Dick’s Light bulb climate plan

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    • #709295
      Anonymous
      Participant

      Light bulb levy, higher VRT in climate plan
      Monday, 2 April 2007 16:42
      The Environment Minister, Dick Roche, has announced that a levy is to be placed on incandescent light bulbs and that motorists driving bigger cars will pay more Vehicle Registration Tax.

      Under the Government’s new National Climate Change Strategy, a €15 million public awareness campaign will be launched and a Climate Change Commission will be created to advise the Government.

      Mr Roche said his strategy would ensure that Ireland’s emissions were reduced and that we would abide by the target set out in the Kyoto Protocol.

      AdvertisementUnder the plan, reducing emissions will account for 80% of the Government’s target, while the remaining 20% will come from purchasing carbon credits.

      He said the policy would ensure the country was better positioned to meet the challenge of more ambitious targets which will come at the end of the Protocol’s first phase in 2012.

      The Opposition derided the Government’s strategy ahead of today’s announcement.

      Fine Gael claims that the outgoing coalition has had a death-bed conversion to matters environmental.

      It points to Environmental Protection Agency statistics that show Ireland’s greenhouse gas emissions are twice the level they are supposed to be.

      I had to laugh when Berties big environmental announcement at Ard Fheis on lightbulbs and I thought that given the massive decentralisation programme the failure to specify green cement & concrete was a major indication of the lack of commitment to real environmental pragmatism.

    • #787916
      admin
      Keymaster

      As research shows mercury lightbulbs are only marginally better than old style lightbulbs and present significant disposal headaches

      http://www.reuk.co.uk/Toxic-Mercury-in-CFL-Bulbs.htm

    • #787917
      admin
      Keymaster

      Warning carbon credits could cost €1bn
      From:ireland.com
      Monday, 2nd April, 2007

      The Government’s greenhouse gas policy could cost the taxpayer up to €1 billion over the next five years, according to a leading renewable energy company.

      Under current policy, the State intends buying carbon credits from Russia and eastern Europe instead of cutting emissions.
      Carbon credits are “licences” traded between countries and organisations. Under the Kyoto and Marrakesh treaties, countries or groups with low or falling emissions can sell credits to those with high emission levels. They allow the purchaser to continue producing high levels of greenhouse gases.

      In the Republic’s case, the State is buying credits from eastern Europe and Russia because the numbers of industries in those countries have fallen over the last 20 years, which means they have had a related fall in greenhouse gas emissions.

      However, Mark Ennis, Airtricity’s chief executive of supply in Ireland, warned at the weekend that the Government has underestimated both the price of credits on the open market and the rate at which the Republic’s greenhouse gas emissions are going to increase.
      “If you take Ireland’s projected growth rate between now and 2020, we’re going to generate 33 million tonnes [of greenhouse gas] above our 1990 levels.

      “At the same time, the projected price of carbon credits is likely to be €15 to €20 per tonne in 2008; that’s projected to rise to €38 by 2012, and it’s reasonable to assume that it will be €40 to €50 by 2020.

      “The Government’s figures are showing that this will cost €270 million over the next five years. They’ve underestimated the quantity and the price. It’s going to be at least €500 million and it could go up to €1 billion.”

      Airtricity’s group chief executive Eddie O’Connor also warned yesterday that the final bill for carbon credits could be as high as €1.5 billion by 2020, a little more than €115 million a year.

      “It is inexplicable why the Government would contemplate purchasing licences to pollute from Russia,” Mr O’Connor said .

      “They say that the cost will be €270 million. The cost is more likely to be €1 billion to €1.5 billion, all taxpayer money.”

      He added that this would be enough to build wind farms with the capacity to generate 3,000 megawatts of electricity, over half the State’s current needs.

      Mr Ennis said the policy of purchasing carbon credits would not reduce greenhouse gas emissions as the countries from which the State was purchasing them have already had their carbon output cut by the closure of many of their industries.

      The Airtricity executives said the Republic should be taking the lead in investing in renewable energy and in developing interconnection.

      Mr Ennis said while the company was involved in developing wind-generation projects, it favoured support for all types of renewable electricity generation.

      “We’ve missed an opportunity in this country. The Government declared a moratorium on all offshore wind projects in 2003, and no new projects have been connected up to the grid since then.”

      All other European countries with a coastlines were “falling over themselves” to get offshore wind generation off the ground.

      The recent Government White Paper on energy includes a commitment to have one-third of all energy needs met from renewable sources by 2020. Mr Ennis described this as an aspiration.

      “They have no chance of delivering on that with no investment in green energy and interconnection.”

      He said to meet this target Eirgrid (which manages the national electricity grid) and the Commission for Energy Regulation needed to join forces with the industry and focus on developing renewable energy infrastructure

      .

      Seems everyone except Dick is having a lightbulb moment picking holes in his hilarious attempts to formulate a plan to meet our finincially onerous commitments to the Kyoto protocol which is actually in fact not a three legged donky running in todays in the 320 at Punchestown but an international treaty which will cost the taxpayer billions if Dick keeps ignoring it.

    • #787918
      admin
      Keymaster

      Greens to make ‘major’ announcement
      From:ireland.com
      Thursday, 5th April, 2007

      The Green Party will today make a major policy announcement on climate change “with implications for the entire political system”.

      The party is to make the announcement at the gates of the Dail this morning after a photoshoot featuring an endangered polar bear.

      Party leader Trevor Sargent, environment spokesman Ciaran Cuffe and energy and transport spokesman Eamon Ryan will be on hand to make the announcement.

