Look at de state of Cork, like!
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I think the proposals for the new bus station are terrible.
How did the Cork City Council approve them?Originally posted by lawyer
I think the proposals for the new bus station are terrible.
How did the Cork City Council approve them?Well the orginal plan saw the extension and partial demolition of existing bus station with a 360-degree ‘control tower’ erected on the roof and so on – this inadequate but substantially better plan was given approval originally, but Bus Eireann came back a few months later and amended their plans, cutting back on almost all major development elements bar the canopy erection. Pathetic!
Meanwhile, Oliver Plunkett Street (OPS) is looking pretty good – though there’s clearly a long way to go yet, some of the first section of its new design has been unveiled and what an improvement it is!
*UPDATES*Though its 2 years away yet, O’Callaghan Properties have put the bid out on designs for the Academy Street (Irish Examiner HQ) retail development – which will cost an est’d 150m euro to build. Deals have recently been completed with almost all the surrounding properties bar the AA Ireland Building. The design will by way of planning need to consider the AA Ireland Building and Le Cheateau public house on Patrick’s Street in its design as these are protected structures – and trust me – will be virtually impossible to get passed with relation to any development – and rightly so. They are important elements of Cork’s history and architecture.
It is believed, the 6 storey over basement development of mixed retail and residential, will hark back to a post-modern design with consideration for its surroundings such as the Crawford Gallery, Patrick Street redevelopment, AA Ireland Building and Le Cheateau. I am informed that the developer is keen to provide a landmark development incorporating modern and old styles – an example of the Jervis Street Shopping Centre entrance on Henry Street in Dublin was given (a large peaked arch way and copper dome incorporating red-brick to blend with surrounding buildings of foregone eras.)
O’Callaghan Properties, with the exception of 21 Lavitts Quay don’t have a good track record for design, so this project will be a HUGE test for them. Both planning authorities and the public are going to demand a superior standard of design for such a prestigious location and development. Here’s hoping!
Its being a newsworthy day in the Cork development arena:
*UPDATES*
– Pierse Construction are to begin construction on the 20m-euro UCC School of Pharmacy, on College Road this August. (I will post a picture of the development on this post later on when I edit it).
– Merchants Quay SC is scheduled to undergo a 7m euro facelift – in order to make the centre a more attractive place to shop running up to Cork 2005 and its 15-year anniversary. (Will post pic here later also). The design is subtle but exciting nonetheless.
– Frinailla have gone to appeal on its project for 221 homes, 74 apartments, creche and after school-minding centre on a 21-acre site between Ballincollig and the city (east-side). The project was scheduled to commence this August.
-> Frinailla seem to be getting a real tough time in the recent projects; their 70m high-rise residential project in Blackpool was refused by CCC, has since gone to ABP on appeal and waits decision – but the prospects are dim.; their 30m An Caislean project suffered as the building contractors assigned to the development went into liquidation half-way through the project (a lone tower crane still remains on a vacant site); their Grand Parade Plaza project has been held up due to archelogical excavations – which seem to never end; and now this project in Ballincollig’s east-side. Just hope their fortunes pick up. Roll on the Grand Parade Plaza!Plans are also afoot to demolish Jurys Hotel on western road and build a new hotel complex plus a separate apartment and creche development plus a new bridge linking it with Lancaster Quay
*UPDATES*
The Munster Agricultural Show Society – owners of the Cork Showgrounds in the Docklands Area – confirmed today it is in the process of determining between 2 bids for the 22-acre site. One bid is being made by the GAA who own the adjacent Pairc Ui Chaoimh, the acquired site would allow for further development of the GAA Grounds. Another bid proposes a 5000 seat convention/conference centre and commercial area – rivalling a similar bid proposed on Horgan’s Quay by CIE/Treasury Holdings and Manor Park Homes.
-> a 5m -euro plan to redeveloped Cornmarket Street is set to get the go-ahead by early next month – this would compliment the 30m euro residential and retail development by Rockfell Investments on the former Guy & Co site, which is still awaiting a planning decision.
2 other large scale development projects are currently at pre-planning along Cornmarket Street and announcements are expected to be made on these in the near future.
