reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches
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@Praxiteles wrote:
The form was lso used as a protection against the plague. From the 18th.c on, it seems almost to have disappeared completely and at this point of time is as a good as unknown in Catholic iconography.
Almost, but not completely unknown. This is the contemporary schutzmantelmadonna in the Benedictine nuns’ Abbaye de la Misericorde at Rosans, Hautes Alpes, founded in 1991.
The Stephansdom Schutzmantelmadonna, one of the extraordinary collection of pillar saints, all of stone and poychromed, largely created between 1446 and 1465.
Overy has certainly put his finger on something here. WHen I read the article, I could not help thinking of Thomas Mann’s Zauberberg and its all pervesive sense of total un-reality. Such, it seems to Praxiteles, is the current situation of the rpactictioners of modern architecture – a clear example being Prof. Cathal O’Neill. Listening to his evidence at the Cobh Cathedral Oral Hearing, one was curiously, and coincidentially, struck by the Zauberberg and just how close to that sense of irreality the great professor O’Neill, at times, sounded.
http://www.hughpearman.com/2008/05.html
On the Zauberverg see here:
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Der_Zauberberg
or here
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Magic_Mountain
While here applied to the book, we could also apply it the destruction which has revaged much of the corpus of Irish ecclesiastical architecture over the past 50 years: “The outbreak of the First World War interrupted work on the book. The conflict and its aftermath led the author to undertake a major re-examination of European bourgeois society, including the sources of the wilful, perverse destructiveness displayed by much of civilised humanity.”
The Schuztmantelmadonna is another example of how medieval iconography connects directly with the classical world. In this case, it links directly to Roman law in which patronage or protection of a client was legally indicated by the patron’s enfolding the client in his cloak.
@Antipodes wrote:
The Stephansdom Schutzmantelmadonna, one of the extraordinary collection of pillar saints, all of stone and poychromed, largely created between 1446 and 1465.
Yes these are very beautiful. Does anyone know if this type occcurs in the neo-gothic revival?
a couple of years ago I took this shot of the Church of the Immaculate Conception in Dublin, opposite the Four Courts (also known as Adam and Eve’s church);
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Unfortunately, the other shots I took where B&W. But anyway this was the colour scheme throughout the church, and it looked quite well with it, even if it maybe wasn’t ideal. Yesterday I learned that about a year ago a complete repainting was initiated, which was completed just before last Christmas. What do you suppose this consisted of? An elaborate stenciling scheme? A sensible, traditional range of whites and low intensity reds, yellows etc, or if there’s just no money a complete whitewash, always reliable, til things pick up? none of that; bright poster paint blue was the natural option;[ATTACH]7069[/ATTACH][ATTACH]7071[/ATTACH][ATTACH]7072[/ATTACH]
the beautiful ambulatory is spoiled as you can see
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A new addition along with the paint job is this ‘fence’ cutting the nave in two. What is the purpose of this? I’ve never seen it before. The actual panels of the ‘fence’ are perfect copies of the ambulatory gates which were already in place a couple of years ago;
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I thought I might also just point this out; this chapel is off the south aisle;
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Now, the altar rails have been eradicated from the main altar, as is liturgically essential if the Congregation is to have any hope of involvement in the Mass, far away and aloof as they are in the nave, almost disconnected from the sanctuary usually, by the 3 feet high rails of horrible exclusion. But what will they do in this chapel? have the liturgists in charge of this church made a simple mistake in adding rails rather than not adding rails? It’s an easy mistake to make after all.
Have to say though, I rather like the rails, or would like them in an appropriate modern church.
Ake:I think you’re a bit hard on the colour scheme; from your initial comments I thought they had done the whole church in bright blue, but as it is they have kept to a fairly neutral base and indeed have used two graded shades of blue – a light blue band lower down and the brighter blue higher up, again used mainly as (extensive) highlighting of the coffers and compartments in the ceiling. In all, it’s not a bad job; presumably blue after the dedication to the Immaculate Conception.
