reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches
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@Fearg wrote:
The second link looks to be even earlier, notice that the stained glass is not yet installed in the east window and the niches in the reredos are empty.
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Indeed, Fearg, you are perfectly correct. This photograph is focused on the Lady Chapel Altar and is taken over the altar in the crossing – you can just about see the top of it. Would this be c. 1880.
Did you notice the depiction of the Crucifixion over the Porta Coeli arch reproducing a medieval element found on rood-screens? I wonder is it still there?
Seems that it went in 1904, also, the mural/mosaic at the east end of the nave must also have been replaced at that time:
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@Fearg wrote:
Seems that it went in 1904, also, the mural/mosaic at the east end of the nave must also have been replaced at that time:
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Oh! That is magnificent and perfectly appropriate above an Altar: the choirs of angels acarrying thuribles indicating divinity. Am I correct in thinking that there is a dove in the center cuspe?
While not quite ad rem, the following quotation which was sent me is not without some bearing on the FOSCC case and on some of the charges laid at the doorstep:
One thing I deduce from the whole proceedings: that Irish bishops do not like judicial processes; a fact of the gravest import for the Irish Church. It is because I lament this so greviously – believing as I do, that no crime which the subject can commit is nearly so injurious to the public weal as is refusal of justice on the part of those who rule – it is because I am deeply convinced of this, while I lament that in the Irish Church there is no liking for judicial forms, in which alone are the safeguards of justice for the subject – it is for this reason and this alone, please God, I have set forth the details of this case. The only way left us to prevent scandals of this kind is to expose them – some of the worst of them, at least.
Would anyone have any idea of who wrote this?
Hi all
I’ve posted a few more images of St John the Baptist Church here
(Haven’t figured out how to include images in this forum yet)
BQ@Fearg wrote:
Seems that it went in 1904, also, the mural/mosaic at the east end of the nave must also have been replaced at that time:
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The stencilling in the arch crossing is absolutely splendid. Great colour reproduction, Fearg! I gather that the statues in the crossing are the four Evangelists – again highly appropriate. The key here is the Apocalypse where the four creatures (symbolising the Evangelists) surround the Throne of the Lamb. Christ, the Alpha and the Omega on the porta coeli is the focal point of the cosmic liturgy into which the worshipping faithful in the earthly liturgy are drawn. This is what Vatican II tells us ought to be happening. The earthly liturgy is to be a reflection of the heavenly liturgy being offered in the New Jerusalem:
In the earthly liturgy we take part in a foretaste of that heavenly liturgy which is celebrated in the Holy City of Jerusalem toward which we journey as pilgrims, where Christ is seated at the right hand of God, Minister of the holies and of the true tabernacle. With all the warriors of the heavenly army we sing a hymn of glory to the Lord; venerating the memory of the saints, we eagerly hope for some part and fellowship with them; we eagerly await the Saviour, Our Lord Jesus Christ, until he our life shall appear and we too will appear with him in glory.
The Holy Spirit hovering over the alter beneath the transversal represents the dual epicleses, first over the offerings (which will be changed into the Eucharistic Body of Christ) and the second over the congregants nourished by the Sacred Species (which incorporates them into the Mystical Body of Christ the Church).
The crucifixion depicted in the earlier design (1880?) does, as Praxiteles mentions, echo the Rood screen which adorned most medieval churches. In that arrangement, the sacrificial dimension of the Eucharist is underscored by showing its identity with the sacrifice of Calvary. The figure of the Blessed Virgin represents the Church (Bride of Christ) sprung to life by the water (baptism) and blood (Eucharist), reflecting sacramental life. John the Beloved Disciple represents the individual disciple called to stand at the foot of the Cross in solidarity with the Church. We, each of us, stand in the place of that beloved disciple and we are to embrace the Church, as John embraced Mary, and to take her to our own.
All this profound theology is at work in the two artistic programmes of this glorious church. Brian Quinn would do well to take a leaf or two from this particularly rich and illuminating tome. None of the above is evident in the wreckage called St John the Baptist at Drumaroad. I shudder to think of the twankling guitars and the tambourines leading the jittering throng in a cacophonous din more akin to the ninth ring of the Inferno than to the cosmic liturgy of the new and glorious Jerusalem our Mother.
