The Tara Bypass – what they won’t tell you
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@Sue wrote:
It would be a huge victory for the anti-road lobby, without them having to spend a penny or a day in court, and it would fuel their campaigns against other bypasses and motorways.
No, let them do their worst in court. A la Carrickmines and Glen of the Downes, the road will get built in the end and by-passing motorists will wonder what the hell the fuss was ever about
Sue youre either deliberately taking the piss or talking bollox – Woodstown viking site is now saved as the Waterford bypass is being rerouted. So there you go – historic site kept and road goes ahead; everybody wins, or am I missing something? Maybe I just haven’t noticed, but so far I don’t see an “anti-road lobby” celebrating!
@Sue wrote:
In relation to the 26 archaeological sites of interest, the question is how important are any of them? Should the march of a nation be held up because a Celt once sharpened a stone in a particular field?
The march of a nation to where? A place with excellent roads, but nothing to see except shopping malls. I can really see that as a selling point to tourists: ‘but sure don’t we have excellent roads!’
What a bunch of loony lefty tweedy conservation types infest this site. I think you’d all be better moving over to the An Taisce chatboard. This is supposed to be an architecture site – and you can’t build stuff without either knocking other stuff down or “destroying” a previously pristine landscape
I agree there has been a very definite move towards edge-city type sprawl in this Country and unfortunately the roads are far from adequate to support this.
It is worth noting that when this road was designed the following planning framework was in place http://www.rpg.ie/spggda2/firstterm-ind.html as the map very clearly displays this route was considered a future and not current project. As opposed to developing a Planning Land Use and Transport Study to tailor with the SPG’s Meath Co Co selected one option and their local minister drove this project through. There is little question that an extension was required to the Clonee by-pass and that Dunshaughlin is one of the worst traffic blackspots in the Country. But can someone please enlighten me as to how the N3 North of Navan can justify a motorway on the current population figures?
The roads are as stated above far from fine as they are congested and feed into Cities that no matter how many roads you build at the edge cannot satisfy an un-necesarrily high commuter driven demand; I feel a lot of sympathy for purchasers of houses beyond 20 miles of Dublin because there are no alternatives put in place for them.Whilst talking about alternatives I really am perplexed as to why the NRA pushing this routing through? Is it revenge for glen of the downs and Carrickmines, there were three routes, why is this the only one that is being seriously considered? Why have the NRA never publicly put the CPO estimates into the public domain on a plot by plot basis for public scrutiny?
One sensible option would be to build Navan Rail link immediately as it is a deliverable project on a short time-frame and is a project that no-one will object to, plus the M3 sections excluding the unexplained lurch east of the existing N3 towards Tara. This construction could be similar to the Balbriggan bypass coming out at Gormanstown prior to the M1 being completed to link with the Dunleer bypass, to correct Bertie on last Fridays Late Late Show the Northern Route is not Finished, the Dundalk Western Bypass/E01 connection to Carrickgarnan is not completed.
@Sue wrote:
What a bunch of loony lefty tweedy conservation types infest this site. I think you’d all be better moving over to the An Taisce chatboard. This is supposed to be an architecture site – and you can’t build stuff without either knocking other stuff down or “destroying” a previously pristine landscape
I note you dont acknowledge the Woodstown reroute win-win for all. Sham argument on your part!
@hutton wrote:
I note you dont acknowledge the Woodstown reroute win-win for all. Sham argument on your part!
There is more to the Tara situation than there was at Woodstown, Woodstown was a situation where mid-construction and almost by accident one of the largest Viking Settlements in Europe was discovered, it was a total surprise to everyone.
Tara is different in that most of the sites were identifiable simply by looking at Duchas maps and the impact on these already catologed sites was plain to any truely independent archaeologist who has expressed an opinion. More importantly the persistant claim that there is no other route has never been proven as detailed costings for both the alignments to the East and the West have never been released. All that exists is the word of a body that has a shameful record of handling public money and refusing to listen to anyone.
There are three possible options:
Halt work on the N2 to Ashbourne temporarily and upgrade it to a three & 1 Motorway that divides into N2 & M3 a few miles North of Tara
Construct either the Eastern Alignment and avoid crossing the N3 and resulting construction disturbance
Construct the Western Alignment and avoid the area completely.
http://www.platform11.org wrote:Beating the stranglehold of our car-dependent culture
A projected population increase of 51 per cent in the mid-east region and the ensuing traffic congestion can be tackled by proper planning and investment in railways, write Derek Wheeler and Mark Gleeson.
Last week’s figures from the CSO show that the population growth of the Greater Dublin Area is expected to continue at an unprecedented rate. With a projected population increase of 51 per cent in the mid-east region, the already strained transportation infrastructure in Leinster will come under intolerable pressure.
Road upgrades such as the widening of the N7 south of Rathcoole and the proposed M3 motorway will simply funnel yet more car-dependent commuters into the ever-growing tailback towards the M50. We simply cannot build ourselves out of the current crisis.
While much has been planned, in particular the Dublin Transportation Office’s Platform for Change proposal, little has been implemented. The announcement of the long-promised 10-year transport plan appears to be on indefinite hold.
Although congestion is unquestionably at its worst in Dublin, Cork has taken the lead with an approach to facilitate development while ensuring proper provision for public transport is put in place in parallel.
The Cork Area Strategic Plan (Casp), developed jointly by Cork City and County Councils, has shown the way by focusing development along existing and closed railway lines. Meath County Council and Fingal in north Co Dublin followed Cork’s lead.
As a direct result of Casp the Cork-Midleton railway line is to be reopened. Fingal County Council has granted planning permission for the North Fringe development in Baldoyle, on condition that a new railway station be provided at the developers’ expense in Grange Road. Similar arrangements are in place at the Adamstown development in west Dublin.
