developments in cork
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Little to Show for Corks year as European Capital of Culture – The Irish Times 10 November 2005.
Scathing article by Frank McDonald ( who else?) after a positive article in the same esteemed journal earlier in the year. In a nutshell hates all the Howard Holdings / O’Callaghan Properties attempts around our City loves the Glucksman.The Cork City Council inertia and double standards baffle us all and its good to have an outside view on our beautiful city and its administrators.
I hate to say it but he’s right about everything.@Saucy Jack wrote:
Little to Show for Corks year as European Capital of Culture – The Irish Times 10 November 2005.
Scathing article by Frank McDonald ( who else?) after a positive article in the same esteemed journal earlier in the year. In a nutshell hates all the Howard Holdings / O’Callaghan Properties attempts around our City loves the Glucksman.The Cork City Council inertia and double standards baffle us all and its good to have an outside view on our beautiful city and its administrators.
I hate to say it but he’s right about everything.Methinks Mr.McDonald must have had sour milk on his cornflakes when he penned that article. The same gent had nothing but praise for Cork some months ago.
I dont’t know about “nothing but praise” but the article in question is broadly fair. A regular reader of this thread and The Times will be aware of the authors views on most of the projects mentioned. Some of which I’d strongly agree with, others I wouldn’t but he did seem to focus on the negative, forgetting many of the better buildings in Cork and in the planning process. I guess, though, thats what the article was about!
It’s easy to knock projects (I do it myself occasionally) but its much harder to make a case for what we should be doing! After all, everyone’s tastes are different. Incidently, the author may be mistaken in part of his article dealing with the future development of Lavitts Quay- from what I hear, the hotel is out the window.
Tommy Barker writing in the Irish Examiner suggests that the decision on Frinailla’s Watercourse Road Development will be made this week. The suspense is killing me :plexington has been slacking off the past few days, but it’s been a hectic week. Things on the development front should pick up again in the not so distant future all going well…in the meantime..
🙂 Yesterday saw Fleming Construction make a joint announcement with the Sheraton Group regarding the operation of its 5-star resort hotel under construction at Fota Golf Resort. Indeed, Sheraton, who also operate the Westin in Dublin, will head up control at the Hogan & Associates designed 3-storey 133-bedroom hotel and spa. The hotel will be the first internationally operated 5-star hotel in the region and is set to open in Spring 2006.
Sheraton Hotel Fota Golf Resort Image
For more details on the Fleming Group’s extensive Fota Golf Resort development see here.
🙂 John Sisk & Sons Ltd have erected a tower crane over the Cork School of Music site on Union Quay today signalling full-steam ahead for primary construction activity of the long-awaited €60 million PPP project undertaken by Hochtief and designed by Murray O’Laoire Architects. Completion is scheduled for the academic term of 2007.
Frank MacDonald’s Irish Times articleLink here. (Thank you Radioactiveman ).
Unfortunately, I don’t have the time to dissect the article, but I agree it was probably a case of sour milk over the cornflakes – to quote kite.
However, I just wish to take issue with 1 or 2 things very briefly –
I think undue aggro is afforded O’Callaghan Properties in the article. People are very quick to knock Merchant’s Quay (MQ) for example – in terms of its architecture. I agree, it is perhaps not the most attractive city centre structure – in fact, I believe (and I may be amended on this one), Mr. O’Callaghan himself noted that it’s design was a product of its time (and one which far preceeded the actual construction dates as well) and the economic climate associated with it. Some may not find this excusable, but I would ask them to consider the context in which it was built, and take note that on completion in 1989, MQ was Cork’s largest urban regeneration project, valued at approx. IR£30m. 3 years prior to it’s opening, Cork was trenched in economic duldrums following not only the closures of plants by Ford and Dunlop, but also the knock-on effects this had for many other businesses around Cork. When Mr. O’Callaghan and the Heron Property Company undertook the initiative at Merchant’s Quay, it was indeed a big risk considering the climate – however the centre and it’s construction provided a vital economic boost and source of employment to a region which needed a little light in some pretty dark days. The coup of attracting tenants like Marks & Spencer, Laura Ashley and so on, was icing on the cake and fair credit to Mr. O’Callaghan and his team. Significantly, OCP projects have over the years continued to pay more attention to design and adjusted with the perceptual and economic climates which accompany their projects, such as Jurys, such as 21 Lavitts Quay and so on. There is always the possibility that MQ will receive a makeover in the coming future, a vertical extension perhaps?, and this may amend external facades. But when people go to knock MQ and OCP, remember what an important and risky project it was to undertake and the lease of life it helped afford the city. The same can be said for Mahon Point (an Ambrose Kelly designed project). Without the prosperity we are so lucky to enjoy today, our increasingly prevalent appreciation for better and more imaginative design, may not be so – say, ‘forthright’.
