Smithfield, Dublin
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Last I heard was the criminal assets bureau were involved in some way with those properties. CAB are usually quick to get this kind of thing on the open market but i presume there is some sort of legal challenge blocking the way
@gunter wrote:
could they not stick in a few pockets of trees and the odd bench.
agghhhhhhhh! don’t encourage them, ‘pockets of trees’ is as far as the collective imagination of the city council stretches, college green anyone ?
a considered planting scheme please, by a landscape design practice and preferably some firm other than mitchell 😉
@Peter Fitz wrote:
agghhhhhhhh! . . . . a considered planting scheme please, by a landscape design practice . . .
That sounds like six hundred quid for the trees and ten grand in consultancy fees, a competitive tender process and two years of dithering!
Could they not just get out the google-earth view, splodge on a few tree until it looks right, print it off as a map and send someone round to B&Q.
They could even fix the paving on Haymarket with the cobbles they’d take out!
@gunter wrote:
Could they not just get out the google-earth view, splodge on a few tree until it looks right, print it off as a map and send someone round to B&Q.
Fine in principle, but it didn’t exactly work for Plaza del Robocop on Dame Street.
You’d think it’d be hard to get the random placing of planters wrong, but DCC found a way!
@gunter wrote:
splodge on a few trees until it looks right, print it off as a map and send someone round to B&Q.
you see the word ‘splodge’ kind of embodies DCC’s planting policy for me & i just don’t trust them to decide what looks right !!!
once a tree goes in, assuming it lasts by accident or design for 20 years, aquring a level of gravitas in the process, its likely to remain part of the street scape for the next 50 years+ with obvious potential to significantly alter the appearance of the street / space.
so a little hotch-potch patch-up job in a visual ‘wasteland’ like smithfield could come to be emblematic of the space and should not be undertaken on a whim! :p
One of the lesser entries for the 1991 Smithfield competition just envisaged a bit of in-fill, trees and a market!
It’s too late for the in-fill, but we could still have a few trees and a market, what’s wrong with that?
@gunter wrote:
It’s too late for the in-fill, but we could still have a few trees and a market, what’s wrong with that?
If you’re just talking trees in planters, fine – and a decent market would be great … but if trees are to be ground planted, and not just in a formally laid out space like smithfield but on any city street, you have to plan !!! obviously the addition of trees will completely change the appearance of the space in time, block facades, sight lines, create vistas etc.
again, ‘sure just plant a few trees’ sums up DCC’s hotch potch approach to the public realm and its just not on.
@gunter wrote:
OK, forget about the trees, can we get some tumbleweed ?
I believe there’s plenty drifting about the docklands 😉
old newspaper cutting of Smithfield (April ’97) . . . before redevelopment.
Interesting caption!
The way I remember it, apart from the monthly horse fair, the fruit & veg market illustrated was just a spill-out from the market sheds and stores along the west side of Smithfield and was mostly a Saturday morning thing.
But, even with this limited use, and accepting that there may have been an architectural deficit, little urban enclosure, and no towering gas braziers, the space ‘worked’!
It can’t be rocket science to just stick a open-air market into Smithfield at weekends and just see what happens!
The Meeting House Square market in Temple Bar is fine if you don’t mind paying €4.50 for a loaf of bread, but it too small and too arty to really satisfy. The Marlay Park and Peoples’ Park, DunLaoghaire markets have their charms but are too far out to make a contribution to the city, and are equally arty and over-priced, IMO.
Is there any reason why a city the size of Dublin couldn’t have half a dozen decent unpretentious open air markets within the city centre area, enlivening dead spaces and drawing people into the ghost areas of the city centre?
Why would Smithfield and Newmarket not be the obvious places to start?
http://www.dublincity.ie/SiteCollectionDocuments/markets_area_framework_plan.pdf
The plan is for an indoor public market, and the Stallholders of the Temple Bar market have already been consulted about this and expressed a willingness to move to Smithfield once the market is available.
I prefer DCC’s plan, in the mean time Smithfield square IS ALREADY available to artisan stallholders fruit&veg alike but it seems the stallholders are not interested. Wonder why!?
@gunter wrote:
old newspaper cutting of Smithfield (April ’97) . . . before redevelopment.
Interesting caption!
The way I remember it, apart from the monthly horse fair, the fruit & veg market illustrated was just a spill-out from the market sheds and stores along the west side of Smithfield and was mostly a Saturday morning thing.
But, even with this limited use, and accepting that there may have been an architectural deficit, little urban enclosure, and no towering gas braziers, the space ‘worked’!
It can’t be rocket science to just stick a open-air market into Smithfield at weekends and just see what happens!
The Meeting House Square market in Temple Bar is fine if you don’t mind paying €4.50 for a loaf of bread, but it too small and too arty to really satisfy. The Marlay Park and Peoples’ Park, DunLaoghaire markets have their charms but are too far out to make a contribution to the city, and are equally arty and over-priced, IMO.
Is there any reason why a city the size of Dublin couldn’t have half a dozen decent unpretentious open air markets within the city centre area, enlivening dead spaces and drawing people into the ghost areas of the city centre?