      The event is timed to coincide with the publication of the second of three major reports by the UN’s Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) today.

      Sounds interesting

    • #787919
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      As much as I hate Dick Roche and find him to be the very epitome of a crass Irish politician who stands for nothing except getting re-elected, I do support this general “softly-softly” disregard for the Climate Change Hype which Hollywood is foisting upon us all. There is no proof that climate change is man made. Until we have objective hard facts that humans are the cause, or indeed that there is real Global Warming happening and it is indeed because of Human Co2 emissions, and we are not just coming out of a cooling phase then I would be the same mind as this Government.

      As for the Greens, I cannot vote for a group who promotes something as ethical and sound as getting off Middle East oil and then claims that Nuclear is not an option. Perhaps we can power the Irish grid by holding Trevor Sargent up to the sky and tapping into the smugness he radiates constantly.

      Did anybody see the recent episode of Grand Design were these two social workers who wanted to save the planet and who tried to make a houseboat from recycled stuff off ebay with the little stupid windmill on the roof, compost toilet of course and whole project ended up high and dry. Completely summed up this whole trendy Green Lifestyle for the sad and often comical reality it is. There really were The Modern Parent’s from Viz.

      I suspect this whole Global Warming stuff will be over and done with in a couple of years anyways and we’ll be back to a new ice age, or whatever the next scare-mongering among the Dalkey chattering classes will be.

    • #787920
      admin
      Keymaster

      I think you are in a very small minority who are in denial that climate change exists. I do acknowledge its existence and concur with the vast majority of scinetists with the principle that whatever goes up must come down. Unfortunately in this case it tends to come down in some of the Worlds poorest regions and destroy the very little infrastructure they have. It is only since the problem started to affect America that Hollywood has taken much of an interest in this at all.

      In relation to Nuclear Power it is inevitable that non-carbon intensive sources of power will have to increase very soon and at some point that may involve atomic energy but at this point in time it is far from proven to be the most cost effective option in the long term when the 10 year construction period, generation, distribution and disposal costs are taken into account. Personally I would prefer to live beside a nuclear power plant than Moneypoint but hey 10 years later after its conversion was first mooted by the Green Party its still burning coal because when it comes to the environment this government is great at soundbites and has no will to take action.

      My real problems with Dick’s plan are that as opposed to cutting carbon we are buying credits this (a) does nothing to reduce emmissions and (b) if you don’t believe in climate change you should be livid that €1bn of taxpayers money is going to be given away when clean alternatives costing nothing exist.

      The only thing that this plan acheives is that all those who saved on SSIA’s with the idea of buying a new motor will give Dick not only their SSIA free money and interest but also now a larger chunk of the principal invested as well. There is nothing free from this government

    • #787921
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      Irish solution to Irish problem.

      Problem – CO2 emissions of a country are too high.

      Logical solution – Lower CO2 emissions.
      Irish solution – Buy the ability to not lower CO2 emissions, wasting money and hiding under a bush.

    • #787922
      admin
      Keymaster

      Greens call for cross-party climate strategy
      From:ireland.com
      Thursday, 5th April, 2007

      The Green Party today urged a cross-party approach to a commitment to reducing the State’s carbon emissions by three per cent annually over the next ten years in order to tackle climate change.

      Speaking the day before top UN scientists release a report on the impacts of global climate change, Green Party leader Trevor Sargent said it was now time for action.

      He called on other political parties to resist the temptation for point scoring and said that a cross-party approach was essential because “this, for us, is the biggest challenge that this country has ever faced.”

      Energy spokesman Eamon Ryan TD added: “Fianna Fáil are assuming that we will only have to reduce our emissions by two per cent below 1990 levels by 2020 rather than the 30 per cent overall reduction that the EU is committing to.”

      He described the National Climate Change Strategy as “atrocious” and said the claim that Fianna Fáil would have a sustainable transport policy by the end of next year as “a sham” and “a fraud”.

      Mr Ryan also criticised Fine Gael saying that although they have are calling on the Government to set climate change targets “they have failed to set any such targets for an alternative government.”

      The Labour Party were also criticised by Mr Ryan for giving no indication as to how they will achieve its pledge of 20 per cent reduction in climate change emissions by 2020.

      Green Party environment spokesman Ciarán Cuffe committed a future Green government to a target of reducing climate change emissions to 20 per cent below 1990 levels by 2020.

      “We aim for this on the understanding that there will be international co-operation on the issue of climate change; that the European Union will be working towards the 30 per cent reduction, which scientists say is needed; and that we will have a slight derogation on that target due to our lower than average 1990 figure.”

      He went on to say the Greens would oblige the Minister of Finance to balance the carbon account in his annual budget in exactly the same the financial books are balanced.

      Mr Sargent said any future government that involved the Green Party would have to commit to three per cent reduction in climate change emissions per year but that they were open to negotiation as to how that was achieved.

      I wonder how much the 30% reduction will cost in carbon credits?

    • #787923
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      @PVC King wrote:

      I think you are in a very small minority who are in denial that climate change exists.

      That’s not what I stated. Climate Change is very real. The ice core samples from the polar regions back this up beyond doubt. It is the cause of this change which still has to be verified. The earth is getting warming compared to how it was in the 1970’s. So is Mars, Venus and the Moon. This would suggest the Sun is the cause and not Green House gases. Until we have conclusive proof of humans being the cause, then we must thread carefully until all the facts are known.

