O’ Connell Street, Dublin
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I don’t know about knocking the design quality, but I wouldn’t call the other concerns ‘rant’ particularly Dr Quirkeys which is dire and also the Nationwide building which they can well afford to fix.
I also realised yesterday just how little of the Street is actually finished, All of Upper O’Connell St has seen minimal changes at best. The Section You are talking about to the Bridge needs wider paths as I watched a LUAS cut the Street yesterday there was not enough space for pedestrians to see LUAS safely.
This is not LUAS bashing but merely an observation that if it is to operate safely a wdider footpath is required at this point of the line, in contrast the other (wider) path provided more than enough vantage for people. It looked great in its new ‘restored’ surroundings.
Well it would be unfair to criticise the CC for the upper end at the moment in that the public domain works phase hasn’t started here yet, but yes on the properties side of things Dr Quirkey’s is terrible, although conversely I’d say the public at large would quite like it; as Devin memorably said – plastic window boxes and picket fences etc… But if this is the precedent for future development, the place is only going to go further down the tubes.
Surely there are going to be double pavements on the lower section – I haven’t been on the street for a couple of weeks now but what you describe J Seerski is worrying. This is the most congested part of the street and also features the busiest pedestrian crossing in the country, it is essential that a double width is used here, not least for the sake of conforming with the rest of the throughfare.
Indeed that’s a point that’s been irritating me for ages – seeing everything happening nearly every single day inevitably results in the novelty of the project wearing off a bit, but even so there is still something about the newly completed part that doesn’t quite click with the exciting plans first proposed. And it’s the consolidating of the street into a whole with trees as originally proposed that’s the issue. As it stands, I cannot see a grand sweep of timbers emerging from what has been planted to date. Of course the trees along the footpaths have to mature and fully form, and the IAP CGIs were a bit fanciful but even so, the effect is disapointing. Perhaps when the upper end, with few to no interruptions from sidestreets or plazas is completed, the unity will emerge.
Certainly I find the median a big let down – as delicate and architectural as the new wispy trees are, a marching terrace of limes could have looked so much better and striking, they could have defined O’ Cll St from the rest of the city. As beautiful as the new paving is and the lamposts etc, the median is very leggy and windswept, with poles and posts and trunks of trees poking up everywhere – instead of being a place of interest and a break away from the congested side pavements. Instead it feels like a big stepping stone to be used to get to the other side of the street as quickly as possible.Those brass plinths on the Irish Nationwide shop front are a lovely detail, and must be restored. This building was a jewellers when first opened, the owners took great pride in rebuilding their premises in this grand, modern manner after 1916 on such a prominent site in the city. As far as I can remember, the upper floors could do with a slap of paint too.
Originally posted by J. Seerski
well sorry to dissapoint everyone but is it not clear that the stretch from Abbey Street to O’Connell Bridge will NOT have widened footpaths?! They are laying new granite at junctions with abbey street – it is clear from this that the narrow paths will remain.It would be a disappointment if these footpaths were not widened. It would take away from the unity of the street and as Graham Hickey points out it would not help elieviate the problem of the pedestrian crossing. If these paths were widened, I suppose the bridge paths would have to be widened aswell. This would be great for pedestrians, but would it cause more traffic chaos than is already there?
As a cyclist who daily crosses O’Connell Bridge I doubt using the inside lanes on either side would have any difference to traffic flow. Certainly on the northbound side the inside lane is nearly always empty for some reason maybe because of the lay out ahead.
I wonder do they plan to have bus stops instead of widening the path on this section of the street! I hope not.
Frankly, the O’C st makeover can’t even stand comparison to what’s happened on Patrick St.
Was in Cork at the weekend and thought it was absolutely terrible. Apart from a nice big wide section of paving on the West side of the street, don’t think there’s anything worthwhile in it.
Some of the lighting looks like half-assed floodlights the local GAA club would put up so they could train at night.
The paving stones are probably incredibly expensive but the pink hue of some of them just makes them look terribly cheap.
