reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches

@Praxiteles wrote:

And what about poor Gildersleeve’s Latin Grammar to say nothing of Longman’s – over which we all toiled!

Our Latin Legacy offered a first-rate course in Latin for high-schoolers.

It may be of interest to readers in Ireland that there is actually a shortage of Latin teachers in North America. The demand for Latin is quite highat all levels from elementary school to university, I am pleased to report, but not, I regret to mention, in ecclesiastical circles. This is where the Church ought to be in the vanguard; after all, Latin is the official language of the Church and of the western liturgy.

As the Anglican Dean Inge put it, if the Church marries the spirit of the times, it should come as no surprise for her to find herself soon widowed.

Classics of language, art, and architecture are the way to go – not fads and trends! My impression is that the folks in Cloyne understand this very well. Too bad the top brass there are utterly out of touch with the grass roots and their own Christian roots. So much for “the organic development of the liturgy.”

Henna rinse, anyone?

@Praxiteles wrote:

On the subject of Latin, I am afraid its decline in the present degenerate state of the Church in Ireland is plane and evident for every one to see in the recent habit of doing inscriptions in demotic English. Even the bIblical texts so inscribed are taken from the lowest grade Englist texts that certainly are rather distant from the sense of the Sacra Pagina.

On the other hand, just to show that not all is goom in the garden, try this treat:

http://frcoulter.com/leo/index.html

Is there no bishop in the Emerald Isle who so values classical learning and the access which it affords to the teaching of the Fathers and Doctors of the Church that he would establish a school or institute to transmit this inestimable patrimony to the next generations?

Too much preoccupation with cosmetic changes in church fabric and insufficient attention to the inculcation and preservation of authentic Catholic culture.

Although such dilettantism is deplorable, it is probably better, all things considered, that they not stick their oar into the enterprise of real education. Imagine, if you will, the mindset that wrecked the Catholic cathedral of Armagh set loose in the classroom or the lecture hall. Fabric at least can be salvaged; not so the human soul when entrusted to the tutelage of such destructive beggars.

Thanks for the link, Prax. I am confident that the good readers of this thread will recognise something truly worthwhile in the many good things offered by Fr Coulter and his associates.

One of the blessings of high technology is that people in the cultural and religious wasteland can enjoy access to the blessings of education, culture, and the spiritual life through electronic contacts.

@samuel j wrote:

Very true….

Indeed…

And were anyone to have a spare moment they might like to try this:

http://la.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reginaldus_Foster

or this

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Father_Reginald_Foster

I was in kilkenny recently and visited the stunning catholic cathedral there (st. peter’s is it?) -at least I managed to form some idea of how beautiful it must have been before the scarcely credible vandalism of the reoerdering which has moved the altar into the crossing and introduced new furnishings, a name they don’t deserve. Back in Dublin I visited the truly wonderful neo-Byzantine church in clonskeagh (of the miraculous medal?!) which has also been re-ordered but infinitely more sympathetically. Still the coherent (well thought out!) design is interrupted. I understand that Ireland is in fact the only country that has been engaging in this orgy of desecration- am I correct in this? That makes me marvel at how singularly unlucky we seem to be, in a european context as far as artistic and architectural heritage goes- in fact, our bad fortune is of an amusing scale and continuity: We enjoy no Roman ruins, since they never reached Ireland, the vast body of churches, cathedrals and monasteries, as well as perhaps secular buildings which we know to have existed (and been great works of art) constructed of wood in the dark and middle ages have left not a single sorry trace! The Romanesque did not penetrate until a century after it could have. Just two or three great (only by Irish standards) gothic churches or cathedrals were built- These were ruthlessly ‘restored’ by the victorians. We missed out entirely on the Renaissance. Then our nonetheless considerable medieval heritage of churches, monasteries and castles was near obliterated by Protestantism, Tudor Wars, Cromwell…etc . Next huge numbers of our country houses and mansions, and the rest of our Georgian heritage is carelessly demolished by nationalists and now the only corpus of architecture in Ireland comparable to that of any other country in europe or almost so – our great post-emancipation churches – are being almost as badly despoiled as the original churches were 500 years ago by the zealots! (It makes for sorely ironic reading.)

Is there any end in sight?