      @PVC King wrote:

      I do acknowledge its existence and concur with the vast majority of scinetists with the principle that whatever goes up must come down. Unfortunately in this case it tends to come down in some of the Worlds poorest regions and destroy the very little infrastructure they have. It is only since the problem started to affect America that Hollywood has taken much of an interest in this at all.

      I have to wonder if indeed the vast majority of scientist around the world do fully accept that climate change is man made? The ones I know personally are very “iffy” about it all and some are very cynical about much of the so called evidence. This ‘Man-Made Global Warming as fact’ is really only the case in the English speaking world and even in countries such as Canada the split is very much 50/50 among scientists.

      This is a saga which has far form played itself out. Hollywood and mass media have taken an interest in this because sensationalism and scare-mongering sells. However, this is not science. What it is – is a golden oppertunity for Governments to tax the tits off us so politicians can claim their are on mystical quest to save the planet and it is somehow our moral duty to pay up. Even Bush has seen the potential to raise more revenue via taxation on Green House gases.

      @PVC King wrote:

      In relation to Nuclear Power it is inevitable that non-carbon intensive sources of power will have to increase very soon and at some point that may involve atomic energy but at this point in time it is far from proven to be the most cost effective option in the long term when the 10 year construction period, generation, distribution and disposal costs are taken into account. Personally I would prefer to live beside a nuclear power plant than Moneypoint but hey 10 years later after its conversion was first mooted by the Green Party its still burning coal because when it comes to the environment this government is great at soundbites and has no will to take action.

      That’s fair enough and you are bang on there. I wish the Green Party would think more along this line and I might vote for them. But their stance on Nuclear is irrational and out of step with Green parties all over Europe.

      @PVC King wrote:

      My real problems with Dick’s plan are that as opposed to cutting carbon we are buying credits this (a) does nothing to reduce emmissions and (b) if you don’t believe in climate change you should be livid that €1bn of taxpayers money is going to be given away when clean alternatives costing nothing exist.

      The only thing that this plan acheives is that all those who saved on SSIA’s with the idea of buying a new motor will give Dick not only their SSIA free money and interest but also now a larger chunk of the principal invested as well. There is nothing free from this government

      Can’t argue with you there. This Carbon Credits stuff reminds me very much of royalty in the past times buying off their indulgences from the Pope to forgive then their sins.

      Just because I am not convinvced that Human C02 emissions are the cause of Global Warming does not mean we should not strive for an good environmental and energy effcient society here in Ireland.

      But I would rather see the Government (and the Green lobby as a whole) take steps such as arrest farmers who pour their shit and piss into municipal drinking water supplies and prosecute them fully under the law, rather than have us all on this taxation-happy mystical quest to save the Earth.

      We have real and very tangible environmental problems here in Ireland which have nothing to do with Carbon Footprints or Al Gore’s next presidential bid and everything to do appalling lack of civic responsibility among vast elements of our population both urban and rural.

    • #787924
      admin
      Keymaster

      I don’t go for the sun heating argument as it is usually followed by the Vinyards in Gloustershire and Tobbacco farms in Kent 17th Century speil. The sun may in fact be heating up but to expect that the sun which is billions of years old is heating up at the same rate of the earth is now doesn’t work for me. The sun probably is heating up but at a much slower rate. What is happening is that the atmosphere is becoming more opaque which is directly intensifying the effects of the sun which is leading to melting icecaps at the poles and higher rainfall in the tropics due to higher sea evaporation rates.

      The simple solution is to reduce the sources of atmospheric gases before climatic effects intensify any further; I don’t subscribe to the doomsday scenario of a lunar earth but if current trends are carried on for another 25 years there will be serious problems.

      I totally agree about the problems of pollution at home; no other country in the EU 15 has such a prevelance of illegal dumps or would permit a City lose its drinking water supplies in unexplained circumstances. Nor would it allow wholesale development of one off houses serviced only by septic tanks. Ironically it is the development pattern and not the power situation that will tip Ireland into real trouble with Climate change targets.

    • #787925
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      The notion that the sun is the cause of global warming, melting of the polar ice caps etc, is genius!

      Now we can just go on our merry way – consume consume spend spend, and our economies thunder on. making a small amount of people very rich.
      Who benefits? We all know, The oil companies, giant corporations, who in part control most of the worlds media
      If they can just muddy the debate , it will sew seeds of doubt in peoples minds. Its classic dirty politics

      Its not surprising that i read in the NY post about how global warming is a myth, a paper owned by Rupert Murdoch’s News Corporation with Fox News nothing more than a mouthpiece for the bush agenda
      It just seems that its always the big business funded research that comes to these conclusions

      Maybe Al Gore is exaggerating and by God i hope he is! but we really cant ‘carry on regardless’ with the slash and burn tactics of the past 100 odd years

    • #787926
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      @paul h wrote:

      Maybe Al Gore is exaggerating and by God i hope he is! but we really cant ‘carry on regardless’ with the slash and burn tactics of the past 100 odd years

      You forgot to add “Repent You Heretics!!!!!!” at the end of your cliche-ridden sermon.

      One aspect of this which fascinates me, with this whole Man-Made Global Warming religion, is the class element. Have you noticed that this concern is almost exclusively middle class? There is a good reason for this – everyone else has twigged that it is actually a method of restricting working class access to privileges the middle classes and above have enjoyed for years. There are a lot of people in places like Dalkey and Foxrock who are simply sickened to see that the celtic tiger has allowed people in Finglas and Ballymun to buy nice cars, go on foreign holidays and general become middle class in all but name through their own industry rather than via accidents of birth.