As for Howard Holdings’ efforts at Lapps Quay, I think the product speaks enough on its own standing. 🙂
@Radioactiveman wrote:Tommy Barker writing in the Irish Examiner suggests that the decision on Frinailla’s Watercourse Road Development will be made this week. The suspense is killing me :p
The decision has actually been made RM and I will do my best to let you know more as soon as I can.
Agree with Lex and Mdowling on this one. Merchant’s Quay was the only big project at the time. I remember talking to a city planner and his point was that it was not an ideal design, but it was better than what was there and they were hoping it would kickstart the redevelopment of the city center. To be fair, they had a point. Does anyone remember the old warren of alleys and car parking there prior to redevelopment! The entire quay was a mess.
As for the other criticisms, some are valid, while others are in my view an exaggeration. Thankfully, the public at large tend to be more aware of the importance of design and things have improved considerably. But his description of HH’s Lapps Quay development is a bit rich….do you remember the open expanse and blank wall of the old Dan Seaman motor ‘showroom’? 😮
Finally, although the McDonald article was a critical, it is good that these things are highlighted in the press and for that I am grateful. The more debate the better.@lexington wrote:
lexington has been slacking off the past few days, but it’s been a hectic week. Things on the development front should pick up again in the not so distant future all going well…in the meantime..
🙂 Yesterday saw Fleming Construction make a joint announcement with the Sheraton Group regarding the operation of its 5-star resort hotel under construction at Fota Golf Resort. Indeed, Sheraton, who also operate the Westin in Dublin, will head up control at the Hogan & Associates designed 3-storey 133-bedroom hotel and spa. The hotel will be the first internationally operated 5-star hotel in the region and is set to open in Spring 2006.
Sheraton Hotel Fota Golf Resort Image
Frank MacDonald’s Irish Times articleLink here. (Thank you Radioactiveman ).
Unfortunately, I don’t have the time to dissect the article, but I agree it was probably a case of sour milk over the cornflakes – to quote kite.
However, I just wish to take issue with 1 or 2 things very briefly –
I think undue aggro is afforded O’Callaghan Properties in the article. People are very quick to knock Merchant’s Quay (MQ) for example – in terms of its architecture. I agree, it is perhaps not the most attractive city centre structure – in fact, I believe (and I may be amended on this one), Mr. O’Callaghan himself noted that it’s design was a product of its time (and one which far preceeded the actual construction dates as well) and the economic climate associated with it. Some may not find this excusable, but I would ask them to consider the context in which it was built, and take note that on completion in 1989, MQ was Cork’s largest urban regeneration project, valued at approx. IR£30m. 3 years prior to it’s opening, Cork was trenched in economic duldrums following not only the closures of plants by Ford and Dunlop, but also the knock-on effects this had for many other businesses around Cork. When Mr. O’Callaghan and the Heron Property Company undertook the initiative at Merchant’s Quay, it was indeed a big risk considering the climate – however the centre and it’s construction provided a vital economic boost and source of employment to a region which needed a little light in some pretty dark days. The coup of attracting tenants like Marks & Spencer, Laura Ashley and so on, was icing on the cake and fair credit to Mr. O’Callaghan and his team. Significantly, OCP projects have over the years continued to pay more attention to design and adjusted with the perceptual and economic climates which accompany their projects, such as Jurys, such as 21 Lavitts Quay and so on. There is always the possibility that MQ will receive a makeover in the coming future, a vertical extension perhaps?, and this may amend external facades. But when people go to knock MQ and OCP, remember what an important and risky project it was to undertake and the lease of life it helped afford the city. The same can be said for Mahon Point (another Ambrose Kelly-school designed project). Without the prosperity we are so lucky to enjoy today, our increasingly prevalent appreciation for better and more imaginative design, may not be so – say, ‘forthright’.
