Thomas Street & James Street, Dublin!
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@jackwade wrote:
Does anyone know the status of this project by HKR architects?
It was granted by DCC and is currently awaiting an appeal decision from ABP.
The 51-storey etc. proposal by Manor Park Homes stole all the attention when it was lodged last year, but this mega Dig. Hub scheme on the opposite side of Thomas Street – the ’Windmill Site’ – went through at around the same time. The prot. struc No. 84 Thomas Street would be refurbished as part of the scheme.
The tall building is not by HKR. It’s by an English firm – John Pardey Architects – but HKR are doing all the rest (same set-up as the Arnotts site, incidentally, with John Pardey doing one building & HKR doing the rest).
Both the Manor Park & Windmill schemes are due an ABP decision on the same day, so they are obviously being looked at together (perhaps partly because they both propose high buildings but are both located outside the designated areas for high buildings). Details:
http://www.pleanala.ie/casenum/221294.htm
http://www.pleanala.ie/casenum/219930.htmAs Sarsfield said, the NCAD / Fire Station building on Thomas Street has been hoarded off since 2001, but work has recently begun on <a href="http://www.dublincity.ie/swiftlg/apas/run/WPHAPPDETAIL.DisplayUrl?theApnID=4812/05&backURL=Search%20Criteria%20>%20Ref. 4812/05
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@hutton wrote:
Hutton, good document of Thomas Street’s wonderful but sadly decaying period stock. The building that was in the above gap was only demolished in 2003 (see below) … nice old building …… don’t go ….
Why would it have been demolished if there’s apparently no replacement planned*? It didn’t look like it was in that bad shape?
* – or at least, nothing’s happened since 2003
http://www.etenders.gov.ie/search/search_show.aspx?ID=AUG091047
Corpo tender out today
‘Dublin City Council invites tenders for the engagement of a consultant design team for the design of an Environmental Improvement Scheme for Thomas Street, Dublin 8’
Manor Park APPEALED that decision!!!! What a boon for their planning consultants! Not only do they get their fee for lodging a lost cause, but they go on to get paid to lodge the appeal. Fckin hell. More money than sense.
@tommyt wrote:
http://www.etenders.gov.ie/search/search_show.aspx?ID=AUG091047
Corpo tender out today
‘Dublin City Council invites tenders for the engagement of a consultant design team for the design of an Environmental Improvement Scheme for Thomas Street, Dublin 8’
Jaysus is that the power of Archiseek? An illustrated bitch/ moan yesterday – and by today theyre issuing tenders!! 😮 😀
Some good information and illustrations added there]http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w108/hutton001/PICT0058.jpg[/IMG]
Why are these being let rot? They abut the hop store complex on one side, and the redbrick victorian used by the digital hub on the other, so it’s not as if the footplate could form part of a bigger scheme. Would it be cynical to suspect that the owners are simply letting them to rot so they can replace the 3 floor corner with a 5 floor Henrietta Hag type scheme? If this were to transpire it would amount to rewarding anti-social ruthless speculation with pp – something I have touched on in the thread “Endangered Georgian Dublin”. There is no excuse for this. 😡
Meanwhile No. 84 across the street should not be left derelict, it’s not as if it’s restoration or active use is materially dependent on the John Pardey/ HKR Manor Homes scheme – particularily as their proposal shows retaining the house abutting the scheme. Again, unless a better explanation is forthcoming, there is no excuse for this.
Also the building shown by Devin as demolished in 2003 is very odd – again it’s not as if the cleared area completes a larger site. 4 years on with no sign of anything, it would appear that the owner is incapable of developing; here and some others already mentioned, perhaps time for CPOs ?
Then (2003)…
Now…
A little bit of good news re these on the corner of Crane Lane – I am informed by reliable sources that these are currently being preped for restoration, with one of the city’s better known and respected practises attached to the project. Apparently these passed thru the hands of DCC in recent years, who it is said were largely to blame for their current condition. However I am now happy to report that those currently involved are doing their work very diligently, having already researched other builings of similar stock. So here’s hoping to a happy-ending on this one 🙂
This is great news indeed.
Its so sad to see in many cases fine old building stock left to fall into disrepair. The historical context and the old and original building stock of this area should be restored and maintained. Ye wouldn’t see an equivalent significant historic area in such a paltry condition abroad, especially in Europe.Again this whloe area has great potential from Christchurch right up to Kilmainham Gaol. (Even far more historically valuable than the overly inflated egotistic Ballsbridge & Co , in the headlines at the mo.)
@igy wrote:
Why would it have been demolished if there’s apparently no replacement planned*? It didn’t look like it was in that bad shape?