-> The Millenium Cornmarket Street Bridge, whose sections can be seen resting along Lavitts Quay, are being shift into place soon. CCC are funding the project, Ascon are the contractors. The bridge is expected to further compliment the pedestrian flow to the street – which is, in development terms, one of the most exciting and sought after streets in the country – as it is seen, along with Grand Parade as a natural extension of Patrick’s Street.
Originally posted by corkdood
Plans are also afoot to demolish Jurys Hotel on western road and build a new hotel complex plus a separate apartment and creche development plus a new bridge linking it with Lancaster QuayWell, the plan includes a partial demolition to cater for refurbishment. The proposed development for Jurys on the Western Road includes a private multi-storey car-park, additional floor to cater for between 40 to 60 new rooms, extended conference facilities, internal refurbishment, external facade and structural adjustments to existing river-side hotel, possible additional fourth floor, new leisure facilities, adjusted amenity landscaping and demolition and relocation of new, wider bridge between new development and Lancaster Quay/Western Road.
*UPDATES*
-> Speaking of hotels, the Kingsley Hotel on the Carrigohane Straight Road, across the road from the 60m euro Cork County Hall extension and redevelopment, have just been greenlighted for a 50m euro extension, including construction of 10178 sq.m. of new hotel facilities, comprising 4674 sq.m. 82 bedroom extension in two new wings to the existing Kingsley Hotel, 818 sq.m. of conference facilities, 597 sq.m. of leisure and spa facilities, 500 sq.m. extended dining and kitchen facilities, and 3589 sq.m. 19 unit aparthotel and associated offices to the Western end of the existing hotel. 3. Two level basement carpark of 740 spaces to serve the two developments, and 102 surface spaces. 4. Formation of a new vehicular access to the centre of the site. And all other site development works including internal access roads, parking areas, and landscaping to facilitate the proposed development
-> Right next to the Kingsley (and as part of the same application as the above) on site of a former Park and Ride facility, permission, after appeal, has been granted to Rathmelton Investments Ltd for construction of a new 14,068 sq.m. five storey student housing development, comprising 116 apartments, (514 student bedspaces) and to incorporate 840 sq.m. communal facilities including retail, restaurant, laundary, and other support facilities. Rathmelton is responsible for this development of both the Kingsley and Student accomodation.
Construction begins soon.-> Meanwhile, just a few steps away from the Kingsley, Paul Montgomery and Edmund Kenneally’s 25m euro 9-storey student development, Victoria Hall, is seeing the scaffolding come gradually down on the main building, work is swiftly continuing on the Victoria Cross elevation. Anyway, the same developers are in appeal for a further student development on the site of the current Statoil station adjacent to Victoria Hall. Next to that, on the site of the former M&P O’Sullivan Cash & Carry, Fleming Construction are in appeal for a student development of 166 student apartments in 4 5-storey blocks.
Some interesting construction pics of Victoria Hall.
More recent pics of Victoria Hall.Visitt THIS link to see computer images of the finished product – both Phase One of Victoria Hall, and 2nd phase currently in appeal (former Statoil) ->
-> In an answer to an e-mail enquiry for a forum member; the development at Camden Quay, across the road from John Hornibrook’s 20m-euro residential (58 apartments) and commercial (offices, 9 retail units and restaurant) development, is being developed by Neil O’Sullivan of OSB (O’Sullivan Bros.) DIY store in Hollyhill Industrial Estate, Cork. The current, first phase of development consists of demolition of existing industrial buildings, the construction of 40 No. apartments, incorporating 32 No. 2 bed and 8 No. 1 bed and ancillary site works and minor elevation alterations to the property at 4 Camden Quay (Protected Structure). Contractors are John Supple Ltd. However, the 2nd phase of the development is in appeal, thanks to ‘you know who’, it involves, the demolition of existing buildings, the construction of 55 no. apartments, incorporating 16 no. 1 bed and 39 no. 2 bed, the reconstruction of the Cork Arts Theatre and Pa Johnsons licensed premises and ancillary site works
along 10 & 11 Devonshire Street, 4 – 7 Knapps Square, Camden Quay.The fact that this 2nd phase has gone to appeal is a great shame, this area is the last remaining negelected site along Camden Quay (which one must agree looks so much more cosmopolitan and impressive as a result of the many major developments here), and the design is in keeping with the area respective of adjacent developments. It would provide a badly needed new Cork Arts Theatre coming into Cork’s year as Capital of Culture and reconstruct Pa Johnson’s famous local bar, which is near ruin. James Leahy and Associates (not always my favourite architectural firm – but who have made a nice effort on this particular development) are the design time for this project. I have to say, it is by far one of Leahy’s better projects. A great pity, which was one of the conditions under which CCC granted the project, was the removal of a 6th floor roof garden, with playground and extensive vegetation and the works – it would have been a superb amenity element to the project for residents. It was conditionally removed on the grounds that it would be a visual impediment to Shandon Bells (don’t ask! – it ticked me off too trying to answer it, I mean, it was a garden – not an additional concrete floor!).