Just heard the BBC report from Cobh. Perhaps the local bishop might find the good grace to leave any “improvements” to his successor and drift purposefully into blessed retirement.
The clerical person interviewed gave a less than stellar performance with his feeble “This is a nineteenth century church inadequate for a twenty-first-century liturgy” or some such palaver. Liturgy is too important to be left to the likes of that nincompoopery. All these timeservers can do is spout the jargonese they picked up from some slickster who runs about giving “workshops” on liturgy and worship. Snake oil, anyone?
Brian!
Thanks for the other shots of Drumaroad. They will allow for a closer consideration of the church. But. could ever tell us:
-a. what is that just inside what looks like having been the old main door?
– b. what is the black looking object standing in front of what looks like a side door – in fron of the chair?
– c. what is the tree-trunk looking object at wall end of the church?
– d. what is the totem looking black item on the wall?
Can I presume that what looks vaguely like a first empire occasional table is the Altar?
Hi Rhabanus!
Your advent to this discussion is truly a blessing and promises to be very postive. I liked your liturgical analysis of the ceiling in crossing at Armagh. Unfortunately, I very much doubt that much notice was taken of it. Certainly, I cannot recall mention of it in any of the broschure literature I saw before, during or after the arrival of BQ’s expeditionary force.
But to return to an earlier question of mine: I contended on this thread that BQ should have raised the Altar on a predella of at least one step and on possibly further steps bearing in mind the proportions of the crossing. BQ disputed that there was not any need to raise an Altar on a predella for, he claimed, the Institutio Generalis and the Caeremoniale Episcoporum, make no mention of this. He further calimed that the “praxis curiae” amassed by the Sacred Congregation for Rites had been abrogated by the publication of the 1984 Caeremoniale Episcoporum (for which I am not certain that an approved English translation exists); and the commentary of Pietro Gasparri de Sanctissima Eucharistia was dismissed as being simply “so pre-vatican II”.
I contended that at least one step is needed for any sacrificial altar to assure the prophetic, priestly and regal gesture of “ascending” to an Altar. BQ believes that he has an option not to use a predella when constructing an Altar and did not comment much on the point of ascending – although, I think that I did make reference to St. Augustine’s commentary on the Psalms of ascent and on his comments on the importance of this gesture both in cultic or liturgical activity (New and Old Testaments) and for the living of the Christinan life :laetatus sum in eo quod dixerunt mihi. in domum Domini ibimus. Stantes iam sunt pedes nostri in portis tuis Ierusalem!!. I think that I also referred to Augustine’s comments on the theological significance of “descent” and on their application to liturgical action (cf. Aurelii Augustini, Ennarationes in Psalmos 119-134 in J.P. Migne’s Patrologia Latina etc.). This line of discussion, however, seems to have dried up.
My problem about alllof this is to be seen in BQ’s arrangement of the sancturay of Armagh: a). an small ALtar of peculiar design sitting on the raised floor of the crossing; behind this is a higher plane (three steps higher, I think) containing b). a hemisphere of wooden chairs, covered in red, and built to resemble a faldisterium which seem to serve a dual purpose of “stalls” for the chapter and seats for concelebrants; and then, on a plane a further step higher, the Cathedra. As I pointed out, in this arrangement, we have the theologically peculiar sight of the Archbishop of Armagh and Primate of All Ireland, having to DESCEND several steps to the Altar which is just sitting on the crossing floor.
I have already pointed out that in the classical Basilicas where the Cathedra or sedilia is situated in the apse, the celebrant leaves the sedilia or cathedra, descend the steps, corsses the floor of the sanctuary and then ASCENDS the predella of the Altar – as e.g. in the Lateran, and Santa Maria in Trastevere in Rome.
I have also pointed out that the long tradition in other styles of churches has been to have the Cathedra on the Gospel side raised on three steps but never higher than the presella of the Altar. I posted a good example of this arrangement in Bordeaux Cathedral which, like Armagh, has a retro-choir. Indeed, since making those remarks the good Fearg unearthed a picture of the pre-1904 sanctuary in Armagh which reveals an arrangement very similar to Bordeaux – bearing out my point, I think.
As an impartial commentator and expert would you have any comments to make on the position I maintained in the face of BQ’s more social-democratic understanding of the theological concept of “Populus Dei” or People of God? Frankly, I do believe that BQ’s (faulty) understanding of this concept lies at the heart of all of our trouble!
