The Greens and O Connell Street
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I’m not an architect either.
Marion’s address: marian@rte.ieThanks for the address, Paul, I probably should have been able to guess it (duh…)
Maybe someone with a better computer than me could send her the pics of the treeless north end of O’Connell Street in the 40s to put paid to the ‘1916 witnesses’ crap.
I may be wrong, but my memories of photos from the 60s are of a treeless O’Connell Street at least up to the pillar…
By the way, I have to say being told to ‘lighten up’ by someone who chains himself to a tree of an afternoon is a bit rich.
To think I once voted Green…Very good of you too reply Ciaran Cuffe but I think in your response you are quite dismissive of you and your party’s actions. Chaining yourself to the trees and only for a short while for that matter was a cheap publicity stunt. It was not for the betterment of the city of Dublin in any way but the betterment of the Green party’s profile.
Hard to believe that you are an architect who lectures in planning in Bolton Street.to those who can no longer believe that they once voted green, or those who now feel they can no longer vote green……can I ask which particlular political party are you going to vote for now? Which one best represents your feelings on this issue? Who has the best manifesto in relation to tree protection on our capitals main thoroughfare? They all seem silent to me – ie. couldn’t give a flying f**k! At least the greens, whether you support them in this ‘save our trees’ matter or not, have an opinion on things like this which matter to all of us, and are not only concerned with the size of their brown paper envelope wallets.
If green party voter support is this fickle, it’s no wonder those other bastard parties keep winning the elections!!!All politicians are the same. Primarily they are out for their own particular parties, the general public come second. It is up to the general public to see through such charades. Many people can see through this charade by the Green party on this occassion.
Whether it be Fianna Fail, The Progressive Democrats, Fine Gael, Labour, The Green Party, Sinn Fein, The Socialists Workers Party etc etc…I would’nt trust them as far as I could throw ’em.
Great. A pompous architects board.
Fact: most people are prepared to allow the City Council proceed with their plans and redevelopments until it involves taking something they hold dear away from them. As is happening here.
Support for the removal of the trees has been thin on the ground. Why? Because as Dubliners, we grew up with them – pretty much everyone under 40 has grown up with the Planes on O’Connell Street, and most people – up-their-own-arses architects apart – like them well enough. And that sterile shite we are being offered instead is a poor substitute.
So – how about HANDS OFF? With few exceptions, Dublin’s experience of our own homegrown brand of architect in the past hasn’t exactly inspired confidence.
And I love how dismissive some of your posters are of the public’s opinion. Do you have to pass exams in boorishness and pomposity to qualify as an architect?
As pointed out before, you will find that many of us here are not architects but people interested in the city.
Just out of interest, why would you visit a “pompous architects board”? Where you directed here?
Yeah DaveR – plenty of us are non-architects (inc me). I even spell the damn word wrong sometimes.
This means that I’m a member of your glorious aforementioned public, and I don’t agree with what YOU just said, or the attititude you’re taking towards people posting on these boards (though I imagine you didn’t read too much before you posted).
Hands Off – interesting concept. Do you mean leave O’Connel Street as it is (inc litter, fast food, general shabiness at ground level)??? Or hands on until something you don’t like is encountered – like the trees. Then it comes down to our opinion versus yours. Your opinion seemed to be “leave them there because we like things as they are”.
Once again, we are the Public too…
fjp
Pot, kettle, black springs to mind…..I’m afraid reports of your boorishness have not been exaggerated! Me I’m just a disgrubtled plumber with an afternoon off…..well how would you know any different about me or anyone else posting here?
Work in the media, have nothing to do with architecture. Live a few minutes’ walk from O’Connell Street. Grew up in Dublin. Is it OK for me to have an opinion?
No AndrewP you’re obviously not a “professional dub” or signed up member of an environmental group, so be quiet. 😉
I’m not allowed an opinion at all because I’m not even a dubliner…. shock horror… i know i hide it well…. i’ved just lived here for 15 years…
Okay, I see how your so called discussion board works now, moderator. Remove the posts that don’t suit, like my reply of last evening. Fair enough. I’m off.
But before I go, Mr Clerkin, your “professional Dub” jibe was cheap. Actually, I don’t care whether you’re from Dublin or not. I was merely trying to explain why a lot of Dublin people like the trees on O’Connell Street, ie we grew up with them – a “strong sense of place” is what I think its called.
