well what about the developments popping up in the shannonside ?
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Who’d have thought land prices were so expensive in that part of town that they’d have to build up?
I wonder does the developer have tenants in mind for storey 3 to storey 18? Or will it be another white elephant squatting in the city?
:confused:@Tuborg wrote:
Apparently ABP are in the midst of a huge backlog of cases so I suppose this dosent come as much of a surprise. Despite this, the decision date for the proposed new bus station remains unchanged, its due to be decided this Wednesday.
Btw Dan, whats the latest on Curragour house, is it still standing?
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Curragour is still standing, and they appear to have effected some repairs to the part that fell down.
Limerick is expected to be ahead in econmic terms over the next decade with vairous investments, changes and developments facing the city.
Silent revolution puts Limerick in winning position
LIMERICK city is poised to outperform the rest of the country in economic terms over the next decade, with investment set to surpass that planned for any other part of Ireland.
Major investments include a one billion euro input into the city centre’s Opera Centre and Arthur’s Quay retail developments, a 500 million euro project along an eight acre site from Sarsfield Bridge to the Hunt Museum (including the demolition and redevelopment of such retail outlets as Dunnes Stores, Penneys, the Revenue Commissioner’s Office and the current Arthur’s Quay Centre. Also coming on stream are new riverside walks, restaurants and cafes, a park, cinema complex, extensive underground car parking, outdoor performance space and a visual and performance arts centre.
“The reality is that Limerick City is currently in the middle of a silent revolution that is gradually transforming it into a modern, dynamic European city,” says Mr Power, one of the country’s leading economists who is also confident that the Opera Shopping Centre will further enhance the retail potential of the city’s central core zone.
“This site includes the landmark Granary building and there are also a number of other proposed developments in the city centre, ranging from a new city library to office and residential developments on Henry Street.
Allied to this optimistic forecast, Conor O’Connell, secretary of the Construction Industry Federation, Mid West Branch has predicted a positive outlook for the city and region in terms of significant infrastructural projects.
Critical of the “three local authorities role in thwarting the city’s development,” Mr Power favours a single local authority structure for the city which evokes the response from Deputy Jan O’Sullivan that the Environment Minister, John Gormley should now “bite the bullet” to set up a Boundary Commission. .,
“In view of this report and Mr Power’s comment, the time is now more opportune than ever to extend Limerick’s boundary,” she said.
With a view to securing an expert analysis on the economic profile of Limerick city, the report was commissioned by the Limerick based developer, Ger Clohessy.
@KeepAnEyeOnBob wrote:
I agree there’s nothing inherently wrong with apartment complexes, and certainly I think the higher level development by the riverfront is great, and am happy to see more of it.
However, I do object to this “flatten it all” attitude that has seen Limerick end up with less historical building stock and more crummy poorly thought out buildings (some of which themselves are to be knocked). It is arrogance to think that all 2008 designs will be so great and modern that they will have the permanance of the old buildings.
You say that part of town is soulless. I beg to differ. It is dreary and run down, and yes the buildings are typical of other places in Ireland. That is the point though, we are in Ireland and the buildings contribute to the authentic indigenous character (i.e. we don’t have to make up plastic stuff for tourists). Even paint would spruce up some of the less run-down buildings, and indeed already has helped (e.g. at the William/Gerald Griffin st corner). The streetscape is also a contributing factor to the run down feeling. William street despite some decrepid buildings would not be half as bad if it had a decent streetscape (although a pity they didn’t bring in the chewing gum tax).
Some of the old buildings are actually very distinctive in that area, for example the building near the corner of Gerald Griffin St. and Sexton St. that has timber frame on the outside. Quite run down but worth doing up. New buildings around there could be good, but they could just as easily be soulless monstrousities that will be as depressing as run-down old buildings in just a matter of 5-10 years.
I’m not for all flattening either, but the majority of south william street to Parnell street is among the most run down decayed, bland and same crap buildings thats in every provincial town around the country. There is nothing of character or beautiful about them IMO. Some parts of Willams street yes is distinctive etc. This development could be nice addition to be a gateway building coming from the south of the city. This project is not going to hinder or destroy the streetscape of the area, its already decayed. The Tower proprosal, if goes ahead, will probably reduced to 12 to 15 storeys. If its that height it might work. Take a look at other cities around the world that has high rise in the city centre, even as small as Limerick or Cork. People in other countries just don’t have a phobia with high density, high rises. I use the term “2008” as we need to discard the attitude that something new and ambitious is negative. Although not every high rise built in Ireland is inspiring, breathaking or imagnative. The Riverpoint was a big success here in Limerick. tbf. Despite the controversary prior to the go ahead of it. Now the positive attention Limerick get’s as a result that its gilimmering in view. It’s new, its modern, its awesome.
