Look at de state of Cork, like!
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How exactly does my comment display that a perfectly comprehensive and accessible discussion about architectural developments and their respective social and aesthetic merits is ‘clearly way over [my] head’ Corkdood?
Do you think that my straying from the major thread topic shows this? Or is it just because you weren’t bothered giving any time to my (admittedly acerbic) comment and so flung me an adolescent ‘won’t attempt to explain it to you’ ?
Always a thought provoking and truly mature response.What exactly won’t you attempt to explain? Because I really don’t feel a single comment in this thread is in anyway ‘above’ anyones ‘head’.
I regularly visit Cork, and so took an interest in this thread.
Lets be honest now; your comment was a way of quickly brushing off my point whilst maintaining a sense of superiority for yourself by implying that I simply don’t ‘get’ this ‘exclusive’ conversation.
Pah!
Rjajc,
This discussion has moved on in the 5 days since you last posted so perhaps you should do the same.
Your comment was irrelevant and childish so I felt it didn’t warrant a response.
I still feel that way.Relax a little lads. I really don’t think that Rjajcs original comments were at all childish. Although he said them in a slightly sarcastic way, I actually think he made a good point. Some times things are done in the built environment to erase a ‘problem’. The belief in the concept that we can change the way people act by good architecture is somewhat problematic as in most cases it just serves to hide reality even further.
Thanks
Phil
His original comments were very apt – junkies, custom house etc … but… “I’ve also heard that moaney, second-city-issue-ridden Corkonians meet in Heuston station when they arrive in Dublin; so I propse we completely refurbish it or better yet move it to remove the ‘problem’ “
Ouch the poor Corkonians! Maybe the chip is infact on the other shoulder?!?
d_d, I thought he was only messing with that final comment. I did not take him seriously. However, maybe he was!?
Yep, I was just messing with the last comment; being overly flippant to prove a point.
Casual usage of social stereotypes infuriates me; particularly when used as a sole justification to pursue a course of action such as refurbishing/reconstructing a public space. If this is inherently ‘childish’ then so be it.
I also don’t believe it is ‘irrelevant’ to challenge them in any circumstance Corkdood; on the contrary, it is wholly relevant.
Anyway, no hard feelings, just needed to get it off my chest.
whatever happened to the the site oppossite the Bodega on the Coal Quay, planning for a hotel was refused there a few years ago? Any developments since? Knowing Cork probably not…………..
anto, the city council succeeded in persuading the developers behind the hotel application to re-submit and change course completely. An application went in before christmas for retail street connecting cormarket to paul st and approx. 80 apartments (no car parking)
sounds good. Things do seem to be happening in Cork alright. I remember living there 96-99 and not much seemed to be happening. Think that Celtic Kitten was a bit late arriving to Cork. Good to see the retail being expanded in the city centre. When Mahon point opens it might suck alot of punters away from the city centre.
You could be right about Mahon point. Although on the other side of town in Blackpool they opened a large shopping centre three years ago which is always busy. That must have hit the city centre too.
Another major development in the city is that Examiner Publications have put their offices up for sale. Their offices take up a huge chunk of the city centre from Academy Street up to the savoy. They also have paper stores on half moon street. Johnson and Perrot on Emmet Place are also set to move opening up almost an entire block of retail space a stones throw from Patrick Street. I bet the Briitish retailers will be fighting for that one!Congrats to the city manager – forced an attitude change in landlords and massive amounts of retails space has been (will be) released coming on stream in the next few years. Too many of Cork’s inner city “prime” retails units are too small for suitable modern shops (think smaller units of grafton st). My only problem is that Owen O’Callaghan seems to have his fingers in almost all of the developments. The J+P building, the formers Guys site opposite the Bodega, (possibly) the Examiner site – AND Mahon Point… while he has proved his retail pedigree and ability to draw big names (check out lineup in Liffey Valley and Mahon Point) will he be happy to cannibalise one developments draw to suit another. Me thinks not.
