developments in cork
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anybody hear anything about apartments going in where the brog bar/gorbys complex currently is on oliver plunkett st? apparently the brog building is for sale for 10 million (approx)
also, any thoughts on the ‘lisin’ development on strawberry hill?
@Radioactiveman wrote:
As far as i’m aware, the Elisabeth Fort is spotlighted at night.
Err… really? You’d think I’d have noticed that, given that I live in the apartment building next door! 😮 I really need to get out more..
Still, looking forward to getting a look at a few interiors that day. I’m not sure why the Clarion penthouse is included, but I’d be very curious for a look.
Wow, that picture of Lapps Quay looks fantastic, hard to believe that it isn’t a plan on a few sheets of paper any more (someone should post it in the Most beautiful building in Cork forum!). I definetly think that multicoloured lights should be used to illuminate city attractions more at night. I think that the white canopy on the bus stop would look nice if it was lit up with different coloured lights.
🙁 Well despite Paul Kenny’s confidence that his The Treasury office development for St. Patrick’s Quay, designed by Wilson Architecture, would not be taken to appeal by the McLaughlin Family and Bell Scott Engineering – it would seem the two have lodged individual 3rd Party Appeals against the proposed new home of the Revenue Commissioners (RC). The landmark office development is in the running for the RC with a decision scheduled from the OPW on the preferred location on September 24th 2005. Mr. Kenny had lodged his own 1st Party appeal regarding certain CCC imposed conditions – however the prospect of a 3rd Party Appeal (which may delay the project by another 4 months minimum – should a resolve not be found in the meantime) may also damage the proposals hopes for a successful outcome on attaining RC tenancy.
😎 It seems Fleming Construction look set to purchase the 136 acre lands gracing the Ballincollig By-Pass near Curraheen. It’s a bit of a gamble considering the lands, which were guiding at approx. 10m euro through auctioneers Irish & European, are not zoned for development and probably won’t be for some time. It is rumoured that the lands are being sold for approx. 17.5 to 17.75m euros. This is a long term investment it would seem – unless a certain speculation regarding a certain national sports organisation and their valuable site were to materialise! 😉 :confused:
😮 O’Callaghan Properties (Classes Housing) have attained permission for a community related development at their Classes Lake housing development near Ballincollig. The new development will include retail, restaurant, take-away, offices, 3 apartments, a pharmacy, library, medical centre and petrol station.Why would someone lodge an appeal against such a gorgeous building. It would completly transform the area…. I wouldn’t change a thing about it.
@A-ha wrote:
Why would someone lodge an appeal against such a gorgeous building.
oh..oh dear god…where, where do i even begin to start pointing out whats wrong with that question… ya see…no…havent you ever heard of…no…whats it…ugh i give up. 😀
only messing aha. its not about the look of the building sometimes, its got to do with issues of property rights, or value fears, entitlements to rights etc etc etc and sometimes just plain arrogance or petty hidden agendas. but hey thats for the inspectors to decide. and also remember lex said that paul kenny lodged a 1st party appeal himself anyway. 3rd parties just make it a little trickier-rer-rer-rer.
but yes i agree its unfortunate. im really routing for this building and i agree it would transform this particular quayside immensely. suppose all we can do is hope for the best. 😉
@Jim Comic wrote:
anybody hear anything about apartments going in where the brog bar/gorbys complex currently is on oliver plunkett st? apparently the brog building is for sale for 10 million (approx)
WHAT! The Brog.. Gorbys … Gone! 😮
Where are we going to go now when we want to relive our twenties :confused:And for apartments, hardly a suitable usage in a prime trading area. It would be much better for CCC to take it and extend the English Market which has the potential to be a major tourist attraction in the city.
@lexington wrote:
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😮 O’Callaghan Properties (Classes Housing) have attained permission for a community related development at their Classes Lake housing development near Ballincollig. The new development will include retail, restaurant, take-away, offices, 3 apartments, a pharmacy, library, medical centre and petrol station.Has this development started yet lex or am I thinking of another development by them in ballincollig. Who is doing the work on this one cos lately its seems that Bowens are doing all their work I wonder is this because the rest are in direct competition with them elsewhere with their own developments I.e Flemings, O’Flynn Construction, O’Brien O’Flynn, Rohcon, Murphy construction, Murnane O’shea etc..
@securityman wrote:
Has this development started yet lex or am I thinking of another development by them in ballincollig. Who is doing the work on this one cos lately its seems that Bowens are doing all their work I wonder is this because the rest are in direct competition with them elsewhere with their own developments I.e Flemings, O’Flynn Construction, O’Brien O’Flynn, Rohcon, Murphy construction, Murnane O’shea etc..
