reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches
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Some further information on St. George’s Cathedral, Southwark
St. George’s Cathedral, Southwak
1. Showing a drawing by A.W.N. Pugin of 1838 for the interior of the building;
2. The sanctuary as built by Pugin and before bombing in 1941.
@Praxiteles wrote:
St. George’s Cathedral, Southwak
1. Showing a drawing by A.W.N. Pugin of 1838 for the interior of the building;
2. The sanctuary as built by Pugin and before bombing in 1941.
Much more elaborate than what was actually built, the drawing shows a triforum and clearstory,which were not part of the building prior to war damage.
@Praxiteles wrote:
Lack of cash caused restrictions on the on the original plan.
Pugin’s original 1838 plan was probably always way beyond the realities of what could be achieved at that time given the financial realities for poor Catholics. His 1839 design, the one constructed except for the huge tower and spire, was totally different from the previous one. It was of the triple-gabled genre, also used by him for: St Mary’s Cathedral, Newcastle upom Tyne (1841); St Benedict’s, Broadway, NSW (1842); Ss Mary and Joseph’s, Guernsey (1845); St Thomas of Canterbury’s, Fulham (1847); and an unexecuted design for St Mary’s Cathedral, Hobart, Tas (1847). Its nave trusses were of a kind widely used by Pugin even for such small churches as St Paul’s, Oatlands, Tas (designed 1843), and it had a glorious rood screen. Quite early on this was removed to the nave west end leaving only the crucifix suspended beneath the chancel arch.
The few surviving Pugin furnishings such as the Blessed Sacrament chapel altar and the Petre chantry chapel can only give a tantalising feeling for what was a very beautiful interior, the Lady chapel with its glorious carved stone altar and reredos and its elegant parclose screen being just one tragic loss from the 1841 bombing that reduced the building to a smouldering ruin.
The subsequent re-design and 1950s rebuilding by architect Romilly Craze really created in effect a new structure, with its clerestoried nave, transepts, new columns, roof and so on. Then the wreckovation of the chancel in the early 1980s left the chancel itself as a vacant allotment with a bland set of liturgical furnishings that would have Pugin turning in his grave at 1000rpm placed at the crossing created by Craze. If you want to appreciate a Pugin interior in its full integrity go to St Giles’, Cheadle. Sadly, there are precious few other alternatives.
@Antipodes wrote:
Pugin’s original 1838 plan was probably always way beyond the realities of what could be achieved at that time given the financial realities for poor Catholics. His 1839 design, the one constructed except for the huge tower and spire, was totally different from the previous one. It was of the triple-gabled genre, also used by him for: St Mary’s Cathedral, Newcastle upom Tyne (1841); St Benedict’s, Broadway, NSW (1842); Ss Mary and Joseph’s, Guernsey (1845); St Thomas of Canterbury’s, Fulham (1847); and an unexecuted design for St Mary’s Cathedral, Hobart, Tas (1847). Its nave trusses were of a kind widely used by Pugin even for such small churches as St Paul’s, Oatlands, Tas (designed 1843), and it had a glorious rood screen. Quite early on this was removed to the nave west end leaving only the crucifix suspended beneath the chancel arch.
The few surviving Pugin furnishings such as the Blessed Sacrament chapel altar and the Petre chantry chapel can only give a tantalising feeling for what was a very beautiful interior, the Lady chapel with its glorious carved stone altar and reredos and its elegant parclose screen being just one tragic loss from the 1841 bombing that reduced the building to a smouldering ruin.
The subsequent re-design and 1950s rebuilding by architect Romilly Craze really created in effect a new structure, with its clerestoried nave, transepts, new columns, roof and so on. Then the wreckovation of the chancel in the early 1980s left the chancel itself as a vacant allotment with a bland set of liturgical furnishings that would have Pugin turning in his grave at 1000rpm placed at the crossing created by Craze. If you want to appreciate a Pugin interior in its full integrity go to St Giles’, Cheadle. Sadly, there are precious few other alternatives.
Nomen est omen!
The effects of Craze on the sanctuary of Southwark Cathedral well reflect Craze.
@Praxiteles wrote:
Nomen est omen!
The effects of Craze on the sanctuary of Southwark Cathedral well reflect Craze.
