to: O’ Connell Street, Dublin #730495
    GrahamH
    Participant

    Why does this anti-social issue keep cropping up here in relation to public seating? It’s got absolutely nothing got to do with it – certainly not on our principal streets. Why would an ‘anti-social element’ suddenly be attracted to seating on a busy public thoroughfare? Even as it is they don’t make use of the monument steps on O’Connell Street. But agreed there is without question an underlying reason as to why DCC aren’t providing public seating, even on O’Connell Street, and I’d love to know what it is. The Boardwalk is a different kettle of fish entirely, and cannot by any logic be used as a comparison – so their reluctance is just bizarre.

    As was pointed out at the urban conference a few weeks ago, planning for the public domain is all about anticipating pedestrian requirements, creating incidental spaces, and making relaxed, coherent environments for urban dwellers – much of which also helps to quash anti-social elements. Having seating along the median for example can only help repell those who openly shop about for bicycles to steal, glancing over their shoulders every few seconds like jackdaws as they debate the best model to nick.

    Never mind the elderly, everyone needs public seating, and there isn’t a single public provision between Parnell Square and St. Stephen’s Green – it’s a scandal. All along under the shade of the lime trees lining the Plaza opposite the GPO is an ideal space for seating, as is the entire length of the median which was massively in demand as a resting place when the dancing rabbits lined the street last year. Proof if ever it was needed – they were often jammed solid mid-afternoon.

    Two other pics that show how clean the Spire is at the minute.

    Alas the rusty streak is very very noticable, and doesn’t rub off either…

    Also work to Findlater House has started very quickly.

    Some trial LED units have also been erected.

    GrahamH
    Participant

    16/6/2007

    As this thread contains quite a bit of Kildare Place material, this might as well go here. I came across this photograph of Kildare Place from c.1890 in the National Library Collection. What a radically different place it was ๐Ÿ™


    ร‚ยฉ National Library of Ireland

    Also note the Georgian terrrace in the distance forming one side of Merrion Street prior to demolition for Government Buildings/Royal College of Science.

    The grand Victorian on the site of the present Department of Agriculture was the Church of Ireland training college according to Frank McDonald. Acquired in the early 1960s by John Laing, a large UK contruction firm, they got permission in 1963 to build an eight-storey office block on the site, but nothing happened until the State stepped in in 1969, paid some of the site acquisition costs, and then got Irish Life of all people to bank-roll the construction of the block, to be built by Laing. Notoriously of course, Irish Life thereby acquired the freehold of the building, and rented it to the State on a tenure of 150 years! (it’s since been bought out). Indeed by 1984, the rent annual rent amounted to the cost of building it in the first place!

    The two Georgians as pictured before were demolished by the State in 1957, and replaced by McGrath’s brown brick wall, now rsther picturesquely coverd in ivy. Apparently a Governemnt minister at the time said: ‘I was glad to see them go. They stood for everything I hate’. Here they are being stripped down.

    The doorcase is remarkably similar to Richard Castle’s surviving house on O’Connell Street :(. Rather conveniently, the houses were demolished by the OPW at the same time that the State Apartments in the Castle were being restored/rebuilt from scratch, and two late 18th century fireplaces salvaged from Number 3 Kildare Place were reused there: one in the Wedgewood Room, and another in a fomer Viceregal bedroom to the rear.

    Anyone any idea what/where this building is to the rear? Where Huguenot House now stands?

    Also the enormous bulk of Agriculture House, as designed by Sam Stephenson, then the largest office block ever built in Ireland.


    ร‚ยฉ fantasyjackpalace.com

    And Kildare Place today.

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