I think O Callaghan Properties are building them themselves
@securityman wrote:
Has this development started yet lex or am I thinking of another development by them in ballincollig. Who is doing the work on this one cos lately its seems that Bowens are doing all their work I wonder is this because the rest are in direct competition with them elsewhere with their own developments I.e Flemings, O’Flynn Construction, O’Brien O’Flynn, Rohcon, Murphy construction, Murnane O’shea etc..
Classes Lake is well under way – I believe the final phase is now about construction. It is located on the Ovens side of Ballincollig. OCP have a good working relationship with the Bowen Group – however, Bowen do not handle all of OCP developments, for example, Rochelle College apartment developent along the Old Blackrock Road, which is being handled by John Paul Construction. One may cite a similar relationship between Howard Holdings and PJ Hegarty & Son Ltd, Frinailla with John Paul Construction etc – however I believe at the end of the day, it’s a project by project matter.pier39 wrote:but yes i agree its unfortunate. im really routing for this building and i agree it would transform this particular quayside immensely. suppose all we can do is hope for the best. ]Each to their own I guess.. of all the quays, that’s one I’d rather was left alone (well, given a cleanup, but naught more). Now, if the RC building was to replace, say, the rear of the Metropole, or the god-awful Penrose Wharf building, then I’d really be in favour of it.
@brainscan wrote:
WHAT! The Brog.. Gorbys … Gone! 😮
Where are we going to go now when we want to relive our twenties :confused:em….yeaaah, “twenties”, thats what i told the bouncers too… 😀 more like my early teens that place!
havent heard anything of it being bought, is this another one of those brown thomas bought scotts rumours??? and apartments?? doubtful.Does anyone else thing that generally Fleming constructions developments are somewhat lacking in the design department? just looking at some of their schemes I can’t get over how boring and bland they are. The most they seem to have ever input into design has been with Trinity court or the hotel in their Fota island development. For such a seemingly successful company youd think they could afford the time and effort to push for good design.
@ewankennedy wrote:
Does anyone else thing that generally Fleming constructions developments are somewhat lacking in the design department? just looking at some of their schemes I can’t get over how boring and bland they are. The most they seem to have ever input into design has been with Trinity court or the hotel in their Fota island development. For such a seemingly successful company youd think they could afford the time and effort to push for good design.
Lets not forget that only few years ago, John Fleming was doing nothing else then bridges. The Fota Hotel that we see now on site is a mere resemblance of the original scheme proposed by Hogan Associates but that is not Fleming fault. The valuable input and the magnificent architectural knowledge of few of the planners involved in this project brought the hotel to what we see today on site. Knowing the people in Fleming and working with them for a long time I could say that they have been very open minded with regard to this project.
To answer your question…yes. They do lack in design. But I would ask something else. Since when is a planner allowed to make comments and to impose changes in the design of a project considering that they don’t have any architectural qualification. :confused: What if a mechanic would go and give advices to a neurosurgeon in how to do its job!!! After 7 years in Ireland, this is still a question that puzzles me. :confused:
So I would say, don’t blame (entirely) the developer, shoot the planner. 😡Thank you Caesar for those interesting images of the Fota Resort Hotel. Hogan Associates have shown an ability to display strong imagination on many of their projects. I agree that planners, who are not architects, sometimes impose conditions that may adversely affect the quality of design in a project – and in perhaps some cases, improve the design (perhaps by putting a proverbial ‘gun’ to the developers head saying “If you don’t improve, you don’t get the clear”) – and maybe that’s a debate you would be willing to contribute to in the thread The Effects of Planning on Design, I think a good debate was started on the topic there and I personally would be most interested to hear your input.