Hey lads! How’s it going? The Guy & Co site on Cornmarket Street is actually owned by the O’Donoghue/Ring families, they own the Munster Joinery in Ballydesmond near Mallow and a string of hotels in Killarney including the lovely Killarney Plaza. Money is no object! They applied for PP for 80 apartments and 7 retail units pretty much along the same design as the original hotel they’d planned 3 years ago. It’s a shame the hotel didn’t get the green-light – it was aesthetically beautiful and would be a far greater asset than more apartments to Cork.
Also, Owen O’Callaghan has a deal with J+P with relation to their Emmet Place premises – they have a no-talks-with-the-press deal. But Owen O’C has in the meantime bought the site along the side-street adjacent to the Examiner premises on which the gay bar Taboo was situated at the former Vodafone store next to GQ on St. Patrick’s Street – so it’s not too hard to guess what he’s up to as he is one of the 3 tenders being reviewed by Thomas Crosbie Holdings for the Examiner site on Academy Street. There’s also a rumour Barters Travel Agency, the pharmacy and pub next to it on Paddy’s Street have entered deals with him to sell-up or relocated, free up a huge development quarter on Cork’s main shopping thoroughfare.
Oh great… Merchants Qy MK2.
So having inflicted a red brick carbuncle along an ENTIRE quay side – he’s now moving to infiltrate both Emmet Place and Patrick St.
On the plus side – Cork City is in need of investment and this activity HAS to be a benefit.
Originally posted by lexington
Hey lads! How’s it going? The Guy & Co site on Cornmarket Street is actually owned by the O’Donoghue/Ring families, they own the Munster Joinery in Ballydesmond near Mallow and a string of hotels in Killarney including the lovely Killarney Plaza. Money is no object! They applied for PP for 80 apartments and 7 retail units pretty much along the same design as the original hotel they’d planned 3 years ago. It’s a shame the hotel didn’t get the green-light – it was aesthetically beautiful and would be a far greater asset than more apartments to Cork.So why didn’t it get permission?
Corporation Housing residents behind the Guy site objected to the scale of the project (at 6-storeys) and they were helped out by – who else? – An Taisce. The Bodega bar also objected. But the street is now worse off because of petty-short sightedness. 80 apartments has become the revised solution. Ugh! The hotel would have been SO much better. And of the Corp Housing residents? There is only one permanent resident remaining. Typical!
Originally posted by lexington
And of the Corp Housing residents? There is only one permanent resident remaining. Typical!Have they been booted out so that the Corporation can make more money off the land?
I don’t think so. A lot of the residents were OAPs – and they’d been there since the red-brick houses were built in the late 1950s/early 60s. As far as I know and don’t quote me on this, but a lot of the residents left either to move in with family or simply passed on. I understand the sentimental element to their objections but the developers had made generous incentives to the residents ( one of the residents themselves told me this, but refused to tell me what exactly it was) in order to compensate for construction disruption – but even those objections may have passed if it wasn’t for good ole An Taisce jumping on the bandwagon. I swear, I understand the relevance of An Taisce, but it seems they have nothing better to do with their excessive time than hold back the progress of our cities. Shouldn’t city planners worry about the appropriate development of our cities and not An Taisce? Let them raise appropriate arguments with relation to Protected Structures and leave it with City Planners to decide thereafter, not go running to An Bord Pleanale everytime a new development is proposed.
thank god that hotel proposal was rejected, it was TERRIBLE. it was something along the lines of a red-brick confusion of mock georgian and other bits thrown in, cheap, poorly designed. i saw the model in city council’s office a few years back and it was really poor and would have been a disrace if it were permitted. also, the site is more suitable for retail and residential, there are far better sites for quality hotels in the city. as far as i knew residents in the ‘old labourers dwellings’ as well as bodega people objected purely on the basis of loss of amenity i.e. light. in general, i think an taisce, and other residents are entitled to object, and by the way, it had significant local support from street traders etc. in the end, i believe cornmarket street has been ‘saved’ in this regard, and hopefully, the current application, due fairly soon, will represent a more attractive and interesting addition to the streetscape.
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