      Have you noticed how, when it was only the middle classes that drove big cars and jetted off to exotic locations, Man-Made Global Warming was not a problem? But now that the Skangers can do it…. well, we have to Save The Planet!

    • #787927
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      @Cute Panda wrote:

      Have you noticed how, when it was only the middle classes that drove big cars and jetted off to exotic locations, Man-Made Global Warming was not a problem? But now that the Skangers can do it…. well, we have to Save The Planet!

      That is beyond ridiculous:confused:
      I come a long way from foxrock or Dalkey, believe me! I just happen to put faith in what most of what the worlds most respected scientists have to say.
      You really in this age, have to ask ,where do you get your information from
      I think living in New York City has given me a perspective that i would not have had living at home

      Who would you trust, scientists who by and large do not have anthing to gain or a corporate entity whose sole purpose is to make as much money as possible
      I wont even go into how maybe globalisation and other factors have started to lift a lot of former poor countries out of poverty with massive industrialisation occuring accross asia and elsewhere

    • #787928
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      @paul h wrote:

      That is beyond ridiculous:confused:
      I come a long way from foxrock or Dalkey, believe me!

      You know, reading my post back perhaps you are correct. It was indeed ridiculous of me to limit this Climate Snobbery just to holding back the Irish working classes when it applies far more to the entire Third World. As Al Gore and his followers tell us, large areas of the third world are in danger of ‘developing’ and in the “Man-Made GW” scheme-of-things dictates that they too should ‘know their place’ and stick their traditional, useful role of innocent, exploited man. Forget about industry, commerce and then healthcare, education and wealth. Remain rustic and impoverished. Might save the Polar Bears you know…

      @paul h wrote:

      I think living in New York City has given me a perspective that i would not have had living at home

      Are you sure you just haven’t just been caught up in this unique American desire to hurry up the Rapture?

      Americans, be they liberal or conservative are utterly intoxicated with the end of the world and inventing new ways to hurry it up – the global-warmers believe the world as we know it IS GOING TO END. I say this as someone who lived in New York (and Atlanta) myself for over a decade and all during that time was constantly amazed at even educated Americans acting like an extra 2 cents on the price of gasoline was proof that Saint Paul’s visions were about to come true. The endless media hype and scare stories in the US can really make one lose all sense of reality.

      Al Gore’s true believers form the latest installment of that long line of the ‘Gloom Club’. Stretching back through history, these disgruntled folks who have always held a negative veiw of man’s interaction with the world, of man’s wonderfully creative use of the world’s resources and of man’s inherent need to ‘develop’. As usual, the threats are the same: “End the world – or the World ends!” And, as usual, the Gloom Club are privy to indesputable ‘proof’ from stern, wise old men that their prophecy will come to pass in the future they can see.

      You can always tell a member of the Gloom Club from the things they say. It’s fairly transparent that if their wise old men (here it’s the Scientists, in other versions of the same story it’s the Bishops or the Mullahs etc etc) popped up tomorrow and said they’ve made a BIG MISTAKE and the world is just fine as it is – these End-of-the Worlders would feel distinctly put-out and quickly regroup around some new fad which once again will definitely, indisputably, imminently bring Armageddon on us all.

      Forget this mystical quest to save the planet based on the very subjective findings of SOME scientists and deal with the real issues Ireland has now. Cleaning the place up and stopping farmers from pouring their shit and piss into drinking water. Stop avoiding the real enviornmental issues by trying to look enlighted by saving Polar Bears. I don’t not care about Polar Bears – I care about people in Galway not drinking famer’s shit and piss whenever they turn on the tap.

      Stop unconditionally buying into this unproven hysteria of Man Made Global Warming until will have the facts and absolute proof that humans are causing Global Warming, when it’s still all subjected at best and outright wild speculation at worst. Study all the facts for yourself and not depending on some pointy faced nerd on TV telling you to switch off your mobile phone chargers, or turn down the volune on our i-Pods in order to save Polar Bears. Deal with real environmental issues for god’s sake…one-off houses…polluted drinking water…badly insulated homes…people commuting vast distances in cars because of stroke politics. Polar Bears do not matter. Irish human beings and their quality of life matter.

      The reason I do not subscribe to Man Made Global Warming is a) Al Gore is a oppertunist, hypocritical, intolerant lunatic talking crap and b) CLIMATE CHANGE IS COMPLETELY NORMAL AND NATURAL.

      Since the last “Little Ice Age” ended, the current “Global Warming” trend has been occurring for the last 150+ years. It was not triggered by Big Oil Companies. It was not triggered by selfish American Soccer Moms driving SUV’s. It was not triggered by Coal Fire Power Plants.

      It’s called “Climate Change” and it happens all the time. It never stops. Just look up to the sky in the daytime.
      See that Big Yellow Ball up there? That’s called The Sun. Are the Global Warming alarmists going to try to tell us that The Sun is inconsequential to this whole debate? Yes they are. Because, in their mind, Man is inherently evil. More than that, Man is the root of all evil.

      When temperatures dropped between about 1940 and 1980 it was “The Coming Ice Age”. That was also being blamed on man. Temperatures over the last few thousand years have been both a whole lot hotter and a whole lot colder than they are today. And you know what? Over the next few thousand years the temperatures are going to also be a whole lot hotter and a whole lot colder than they are today.

      It’s called “Climate Change”.