Generally, my opinion is, that it’s a multi-layered effort – and I whole heartedly agree, planners have an important input which sometimes is not always positive from a design perspective, but they have other considerations too – although I accept that this does not always justify their own causes. However, I do believe a big big part is clearly the responsibility of the architects and the developers. Fleming Construction have provided some positive steps I think with Trinity Court, but I would agree that quite a few of their other development efforts are wanting in the design department and I think they should be more forcefully encouraging of promoting better aesthetics. Design/Build efforts like that at Victoria Cross and Victoria Lodge are very disappointing. Their schemes at Rushbrooke, Stepaside etc are also not quite what they could perhaps otherwise be. I would hope to see the company take more proactive steps when considering design. But that’s just a personal feeling regarding design and is not in anyway an attack on the company, which has been most admirable in it’s growth strategy – they have shown to be generally open-minded indeed, but perhaps they could apply this mentality to a more positive design policy. Then again, if they keep getting planning for some of the more substandard designs, who is to tell them otherwise? :confused:
Bowen Construction Apartment Development for Musgrave Park
🙂 Long term followers of this website may remember that I indicated in the LADSOCL thread that Bowen Construction would be seeking to develop approx. 50 apartments on lands abutting Musgrave Park – fronting the Kinsale and Tramore Roads. Well it now seems Bowen Construction are ready to lodge that application to build on the narrow strip of land beside (east of) the famous rugby grounds with permission to be sought for 55 apartments, 10 townhouses, roof gardens, 93 ground floor parking spaces, a retail unit just under 3,000sq ft and 2 new office units. The development blocks will stem between 3 and 6-storeys high with Wilson Architecture responsible for the design (Wilson have also been involved in another prospective, high-profile project very close by).
Massive OFC Housing Development near Glanmire
😎 Meanwhile, O’Flynn Construction (OFC) currently in appeal for their 629 unit housing development on the lands of Dunkettle House, will now seek to develop another 700 units on a 77-acre site they purchased at Ballinglanna near Glanmire. The 200m euro + development is to be built on the lands which OFC purchased for a believed 30m euros and will comprise of 393 two, three and four bedroom terraced houses, 166 two, three and four bedroom semi-detached houses, 79 detached houses of three and four bedrooms each and 62 one and two bedroom apartments. Also included are plans for a 2-storey creche, 3 commercial units, new vehicular access and a new roundabout from the Dunkettle Road. 2 tennis courts, play areas and public spaces are also proposed.
@lexington wrote:
………. Design/Build efforts like that at Victoria Cross and Victoria Lodge are very disappointing. Their schemes at Rushbrooke, Stepaside etc are also not quite what they could perhaps otherwise be. I would hope to see the company take more proactive steps when considering design. But that’s just a personal feeling regarding design and is not in anyway an attack on the company, which has been most admirable in it’s growth strategy – they have shown to be generally open-minded indeed, but perhaps they could apply this mentality to a more positive design policy. Then again, if they keep getting planning for some of the more substandard designs, who is to tell them otherwise? :confused:
Good morning lexington
Unfortunately I do not have much time this morning to discuss this “planner = GOD†issue. Loads of site meetings. I said planner = GOD because most of the senior planners are acting like God. They have the power to build or to destroy and nothing could stay in front of them. But there is a conflict here. God is only one, while planners are more then one. One could easily see the conflict here and thus the personal issues arising from this inside every planning department.
Strange is also the fact that while they act like Gods, they are also proving a fear of their own decisions. I don’t blame them. It is hard to “read†and understand an architectural proposal if you don’t have any architectural background. Thus their “comfort†in accepting a scheme that is easy for them to read and comprehend. I would really want to see some of the old planners in Cork trying to study and come to a decision for one of Libeskind’s proposals. That would be funny.
Rusbrooke is one of the developments considered by Nicolas Mansergh as one of his biggest mistakes and that from a visual impact point of view. I would dare to gainsay you when you use the development in Rusbrooke as an example of Fleming’s incapacity to produce good quality design. The layout has been changed by the above mentioned planner for a reason that keeps eluding me. The facades may not be of a good design but Fleming should be praised for few things. Good quality and innovative solutions (I would dare to say that Pat Stack from Fleming had a huge input in this). The metal frame structure used by Fleming is a great idea. I was personally concerned at the beginning when this metal frame system has been presented to me, but I can see now that it is a great thing. The houses are incredible warm and there are no cracks in the plaster, proving that there is virtually no expansion or contraction at the structural level. Thumb up for John and his team.
Well that would be all for today.
I apologise for the broken English. Hope it made some sense.
I promise to have a look at the topic you mentioned and to express my view.
A nice weekend to all of you.When is work on City Hall due to be completed? I like what they’ve done so far. What is it that will be housed in there, offices?
@A-ha wrote:
When is work on City Hall due to be completed? I like what they’ve done so far. What is it that will be housed in there, offices?
See below.
Ceaser
“What if a mechanic would go and give advices to a neurosurgeon in how to do its job!!! After 7 years in Ireland, this is still a question that puzzles me. :confused:
So I would say, don’t blame (entirely) the developer, shoot the planner. :mad:[/QUOTE]”Bit harsh, there’s nothing wrong with a mechanic giving advice to a neurosurgeon, OK the patient may die but still, if the neurosurgeon is mad in the first place what’s the harm………
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