Tu dixisti, Praxiteles! Any fool knows that one DESCENDS into the waters of baptism and one ASCENDS to the Altar of the Lord. Here again, those who reject the sacrificial nature of the Eucharist (and their name I regret to say is Legion) will flatten down the Altar lest the image of Isaac ascending Mt Moriah or the words of the Psalmist “laetatus sum in eo quod dixerunt mihi: in domum Domini ibimus. Stantes iam sunt pedes nostri in portis tuis Ierusalem! find appropriate expression. Christ descended into the River Jordan but WENT UP to Jerusalem. This is a frequently mentioned reference to His Passion and Death where, according to the Fourth Gospel, the Hour was accomplished when the Son of Man was GLORIFIED, not hidden from the crowds.
The cathedral in Milwaukee was wreckovated by Rembert Weakland osb and the Altar, which is where the central act of Catholic worship and the very priestly office itself of Jesus Christ is exercised. There, too, the celebrant must descend to the level of the floor to offer the Most Holy Sacrifice. Abraham and Moses, no less than Our Lord, offered sacrifice on the heights, the summits, the peaks. The Shekinah YHWH – the Glory of the Lord – hovered over the mercy seat of the Ark atop Mt Zion.
In the Milwaukee cathedral the sanctuary of the Lord is filled not with His glory but with organ pipes (the graceful ciborium having been discarded as a mere “distraction”) and jutting out from a platform, like the prow of the Titanic, is a kind of ambo. So what greets the visitor upon entrance to that Abomination of Desolation is MUSIC and WORD: the work of the Protestant Reformers of the 16th century carried out four hundred years too late.
I’m sorry, Praxiteles, and all kind readers, but this reduction of the Altar to an ignominious, disproportionately truncated butcher’s block on the lowest point of the building screams out a rejection of the SACRIFICE of the MASS. The good folks in Cobh can tell when they are being bamboozled. Cliche after banal cliche is trotted out by every architectural hack keen to make a quick buck off the vanity of idle prelates and the caprice of cynical clerics keeping the Church going as long as She keeps them going. Time-servers and wastrels the lot of them! Let them turn their attention to something useful, like reevangelizing the Emerald Isle, feeding the poor, harbouring the homeless, and letting Catholic believers and thinkers get on with restoring the Worship of God in the House of God.
The glory of Ireland’s magnificent houses of worship is too precious a patrimony to be handed over to ill-educated clerics with one foot in the grave and the other on a banana peel. Before they are allowed to put one grubby, iconoclastic finger on any part of a church or chapel (let alone a cathedral!), they should be made to pass an examination in systematic theology, then another in liturgical and sacramental theology; then finally, another in Christian iconography.
There would be fewer tragedies like the wreck in Drumaroad if Ireland were to rediscover the rich tradition of her Catholic faith and recover the noble patrimony of classic Christian iconography. For Heaven’s sake, break down and buy a book like Zibawi, The Icon: Its Meaning and History, tr. Patrick Madigan (Collegeville MN: Order of St Benedict, 1993) or the classic work by Evdokimov, The Art of The Icon: A Theology of Beauty, tr. Stephen Bigham (Redondo Beach CA: Oakwood Pub, 1990 [original French, 1970]). Ratzinger, incidentally, uses the latter to great advantage. Oh yeah! He’s Pope now. I suppose that counts for something, even these days!
One excellent way to begin is to read (or reread) and circulate Jean Corbon’s The Wellspring of Worship. Corbon, an Easterner who brings to his subject some well-needed Lumen Orientale, He unpacks for even the most theologically and liturgically illiterate, the mystery (mysteries) of the Sacred Liturgy. He brings the reader from the fountain of life streaming from the Heart of the Father to the New Jerusalem where the River of Life culminates in the trees that bear fruit in due season (saints around the Throne of God and of the Lamb).
And if any of these books is beyond your limited income, either go to a public library or ask to use the library of any Catholic college or university.