      Save Galway’s Drinking Water – Polar Bears can Get Stuffed IMHO.

    • #787929
      admin
      Keymaster

      As always very personal and unique arguments on this forum. Unfortunately these arguments fly in the face of accepted scientific consensus of bodies such as OECD and the UN and companies as diverse as Swiss RE and BP whose new corporate brand is ‘Beyond Petrolium’

      What sticks in my craw most is that the current government goes to Brussels, acknowledges the problem and signs the country up for. 30% cut in emmisions as at 1990 and then basis their entire strategy on taxing SUVs, light bulbs and purchasing carbon credits from compliant states such as Russia and Slovakia.

      My boss drives a Range Rover he has four teenage children all over 6 feet tall they play a lot of sports including canoeing. However someone commuting from Virginia from a one off house in a Micra produces a lot more C02 as my boss and 3 of his children use public transport whilst his wife and daughter walk their daily commute.
      Despite this they get hammered in ‘publicity stunt’ ‘gesture politics’ moves which the PR consultancies get millions to make semi-compliant people feel guilty.

      The real causes are settlement patterns a la the parish pump and the unwillingness to plan sustainable transport networks. Golden opportunities such as the Decentralisation auction have been an abysmal failure and torpedoed the spatial strategy. Instead of making Cork, Galway and Limerick viable settlements 52 sites many in the Dublin commuter belt were chosen in such small lot sizes that no critical mass has been given anywhere.

      This will hurt big time in future years

    • #787930
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      The Professor of Meteorology at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology says there is no such thing as optimal temp.

      http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17997788/site/newsweek/

      April 16, 2007 issue – Judging from the media in recent months, the debate over global warming is now over. There has been a net warming of the earth over the last century and a half, and our greenhouse gas emissions are contributing at some level. Both of these statements are almost certainly true. What of it? Recently many people have said that the earth is facing a crisis requiring urgent action. This statement has nothing to do with science. There is no compelling evidence that the warming trend we’ve seen will amount to anything close to catastrophe. What most commentators—and many scientists—seem to miss is that the only thing we can say with certainly about climate is that it changes. The earth is always warming or cooling by as much as a few tenths of a degree a year; periods of constant average temperatures are rare. Looking back on the earth’s climate history, it’s apparent that there’s no such thing as an optimal temperature—a climate at which everything is just right. The current alarm rests on the false assumption not only that we live in a perfect world, temperature wise, but also that our warming forecasts for the year 2040 are somehow more reliable than the weatherman’s forecast for next week.

      A warmer climate could prove to be more beneficial than the one we have now. Much of the alarm over climate change is based on ignorance of what is normal for weather and climate. There is no evidence, for instance, that extreme weather events are increasing in any systematic way, according to scientists at the U.S. National Hurricane Center, the World Meteorological Organization and the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (which released the second part of this year’s report earlier this month). Indeed, meteorological theory holds that, outside the tropics, weather in a warming world should be less variable, which might be a good thing.

      In many other respects, the ill effects of warming are overblown. Sea levels, for example, have been increasing since the end of the last ice age. When you look at recent centuries in perspective, ignoring short-term fluctuations, the rate of sea-level rise has been relatively uniform (less than a couple of millimeters a year). There’s even some evidence that the rate was higher in the first half of the twentieth century than in the second half. Overall, the risk of sea-level rise from global warming is less at almost any given location than that from other causes, such as tectonic motions of the earth’s surface.

      Many of the most alarming studies rely on long-range predictions using inherently untrustworthy climate models, similar to those that cannot accurately forecast the weather a week from now. Interpretations of these studies rarely consider that the impact of carbon on temperature goes down—not up—the more carbon accumulates in the atmosphere. Even if emissions were the sole cause of the recent temperature rise—a dubious proposition—future increases wouldn’t be as steep as the climb in emissions.

      Indeed, one overlooked mystery is why temperatures are not already higher. Various models predict that a doubling of CO2 in the atmosphere will raise the world’s average temperature by as little as 1.5 degrees Celsius or as much as 4.5 degrees. The important thing about doubled CO2 (or any other greenhouse gas) is its “forcing”—its contribution to warming. At present, the greenhouse forcing is already about three-quarters of what one would get from a doubling of CO2. But average temperatures rose only about 0.6 degrees since the beginning of the industrial era, and the change hasn’t been uniform—warming has largely occurred during the periods from 1919 to 1940 and from 1976 to 1998, with cooling in between. Researchers have been unable to explain this discrepancy.

      Modelers claim to have simulated the warming and cooling that occurred before 1976 by choosing among various guesses as to what effect poorly observed volcanoes and unmeasured output from the sun have had. These factors, they claim, don’t explain the warming of about 0.4 degrees C between 1976 and 1998. Climate modelers assume the cause must be greenhouse-gas emissions because they have no other explanation. This is a poor substitute for evidence, and simulation hardly constitutes explanation. Ten years ago climate modelers also couldn’t account for the warming that occurred from about 1050 to 1300. They tried to expunge the medieval warm period from the observational record—an effort that is now generally discredited. The models have also severely underestimated short-term variability El Niño and the Intraseasonal Oscillation. Such phenomena illustrate the ability of the complex and turbulent climate system to vary significantly with no external cause whatever, and to do so over many years, even centuries.

      Is there any point in pretending that CO2 increases will be catastrophic? Or could they be modest and on balance beneficial? India has warmed during the second half of the 20th century, and agricultural output has increased greatly. Infectious diseases like malaria are a matter not so much of temperature as poverty and public-health policies (like eliminating DDT). Exposure to cold is generally found to be both more dangerous and less comfortable.