Anyway, enjoy each other – though blocking counterposts does kind of limit the authority of your site. Don’t you think?
Bye
Well DaveR pronouncing “Great. A pompous architects board” is hardly the best way to enter a discussion…
People here are not all architects, we just feel that O’Connell street does not benefit from the existing trees and feel that everyone will benefit from the upgrading… hence politicians jumping in for 5 mins of fame is somewhat frowned upon…
Of course u are entitled to your opinion “that [the] sterile shite we are being offered instead is a poor substitute”, as are we to differ…
PS As far as I can see your post on the 8th is and always was there….
Dave R is obviously a devout Green Party supporter and he does’nt like what has been said here because it conflicts with the party’s policy, which is at the moment get as much publicity as one can for the party by making a mountain out of a mole hill, in this case jeopardize the multi million Euro upgrade of O’ Connell Street. I’d recommend reading a few architecture books etc Dave before you spew off. I happen to be an artist not an architect but I have a great love of dear aul’ battered Dublin, the capital city of Ireland.
I think that you are naive and do not really understand.
When the O’Connell Street scheme is complete and the new trees are blossoming in all their glory hopefully the penny will finally drop and it will finally register with you Dave R. But a playstation pseudo prolateriat aka middle class mind finds such things difficult.I am amazed with some of the comments that have appeared on this subject. The radio is full of ranting over a few bloody trees that have nothing to do with good urban design – they may suit monotonous suburban Dublin, but surely not what still is one of the greatest streets in Europe.
Until quite recently, some of the great buildings on the street were obscured by these overwhelming and hideous plane trees. Just admiring Clerys the other day from the other side of O’Connell Street, it was hard to imagine that this great building was hidden from view unless you went closer – thus diminishing the effect it has on the streets entirity. The imposing elegance could not be rightly admired less than two years ago. Now its integral beauty is there for all to see. Where you have good architecture, you should not try and hide it. Where you haven’t, cover it in Ivy.
Can you imagine what O’Connell Street would look like if its remaining stock of magnificent and powerful buildings could be visualised in its entirity without being broken by awkward London Planes? The most stirring images of O’Connell Street in the past are of a powerful street without trees. Hence most of these popular pictures are of Lower O’Connell Street – The trees of Upper O’Connell Street would distort any powerful images that the architecture could muster.
Finally, is anyone going up to the GPO tomorrow to vent their anger to Marian over, not only this debacle, but the painfully slow progress that is being made in O’Connell Street???? The Spike may be ready by January, but what of the Burger King’s, the Ann Summers, the arcades, the Dr Quirkeys, etc, etc, etc…………… the woeful office blocks, the hopeless lighting, shopfronts, mingers that run amok, filthy pubs…….oh I feeeeeel sick.
The corpo need balls if they are to take on the problems facing O’Connell Street – and respond to criticism, not just accept it. 🙁 🙁 🙁 🙁 🙁
Oh, and I am not an architect………..
Maybe someone else has mentioned it previously but I noticed the Paddy Power has acquired the old Bank of Ireland up from Clerys. Now we’ll have a bookies to go with the Burger Joints, the Games arcades and the lingerie shops, Hurray!
This has to go down as one of the most divisive threads yet strted on this forum. And frankly I am utterly amazed that peoples feelings can run so high over some trees. To add my two bits worth, I reckon the trees should go and that the regeneration plan should move forwad full steam ahead.
Reemeber when the central mall was repaved in 1988 and (yet more) trees were added in no particular planned fashion. Not a peep from people back then! I really fail to see why this is being made into such a huge issue. I do think the Greens have a case to answer – because after all Ciaran Cuffe YOU have the privilege of being a member of the city council and having a direct imput into the whole O’Connell St scheme…unlike the ordinary Joe Soaps here on Archeire! The time to have expressed you views was when the plan was being formulated all those many moons ago. Not now when all it serves is to get your party’s name mentioned. And they wonder why people are cynical of politics! As for Marion jumping on the bandwagon…!Lastly, I think we are very lucky (thank you Paul and all contributors) to have this forum to share views and at least know that there are others out there (non-architects included) who share a desire to see an improved city. Lets not bugger it up with slagging matches!
Now hand me my chain saw…..
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