I had seen pictures of it and thought it was OK but being there, I thought it was dismal.
Also, I think if a city ever needed a decent monument, it’s Cork at the Dublin side of Patrick Street. The statue that is there is so underwhelming and it’s such a potentially great site.From what I know, the path IS to be widened at this point, tapered from the full widened width at the abbey street end, to being half-widened at the O’Connell Bridge end (so half as wide as existing path)…wasn’t possible to keep full extra width the whole way due to Daniel O’Connell statue, or traffic flows, or something…so the path tapers gradually wider from bridge end to Abbey st end…seems like a good compromise to me
Kefu – the statue at the Dublin Side was earmarked under the original plan to be moved from there and the local gutter press organised an outcry. So the design was compromised from day one.
Personally I think the Patrick St redevelopment is excellent – it has a bit of character while I feel the new O’Conn St has a dreary corporate clinical feel to it. The lights tend to polarise opinion – but at least they are a unique feature to this street and not something picked out of a catalogue. The paving is high quality – but as with most public areas in this country – it has been allowed to get filthy.
You can already see this tapering effect on the kerb line of the central median currently being constructed. I dont like it as it is ruining the uniformity and formality of the section completed to date. Having said that I suppose that the O’Connell Monument has to be passed by pedestrians otherwise the whole median here becomes redundant. If I remember rightly the median prior to the 1988 reconstruction did not allow you to walk around the stature which was also surrounded by railings.
I think that the lack of spotlighting for the various monuments on the street is pity. Also I would have liked some colour introduced as part of the lighting scheme. Blue can look particularly effective.
I am starting to rethink my opinion about the tree planting. I think a more consistent planting scheme would have been better, perhaps clipped trees throughout.
Also What? have the Savoy done to their frontage. It looks crap. I think they are trying for the Odeon Leicester Square look but the result is cheap and tack and bland in the extreme. I would have much prefered to see a return to the classic cinema canopy with lights and lettering. Shame.
Originally posted by kefu
Some of the lighting looks like half-assed floodlights the local GAA club would put up so they could train at night.agreed, ass i said in feb 2003…. “I think these are f***ing awful. They look like crude lighting fixtures assembled by the local welder in Ballyhoo to floodlight the local catholic church.”
They’re terrible alright, esp how the pole continues on upward after the last light – they’re like giant fishing rods or something!
Just to confirm on O’ Cll St, the median is tapering from wide at O’ Cll Monument to narrow at Abbey St, and the side pavements are tapering the opposite way to end up narrow at the bridge?
The distinguished railings that used to encircle O’ Cll should be reinstated, the Monument gets vandalised and peed on regardless of how often it’s cleaned – the narrow strips of footpath at either side of it are where the railings used to be, on a stone plinth which is also gone.
The lack of consistancy of the paving is a shame, but pedestrians must be able to access the median here. And O’Cll Mon should certainly be lit – now here’s somewhere where something special could be carried out. Bit more difficult for the likes of John Gray & Co.Good to see soemeone’s thinking ahead in the CC, an access manhole has been provided in the middle of the plaza for the Christmas Tree electricity supply, unfortunate it happens to be slap bang in the middle lining up with the GPO but there you go.
I so shouldn’t have noticed that…I can’t believe my eyes…when I first saw Paul Clerkins photos of the lights, I thought it was a Photoshop job…My God…they’re actually real?…I have to say I can’t but laugh…this country :p …I was reading earlier some of the posts to do with the bookstall kiosks on Grattan Bridge…actually Capel Street Bridge – think the CC renamed it last year sometime…but I was thinking that the main prob that I have with the kiosks is that they’re just completely characterless and souless…the same goes for the boardwalk kiosks…BUT it’s very different to design ‘soul’ and character…as the O’Connell St lights show…I dunno, it’s easy to criticise, but they do look a bit OTT for what’s essentially supposed to be a ‘grand’ street…they look like those lights in Rotterdam (is it?) that the public can move by moving little adjoining joysticks…they fit in well…there’s 3 of them and they face onto the plaza…the O’C lights face across the street…is that whats wrong???
