reorganisation and destruction of irish catholic churches
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Two kilkenny churches: the very intact looking capuchin friary, and the gothic church near the train station
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[ATTACH]4004[/ATTACH]Is that red good or bad?
Nice posting, Ake, but there is no need for the amazement concerning the quality of Irish church building up to the 60s: just take a look at St. Francis in Liberty Street in Cork or The Descent of the Holy Ghost at Dennehy’s Cross in Cork etc.
WHat is amazing that this whole tradition seems to have evaporsted over night in the 1970s.
@Praxiteles wrote:
Nice posting, Ake, but there is no need for the amazement concerning the quality of Irish church building up to the 60s: just take a look at St. Francis in Liberty Street in Cork or The Descent of the Holy Ghost at Dennehy’s Cross in Cork etc.
WHat is amazing that this whole tradition seems to have evaporsted over night in the 1970s.
…and despite most of these Churches being listed buildings, unelected officials, (Mr. Joe springs to mind) insist on “linier views†from one or two angles same taken from a 80 ft. cherry picker to justify surrounding beautiful buildings by slum flats to maximize development levies (and their “performance†related bonuses + future employment prospects) :rolleyes:
@ake wrote:
…. kilkenny churche: …the gothic church near the train station
Is that red good or bad?
That red all over the ceiling is MOST unfortunate and in very bad taste.
1. The colour scheme of the ceiling should differentiate the apse from the sanctuary. The same colour should not be used on both. In this case, you would expect the apse to be painted in alternating blue and red panels with stencils or inserted painted panels or angels or saints or indeed of stars.
In the neave you would expect to find alternating panels of blue and red; or torquise green and pink.
2. In the attic of the Porta Coeli arch, facing into the nave, you would expect to find a fresco, possibly of the resurrection or the ascension or assumption and a similar counterpart on the other side facing into the apse.
3. Those banners are utterly absurd and serve no useful purpose.
Here is an example of what you might expect to find in this church had its original paint work been preserved. The example is taken from St. Peter’s Cathedral in London, Ontario, Canada.
@Praxiteles wrote:
Here is an example of what you might expect to find in this church had its original paint work been preserved. The example is taken from St. Peter’s Cathedral in London, Ontario, Canada.
Is it the case do you know, that whenever you see a church with large monochrome areas like that, it was always originally painted, like the above mentioned, meaning like the chancel of Kilkenny Cathedral, or St.Finbars COI, you know with patterns and illustrations etc- at least if the church is 19th century?
I seem to talk about paint alot, but I have another question on it-
Do you believe modern methods of painting are inferior to original methods? Are they even different? The reason I ask is because in alot of churches the paint job seems somewhat crude to me, I don’t know exactly in what way, but for example in St.Teresa’s in Dublin (the one off grafton street), where I was recently, the colours seemed very harsh, almost cartoonish, and even seemed to obscure the plasterwork occasionally. In contrast is St.Audeon’s RC which I understand has not been repainted in the last 35 years:[ATTACH]4008[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH]4009[/ATTACH]Am I imagining things?
before I forget, does anyone have any information and pictures on modern Irish cloisters, if they exist? I believe there is one in the Cistercian house in Waterford, Mount Melleray, maybe I’m wrong
Prax, that looks like it could be the very same design as clonskeagh, with one dome less
@ake wrote:
before I forget, does anyone have any information and pictures on modern Irish cloisters, if they exist? I believe there is one in the Cistercian house in Waterford, Mount Melleray, maybe I’m wrong
Take a look at the areal picture of St. Francis in Cork. You can see the cloister on the North side of the Church.
Re Painting:
You can take it that when money was available and painting had to be done, elaborate schemse covered the entire church.
When money was available but limited, then most was spent on the Apse and a reduced scheme in the nave.
When funds did not allow this, then what was available was spent on the Apse with whitewash used in the nave usually relieved with scrolls over the arches quoting lines from the New Testament.
In Ireland, the unfortunate 1970s saw much of this work simply painted over in nice glossy paint. As time progressed, the colours became lighter and lighter until we now have bland pastels all over the place.
The interior of St Mary’s in Mallow was re-painted not so long ago. the pinters employed were competent and some of the scagliola work is very good. I suppose it all depends on what you are prepared to spend!!
“I suppose it all depends on what you are prepared to spend!!”
Or spend on graniose unwanted schemes..whilst the church around you crumbles….. ….Bishop Magee comes to mind for some strange reason……
Mount St. Joseph’s Cistercian Abbey, Roscrea, Co. Tipperary
You should be able to find an example of a cloister here
St. Patrick’s College, Maynooth, Co. Kildare – St. Mary’s Cloister
The monstrosity in the middle of the cloister was never envisaged by A.W.N. Pugin!!
@Praxiteles wrote:
The Cistercian Abbey at Portglenone, Co. Antrim
Too sterile for my taste. Much prefer the other cloisters. Thanks for the photos, Prax!
What “nature-boy” got his talons into the cloister at Maynooth? Reminds me somewhat of that “artiste” who littered the gutted nave of St John the Baptist Drumacree Rd with his El Greco lawn gnomes.
Was good taste driven out of Ireland on 1 Jan 1970, like the snakes in St Patrick”s day (5th century)?
@Rhabanus wrote:
Too sterile for my taste. Much prefer the other cloisters. Thanks for the photos, Prax!
What “nature-boy” got his talons into the cloister at Maynooth? Reminds me somewhat of that “artiste” who littered the gutted nave of St John the Baptist Drumacree Rd with his El Greco lawn gnomes.
Was good taste driven out of Ireland on 1 Jan 1970, like the snakes in St Patrick”s day (5th century)?
For modesty sake, let us not ask anythig about the introduction of the New Age garden into St. Mary’s Cloister in Maynooth!!
St.Mary’s cloister- obscene
Is the cloister in St.Francis, Cork a proper cloister with four walks?is it public?
By the way on the topic of cistercians, does anyone have the book “Cistercian abbeys of Europe”, with photographs by Henri Gaud?
I really think cloisters are a sad absence in modern churches, notwithstanding their monastic function. For example in the medieval cathedrals of England, it is truly sublime to wander around a quiet cloiser garth when visiting the church… I believe there is a similar survival in Adare but I’ve never been
St.Audeon’s: Damn Christmas tree was blocking the altar. I really don’t agree with trees in churches, call me scrooge
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[ATTACH]4017[/ATTACH]And of course, we cannot forget our good friend Brian Quinn’s effort at Rosstrevor
http://www.bbc.co.uk/northernireland/yourplaceandmine/down/rostrevor_monastery.shtml
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