GrahamH
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Have to say I’m really not a fan of Foster’s design for this particular site. It doesn’t address its location properly: presenting a gable wall to the city, while its principal elevation is so narrow as to be at odds with the vast horizontal expanse of the Liffey. It’s as if it’s addressing or pointing to a specific point on the river – by virtue of its leaning character and its narrow main facade – and yet when you get down there, there’s, well, nothing.
This critical corner site is more suited to a proud, upstanding, elegant statement that’s more outward looking; something that addresses the city at large as well as the corner site in question. It needs to be more all-encompassing, more democratic in appearance than what is proposed. What we have is rather self-absorbed – not necessarily a bad thing – but given this is to be the defining building of the Docklands to which all future towers are supposed to bow in deference, I’m not sure we have the right building. This design is more along the lines of one of those very smaller towers that wants to make a bit of a statement with a quirky shape, not the flagship that should be addressing the entire area.
Does it not grate with anyone that a corner site is being filled with what is anything but a corner building? Personally I find it very jarring.
To say the least. I disagree regarding the lines, Blisterman: only one of the window courses matches, and frankly it’s entirely coincidental. To attribute the ignorant, lazy and insensitive bulldozing of horizontal courses to an intended tongue-in-cheek post-modernist approach is faintly ridiculous, though no doubt exactly what the architects would have spouted had the planning authority pressed them on it. Luckily for them however, it was DCC they were dealing with, who not only blithely waved it through, but also promptly rolled over to have their tummy tickled.
Agreed the facade itself is crisp and fresh, and not without merit at another location with different cladding. But this terrace should not have been interfered with. It’s as simple as that.
🙂
The emergence of Supermacs here is naturally of great surprise, and would appear to be warranted given the apparent lack of planning permission – there’s no record of a change of use application on DCC’s site, nor for alterations to the shopfront. I also saw no site notice to this effect.
The Special Planning Control Scheme which covers Westmoreland Street states: “The conversion of a restaurant/café or part of a restaurant/café to a fast food outlet will constitute a change of use and will require planning permission.” It also specially notes: “There are no locations in the Area of Special Planning Control that are considered suitable for additional fast food outlets or outlets for the sale of hot food for consumption off the premises (take-aways).” Can a take-away/sit-in coffee outlet (i.e. Barnie’s) be considered the same as a full-blown fast food restaurant? Perhaps Beshoff’s takeaway designation beforehand swung it, with Barnie’s continuing to trade under the banner.
Even use aside, the previous Barnie’s signage which was average but at least muted was completely altered by Supermacs painting the cheap, applied timber facia day-glo white. It is cheap and nasty, and a tacky scar on this imposing building.
Also more holes drilled in the granite for security camera fittings and nasty cabling, and yet more brash floodlighting with exposed junction boxes and cabling overhanging the street.
While yet more doorcases and window frames have been taken out in favour of expansive glazing exposing all of the interior to the street. And already they have illegal postering tacked about their new glazing.
The only positive move was the cleaning of the stonework and removal of menus. Here’s Barnie’s before.
Did DCC have so much as a look-in on this case? Even if they did, it thoroughly stinks.
Another slap in the face towards improving Westmoreland Street.
Great! Thanks for that adhoc. What a depth!
Perhaps Paul the water table issues are due to the River Styne which flows in this area, roughly down from Harcourt Street, through the Green and along Grafton Street down to Hawkins Street? (ish). Indeed the winding form of Grafton Street is thought to be derived from following the course of the Styne. It may cause some headaches for the Metro…Just as we’re in the area, the York Street redevelopment went down by one floor (this picture taken October 2006). The RCSI part of the site though (out of shot) apparently went down four storeys.
Okay, so we have an idea of form – which is eye-catching – but that’s about it thus far. What is Foster’s love affair with night-time renderings?! Even with no planning hurdles to jump through and their requisite glitzy illuminated smoke screens, we still only get a dusky shot. Day-time is what matters.
Morlan, I would have thought the tower is deliberately tilted to the front?
Personally I feel the square shape of the previous tower, evenly denoting this special corner site from all viewpoints in the city, was a more elegant solution. I’m not sure how apt this multi-faceted tower is to such a location, but we’ll see how it pans out.