And if you cannot read these works for lack of time or academic acumen, then just read an Easter homily by St Melito fo Sardis (available in The Liturgy of the Hours, Vol. 2: Holy Thursday Office of Readings): All the Old Testament types of Christ are mentioned there. This single homily alone could inspire a bright new interior of St John the Baptist in Drumaroad and help, rather than distract, the congregation to take their rightful place around the Altar of God as they celebrate the Victory (not the deflation) of The Lamb!
St Patrick preached the fundamental mystery of the Blessed Trinity with the simple shamrock. How is it that centuries of Catholic worshippers in Ireland recognised this treasure of inestimable worth and the wannabe-chic know-alls of the new liturgical destruction despise it?
The solipsistic designs on the oversized dishrags hanging from the walls of the drearily reordered St John the Baptist in Drumaroad sum up the whole pitiful tale: we repudiate excellence in design; we reject the vast heritage of Christian art; we defy any attempt either to raise the worshipper to the new Jerusalem or even to push aside for an instant the curtain of heaven. “Dust thou art and unto dust thou shalt return!” None too soon, either!
The real animus against the elevated Altar is a combined opposition to the Sacrifice of the Mass and the glory of the Catholic priesthood. It likewise is a rejection of Roman models of worship. After all, these ideologues are inveterate Gallicans, who long since have rejected Rome’s authority on all levels. O Ireland, Isle of Saints and Scholars! How didst thou press such snakes to thine unstained bosom?
Armagh Ceiling:
Here is a close up – I think the repetitive patterns are stencil work – all executed in oils – but does anyone know if these were painted directly onto the plaster, or are they canvas?
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The fissure emanating from the rib down through the fabric to just above the head of the saintly bishop suggests to me that the stencilling and painting were done directly onto the plaster or stonework. Amazing!
Note the delicate coloration of the painting, the subdued hues, the elegance of design and mastery of execution. This is excellence indeed! Thanks for the splendid detail, Fearg.Do you have access to details of the actual iconographic programme of the triumphal arch? I would hazard a guess that there is a progression in unfolding mysteries as the pilgrim faithful move from the west door toward the east. Has a book recording these murals been published locally? Nationally? Do be sure to secure that patrimony for generations yet to come.
The decoration of these magnificent houses of worship reflects not only a profound understanding of liturgical theology, but also – and this is critical – clarity of ecclesiology. What makes Ratzinger such an insightful liturgist is his mastery of ecclesiology.
The iconographic programmes of the nineteenth and early twentieth centuries so far displayed on this thread, through the kindness and industry of Fearg, communicate as much ecclesiology as they do liturgical theology. Consider, for example, the cruciformity of the buildings themselves. They reflect the Pauline theology of the Church as the Body of Christ and likewise the theological understanding of Christ as High Priest and sole Mediator of the New Covenant as elaborated in the Epistle to the Hebrews. The faithful gather in the Church as Ark (Noah’s) and Barque of St Peter. They usually stand atop promontories – the site of the union between Heaven and earth, between God and man, effected by Christ’s once-for-all Sacrifice. Ratzinger reminds us that the Church in her earliest period used to be known as the corpus verum Christi – the real Body of Christ – nourished by the mystic Food of the Eucharist (corpus mysticum) but that these two terms, owing to the eucharistic controversies of the 9th and 11th centuries, came to be reversed in their application: the corpus verum referring now to the eucharistic Body of the Lord and the corpus mysticum to His ecclesial body.
The awesome examples of Armagh and Cobh resonate this theology of the Church as the Mystical Body of Christ the High Priest, Minister of the Holies at the right hand of the Father.
What seems to be woefully lacking in recent “renovation” packages like the example furnished by St John the Baptist in Drumaroad is any appreciation of the mystery of the Ascension. Jean Corbon, author of The Wellspring of Worship (as well as the section on prayer in The Cathechism of the Catholic Church) bemoans this unhappy lacuna in the mindset of many:
“It is highly regrettable that the majority of the faithful pay so little heed to the ascension of the Lord. Their lack of appreciation of it is closely connected with their lack of appreciation of the mystery of the liturgy. A superficial reading of the end of the Synoptic Gospels and the first chapter of Acts can give the impression that Christ simply departed. In the minds of readers not submissive to the Spirit a page has been turned; they need now to think of Jesus as in the past and to speak of what “he said” and what “he did.” They have carefully sealed up the tomb again and filled up the fountain with sand some churches in North America suffer from this problem literally when the local liturgical ideologue visits in Lent, dumps out the holy water from the stoops and fills them with sand!— my aside (Rhabanus); they continue to “look among the dead for someone who is alive” and they return to their narrow lives in which some things have to do with morality and others with cult, as in the case of the upright men and women of the old covenant. But in fact the ascension is a decisive turning point. It does indeed mark the end of something that is not simply to be cast aside: the end of a relationship to Jesus that is still wholly external. Above all, however, it marks the beginning of an entirely new relationship of faith and of a new time: the liturgy of the last times.” The Wellspring of Worship, tr. Matthew J. O’Connell (Mahwah NJ: Paulist Press and Eugene OR: Wipf and Stock, 2001), p. 36.