Why would Smithfield and Newmarket not be the obvious places to start?
jasus! wasteland or not, I prefere it the way it is now. Judging by the picture, it was an absolute kip
@cgcsb wrote:
jasus! . . . it was an absolute kip
I don’t know, you could get some good stuff there!
. . . and if you spent €4.50 you’d come home with more than a feckin loaf of herbal bread
Yes Smithfield is a wasteland, lived there for 2 years 2005-2007. In fact me and my mates were among the first people to move into the Smithfield Market apartments. Couldn’t wait to leave by the end.
Problems
– Far too much retail space provided considering the area is not a major destination. The amount of basement parking aims for thousands upon thousands of shoppers which never materialised.
– Major ASB problem in the area. I witnessed many assults and muggings in my time there. Very unsafe at night. Cops were busting skangers practically on a daily basis.
– Alcoholic treatment centre brings many drunks to the seating area at the south of the square near the Luas.
– Criminal Court brought lots of gougers to the square during the day, though only during working hours of course
– Still a large amount of dereliction, including on the square itself.
– Poor finish to the area – cobblestones not reset down near the Luas and just tarmaced over, braziers never lit anymore, lots of litter.
– Horse market. This is more of a neutral though, as although it brought vast quantities of droppings and litter and noise into the area, I know that it’s a tourist draw, and it was only once a month.
– Celtic Tiger feel to the new buildings. Reads was very swanky and expensive, same for Fresh, and the gym under the hotel. Nothing for anyone on a budget that’s for sure. Gentrification in its purest form.Pluses
– Lighthouse cinema: only opened recently but was very impressed, lovely place.
– Jameson distillery is worth a look.
– Cobblestone pub is a gem
– Close to pleasant Stoneybatter area
– Luas is a godsend
– Square and braziers are impressiveSeeing the positive, the New York Times’ take on Smithfield (April 26th 2009)
http://travel.nytimes.com/2009/04/26/travel/26surfacing.html?ref=travel
Folk should’nt get too sentimental for the old market or horse fair. The thing is, that there is an architectural backdrop there now, and it’s just a matter of filling it with people. Getting a bit of human life into the place is the priority now like down the docks.
I suppose folks living there in the new appartments are crippled with mortgages or rent and are only going from bed to work. I dunno how the Council and local business folk cant initiate something to attract folk out of their appartments/cells. The Ice Skating and Chinese New Year festival are the sort of thing to give the place a lift. How about live open air music, jigs and reels etc… in conjunction with the Cobblestone could be a weekly feature….bring back the market but make it like the one in Temple Bar, with an international flavour as well. Hang up flags and buntings. A Horse Fair too but get the Irish Equistrian crowd and the moneybags Horse Racing crowd and a few toffs involved to share their knowledge. Make it weekly or montly etc….Get the Gardai involved as well to keep an eye on the druggies, skangers and half wits. It seems to be a main feature of Irish society today, as there are hundreds of such unfortunate people, homeless teenagers and children abandoned by their parents throughout the city centre, and very prominent along from Wood Quay to Aston Quay.
Regarding the tree planting to soften the place, but I’d be on for that, but with the trees planted in containers so that they could be moved about or removed when required. A few flower containers as well to liven the grey concrete. Jaypers, it’s not too big a deal really.
Moore Street is the exact opposite, a bustling market street full of folk from around the world but with an awful architectural backdrop of dereliction and squalor.
@GregF wrote:
I suppose folks living there in the new appartments are crippled with mortgages or rent and are only going from bed to work.
This is definitely not the case, these apartments were all Section 23, and only suitable for developers. All the occupants are tennants. Perhaps more owner occupied designed units would benefit the area in future.
The main reson people rent here is bacause the area is beside the city center, and so they dont go from work to bed to work. They spend more time in the city centre as a result.@GregF wrote:
I dunno how the Council and local business folk cant initiate something to attract folk out of their appartments/cells. The Ice Skating and Chinese New Year festival are the sort of thing to give the place a lift. How about live open air music, jigs and reels etc… in conjunction with the Cobblestone could be a weekly feature….bring back the market but make it like the one in Temple Bar, with an international flavour as well. Hang up flags and buntings.
All of these things have been tried and happen all the time, including the buntings. Perhaps you didn’t know because nobody attents the events?
There are food markets and international markets on here all the time, but only ppl that live in Smithfield or pass through are aware of this.
A marketing campaign may be needed similar to the way the Docklands Authority markets that area.The whole area needs to be rebranded and marketed properly. The council should be empowered to do this like the DDDA.
I used to work in Stoneybatter and when I first started working around there it was so drab and depressing. Even so, I used to like the fruit and vegetable market in Smithfield and there was a man selling plants outside it everyday – plenty of people browsing all the time (but not pretentious yuppy types obviously). I agree that the new apartment development was gentrification in it’s purest form and the cafes and the supermarket Fresh were clearly aimed at well-healed types. As someone working locally, though, I really appreciated the new seating area beside the supermarket as there was nowhere clean to sit and eat lunch before. I also agree that the events hosted there now are not being properly promoted – I used to just stumble across these things on my way to and from work, I wouldn’t have realised anything was happening there otherwise and it’s so handy to get to, as a venue, from the city centre.
I wish they would restore those old (18th century?) buildings too. Can’t believe we had the whole celtic tiger thing and they are still derelict. What a shame.
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