      Moreover, actions taken thus far to reduce emissions have already had negative consequences without improving our ability to adapt to climate change. An emphasis on ethanol, for instance, has led to angry protests against corn-price increases in Mexico, and forest clearing and habitat destruction in Southeast Asia. Carbon caps are likely to lead to increased prices, as well as corruption associated with permit trading. (Enron was a leading lobbyist for Kyoto because it had hoped to capitalize on emissions trading.) The alleged solutions have more potential for catastrophe than the putative problem. The conclusion of the late climate scientist Roger Revelle—Al Gore’s supposed mentor—is worth pondering: the evidence for global warming thus far doesn’t warrant any action unless it is justifiable on grounds that have nothing to do with climate.

      Lindzen is the Alfred P. Sloan Professor of Meteorology at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. His research has always been funded exclusively by the U.S. government. He receives no funding from any energy companies.
      © 2007 Newsweek, Inc.

    • #787931
      admin
      Keymaster

      http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/03/17/60minutes/main1415985.shtml

      http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/world/archives/2007/04/03/2003355067

      http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/story?id=942506&page=1

      http://news.bostonherald.com/international/europe/view.bg?articleid=193313

      As stated before it is the pace of change that is at issue and it is a lot easier to trust the above as even the Fox media Poll below predicts

      http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,175070,00.html

      And there is consensus amongst the majority of scientists as per below

      http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/full/306/5702/1686

      http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A26065-2004Dec25.html

      But then we have our climate change arrest plan:

      A few cent on chinese lightbulbs a few extra grand on a car to get the SSIA money back; but don’t look at your lifestyle build a house in the middle of nowhere; locate government jobs in places where there is no sustainable transport choice. Ban offshore wind electricity, buy carbon credits with taxpayers money.

    • #787932
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      The way I see it is that we should all try to tread lighter on the planet in any case, whether climate change is being caused by humans or not (Anthropogenic is the posh word on it).

      I try to do so, turning off lights after leaving rooms, walking to and from school, recycling, re-using where feasible etc.

      In this way of reducing our environmental impact if climate change does come and bite us we can say: “At least we did something, it must have been the Sun which caused this”

      If it doesn’t happen, then we can say “Great, we’ve averted climate change, lets colonise space”

    • #787933
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      anyone see the new FF election posters?

      here’s one I made earlier

    • #787934
      admin
      Keymaster

      Morlan any chance of doing a bit of your photoshop magic on the above?

      Scandal-hit hotelier puts another politician in picture
      From The Irish IndependentMonday, 23rd April, 2007
      HE landed Taoiseach Bertie Ahern in hot water with his last photo opportunity.

      But controversial hotelier Louis Moriarty was back shaking hands with politicians in Kerry yesterday.

      Mr Moriarty, who has appeared in court on charges of illegal dumping in Co Wicklow, caused a furore when he was photographed beside a beaming Bertie in hard hats during the construction of his new hotel last summer.

      Now that the plush €20m Sneem Hotel is open, he managed to lure another high-ranking politician for a handshake in front of the camera lens. The tightlipped smile, more a grimace, on the face of Arts, Sports and Tourism Minister John O’Donoghue told it all. He was probably bracing himself for the flak that was flying his way.

      Mr Moriarty has pleaded guilty to an offence related to illegal dumping at Whitestown, Co Wicklow, and is awaiting sentencing. It was the country’s biggest instance of illegal dumping.

      His former business, Dublin Waste, was also ordered by the High Court to clean up hazardous waste at an illegal dump in Co Wicklow.

      At the time of the photograph with the Taoiseach, Mr Moriarty was the subject of High Court enforcement proceedings by the EPA to have his waste operations, in Sheriff Street, shut down.

    • #787935
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      Cowboys Again

    • #787936
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      The Sneem hotel has two major issues to overcome – it has a dodgy water supply and it has a sewage issue…. what to do with the stuff. Sneem has no treatment plant and, although one is planned to cater for the 100+ houses planned for the town, the proposed location is covered by water at spring tides. Hopefully the planners (if there are any in Kerry) will know that the sea rises up and down………
      KB

    • #787937
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      @KerryBog2 wrote:

      The Sneem hotel has two major issues to overcome – it has a dodgy water supply and it has a sewage issue…. what to do with the stuff. Sneem has no treatment plant and, although one is planned to cater for the 100+ houses planned for the town, the proposed location is covered by water at spring tides. Hopefully the planners (if there are any in Kerry) will know that the sea rises up and down………
      KB

      Do you mean that the hotel (which is open according to the previous post) has no sewerage system?

      Surely not?

      And – even for Kerry (God help us !) they cannot be proposing a treatment plant below the high spring water mark?

      Doesn’t add up (not even in the Land call HonnaleeRea).:confused:

      BTW – I hear that they are suffering from a very high turnover of planners – anyone know if this is true?