As for Howard Holdings’ efforts at Lapps Quay, I think the product speaks enough on its own standing. 🙂
The decision has actually been made RM and I will do my best to let you know more as soon as I can.
Merchants Quay was another opportunity lost on a massive scale for Cork in such a prominent position and the problem with “build something instead of nothing at all” policy. Driving down the city’s quays all it offers is the massive neon backlight signage of “Dunnes Stores”.Remember Ambrose Kelly is’nt an architect.
@Saucy Jack wrote:
Merchants Quay was another opportunity lost on a massive scale for Cork in such a prominent position and the problem with “build something instead of nothing at all” policy. Driving down the city’s quays all it offers is the massive neon backlight signage of “Dunnes Stores”.Remember Ambrose Kelly is’nt an architect.
still a damn sight better than the quay accross the way with the metropole!! how long are we going to have to wait for something to be done there?
@Leesider wrote:
still a damn sight better than the quay accross the way with the metropole!! how long are we going to have to wait for something to be done there?
And not a patch on the Kyrl’s Quay Car Park/North Main St Shopping Centre river frontage.
@Saucy Jack wrote:
Merchants Quay was another opportunity lost on a massive scale for Cork in such a prominent position and the problem with “build something instead of nothing at all” policy. Driving down the city’s quays all it offers is the massive neon backlight signage of “Dunnes Stores”.Remember Ambrose Kelly is’nt an architect.
Look, I don’t think you’d find anyone willing to give MQ a design award but if you look at the history of development in this city and consider the feeling that was prevalent at the time it was designed and built, one could argue that the success of Merchants Quay (at least in a commercial sense) served as a real catalyst for the city.
I believe in the medium-term that a redevelopment of the centre, along with the quay front itself is on the cards, which is most welcome but i do think that maybe, just maybe the loss of the old quay might have been worth it in terms of the example it gave for the city as a whole.
I’m not saying another MQ is acceptable. The people of Cork now will not accept poor architecture- thats an indication of how far we’ve come. But, taken in context, the old quay would not have survived to this day without total redevelopment anyway- it was always going to be replaced. What we;ve got can and should be improved upon. One of the main problems is not the shopping centre, but the quayside, footpaths, public lighting etc, It all needs a lift and hopefully that’s something OCP and CCC can work on together in the near future.
Lexington… I’ll await you’re news on Frinailla’s Lady’s Well. I’ve been following this for a while and what ever way it goes, it’ll be an interesting one. Thanks.@jungle wrote:
And not a patch on the Kyrl’s Quay Car Park/North Main St Shopping Centre river frontage.
at least there are plans for that area, (Kyrl’s Quay) anyone have news on that btw?? ANything going to planning soon?
Just a question…has anyone noticed a sort of white residue staining across the redbrick facades of Camden wharf? What is that and how did it get there? it looks awful!!!!! Driving toward Blackpool I saw the Sean muillean apartment complex, i think by the same architect and also redbrick, stained with the white residue as well but not to the same extent. It seems only on those 2 buildings and its rotten!!!
@ewankennedy wrote:
Just a question…has anyone noticed a sort of white residue staining across the redbrick facades of Camden wharf? What is that and how did it get there? it looks awful!!!!! Driving toward Blackpool I saw the Sean muillean apartment complex, i think by the same architect and also redbrick, stained with the white residue as well but not to the same extent. It seems only on those 2 buildings and its rotten!!!