* – or at least, nothing’s happened since 2003
It was claimed at the time that it had structurally deteriorated and needed to be demolished. Whether or which, there was a site assembly going on there for a number of years, so it wouldn’t have been any harm to get an old building out of the way …
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@hutton wrote:
A little bit of good news re these on the corner of Crane Lane – I am informed by reliable sources that these are currently being preped for restoration, with one of the city’s better known and respected practises attached to the project. Apparently these passed thru the hands of DCC in recent years, who it is said were largely to blame for their current condition. However I am now happy to report that those currently involved are doing their work very diligently, having already researched other builings of similar stock. So here’s hoping to a happy-ending on this one 🙂
The buildings (Nos. 7 & 8 Thomas Street) formed part of the infamous Manor Park Homes Mini-Mahattan plan of last year. They are an interesting survival of Dublin-vernacular architecture. The Crane Lane frontage is interesting too. The proposed treatment of them in that plan by deBlacam & Meagher architects was pretty diabolical; they proposed building directly upwards over the protected structures, as seen in the drawing below.
The proposal for that whole block actually between St. Catherine’s Church and Crane Lane was crude, the attitude being ‘regeneration hasn’t worked so something dramatic is needed’.
After DCC refused the whole thing, the developer appealed, but it just got log-jammed with the Board; every time it reaches its decision-due date, it gets put back another month. Reading between the lines, they were told the proposal wasn’t a runner, and, hutton, I’ve heard the same thing, that a complete revised proposal is being lodged right at the moment … we’ll wait and see …..
.Devin wrote:The buildings (Nos. 7 & 8 Thomas Street) formed part of the infamous Manor Park Homes Mini-Mahattan plan of last year. They are an interesting survival of Dublin-vernacular architecture. The Crane Lane frontage is interesting too. The proposed treatment of them in that plan by deBlacam & Meagher architects was pretty diabolical]Thanks for thr clarity on this Devin – it is dBM that I had heard were doing their homework, although that was in connection with interiors. Unfortunately I had failed to twig that it was part of the MH madness scheme 😮
In any case the intervention needed should not be dependent on a much bigger scheme which may or may not get the go ahead. The buildings will deteriorate in the meantime. Their current state is appalling; action is needed – otherwise, if its beyond the ability of the current owners, candidates for CPO perhaps… *wishful thinking*Do you have any info this other house opposite, near the corner of Watling St? Or is it too caught up in indefinate animated suspension, dependent on some spec developer?
Yeah. As said in Post 21 on the previous page it will be refurbished as part of the ‘Windmill Site’ development, provided it gets the go ahead from ABP. Decision due on 4th of October, but I won’t be surprised if it’s put back again; it’s been put back several times already:
Thomas Street generally needs to be designated an ACA. Many of the terraced buildings that make it what it is have no protection – only the weak old ‘Conservation Area’ designation.
Take this group (above) between Frawley’s and St. Catherine’s Church. None of them are protected structures. They have a wonderful array of pitched roofs and gables at the rear, very characteristic of the old city (including what appears to be a rare cruciform roof to No. 30). But that could all be lost at the moment because they have no protection. And they could well the subject of landbanking arising out of the Frawley’s closure/sale …… jdivision, maybe you know?
What is also important about these building is that they give historic context to St. Catherines Church. So many settings of major buildings have been ruined by the demolishishment of their immediate surroundings…ie the Four Courts with the offices to the left, the GPO with Penny’s (BHS) to the left etc…
deBlacam & Meagher are definitely sociopaths or mentalists of sorts to design such an absurdity for this historic and neglected area of the city.
Thanks to the decision to put a QBC on the North Quays, those of us stuck on buses on Thomas and James Steet every morning now get extra time to appreciate these streets. Like a little slice of the 70s they are …
sorry for not reading the whole thread but do we have a decision on two potential high rises tomorrow…?
Yes. Here, this’ll get you salivating; the Manor Park scheme as seen from O’Connell Bridge:
Ah that’s absolutely rediculous …they’ve gotta be havin’ a laugh. The architects are definitely on some happy pills or something. Would be hard to take this architectural firm serious with such an outlandish proposal or anything else for that matter.
lol not a hope! maybe it was one of those promotional type projects like shamrog city,but that windmill development has a chance at least.
Saw on the Irish Times today that the DCC is planning a whole new regeneration project for this area….aka, the Liberties etc… About time! North King Street and Smithfield have never looked back since their makeover. Let’s hope Thomas St., James St., etc… gets the attention it deserves.
SoHo springs to mind. Big announcement, nothing happens.
@jdivision wrote:
SoHo springs to mind. Big announcement, nothing happens.
I’d be inclined to agree with you alright, though tbh imo the Manor Homes scheme was a grossely greedy scheme which DCC were right to reject. DCC should not be dependent on the whims of those who wish to overdevelop in order for renewal of the area to get under way; equally buildings on the RPS which are owned by the same interests should not be left continuing to rot – DCC needs to enact the derilict sites act, and imo issue the letters threatening CPO. If there’s still an inadequate response, CPO at current value (ie no commercial concern) and then sell tto those who will put such buildings to good use. Here’s where DCC should be using CPOs – not at the Carlton, where it was used imo most unfairly. But then which was the more valuable to certain parties? :rolleyes:
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