    • #787938
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      No wonder they keep getting sacked if they keep putting new developments in the sea 😀

    • #787939
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      I was in Sneem at Easter visiting friends… apparently staff are recruited for the hotel, but supply of drinking water is a problem and the sewage will have to go into storage tanks for eventual pump-out.
      Permission was granted, upheld on appeal to An BP. Local belief is that it got through (a) because raw sewage is flowing into river at present, (b) it succeeded on “data” rather than muddy feet, where anyone could see from the jetsam where the real HWL is.
      No work started (at that time) on the treatment plant, which is located on the opposite side of the river to the hotel. Planning for about 200 houses around the village has been granted, work is underway on several developments already. For an elevation, see page 17 of applic. 052567 on Kerry CoCo website ……
      (Shur it will be all right, isn’t the pumpin station outa the tide up next to the kids playground on the old pitch n’ putt? We can pack in a bit of hardcore to raise up the level, and the top of the tanks will be above the tide annyway, and shur wouldn’t the sthuff float away on the tide if there was a biteen of a flood? )
      KB2

    • #787940
      admin
      Keymaster

      FF publishes environmental proposals
      Wednesday, 25 April 2007 17:00
      Fianna Fáil has launched its environment manifesto promising it will deliver drinking water that is fully compliant with EU standards and denying it cannot be trusted following the contamination problems in Galway.

      The party has rejected suggestions that greenhouse gas emissions should be reduced by 3% each year, but this stance has been criticised by the Opposition.

      There were four ministers on hand to impress on the electorate that Fianna Fáil has coordinated environment policies to deliver sustainable economic development.

      AdvertisementA promise was made to deliver public and group water supplies that are 100% compliant with drinking water standards.

      The party says it is getting on top of the problems in Galway and Ennis and will also ensure that tougher fines and harsher sentences are imposed on those who flout the law and put the public at risk.

      On waste, Fianna Fáil is promising only 10% of rubbish will end up in landfill, but given two incinerators are tied-up in the courts, this could be a hard one to deliver.

      On climate change, the Minister for Environment, Dick Roche, said there was a green energy revolution around the corner but dismissed suggestions from a new coalition involving Concern and Trócaire that emissions should be reduced by 3% each year.

      Opposition parties were scathing in their criticism of Fianna Fáil, its environmental record and the Minister, and said it will be up to the electorate to decide on who they believe.

      Labour said the policy published today was a list of all the things Fianna Fáil has failed to do over the last ten years.

      The Green Party believe the manifesto is nothing more than a shallow attempt to gloss over the party’s huge failings.

      Fine Gael said the policies were more false promises from the least green Government in history.

      We must be the only country in Europe where an ‘Environmental Policy’ opens with a denial on water quality but mind you with a Taioseach & ministers photographed with convicted illegal dumpers opening hotels in the sea…………….

      We elected them

    • #787941
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      PVC K ,
      You’e confusing the proposed Sneem sewage works and the Sneem Hotel. The latter is well above HWL, and even in the event of global warming, its design is such that it would float;)
      KB2

    • #787942
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      @PVC King wrote:

      We must be the only country in Europe where an ‘Environmental Policy’ opens with a denial on water quality but mind you with a Taioseach & ministers photographed with convicted illegal dumpers opening hotels in the sea…………….

      We elected them

      We must be the only country in Europe in which after a huge economic boom, the water supply for a major city is served by a lake into which untreated sewage flows from thousands of homes and broken treatment plants.

    • #787943
      admin
      Keymaster

      Any images KB2?

      Agree Chris and it looks like Galway is far from alone:

      Parasite threat to Ireland’s water supply
      Thursday, 26 April 2007 17:32
      One fifth of the country’s drinking water supplies are at ‘high risk’ or ‘very high risk’ of contamination from Cryptosporidium.

      Figures obtained by the RTÉ Radio Investigative Unit show that in 2005 the bug, which has contaminated Galway’s water supply, threatened over a fifth of the country’s drinking water.

      With the exception of the town of Ennis, Co Clare’s water is at least risk of contamination.

      AdvertisementNeighbouring Galway, however, is exposed to the greatest risk of cryptosporidiosis and not just at the Terryland plant in Galway city, 19 other drinking water extraction points in the county were judged to be at ‘very high risk’.

      Co Waterford and Co Cork scored very well. Individual water sources in Longford, Carlow, Kilkenny, Donegal, Leitrim, north Tipperary and Roscommon were found to be at very high risk.

      In total, 75 drinking water extraction points around the country were assessed as being at high or very high risk of contamination from the potentially fatal bug.

      The assessment, however, is not complete as 14 county or city councils would appear not to have conducted risk assessments.

      Or in the case of the Minister for Environment’s own constituency of Wicklow, the risk assessment has been conducted but the figures were not passed on to the EPA.

      Were figures from the remaining 41% of water supplies not assessed to be added, the real figure may be much higher than 20%.

      From tomorrow the EPA has the power to compel local authorities to conduct these risk assessments.

    • #787944
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      @PVC King wrote:

      Any images KB2?

      It’s not yet open so I have none; it is hidden from th emain road and I’ve seen it from the sea and did not have a telephoto. It’s opening next month I believe; will report then. KB2

    • #787945
      admin
      Keymaster

      KB have you been home at all recently?

      Ireland ‘EU leader’ in waste – Greens
      From ireland.com16:53Thursday, 17th May, 2007
      Ireland is now “European leader” in creating waste, dumping it in landfills and exporting it abroad, the Green Party said today.

      Publishing its 10 steps to clean up the environment, the party said it would, in government, open more recycling centres with work-friendly hours, offer recycling incentives and tackle illegal dumping.

      Speaking in Blessington, Co Wicklow, Green Party leader Trevor Sargent said the ‘Garden County’ had been “the dumping ground of Ireland” for too long.

      “This Government has refused to tackle Ireland’s waste problem and latest waste figures show that that we are now European leaders in creating waste, dumping it in landfills, and exporting it abroad.