I brought up the same point ages ago in the old thread I think. I’ve got no knowledge of construction, etc. but was told that its all to do with the mortar that’s used and that its natural and will go away, etc.,etc.
That doesn’t detract from the fact that it looks crap and happens to every red-brick building in the city. Camden wharf is a particularly obvious example.🙂 The Software Development Company has been granted permission for the development of a further office block of some 2488m sq at its lands, the NSC Campus, in Mahon. Wain Morehead Architects handled the application which was praised by Senior Planner Ronnie McDowell for its attractive design stating “There is no objection from a design aspect to the attractive building proposed” in the official planning report. The 4-storey block will be constructed adjacent to the existing NSC Campus block. 50 car-parking spaces will accompany the development.
🙂 An application for planning is expected soon by the HSE to develop a new BreastCheck Clinic off South Terrace (on the site of the former Irish International Trading Corp. premises), adjoining the South Infirmary Hospital along the Old Blackrock Road. Designs on the €7m facility have been finalised and permission will be sought with the intention of having the centre ready for mid-2007. A further healthcare development has been pitched for the South Infirmary in the future, but details will have to remain capped on that for the time being.
Leesider – regarding Kyrl’s Quay, the lands which had been subject to the design competition are possessed by various owners, private and including CCC. Though I understand the lands have been assessed, I am not aware of any concrete undertaking to redevelop the lands. Personally, I don’t think the winning Conroy Architecture proposal, would be my choice – but that’s a matter of preference all the same. I think there were some far more imaginative entries which would serve the site better – should one of these models be adopted in any possible redevelopment.
@Radioactiveman wrote:Lexington… I’ll await you’re news on Frinailla’s Lady’s Well. I’ve been following this for a while and what ever way it goes, it’ll be an interesting one. Thanks.
Should have information for you on Monday. Decisions are only being posted out today – it is suspected to have been a successful grant, however, under which conditions I don’t know.
@Radioactiveman wrote:
I brought up the same point ages ago in the old thread I think. I’ve got no knowledge of construction, etc. but was told that its all to do with the mortar that’s used and that its natural and will go away, etc.,etc.
That doesn’t detract from the fact that it looks crap and happens to every red-brick building in the city. Camden wharf is a particularly obvious example.Efflourescence – Deposits of soluble salts which appears on the surface as brickwork dries out out for the first time.The mortar used is only a minor contributor to the problem.
@lexington wrote:
🙂 The Software Development Company has been granted permission for the development of a further office block of some 2488m sq at its lands, the NSC Campus, in Mahon. Wain Morehead Architects handled the application which was praised by Senior Planner Ronnie McDowell for its attractive design stating “There is no objection from a design aspect to the attractive building proposed” in the official planning report. The 4-storey block will be constructed adjacent to the existing NSC Campus block. 50 car-parking spaces will accompany the development.
I work in the NSC and I think it’s a kip of a building. It looks ok from the outside and the ground floor is plush but the offices upstairs are no good. The building is either too cold in the winter or too hot in the summer thanks to a poor heating system and air-con that’s not worth talking about. Add to that the fact that there are no facilities for cyclists (showers, covered bicycle stand) even though myself and others have asked many times for such a provision. Cork City Council has a shareholding in Software Development Company which owns the NSC so it’s probably not going to get knocked back in the planning dept is it which probably explains why there are 8 mobile phone masts on top of the building since the last count. Rant over.
Looking forward to hearing the result of Frinailla’s Lady’s Well development… Will be interesting to say the least.
😀 Frinailla Developments have been greenlit by ABP following an exhaustive appeal process which saw the decision date delayed on a number of occasions. The regeneration project which has been cleared will make way for approx. 60,000sq ft of commercial space, community facilities, underground car-parking and residential units. Some alterations have been made to the project in the grant, a block, forming part of the overall development has been removed however reductions previously made in conditions posed by CCC have been reinstated bring apartment figures to approx. 120. This all brings conclusion to one of the most highly anticipated development project decisions for Cork this year. John Paul Construction have been active in clearance activities along the Watercourse Road site, with main work scheduled for the not too distant future.
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