Well, 2 friends of mine who were in Dublin from the US were impressed by the new median and wish it to be completed ASAP, so when they can come back it’s done. The northern part of O’Connell street would in fact look better than the central median when finished , as there are less interruptions. I still like it. And I love to walk the median too, although it is true that very few people do it. Thats fine with me, though.
I do wish there were was no parking of bikes or motorcycles there, however.
They liked the city, we had good weather – one improvement which they mentioned was a boardwalk on both sides of the liffey all the way to Heuston. i told them that there were money issues with that:-)
I think most people do like the central median its width gives a feeling of quality the opposite of which is walking across College Green towards Westmoreland St on the BOI side.
What is best about the GPO plaza in my opinion is what can be done for special occaisions such as the Bloomsday Breakfast, the choice of road surface to go with the paving was excellent.
I also noticed a feature on the news one day promoting a forthcoming event (world monopoly championships) for media soundbites it is again excellent.The issue that you raise about bicycle parking is valid, the parking of same should be moved elsewhere as between statues and crossings there isn’t really a viable spot. I don’t think that any of the streets off O’Connell St are wide enough or quiet enough to do it. Is it possible that the corporation may need to look at incorporating a large bicycle park as an objective of the Carlton Cinema project.
These bikes have to be moved, even if there’s no option other than to assemble some sort of dedicated park on the median then at least have that. I know how frustrating it can be for cyclists to park, but the current situation is not sustainable, esp with the motorbikes – the clutter generated is not nice, on a practical and visual level.
I agree about walking along the median, it’s such a pleasant experience, nice and quiet. The paving can really be appreciated here and the symmetry of the trees is very striking, but I think broad clipped limes would have been much preferable, taking the best element of the old trees – creating an air of seclusion and relaxation – while not dominating the street and concealing the building stock. Combined with shady seating it could have been extra special.
dunno, think boxed limes the length of the street might be a bit much Graham, I think the bit of variation is nice, probably just because I really like silver birch !
Well, I don’t think that Patrick’s Street picture is the most flattering – but that aside, I do believe the lights are unique, I mean, the fact that they have sparked up debate is what striking architecture should do. You don’t have to like it, but at least it gets noticed.
I have to say, I kinda like the revamp of O’Connell Street, maybe its the imposing figure of the Spire overlooking the thoroughfare, that makes the street look that bit better. Perhaps without the Spire’s presence the street would look much more dire. In contrast, I do feel (lights aside), the redevelopment of Patrick’s Street in Cork has a much warmer feel to it than O’Connell Street, it gives off a nice ‘city on the rise’ feel without compromising a sense of homeliness. I think the description of the lights as being ‘level crossing barriers’ is a good one, but ya can’t deny, the whole street has become a vibe of activity since the development. Pedestrian traffic has tripled and business is growing like never before according to retaillers on the street. Oliver Plunkett Street and Grand Parade are set for the same, with simlar plans for Grand Parade, but with more incorporation of plant-life and market vibrancy.
I agree with Lexington who says that the picture shown of the lights on Patricks st. is unflatering. Also the fact that it looks like a dull november day isn’t doing it any favours either.
Actually I really like the lights. Firstly they are unusual and their uniqueness befits the main street of the city. Secondly they provide a reference point to the herritage of the city. The architect Beth Gali spoke about the the images she encountered when she visited Cork, and the most striking aspect was the masts of the ships and boats in the docks. These lights are a reflection of this image. Living in a region with the second largest natural harbour in the world and where the sea has had such a major influence on the development of the city I commend the architect for including a reference to this in her design.
The change on Patricks St. has been drastic and it has been transformed from a stretch of traffic choked, cracked pavement to a fantastic public open space.
If the designers of the the O’ Connell st redevelopment achieve even half what Beth Gali has done to Patricks St. they will have done a very good job!
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