Joseph Ratzinger (The Spirit of the Liturgy) reminds readers that the Pantocrator which dominated the apse of Byzantine and Romanesque churches represented the ascended Lord who would return from Heaven in His glory to judge the quick and the dead. Corbon points out that the eastern churches would adorn the interior of their domes with the image of the ascended Lord who will return in glory – the rising Sun of justice.
This liturgy of the last times is something intuited if not explicitly stated by the artists and patrons of the majestic cathedrals and noble churches of Ireland. Examine the marble used in Armagh and Cobh – where did that marble come from? So pure and so clean! Note the excellence of both material and design.
Consider, too, the presence of so many saints around the altar – that great cloud of witnesses mentioned in Hebrews and to which the liturgy in the Apocalypse frequently alludes. These are the great witnesses who washed their robes clean in the Blood of the Lamb. Their statues are rightly carved with exquisite craftsmanship out of carefully selected stone or wood. Their attributes, clearly distinguishable to convey meaning, remind us of their martyrdom or, in the case of confessors, doctors, pastors, and virgins, various other contributions to the life of the Church by their life and by their holy death. They remind us likewise of their continued intercession for us. They, the Church Triumphant, call us, the Church Militant (coheris with them of Heaven), to joing the cosmic liturgy and to pray for the Church Suffering that we might all meet happily in Heaven – before the throne of God and of the Lamb.
Does one have to be a nineteenth-centruy Catholic to understand this perennial truth? Those who erected the monuments of faith that are the glory of the Church in Ireland had no doubt in their minds about the reality of the Communion of Saints. Vatican II underscored the importance of KOINONIA not only within the Persons of the Holy Trinity, but within the whole Church – in Heaven, on earth, and in Purgatory. How is any of this reflected in St John the Baptist in Drumaroad or its other contemporary packages?
Like Praxiteles, I would be interested to discover the meaning of the dark figures directly across from the chair (in front of the [side] door), and on what was likely the eastern wall at Drumaroad. What are they? Have they a purpose? A meaning? Were they covered up for Lent? What gives?
My point is that liturgical design reflects ecclesiology as much as it reflects an understanding of the liturgy itself. Between the models of nineteenth- and early-twentieth-century cathedrals/churches like Armagh and Cobh, and the latest wreckovations foisted upon congregations in the twenty-first century, as at Drumaroad and proposals elsewhere, a movement is clearly traceable from a Church confident in its identity as the Mystical Body of Christ arrayed hierarchically in mirror-image of the hierarchically-arrayed Church at liturgical prayer in the New Jerusalem (Heaven) to a group arranged only randomly, without regard to hierarchy (whether earthly or heavenly) and without much perceptible purpose or direction. Look carefully at the model of St J-B, Drumaroad. Defeatism, confusion and dysfunction, hollowness, sterility are all perceptible in the scattered lawn ornaments utterly out of proportion (and sync) with the vestigial architecture of the building’s outer shell.
In The Spirit of the Liturgy and elsewhere, Ratzinger cautions against the solipsism that is the fruit of the congregation turning inwards upon itself rather than oriented towards Christ. This, he insists, is essential to any worshipping community. The object of worship is unmistakable in the design and iconographic programmes of Armagh and Cobh. I fear that it is evident, too, in the postmodern example afforded above.
Any more details from Armagh, Fearg?
Bene hibernicis de omnibus Rhabane dixisti!!