PS. Not forgetting about pics of UCC School of Pharamacy – just having trouble posting them. Will so my best to get them up as soon as I can!Lexington – is that part of Cork facing student accommodation overkill? It seems that end of UCC was bereft for years and suddenly everyone is jumping on the wagon. A student ghetto???
Last time I was in Cork I noticed that work was being done on the Bus Station. Does anyone know exactly what is being done to it?
Thanks
Phil
d_d_dallas
Lexington – is that part of Cork facing student accommodation overkill? It seems that end of UCC was bereft for years and suddenly everyone is jumping on the wagon. A student ghetto???This is a sorta dodgy question. There’s a couple of things you have to realise – the current Cork City Development Plan has strongly emphasised its desire to reclaim city housing for owner-occupiers/families from investor activities related to student accomodation – most of which is centre along the College Road, Connaught Avenue area. Victoria Cross was earmarked as the preferred area for purpose built student accomodation to facilitate the expanding campus which stretches for the ERI on the Lee Road to the Distillery Fields on the North Mall. As the Cork County Hall area is also zoned for high-rise development, and the Section 50 tax designation, developers were approached by UCC who, in line with the development plan, decided to embark on student developments. You have to remember, almost all new student developments – Farranlea Hall, Victoria Lodge, the Spires and the project undertaken by Fleming Construction for the former M&P O’Sullivan Cash & Carry site, currently in appeal, were all undertaken by private developers on behalf of UCC for UCC requirements. Victoria Hall, the Kingsley/Rathmelton Investments development, Cregnane Hall and so on, were undertaken privately. If the development plan succeeds, a satisfactory demand will soak up all these current developments, but as it stands, UCC Accomodations Offices apparently had a hard time filling all these new developments last year. And now that, come this new academic year, bed numbers have doubled, and will triple with Rathmelton Investments and O’Shea Builders developments soon to begin construction. It’s a dodgy development area, but if cards are played right, it may just pay-off. But it’ll be tight. Not every UCC student or family can afford between 3000 and 6000 euros in accommodation every year.
Hey Phil, details of the Bus Station are available in a previous page of this thread – with pictures. It’s nothing to get too excited about. Trust me. More pics available if ya want.Some of the local residents aren’t too happy about it. Didn’t someone run in the European elections on an anti high rise ticket? I went for a run past Victoria Cross a few nights ago. Passed a few local residents standing outside the Victoria Hall site entrance, they were having an animated conversation. Not exactly happy campers!
Cork City FC 2- Nantes Atlantique FC 0
As I figured, Frinailla have been refused planning by ABP w.r.t. their 70m euro, 9-storey development along Watercourse Road in Blackpool. Hopefully Frinailla will revise their development and reapproach Blackpool in the near future.
This is my first post – I stumbled across this forum, and find it very interesting. I have a keen interest in the development of Cork City. There are lots of positive things happening at the moment. Patrick Street looks impressive, but one or two questions – whay are loading bays in operation all day Saturday, up to 6pm? And whay are cars allowed to park there – they make the street look cluttered and untidy. There must be 4 new taxi ranks along Pana, when originally they were to locate to Academy street. Does anyone konw of that cccTV camera on a high pole outside BT (Maylor St side) is going to move??