I fear my sloppy grammar has let me down. I meant that the crossing space was part of the post-war re-design by Romilly Craze. The sanctuary furnishings and their arrangement were the work of architect Austin Winkley, completed in time for the 1984 papal visit.
Some pictures of the interior of Pugin and Ashlin’s St. Kevin’s Church, Harrington Street, Dublin.
Fortunately, most of the interior has survived more ro less intact and we have a picture of the rare sight of a pulpit in regular use.
@ake wrote:
it’s wonderful. Pity about the playschool paint scheme.
That could be dealt with fairly easily!
Here is something Praxiteles came across recently: the online project of the Frenc Minsitry for Culture which will eventually have the entire inventry of historical monuments and all information/pictures etc about them available on line.
The database for Britany (Finistere) seem to be complete and has an enormous amount of information on it, the Charante Maratime also seem finished with other regions at various stages of evolution..
This approach really shows up the pterry pathetic efforts of many County Council in Ireland who cannot even manage to maintain a list let alone a database of information of listed monuments.
http://www.culture.gouv.fr/culture/regions/drac.html
Just click a region on the map and choose Sdap and patrimoine
The magnificent interior of the Eglise des Carmes (1383-1414) at Pont-L’Abbé in Finistere, Britany:
Unfortunately it has been hacked: the present interior
The present interior:
Note that the statues at either side of the windoe have been replaced with silly looking angels
@Praxiteles wrote:
The present interior:
Note that the statues at either side of the windoe have been replaced with silly looking angels
Last time I saw that pair, they were on either side of the tabernacle in Armagh Cathedral! 😉
The new altar in this church seems rather our of proportion to the rest of theSanctuary – which then becomes nothing more than a store room for rubbish.
Also, Praxiteles is not sure that the introduction of modern benches here is an improvement on the traditional French chaise d’église.
@Praxiteles wrote:
The new altar in this church seems rather our of proportion to the rest of theSanctuary – which then becomes nothing more than a store room for rubbish.
Also, Praxiteles is not sure that the introduction of modern benches here is an improvement on the traditional French chaise d’église.
Rhabanus is confident that the pews are distinctly out of place in this church.
Note the placement of the rood in the earlier, b x w photo – right across from the pulpit. Interesting.
Rhabanus might rather have expected the pulpit to have been placed on the Gospel side and the rood to have replaced the Twelfth Station of the Cross on the wall of the Epistle Side of the nave. Could that print have been reversed?
The golden angels on the plinths flanking the East window are too small for the space they occupy. Bring back the earlier saints!!
The rood and its figures of Our Lady and St John are interesting. Clearly, it was placed in the position in the photograph when it was removed from its original position on the screen acorss the chancel. his is likely to have happened some time in the late 16 early 17th century. The rood figures were generally conserved and re-erected on the South wall of the nave near the chancel. The feature is to be seen in many churches throughout Germany and Austria. Praxiteles doe not know if the the figures are still in the church but wll attempt to find out.
Someone asked Praxiteles recently why the figures of the ox and the ass appear in the Crib. Well, the short answer to taht is because they were put there by St. Francis of Assisi -who invented the Crib- when he firest set up one in 1223 at
However, the Poverello did not put both figures into the Crib merelyfor decorative purposes: he had a fairly trenchant message to deliver to those who gazed upon the chirl in the manger, namely would they be able to recognise that the child in the Crib was indeed the Saviour and Redeemer?
The source for ther eference tot he ox and the ass is to be found at the evry beginning of the Prophet Isaiah:
“cognovit bos possessorem suum et asinus praesepe domini sui Israhel non cognovit populus meus non intellexit”
Roughly translated: the ox knows its owner and the ass its master’s manger but Isael does not, and my people do not understand”.
The Crib here is that of Hugo van der Goes aka the adoration of the Shepherds, painted in Brouges in 1475. The ox and the ass are to be seen peering from behind the figure of Our Lady. The picture was commissioned by Antonio Portinari, a Florentine banker in Bruges, and was eventually taken back to Florence by him and set up in the Church of Sant’Egidio dell’archispedale of Santa Maria Nuova. To.day, it is in the Uffizi Gallery.
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