Some one from the outside is always best placed to put his finger on a problem and diagnose the malady. It is most interesting what you say about the Irish Church’s decline in self understanding: how can we explain the slump from the self confidence that raised Cobh Cathedral (touched on by Anne WIlson and Jesse Castel Mitliski in their studies of St. Colman’s) to the kind of self (and everything else) effacing pathos (bathos?) of the likes of Drumaroad?
It is perhaps not unconnected with a very interesting historical detail concerning the period between the First Vatican Council (1869-1870) and the Second Vatican Council (1963-1965): in its principal (though not sole) representative at the First Vatican Council, Paul Cardinal Cullen, Archbishop of Dublin, the Irish Church played a pivotal role in the proceedings of that Council and thereby exercised considerable influence on the whole Catholic world . Indeed Paul Cullen produced the definition of papal infallibility that was eventually accepted by the Council; whereas 90 years later, the entire Irish hierarchy (with one or two exceptions) had nothing to say at the Second Vatican Council and were largely regarded by their more plugged in continental counterparts as totally detached not only from the kind of philosophical influences unleashed by the likes of Nitzsche and his ilk in the formation of the so called “modern world”, but more seriously, from every major theological development that had taken place within the previous fifty years. It was no surprise that the hierarchy were very quickly sidelined at the Council by the heavy guns who regarded what they had to say as about as relevant as though someone from Mongolia had said it. If you do not believe what I have to say, just read the submissions made tot the Ante-Preparatory Commission for the Second Vatican Council. All documents submitted to the commission havel been published in the Acta Sacrosancti Oecuminici Concilii Vaticani Secundi .
Is it any wonder that all we can do is laugh at the mouthful of guff that crossed the globe from Hong Kong to San Francisco on last Sunday’s BBC World Service: “The main problem we have is a 19th century sanctuary for a 21 st century liturgy”.
The problem, of course, is not the liturgy, but those who are presiding at the liturgy. If Cobh is anything to go by they haven’t a clue. The level of disobedience to the Magisterium is growing weekly. Maybe they think that no one will notice is they can move the ‘furniture’ about.
Hello Brian!! are you out there somewhere? Hello…..is anyone out there? Perhaps you might like to joint the discussion?
Ahem, here is some more photography, some of it not the best, but a few images not seen on the net before..
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Well, at least this much has survived.
The inscription on the right hand side of the ceiling is indeed from paslm 83 ( Quam delicta tabernacula tua Domine virtutum ..how beautiful art thy dwellings Lord God of hosts..) and the angels do carry the instruments of the passion.
The prototype for the Baptism of Our in the Jordan is Juan Fernandez de Navarrete, “El Mudo”‘s picture of 1565 in the Prado.
Are the panels in the spandrels depictions from the life of St. Patrick, possibly taken from the Confessions of St. Patrick (the dream, the consecration by St. Germain l’Auxerrois, the mission from Pope Celestine)?
There seems to be some water ingress.
Surprising that the inscriptions under St. Luke’s account of the dream of St. Joseph and the flight into Egypt should be in English!
Thanks Fearg for the splendid pictures.
DETAILS OF THE CEILINGS
Moving from the sanctuary towards the organ gallery on the South side:
1 The apparition of the Angel to St Patrick.
2 St Martin of Tours gives St Patrick the religious habit.
3 St Patrick receives the mission from Pope Celestine.
4 His dispute with the Druids.
5 The vocation of St Benignus.
6 St Benignus recalling to life the daughter of King Daire.
7 St Brigid blessing her monastery at Kildare.
8 St Brigid giving sight to sister Dara.
9 St Columcille receiving the cranes from Ireland.
10 Prophecy of St Columcille to Eman.
11 St Columbanus founding his monastery at Bobbio.
12 St Ita and her companions guided by an angel.On the North side, beginning at the organ gallery:
1 Death of St Dympna.
2 St Brendan sails on his voyage
3 St Aidan blessing the hands of Gobban.
4 St Colman teaching at Lismore.
5 St Adamnan writing the life of St Columcille.
6 The Pope blessing St Alban and his brothers.
7 St Virgil founding the cathedral at Salzburg.
8 St Celsus dying, sends his crozier to St ~Malachy.
9 St Malachy chosen as Primate of Armagh.
10 St Malachy helping the plague victims at Armagh.
11 Gelasius consecrates St Laurence O’Toole.
12 St Laurence O’Toole before Henry II of England.
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