Fianlly, thanks to Lexington for all the insights – very helpful info.
I just saw the following on the Examiners ‘breaking news’ web-page, looks exactly like Lexington’s recent report!!
*******
Top brand BT2 to open Wilton outlet
24/07/2004 – 15:15:11Designer label store BT2, an offshoot of the popular Brown Thomas, will be drawing fashion-conscious shoppers to Wilton, Cork.
The store is understood to have agreed a lease at Wilton Shopping Centre.
The pricey clothes store features more casual gear than the clothes sold at the main Brown Thomas department store.
Other tenants for the new €20m extension at Wilton Shopping Centre are believed to include clothes stores New Look and Specsavers.
Meanwhile at Mahon Point Shopping Centre, a source has revealed that popular shoe store Schuh is to finalise a lease at the shopping centre.
It has also been revealed that high-street fashion outlets River Island, Mango, Zara and Miss Selfridge have made letting or sale agreements at the 500 million Mahon Point complex.
Already-named tenant stores are French Connection, Next, Principles, Pamela Scott, Easons, Sam McAuley chemists, Tesco, Debenhams and DIY retailers B&Q.
Urban fashion store Topshop has also been linked to the Mahon complex but no papers have yet been signed because of its plans to cut costs.
The shopping centre will also have three restaurants, a food court with six additional food outlets, an 11-screen cineplex and parking for 1,600 cars.
It is believed that Ward Anderson, the largest cinema group in the country, won the multiplex contract over rivals UCI cinemas.
The food court tenants expected to be announced shortly at Mahon are McDonalds, Kentucky Fried Chicken (KFC), Zumo Juice Bars and sandwich outlet Subway.
Meanwhile, shoppers to the west of the city could be buying M&S clothes and household goods locally.
A property source has also revealed that a possible tenant at the new Ballincollig Town Centre could be Marks and Spencer.
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Yes – the report in the Evening Echo, reported by Christina O’Rourke, has a question mark hanging over her ‘property source’. Particular informations supplied in her article are found exclusive to this forum, even the information orders mirror my post. As a consequence, I will investigate the background of the article and be in contact with the aforementioned reporter – and perhaps, based on my reply outcome, the Evening Echo editorial time, plus particular TCM managerial staff. I would hope, that such incidents – if proven to be taken from this forum – will not occur again without prior consent of resepective contributers. I have researched the legal aspects of these acts and they are all supportive of prior consentual initiatives from the primary source before secondary publication regardless of specific word arrangement.
I encourage and willfully supply such information – but within context and based on consent. Media publication of such information at a mass level – jeporadise my ability to provide further, future information – as I am the one who hears all about it at the other end of an angry phone call. If Ms. O’Rourke is found to have adapted such primary source material from this forum and my post for her own benefit, it would paint a poor and unhealthy veil over the reliability and moral conduct of the associated media agency – and may see further announcements of major property developments purposely leaked to other media organisations before that of Ms. O’Rourke’s or other sources within the public domain. I certainly hope that this will not be the case.
The unfortunate thing is, I would gladly inform Ms. O’Rourke of breaking deals and reliable exclusives within the world of Cork’s property market – in conjunction with this forum, if only consent was sought beforehand. What goes on the website and what goes in the press may seem like trivial matters to some – but unfortunately, this is not the view of those involved. As a result, what goes to press must be cautioned and cherry-picked in accordance with associative consequences.
Speaking of Cork generally, is there any sign of the Merchant’s Quay Centre being redeveloped, or even refaced?
That would be a coup, to get a good-looking replacement for one of the most prominent (but awful) buildings in Cork.
Yeah Devin, a 7m euro redevelopment of Merchants Quay SC has already begun and is expected to be complete in time for 2005. However, this redevelopment involves few external alterations and it is unlikely they will be substantial in scale to make the building look in anyway better.
Originally posted by lexington
Hey Phil, details of the Bus Station are available in a previous page of this thread – with pictures. It’s nothing to get too excited about. Trust me. More pics available if ya want. [/B]
Thanks for that. I should have looked more closely through the thread before asking about the bus station.