12/10/2007
The hole being dug for the new Gaiety Centre development is simply enormous – one of the deepest excavations you’re likely to see in the city, especially adjoining existing (old!) buildings. It seems they’re going down at least a whopping three storeys – no doubt partly in compensation for the loss of (originally ridiculous) height proposed for this development. At least one of these basement levels is to be retail/commercial.
These pictures don’t remotely do justice to how far down they’ve gone – you really have to see it on site. I’d be a bit wary if I owned the Gaiety! (also note its chic new flytower above).
Is there parking planned for under here too?
Yes I wonder if the hotel would be incorporated. It’d save them a heck of a lot of hassle – especially given Mr Smith’s recent determination to go all the way to the High Court – while also going some way towards validating the more recent ‘hiccups’ of the tower project.
No change there then 😀
Passed The Point this evening: the building is a gutted shell, wilh no roof and all the walls buttressed and braced – a facade retention of epic proportions. The westerm wall is also just beginning to come down – looks like someone’s taken a big bite out of the top of it. Impressive so much has been stripped out and the structure secured in the six weeks since the last event was held there at the end of August.
Hehe – very true d_d. They were all sold out within minutes, with posters up everywhere from disgruntled staff being asked about them every four seconds 😀
And bizarrely most people were queueing with only a few items of clothing, even though the queues were well over an hour. It’s not as if it was designer savings being made. Some old-fashioned Mr Burns efficiency crept into my head that evening – I’d be happier with the dollar.
Curiously, while Dunnes has made massive leaps in ‘Euroising’ and modernising Homewares and most fashion departments, large swathes of Menswear remain resolutely in the 1990s – other mid-market retailers beat them hands down. I think it’s next on the list for an upgrade.
Interesting view of The Point there Morlan. Looks like a derelict Big House in the country 🙂
Apparently in the redevelopment of The Point itself, its western wall will be demolished and the theatre extended out towards the city, thus preserving the river and rear facades. It’s being conducted by the leading international venue designers HOKSVE at a cost of €80 million, and will have a capacity of 14,000 in amphitheatre style as previously mentioned. The project is expected to have the remarkable turnaround time of about 18 months, reopening in late 2008, having only closed in August. That’s private sector efficiency for ya.
Not to deliberately add to the wave of criticism, but walking down the street the other morning I actually started laughing at how preposterous the environment on the street was. It is truly the most pedestrian-hostile street in the capital after College Green as regards the volumes of noise, traffic and intimidation generated. Walking down the median (whilst avoiding all the bicyles and motorbikes), there was simply ranks of buses with their diesel engines roaring by on both sides, taxis racing down the street to make the lights, and by the southern end it was so congested that there was just two walls of buses and private traffic choking the lanes on either side.
Whatever of the generally decent paving and planting scheme executed, the traffic on the thoroughfare is an absolute farce and couldn’t be any further away from the pedestrian utopia espoused in the IAP if it tried. If anything, it has simply concentrated more traffic into an even smaller space, along with ever-growing volumes of intimidating buses squeezing down the street. It does actually feel like the Champs Élysées in terms of the extent of the traffic pouring down it, but has none of the pedestrian-firendly qualities that goes with its Parisian counterpart. Indeed at times it even feels like there’s the traffic of a world capital pouring down the thoroughfare…
Also the benzene, nitrogen and other harmful pollutant levels captured along this corridor of tall buildings must surely be undesirable to say the least.And to apply Alex’s Road Traffic Act point even wider, it’s truly baffling why the Gardaà sitting on their hands for the entire day on ‘GPO Duty’ cannot be even the tiniest bit proactive in issuing tickets for the myriad motorcycles and indeed often larger vechicles sitting right in front of them along the median and Plaza. These are all persistent offenders: it’s well known in motorcycling circles that the O’Connell median is an ideal dumping ground for vehicles. As a result, it can be equally effectively stamped out inside a month were word to spread as to instant fines. Problem solved.
I couldn’t agree with you more Stephen – indeed I was about to get some pictures of these very stores.
It’s great to see a good news story emerging here – Grafton Street has been upping the stakes enormously over the past 18 months or so. There’s some beautiful shopfront design evolving on the thoroughfare, especially at the south-western end near South Anne Street – there’s almost a Chic Row emerging here, with unit upon unit of sleek modern design.