But building up is the way to go, that is what I mean by 2008. It doesn’t mean in any way flatten the old etc etc.Yes, dave 123, but ‘building up’ is a relative term. If that’s code for highrise, then sticking a highrise block in the middle of an historic townscape, however ‘decrepit’, is not the solution to anything very much and will just encourage developers to flatten even more on the plea that every commonplace development will ‘create’ 10,000 jobs, etc.
@CologneMike wrote:
Coonagh Court Ennis Road
(Chesser) A five-storey state of the art mixed development comprising of ground floor retail, units from c.152.6m2 – 554m2 and office space from 208.8m2. The development will boast high quality frontage and ample car parking.
Anyone know where exactly this office development is?
Office Park Development (Coonagh Roundabout) Robert Butler Group
The development will consist of:
- four office buildings ranging from four to six storeys, gross floor area 21,332msq
- one two storey retail pavilion, gross floor area 225msq
- 484 surface and semi-underground car parking spaces and ancillary works
This development has been designed to generate a pivotal high visibility gateway site to the north side of Limerick City. The business component in the same area consists of a good mix of retail, commercial and professional companies.
The site of this office development is a very high profile site on the Ennis Road (former texaco site), opposite Coonagh Shopping Centre and Tesco superstore. The site has excellent road frontage of approx 92 metres. It is located 4.8km from the city centre close to the Coonagh roundabout providing easy access to the N20, N21 road networks. Opposite the site a road improvement scheme is underway for the N18 Coonagh to Clonmacken route
16-18 Henry Street, Limerick (Image Updates) Robert Butler Group
The scheme will comprise of the re-development of the Mercantile building for retail/commercial use fronting into Henry Street, the insertion of retail space at ground level and office space on mezzanine levels and the provision of four floors of new office accommodation, and basement car parking. The development will reinstate the arched façade of the former Roche’s Hanging Gardens
@Dan Sullivan wrote:
Curragour is still standing, and they appear to have effected some repairs to the part that fell down.
I actually took a detour down that way today, was half expecting to find it reduced to a big pile of bricks, happily its still very much intact and hopefully will stay that way despite the City councils best efforts. I was also pleasantly surprised to find that the streetscape works on Clancy Strand are basically complete. New paving, street lighting and riverside railings have been installed between Thomond and Sarsfield bridges and a mini plaza area with seating has been developed around the treaty stone. The new amenity area and slipway at the curragour bund is also substantially complete. All in all, a simple but highly effective re-modelling job!:)
Just on the subject of damaged buildings, a georgian on Cecil Street (no.8) looks to be in serious danger of collapse. The building is in terrible shape, it appears the uppers floors are effectively being held in place by scaffolding, although some sections seem to have already given way. The street in front has also been cordoned off!
8 Cecil Street (2005)
@Tuborg wrote:
Just on the subject of damaged buildings, a georgian on Cecil Street (no.8) looks to be in serious danger of collapse. The building is in terrible shape, it appears the uppers floors are effectively being held in place by scaffolding, although some sections seem to have already given way. The street in front has also been cordoned off!
8 Cecil Street (2005)
Cecil street is such a waste of potential. It should mark the start of restored Georgian Limerick, but it looks like something from the 1980’s. We’re still waiting for the Arthouse Cinema in the old theatre Royal….
Two items that came up for discussion at last weeks City Council meeeting. It looks like the proposal to redevelop the Limerick boat club site could be dead in the water! Sorry!:rolleyes: For the development to go ahead, the boat club would have to be removed from the list of protected structures and the site re-zoned, which would require the support of a majority of City Councillors
City councillors snub boat club proposals
City councillors have voiced strong objections to a proposed development on the site of Limerick Boat Club, insisting that the “modernistic and futuristic†design will take away from Sarsfield Bridge and its surroundings.
At this month’s city council meeting on Monday, Councillor Kathleen Leddin led a chorus of criticism of the joint application from the boat club and Fordmount Developments. “
This is the kind of development that will have to be looked at in a careful light. I think it will take away from the bridge, the monument on it and Shannon Boat Club on the other side. It’s a modernistic and futuristic building set in a very traditional area of Limerick. It’ll ruin the bridge, which has been there for years, with a big glass box,†she said of the proposed mixed-use development.
The plans aim to demolish the boat club—currently a listed building that has been located there since 1870—and create a four level, 4,215 square foot structure on Wellesley Pier.
It will incorporate offices, “civic space†and a restaurant and will also provide new pedestrian access at bridge level.
The boat club will be accommodated in the multi-million euro development, which was designed by Belfast based, McCann Moore Architects.