Thanks
Phil
was in Cork at the weekend and I like what I saw on Patrick’s Street. OK those lights are a bit curious ok, but the paving has a lovely finish. The bins are inadeqaute and I’ve always thought it, Cork must be one of the dirtiest towns in Ireland and last Saturday was no different.
I see they’ve started on Oliver Plunkett street, should be good when it’s finished. Cork seems to be getting its act together but still has a way to go. Most obviously CornMarket street, and those Gaping holes on Washingto Street. Oh and a proper Litter management / flogging for the natives scheme!
Yeah anto, the Patrick’s Street lamps are a topic of some debate, but I think it’s hard to deny the fact, the city centre is looking way better. Oliver Plunkett Street, Grand Parade, Shandon Street, South Mall and soon to be refurbished Cornmarket Street are all going to add to this.
I agree that Cork still has a long way to go, but it’s nice to see that it is on that way. Some major projects are nearing completion, coming on-line and/or are in planning for the city – its really encouraging.
Fears that developments like Mahon Point, Ballincollig Town Centre and the redevelopment of Douglas Village SC would take away from the city centre, are being combat by projects such as the proposed 150m retail development on Academy Street by O’Callaghan Properties, the 60m retail/residential project at Eglinton Street by O’Flynn Construction, the Grand Parade Plaza by Frinailla, Cornmarket Street (Guy & Co. building) development by Rockfell and proposed 30m retail/leisure development at Grand Parade/Washington Street junction (no confirmation as of yet). As a result, there is a major influx of investment into the city centre, as well as suburbs. The Cork city office market is really coming into swing, with Howard Holdings 100m euro City Quarter office development, O’Callaghan Properties lavish 21 Lavitts Quay, O’Flynn Construction’s No.5 and No.6 Lapps Quay, Corbett Bros. Copley Street office development and their other office development at Parnell Place/Beasley Street – as well as other such projects like Howard Holdings office building for Alberts Quay and the new Irish Examiner HQ on Lavitts Quay. In addition – the full potential of the Cork Docklands will be spectacular.
The market is really treating these developments well – and it is a clear sign, as Howard Holdings always say that ‘Cork is on the up!’ If projects like these keep in motion (and there are many more projects yet to come into effect), Cork is truly getting its act together and will act as a major counter-balance.
As for litter, believe it or not, Cork has actually got an awful lot better it’s refuse problems – but I agree, we really need to enforce more stringent laws against the shameful crime. Though I refuse to believe Cork is any worse than places like Dublin and Limerick, it doens’t mean we can slack off in our fight on litter. Cork should be a leading example.
*UPDATES*In addition to Irish Examiner reports today (28th July 2004), I have been informed that Rockfell Investments look set to be grant permission for their major retail and residential development on Cornmarket Street. The development will include a 6-storey building with 7 retail units amounting to 120,000sq ft in retail space over 2 floors, with the remaining floors utilised as 80 apartments (it is likely this figure will be readdressed). The retail units will be configured to satisfy department store needs. A few big names have expressed interest in this development already, but I can’t reveal their identities without offical notice of planning permission grant. (also because some reporter may splash it all over a local tabloid).
The development will revitalise the street, which it badly needs, and which is set to become a new retail and cultural quarter extending off Patrick’s Street (see previous reports).
Originally, Rockfell had applied back in 1999 for a 9-storey, 408 bedroom hotel development with 1300 seat conference centre, leisure centre, superpub, 20 retail units and 172 space double basement car-park on the same site – but it was refused by ABP. This development was a great loss to Cork – probably one of its biggest in recent times – its design and utility would have revitalised the area much sooner and breathe new life into the street on all levels. It’s most recent incarnation is not up to the same scratch as the past proposal I feel, but it would be a positive step nonethless. I just hope ABP don’t have to get involved this time. An equivalent such loss nowadays would be Water Street, who’s decision has been pushed back until September – I just hope the same mistake isn’t made twice.
Architect = Frank Ennis and Assoc.
Developers = Rockfell Investments (headed by Michael O’Donoghue of the O’Donoghue/Ring Hotel Group and Munster Joinery)
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