By contrast the Northside, while benefiting in the short term from major new retail complexes, will in the long term suffer from out-dated ‘mega-structural’ developments cloaked in uninspiriing two dimensional glossy tiles, with bloated rendered backsides spewing out into various important views in the city. And clearly not even existing decent stock is safe either.
Incidentally, before the event disappears into the annals of time, the opening of the new Dunnes a few months ago was the most extraordinary spactacle the city centre must ever have witnessed since 1916 – only this time it was a consumer war. I just happened to be passing and went in to see the new store, not knowing there was 50% off all stock until getting inside. It is impossible to describe what utter mayhem there was; I have never ever ever seen a store so full of people in all my life; there was literally thousands of people in there: a swarming sea of shoppers slowing rippling across four levels. The shelves were almost empty, there was stock thrown everywhere, the security guards were standing around pretty much helpless, the queues for the checkouts were at least 100 deep across the store, lasting well over an hour, and the escalators and lifts were completely jammers. It was actually frightening at times, with an every-man-for-himself atmosphere pervading the store. Absolute madness – it was fantastic to see such a consumer orgy in all its glory.
Spectacular marketing Margaret – gotta hand it to her.
The adjoining Georgians at the junction with O’Connell Street are also in bits as ever.
So much potential here. And in terms of the architectural hertiage of this part of the city, these facades are almost as significant as the RDH townhouse on O’Connell Street.
An intriguing little gem next door.
Rare Wyatt windows.
An entire streetscape that sorely needs attention. Given these facades can’t be given the developer treatment, I suppose neglect is the appropriate period building equivalant.
29/9/2007
This might as well go here given how the Square feeds into Parnell Street.
The ‘down-at-heel’ envirnment that characterises Parnell Street is well known, even the recently developed areas, but the eastern end of the street is still stuck in the 1980s. It hasn’t been touched by the boom years, and remains the decrepit backwater it has been for the latter part of the 20th century.
This is the reason it was included in the O’Connell Street IAP, was designated an ACA, and sited in an Area of Special Planning Control. It was also because of its second-rate state that the street was given special site cluster designation, with the entire stretch of buildings from O’Connell Street to Marlborough Street tax-incentivised for redevelopment and refurbishment. The ACA also requires that “all new buildings should be designed to the highest standard in a modern architectural idiom. Pastiche will be discouraged and will only be allowed or required in exceptional circumstances.”
And yet the very first of these sites to be (finally) redeveloped, and it gets this.
I kid you not. Notwithstanding basic common sense, even with every development control a planning authority can be afforded in this state this utter rubbish is allowed through the system. It is a shocking indictment of the state of planning in the city.
And what is particularly offensive to the citizen or indeed resident of this building is the enormous dividend handed on a plate to the developer by DCC in the form of this mammothly-scaled development, of which only a tiny fraction actually requires architectural treatment – and yet this is the tight-fisted, mean-spirited veneer of muck presented as the sole public face of the development. What an insult to the city.
Its all-singing upturned finger character on the streetscape is fitting.
And to add insult to injury, tax-payers’ money actually went into subsidising this scheme, a development that was worth a fortune in the first instance. And what did the city get back? Abolutely nothing. The developer wins again.
Meanwhile the important collection of decrepit mid-18th century townhouses directly adjoining it have just a ‘face-lift’. You couldn’t make this up if you tried.
It’s just unbelieveable: all protected structures, in an ACA.
Ravishing.
😀
I see Aviation House (in turquoise above) was recently put to auction as part of a larger property porfolio, advertised as having significant development potential in the medium term. From the outside one suspects it has one of those ghastly late-70’s first generation interiors with full-height fibreglass partition walls inserted about a basic concrete frame. Truly one of the worst buildings in the city, on what has to be the worst quay in the city. Destroyed by the most shamefully abysmal planning, reaching right up to the present day.
And the Immigration Service/Irish Press building once the site of the Tivoli Theatre too.
@paul h wrote:
maybe this would not be the most ideal place……
Ya think?! Flippin heck, the high rise mania here really has reached new levels lol.
Same height predicted, with greater basement exploition and increased site coverage; it’s actually a low density collection of buildings at the minute as seen in Morlan’s linked picture.