Cllr John Gilligan said that he was “appalled†at the proposals, which offer a “cheap answer†by using steel and glass for the ultra-modern design. “This will interfere with one of the most beautiful bridges in Ireland and also with the other boat club, which is very complementary. It’s appalling no matter what way you look at it. I would ask the council to protect the heritage of the city.â€
Cllr Michael Hourigan asked “what will it look like in 25 or 50 years time?†while Cllr Maria Byrne referred to the design as “a monstrosityâ€.
Senior Executive Planner, Dick Tobin, warned councillors that plywood models often do not give a good overall impression. “In this case, we will probably be asking for visualisations of the plans in situ, particularly in the context of the surroundings and nearby buildings,†he said, adding that computer generated imagery would create a more accurate impression of the design.
For the project to go ahead, elected members will have to vote to remove the boat club from the list of protected structures and re-zone the site from to mixed use development instead of recreational use. A decision on the application is not expected until a later date in the summer.
Lack of movement on Opera Centre costing city at least €170k in rates
Limerick City Council is losing at least €170,000 a year in rates revenue because most of Patrick Street is vacant pending the beginning of work on the landmark ‘Opera Centre’.
This financial loss is also expected to increase because the project may not be complete for up to three years and the planning application has now been expanded to include more streets and properties.
Cllr Jim Long pointed out that on May 9, Regeneration Developments Ltd applied to incorporate the Town Hall and the Granary (both protected structures) and buildings on Ellen Street, Michael Street and Bank Place into the plans. “This means that the Granary and businesses on Ellen Street will cease to trade and then the loss of rates could double.â€
Councillor Diarmuid Scully questioned a €650,000 deficit in the council’s 2007 end of year financial statement with specific reference to Patrick Street. He said that the longer a large section of the street remained vacant, the more “severe†the impact would be on council finances.
Acting Head of Finance, Pat Murnane, said that Patrick Street was just “one element†of the deficit while a €250,000 overdraft was another. “Any vacant commercial property in the city is entitled to a 50% refund on rates paid so the owner only has to pay half and the council loses out on this. This is where the €170,000 figure is coming from,†he said.
Cllr John Gilligan said that he has noticed a large number of vacant and derelict properties—some owned by “property speculators†that are “just lying there— and “this does very little for our coffers. We need a more rigorous pursual of developers that are leaving buildings vacantâ€.
The ‘Opera Centre’ will incorporate a massive multi-storey shopping centre with “retail anchors and 38 no. ancillary retail/service unitsâ€.
A decision on the planning application is due on July 3 and it was recently reported that construction may begin as soon as September if it is successful.
@Tuborg wrote:
Two items that came up for discussion at last weeks City Council meeeting. It looks like the proposal to redevelop the Limerick boat club site could be dead in the water! Sorry!:rolleyes: For the development to go ahead, the boat club would have to be removed from the list of protected structures and the site re-zoned, which would require the support of a majority of City Councillors
Which, ultimately, would be good news for the city. Have never seen such a ill-fitting design.
@justnotbothered wrote:
Which, ultimately, would be good news for the city. Have never seen such a ill-fitting design.
Councillors .mmmmmh . . . . I’m sure that they’ll do the right thing architecturally . .
Talking of which , Isn’t Robert Butler’s brother Richard a Councillor with Limerick County Council ? and didnt Limerick County Council lease / Buy a building by the Entrance to GARRYOWEN RUGBY CLUB recently from them ? .. SORRY SORRY …. From Robert Butler properties ?
@Dreamstate wrote:
Councillors .mmmmmh . . . . I’m sure that they’ll do the right thing architecturally . .
Well doing nothing with that site is better than what’s being proposed. The proposed Boatclub design is hideous, absolutely hideous. If that’s the best that architects can currently envisage, i suggest we shoot one on every 10 of them until they get the notion of not building cheap rubbish everywhere.
Boatclub (Limerick Leader) Published Date: 06 June 2008
By Anne Sheridan
THE DEVELOPER behind the plans to demolish and redevelop Limerick Boat Club said he is still hopeful that his €20million “dream” development could receive planning permission, even though nine councillors have voiced their opposition.
To receive the green-light, a majority of the 17 city councillors have to vote in favour of a material contravention to rezone the site and also remove the Boat Club from the list of protected structures.
But the president of Limerick Boat Club, Dermot Moloney, is asking councillors and the public to look at the bigger picture and said the proposal put forward by Michael Daly of Fordmount Developments represents a “once in a lifetime” opportunity for their club.
“I genuinely would be worried for the club if this doesn’t go ahead. This was the first rowing club in Limerick, and even from that perspective it would be a shame to see it go. It could be the end of the club as we know it,” said Mr Moloney.
Mr Daly had previously said he would walk away from the plans if the majority of councillors were against the designs, but he now believes that councillors may not be as outrightly opposed as they have stated in public.