      “While recycling rates have grown, much of that waste is transported out of the country to be dealt with elsewhere. We need to address the problem from home, reduce packaging and waste levels and ensure easier and better access to recycling facilities here,” Mr Sargent said.

      The Green Party said it would tackle illegal dumping by strengthening the Environmental Protection Agency and the Office of Environmental Enforcement and bring in strict regulation of private waste operators.

      Mr Sargent was visiting the Poulaphouca reservoir in Blessington, which provides drinking water to over a million homes in Dublin.

      He said the reservoir has an unexcavated illegal dump just 25 yards from the water’s edge.

      Green Party waste management spokeswoman councillor Deirdre de Burca said that from “overnight privatisation” of waste services in Wicklow in 2000, to the discovery of a large network of illegal dumps in 2001, the county had become synonymous with the kind of waste problems that also affect other parts of the country.

      The Green Party’s 10 steps include the establishment of a new semi-State recycling company to ensure materials are recycled in Ireland rather than exported abroad.

      It said it would introduce deposit refund schemes for drinking containers and also abolish flat rates on waste disposal and introduce a nationally system of weight-related charges for waste collection.

      The party said it would also provide brown bins for organic waste to every household within the next term of Government.

    • #787946
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      I know it’s going back a bit but I’m only browsing this thread now it’s popped to the top again.

      In answer to the earlier climate denial drivel from Cute Panda guoting a Prof. Lindzen of MIT, this from my favourite website:

      “Ross Gelbspan, journalist and author, wrote a 1995 article in Harper’s Magazine which was very critical of Lindzen and other global warming skeptics. In the article, Gelbspan reports Lindzen charged “oil and coal interests $2,500 a day for his consulting services; [and] his 1991 trip to testify before a Senate committee was paid for by Western Fuels and a speech he wrote, entitled ‘Global Warming: the Origin and Nature of Alleged Scientific Consensus,’ was underwritten by OPEC.” [3] “

      More on Lindzen at http://www.sourcewatch.org.

      Global warming denial seems to be quite well networked, so while there check out Prof. Michaels at University of Virgina – he’s a peach! – and LM Group in the UK (have seen them at a couple of conferences and they never cease to entertain with their spectacular right-wing attacks on environmentalists).

      Of course once we’re past global warming denial we’re into the acceptors who do evenm more damage by paying their lip-service – http://www.turnuptheheat.org is the place for endless grim amusement at their expense!

      Anyway – apologies for the side-track.

    • #787947
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      To take the title of this thread in literal terms, I’m curious as to the Government’s intention to replace all inefficient incandescent light bulbs in state buildings with CFL equivalents over the next year or two. Now obviously florurescent tubes and the like will be retained in offices and departmental buildings, but what about the thousands of sparkling candle bulbs in chandeliers, and period lamps and lumineres across the state’s collection of ceremonial buildings?

      Many of these are burning non-stop for 18+ hours a day, 365 days a year, and are woefully inefficient, in spite of their elegance.

      Do they intend replacing them all with, eh, these?

      Or how about a nice set of spirals and sticks encircling the Waterford droplets of the Seanad Chamber.

      Has this matter even been considered? At least LEDs are developing at such a rate that there’s probably a number of sympathetic solutions out there by now. This is a problem internationally after all.

    • #787948
      admin
      Keymaster

      Graham we will return to these images in June as there is a very real angle here.

      Kenny slams Government’s environment record
      From ireland.com12:30Saturday, 19th May, 2007
      Fine Gael leader Enda Kenny today criticised what he said was the Government’s “appalling” record on the environment, warning that a change in government was the only way to deal with the serious environmental challenges that lie ahead.

      Mr Kenny said the Government had missed all of Ireland’s Kyoto targets and the country’s greenhouse gas emissions have increased at twice the target rate.

      He also highlighted the fact that Ireland was now ranked 22nd out of 27 EU countries in terms of wind, wave and biomass generation, despite having the best potential in the EU and that only 3 per cent of Ireland’s primary energy supply comes from renewable sources.

      Outlining his party’s environmental policy at a new recycling centre in Co Mayo, Mr Kenny said Fine Gael was committed to meeting these challenges head-on.

      He said, if elected, his party would establish a department of energy and environment to co-ordinate all climate change initiatives.

      The party also wished to lower VRT for drivers of energy efficient cars and abolish excise duty on bio fuels to increase production.

      Fine Gael, he said, was committed to a recycling target of 50 per cent of household waste and would reduce government department and agency CO2 emissions by 2 per cent per year.

      “Not too long ago many people in mainstream society saw climate change and green issues as peripheral issues. Today they are clearly central to our future,” Mr Kenny said.

      “Every day new studies and new predictions are published on the pace and consequences of climate change and the failure to protect our environment. But the FF/PD Government’s record on the environment is appalling,” he said.

      “Fine Gael and Labour will bring a fresh approach and new ideas to Government that will make a real difference to the environment,” Mr Kenny said.

      There is now a real choice

    • #787949
      admin
      Keymaster

      Land Securities have expressely ruled out the use of carbon off setting or the purchase of carbon credits as ways of acheiving a caron neutral portfolio by 2012 in line with their environmental portfolio policy.

      http://www.shopping-centre.co.uk

      It kind of puts Dick’s light bulb plan predicated on the purchase of carbon credits from compliant countries for billions into perspective.

      Dick for UCD

      Land Sec, to out perform

      I wonder why?

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