My concern is that this development has the potential to homogenise what is the very heart of Dublin city; a sprawling medium-rise, mixed use ‘anywhere’ corporate scheme dumped in the middle of the historic city that by definition of its bulk and (appropriate) height limitation will make for an elephant-in-the-room-like impression in this otherwise traditional part of the city. ‘Traditional’ in the sense that this broad and spacious central core has a unique charm in feeling like it’s been captured in aspic – the Edwardian city frozen at five storeys. At present Hawkins is so monstrous as to almost make it invisible relative to this, but a glossy more expansive scheme will change that.
Hopefully some variety in height and design will make for a visually engaging modern quay skyline. How that disastrous Irish Press and associated decelopment was ever permitted I do not know – it makes me so angry passing it, with all that ignorant muck heaped on top. One of the greatest insults to the image of the city centre.
I’ve often thought exactly the same JoePublic!
Immortalised on video four nights a week – a fitting memorial to this terrace, and the once-distinguished planning ideals we held in this city.On a How Well Do You Know Dublin note, I still can’t figure out where that back alley with the man sweeping the roadway is – Temple Bar perhaps?
25/9/2007
The finished Dunnes product in its all-consuming glory.
It couldn’t be more insensitive if it tried, bulldozing through the reticient streetscape and slashing nonchalantly through the unifying codes of the host terrace.
The success of the bombastic Debenhams/Roches was reliant on its contrast with the charming traditional unified streetscape leading up to it – that has now been utterly lost.
Is it now the renewed policy of Dublin City Council, as in the 1980s, to clear away all of Henry Street? How can they possibly justify future refusals for similar development in this terrace? Simply, they cannot. Not that they’d be bothered either way going by this development.The bleak corridor that is now Cole’s Lane: the blank facade of Debenhams to one side, the ugly elevation of Dunnes to the other, and the pathetic two-storey termination of the ‘refurbished’ Ilac at the end.
The finesse is striking.
The ubiquitous pavillion storey on top forms the restaurant and additional store floor space.
The restaurant design is edgy, crisp, calm and at times tounge-in-cheek – mirror walls are apparently ‘in’ again. One of the saving graces of this development.
The colour scheme seems to be influenced by an Aero bar, and is very cool.
Saying that, €2.80 for a cup of coffee is extortionate, and the warm milk on my table was thoroughly sour. Not a great start. For a restaurant with such pretensions, milk on the table is an oddity at best. You’ll get a far better deal all-round in Chocolate Soup in Debenhams.
The roof terrace directly adjoins the restaurant, and provides all of its natural light. It is from up here that one really appreciates what a loss the unacquired corner building on Henry Street/Cole’s Lane was for Dunnes. It constrains both the floorplates of the store at large, and a highly desirable wrap-around roof terrace with views down Henry Street. There are no views to be had of the city from the current location, other than the blank wall of Debenhams opposite and the horrendous vista of the low-rise air-con peppered roofscape of the Ilac. No wonder all the glazing is frosted!
The interiors of the store itself are relatively predictable. Surprisingly little has moved on since Roches was completed a number of years ago; in that respect I think Roches were ahead of their time. Dunnes only has the allure of the new as an attribute at the minute: generally I think the Roches fit-out still wins out on substance, if a little more worn now. Dunnes has some great escalator wall treatment, but little else of note. It’s no wonder the store was completed so quickly, as much of the corrugated metal and concrete structure is still exposed, just painted black and hung with suspended slab ceilings. Strangely inconsistent eggshell black walls are also a feature.
What is innovative however is its product displays – they’ve come on leaps and bounds from the Dunnes of old. Sweeping sexy crescents of seating with shoe display shelving above, big circular rugs with display tables atop, elegantly laid out shelving units more akin to Fraiser’s apartment than a retail outlet, all makes for a visually interesting retail experience.
A shame it’s all housed in such a monster of a building: even at the entrance on ground floor level it gives Henry Street a slap in the face by turning its back on it. The windows are completely closed off, making for an unpleasant closing-in experience upon entering the store. There’s also no sense of place whatsoever upon entering what proclaims to be a department store of sorts – you walk straight into racks of clothing which looks and feels odd.
And not to lay this matter just at the feet of Dunnes, but the energy these places consume must be crazy. Everywhere you look it’s energy energy energy!
Along with heating and air-conditioning blasting away and escalators rotating 18 hours a day. You’d wonder as to the sustainability of these warehouses in the longer term.
All in all a positive retail and design contribution to the city centre, but an ignorant brush-off to its host streets.