The proposed metro from St Stephen’s Green to Dublin Airport will do little to ease the current congestion problem. While a high-quality citywide metro system has a role to play in tackling congestion, it will do nothing for the commuter stuck on the N3, N4 or N7. In the ideal case a fully integrated metro system would service the quickly developing Swords area.
However, there is hope under the title Provision of a Fully Integrated Greater Dublin Rail System, 2004-2010. Iarnród Éireann has proposed a massive expansion of the current Dart network to include services to Kildare, Maynooth, Dunboyne, Dublin Airport and the Dublin docklands. The key to this project is a new tunnel between Heuston and Spencer Dock, which will provide a second cross-city rail line and in doing so unlock massive capacity on lines into Dublin.
The core of the plan features three cross-city Dart lines, Kildare-Drogheda via Heuston, St Stephen’s Green, Pearse and Spencer Dock]
Also the complete failure by Meath Co Co to consider alternative modes of transport as part of a PLUTS (Planning Land Use and Transportation Study). The hardpressed Meath commuter will be stuck in even longer tailbacks from the Blanchardstown S.C. to the City Centre if no alternative is in place.
If the DoT built the Navan Rail line with adequate Park’nride facilities in tandem with an M3 on a deliverable route the hardpressed Meath commuter could choose what best suited their needs instead of having a tolled motorway rammed down their necks as the ‘only option’
I find it hard to have sympathy for the commuters in these areas when I hear the local TDs on the radio. 🙁
I tend to think that the people that buy miles away from their jobs and social life know what they are doing. They get a larger, privately owned house than they would for the same budget in Dublin. But they then expect the state to spend a fortune on putting in a motorway so that they can drive daily to work. As if it’s an entitlement. This cost is not just hitting everyone on the island in the pocket, but is now robbing us of our cultural heritage too. I for one do not want to have to pay this price for them.
If I can abuse the idea of a “machine for living” – most homes are less that ideal in this regard. Trying to buy a home is a compromise from start to finish on location, size, standard etc. This compromise ends in a less than perfect living solution.
– The large but badly located dublin centered family commuter house out in louth is a faulty machine. The cost of “fixing” this fault is being addressed (however ineffectively) by building motorways at huge cost to us all. 😮
– If you look at the other end of the problem – a very small property near city center but unable to cater for a growing family would be the other type of faulty macine. Fixing this one gets less media coverage. You will get very little sympathy from anyone if you want to extend, and you certaintly wont get the rest of the country chipping in towards the cost. 😉I can see the point that you are making particularly towards extending houses and it really does go into the area of housing affordability and the climbdown from part v of the planning act that has pushed so many people a long way from their workplaces & social infrastructure. I do however have a more positive view of the situation; essentially growth is the sign of a strong economy where there are many employment opportunities.
It is possible to plan growing Cities in a sustainable way by implementing PLUTS studies and incorporating them into development plans, it is possible to deliver different modes of transport that can deliver people back to their workplaces and social lives in a 30-40 minute timeframe. The major problem of a roads only policy is that development occurs at much lower densities and as a result it is not viable to deliver public transport efficiently as densities are too low to make rail viable and buses lose money sitting in traffic jams.
If the M3 gets built can anyone say with any certainty that it will cut commuting times dramatically, look at the Naas Rd situation where a motorway stretches 54 miles ( 86 kms) west of Dublin, it still takes 1 to 2 hours to get the last 12 kms in from Newlands Cross to O’Connell Bridge at peak times. Whilst the Train from Kildare to Dublin at distance of over 50kms can be acheived in less than 40 minutes with a frequency of approximately 4 per hour at peak times.
Having seen so many people having been put out to the margins of the region it is time that they are given a real transport system and not just a tolled motorway that has both a weekly bill and a permanent heritage cost.
Why don’t you see who are the landholders along the N3 route – read it and weep, looks like a Ard Fheis guest list and I won’t say for which party, but (large hint) there seems to be a lot of developers there
The $64m question is were these parcels of land assembled before or after the decision to select this route?
If they were transfered in arms length transactions since the route was announced then it can only be considered opportunism and is a legitimate enough gamble, but if they were acquired before this then it raises very serious questions.
Great thing about the Irish Land Registry system or Torrens system as its known is that it is very secure and cannot be changed once an entry has been registered. This should be checked out; it would be a very different situation if this wasn’t a simple infrastructural decision. I sense a visit to Setanta House for someone.
The Land Registry is apparently being de-centralised to Roscommon,
Any Thoughts?
There was a story in (I think) the Tribune about it – they’ve been buying up land around ther for at least 5 years supposedly
How right you are
@RTE Interactive wrote:
Archaeological work begins at Tara
13 June 2005 14:35
Preliminary archaeological work is beginning at Tara in advance of the construction of the planned M3 motorway through Co Meath’s Tara-Skryne Valley.The Minister for the Environment, Dick Roche, cleared the way for the motorway last month by issuing directions to Meath County Council on how archaeological work was to be conducted.
The project was approved by An Bord Pleanála two years ago, but was delayed until the minister issued licences for archaeological excavations along the controversial route.
I’m sure the residents of Navan will be delighted that the motorway with two tolls is now commencing construction. An interesting feature of this is that to reach the park n ride site at the 115m rail extension you must pay tolls. For another 150m a high capacity rail link could have been provided direct to Navan with 4 trains per hour each of 8 carriages which would have moved 1000’s of people directly to the city centre per hour and not to the Blanchardstown Shopping Centre where tailbacks and gridlock are what wait for the commuter.
In the coming days a Navan Rail campaign will be launched through http://www.platform11.org
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