@Praxiteles wrote:

St. Mary’s Cathedral, Kilkenny, designed by WIlliam Deane Butler, was begun in 1843 and completed in 1857. Its neo-Gothic style is heavily Norman in inspiration and can be easily compared with St. Jean de Malte in Aix-en-Provence, St-Maximin-la-Sainte-Baume in Provence or indeed with many of the pure creations of the Norman displacement in central and southern Italy – such as the abbatial church at Fossanova in Latium, Sant’Eligio in Naples, and San Lorenzo Maggiore in Naples. The decoration of the interior of Kilkenny’s St. Mary’s is by Earley and Powell and was brought to completion in 1865. This firm was responsible for the ceiling painting of the chancel, the glass, the high altar fittings and lightings. The mosaic work is by Bourke of London and the chancel murals by Westlake. In the 1970s, the socially minded Bishop Birch instigated, in the diocese of Ossory, an iconoclasm worthy of the emperor Leo III, a martial pesant from the mountains of Isouria whose hatred of images was largely inspired by an incomparable ignorance of both sacred and profane letters. Kilkenny cathedral, fortunately, escaped the worst ravages and retains its (albeit redundant) High Altar which was purchased in Italy. The altar rails (alas no more) and the altar of the Sacred Heart were the work of James Pearce. A diminuitive and out of scale altar was placad under the crossing and a new cathedra -redolent of Star trek – installed. The contour of this impianto is remarkably similar to the one now proposed for Cobh cathedral. Perhaps the greatest thing that can be said for this “reordering” is that it can (and will) eventually be removed leaving the building more or less as concieved by none too mean an architect.

So far, nobody wishes to claim responsibility for the effort.

Here is an earlier posting re- St. Mary’s Cathedral, Kilkenny

I’d thought I’d bring to attention a book on British Catholic churches that was launched last night. My boss came in to the office today with a copy.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Glimpse-Heaven-Catholic-Churches-Communication/dp/1850749701/sr=8-13/qid=1165020172/ref=sr_1_13/203-4213018-1577568?ie=UTF8&s=books

It’s not available yet on Amazon, is much longer than 96 pages, has great and rich illustrations, including of many chapels and churches I’d never knew existed, many that are well-known and a decent text containing a few barbs directed against some of the more egregious reorderings. It puts all the buildings into some sort of context. I wholeheartedly endorse it, for what it’s worth.

I happened to by in St.Colmans ,Cobh last week, nasty day with wind/rain howling but I noticed on many seats on the right hand side of the aisle bits of small plaster , dust….. definately somewhere must have got water damage as bits of plaster crumbling away. Could not see where it was coming from but feel it would be more in Bishop Magoos interest to look after whats there and not go off on ill advised re-ordering campaigns
Once again being in the building just reinforces how it should not be changed under any circumstances…

@Praxiteles wrote:

Sam!

I am glad you raise th question of maintenance in Cobh Catedral. I cannot get over how the place has degenerated in the last couple of years into a complete kip. No one would ever imagine that millions have been spent on a restoration. Rubbish is scattered all over the building and a general untidyness is more than evident throughout. Basic repiars have been done and an overall neglect is evident – despite all the guff coming for the Trustees about the wonderful heritage building they are responsible for. I do not know whetehr others have noticed this?

First thing they need to do is clear away all the junk they have propped against the windows in the chamber above the baptistry – gives a very untidy first impression. I also saw the dust Sam speaks of, when I was there in October.

You can just about see some of the junk I’m talking about in the following photo, look at the window to left of shot.
[ATTACH]3601[/ATTACH]

Could this be coming from a water ingress that is after hitting the bath-stone? In that case, it is not coming fro the ceiling but from the walls or from the vaults of the side-aisles arcades. If this is now drying out, what does it mean for the fabric that has been affected?

This photograph taken c. 1920 shows the rail dividing the nave from the side aisles and also shows the brass light fittings mounted on them. These survided into the late 1990s but disappeared when the floor was re-done and have not yet been returned. They were the first casulties in the preparations for the star ship enterprise being prepared quietly by Denny Reidy, the parish priest of Carrigtwohill and the principal beste-magline behind the attempt to wreck the interior of Cobh Cathedral.