When the Limerick Leader exclusively revealed the plans for the site off Sarsfield Bridge, Mr Daly said: “I really hope people will look at these plans and say ‘That’s fantastic.’ That’s the reaction I want to get. If they don’t want it, we’ll forget about it. It’s now a question of whether the city wants this building or not.”
Councillors across the political spectrum are divided about the plans, with Labour Cllr Gerry McLoughlin stating the proposed development could establish a “state-of-the-art boat club,” as well as “a fabulous commercial enterprise” and “bring Limerick into the 21st century.”
Among those opposing the plans is Independent Cllr John Gilligan described the development as “crass”, “commercial”, “an appalling structure” and said it is “a cheap answer to interfere with one of the most beautiful bridges in Ireland.”
@Tuborg wrote:
Two items that came up for discussion at last weeks City Council meeeting. It looks like the proposal to redevelop the Limerick boat club site could be dead in the water! Sorry!:rolleyes: For the development to go ahead, the boat club would have to be removed from the list of protected structures and the site re-zoned, which would require the support of a majority of City Councillors
City councillors snub boat club proposals
Senior Executive Planner, Dick Tobin, warned councillors that plywood models often do not give a good overall impression. “In this case, we will probably be asking for visualisations of the plans in situ, particularly in the context of the surroundings and nearby buildings,†he said, adding that computer generated imagery would create a more accurate impression of the design.
Well Michael Daly can only blame himself for been snubbed for not disclosing enough material to them. Did the councillors have to rely on the Limerick Leader for the visualisations?
Among those opposing the plans is Independent Cllr John Gilligan described the development as “crass”, “commercial”, “an appalling structure” and said it is “a cheap answer to interfere with one of the most beautiful bridges in Ireland.”
Good to see that Cllr John Gilligan has the heritage of Sarsfield’s bridge at heart. Irrespective of the merits /weaknesses of this proposal, for an elected public representative who was last year deputy mayor, he lacks in leadership for not encouraging the developer to come up with better plans for the boat club. Instead he is more or less telling the developer to p**s-off with his €20 million.
Below images with three possible scenarios
- Leave it as it is. Small, defunct rowing club with limited public access.
- Restore the pier to its original state i.e. remove the two buildings. Public green space.
- Approve proposed new boat club development.
If it is well designed it could complement the bridge, if not then it would ruin it!
Here the original image by likeubutbetter
There is another option: come up with a better-designed proposal that is not just maximising commercial floorspace and actually complements rather than swamps the bridge and the existing Edwardian boathouse/club. Turning this site into a suburban lawn is hardly an option at all.
@johnglas wrote:
There is another option: come up with a better-designed proposal that is not just maximising commercial floorspace and actually complements rather than swamps the bridge and the existing Edwardian boathouse/club. Turning this site into a suburban lawn is hardly an option at all.
What was with the “I don’t think we should communicate at all.†“The end.â€
There you are sitting on a fence and passing off your standard two liner on every post that goes by!
Why don’t you propose a few examples as alternatives yourself from let say Glasgow, Edinburgh etc, etc.
If possible throw in a few images.
As for “There is another option:” well I wrote that Cllr John Gilligan should do that above.
As for the “suburban lawnâ€, well as you know yourself how family friendly our apartment developments in the centre of Limerick are. It might be the only blade of grass they would see all week! :rolleyes:
can anybody who has two eyes in their head please look at that picture above and tell me what in god’s name do these fat, uneducated, parochial hicks in the city council think it is they’re protecting?
@shanekeane wrote:
can anybody who has two eyes in their head please look at that picture above and tell me what in god’s name do these fat, uneducated, parochial hicks in the city council think it is they’re protecting?
The Bridge and the Shannon Rowing club, and also, the concern isn’t about what’s being knocked (although it’s a listed building) but rather what’s being proposed, which I guess with the two eyes in your head (presumably) you can see is a cheap, rubbish design.
Even the artist’s renditions can make it look no better than low-rate.
Mike, in response to your earlier question about what the councillors saw, I saw some of the designs the councillors were shown. They were awful, it was impossible to escape the lack of windows and the blandness of the majority of the design. Limerick (or any other city) doesn’t need more windowless blocks being built on our rivers. The same mistake was made in Cork with Merchant’s Quay, and (again) in Limerick with the old Dunnes Stores. I’m not vehemently opposed to this plan for the fun of it. It’s a terrible design which would make a waste of the millions being invested on improving the Strands.
Even pro-development Councillor’s like Scully are unimpressed with this plan, and he was the one who proposed it was no bad thing to tear down some Georgian streets to facilitate the Opera Centre.
Mind you, I don’t see what’s wrong with having parks in cities, like the proposal of Mike above (not that that could happen) The park on the pier in the Claddagh in Galway (just opposite the Spanish Arch and beside the Lock gates) is a fantastic amenity for the city to enjoy.
Ultimately, does this development add more to the city than it takes away, imo, no.
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