Love the altar rails in what I presume is the Blessed Sacrament chapel; they have a real Art Deco feel – not exactly appropriate to the style of the church, but splendid all the same. Incidentally, the flooring throughout the church looks magnificent; let’s all pray earnestly that someone does not think of covering it in carpet!
The loss of altar rails in the main church and of the ambulatory gates/railings is to be regretted. ‘Open-ness’ is fine, but not if the price is the vandalism of historic fittings.Of all the horrenda exhibited on this site, the new chapel of the Bon Secours hospital in Galway must be the worst. And what is even more appalling, it received an award from the RIAI last year.
Designed by Murray O Laoire of Cork, this is what tehir website has to say about it: “The Bon Secours Hospital project, designed by Murray O’Laoire/Brian O’Connell Associates, includes the expansion and enhancement of the entrance facilities; a new-build day hospital and endoscopy facility including four new operating theatres and Central Sterile Services Department (CSSD) supported by a full radiological diagnostic suite. In addition the project included a new build Chapel which incorporates a liturgical painting by artist Hughie O’ Donoghue in a curved glass wall”.
Prax: you have it in one – I was pushed to find out quite what was the function of this space when I first saw an illustration of it.
As a ‘meditation space’ it might just pass muster; as a chapel it fails miserably (where is the Christian iconography of any sort?). If it is not a Christian chapel, then it should think of another name (I presume some non-Christians would object to the use of the term ‘chapel’). Perhaps ‘Funky Light Space’ would be better. (Am I too harsh?)
One can but sigh for hospital chapels like the Rotunda’s – now there’s artistry!And here is something else that praxiteles recently encountered: the works carried out to the porch fo St Patrick’s Church on the Lower Glanmire Road in Cork. The internal wooden screen have been removed and these highly inappropriate glass one installed instead. We are told that the afford a clear view of the church interior from the street – the last thing that you expect froma church which is supposed to be a fanum or sacred place which is screened from the profane. Indeed, it is a little incongruous to suggest that the classical temple on whihc St. patrick’s is based affforded a clear view of its interior to the by-passer – not at all. As we have seen, the doors of Roman Temples (and churches for a very long time) were hung with curtains.
Praxiteles is not much gone either on the celeste blue which has been replaced the more classical deep blue on the main doors of the church. The celeste blue lends a certain fée air to the place.
To Praxiteles’ great astonishment the style of this church is described as “Corinthian” on the webpage of the architectural practice.
The acrhitect responsible for this mess is Kelly, Barry,O’Brien, Whelan
@Praxiteles wrote:
We are told that the afford a clear view of the church interior from the street –
hah! what bull crap!
And finally, Praxiteles has managed to locate those responsible for the last interior make-over of Thurles Cathedral: Bluett and O’Donoghue, Chancery Street, Dublin 7.
I am amused at the tellingly unknowing reference to Giacomo della Porta’s Tabernacle and wonder if they have ever heard of him?
Read alòl about it at this link where it is filed under “CONSERVATION”:
http://www.boda.ie/@Praxiteles wrote:
Praxiteles is not much gone either on the celeste blue which has been replaced the more classical deep blue on the main doors of the church. The celeste blue lends a certain fée air to the place.
where have you been? no self respecting church would willingly be seen without it’s own splash of baby boy blue these days. It’s called fashion. look it up.
To be fair to Bluitt and O’Donoghue, I think they deserve high praise for the restoration of the magnificent polycrome ceiling of the Church of the Immaculate Conception in Castlecomer, CO. Kilkenny.
Read about it under CONSERVATION on the link below:
interesting. They could also be praised for restoring the stenciling in Thurles Cathedral. See the rare photograph of the interior of the baptistry there. Beautiful.
@ake wrote:
hah! what bull crap!
In point of fact, the doors of St. Patrick’s Church must be at least 5 or 6 feet obove the level of the street. If the new porch doors afford a clear view into the church from the street, I cannot imaging the height of those on the street able to avail of this facility
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