Developments in Cork
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I’ve just noticed this morning that major ground works are in progress on the site next door to Aldi on Tory Top Road, Formerly Heitons. I think it might be related to the original plannning for the site for residential and other uses as mentioned in one of lexingtons old *updates*.
Pity he isn’t around to enlighten us.https://archiseek.com/content/showpost.php?p=37582&postcount=153
One minor piece of good news.
There is a notice up at the end of Beasley St and it looks like the cobbles are going to be restored.
Any idea what the story is with the hotel that led to the whole street being dug up in the first place? It seems to have been in the same state for ages now. Also, the Parnell Place frontage needs some seeing to still.
just wondering if the canopy element of the cornmarket st redevelopment is to be left out is there going to be anything at all for the market in the project.what is it in cork when theres something good proposed for the city theres always someone who will complain about something.also said planning was approved for the murreyford proposal for the quay, was that not pulled out of by the developers.also anyone know why none of the units in the shopping centre have been taken up apart from tk maxx, dont see this happening anywhere else and just wondering does anyone know how come it happens so frequently in cork?just three last requests-anyone know whats happening on the library site, the sullivans quay site (rev office) on the cap cinema site?sorry two more just came to mind, o callaghans proposal for andersons quay and the extension to mahon point now that opera lane is fin,is he still proceeding with that in the current climate?
Murrayforde are in receivership so you can forget about that one…
@daniel_7 wrote:
just wondering if the canopy element of the cornmarket st redevelopment is to be left out is there going to be anything at all for the market in the project.what is it in cork when theres something good proposed for the city theres always someone who will complain about something.also said planning was approved for the murreyford proposal for the quay, was that not pulled out of by the developers.also anyone know why none of the units in the shopping centre have been taken up apart from tk maxx, dont see this happening anywhere else and just wondering does anyone know how come it happens so frequently in cork?just three last requests-anyone know whats happening on the library site, the sullivans quay site (rev office) on the cap cinema site?sorry two more just came to mind, o callaghans proposal for andersons quay and the extension to mahon point now that opera lane is fin,is he still proceeding with that in the current climate?
I missed the article about the Cornmarket St/Coal Quay redevelopment, does anyone have a scan of that by any chance? I couldn’t find anything online.
I’m not surprised the Cornmarket St centre isn’t filling, after years of ‘famine’ there’s a glut of retail space becoming available now, and the centre is on the edge of the city centre with relatively little foot traffic going by (the Cornmarket St. end). The Opera Lane development is much better located.
Can’t help you with the others, the Capitol cinema site is becoming ever-more of an eye-sore, so hopefully something is done with it soon. IIRC, it was to be another retail development, in which case the demand may well have dried up with the other development coming online.
As for the Anderson’s Quay development, that’s one I’m hoping will never see the light of day, it’s a horrible proposal. From the bus-station side it would look ok, but from down-river it presents a horrible 7-storey blank wall.
I’m not suprised cornmarket st isn’t filling up, for precisely the reasons Who_me mentioned. in some ways the development was speculative, on the demand for retail space, but also on the increased percieved value of the location that would/will come when the street paving is overhauled and the quay site at the end (and other infill works along the opposite side of the street) is complete. any proposed canopy is unlikely to appear until the groundworks are done either. that said, the street has the potential to be great and i don’t think it was a mistake to develop the Guy’s site, just bad timing.
The units in the Cornmarket Centre are also a bit smaller than most retailers are looking for. Also, I think the prospect of being the only retailer in an otherwise empty centre doesn’t appeal to many potential clients.
It’s a pity because the actual fit-out of the centre is pretty good compared to some we have seen.
A sign of the times perhaps, but some of the units at the Cornmarket Centre are due to be let to FAS to replace their public offices at Sullivan’s Quay.
Has work stopped on the old Dennehy’s Cross Garage site.
Passed there today and it looked fairly miserable.@lawyer wrote:
Has work stopped on the old Dennehy’s Cross Garage site.
Passed there today and it looked fairly miserable.There’s a Tesco express open there already and part of it is being used as student flats by UCC. Bet that was a surprise for anyone who actually bought a flat there :rolleyes:
Is there any chance we can not do the 82 page thread thing again ?
It’s almost impossible to follow!
There’s an entire forum dedicated to Cork. It’d be great if people would actually start new threads for each topic rather than this collective stream of consciousness thing!
:confused:Would anyone estimate the number of developments that would have taken place in Cork during the boom years if not for the intervention of that faceless body An Taisce?
Possibly a mirror image of the question about just how much further Cork would have been trashed had it not been for the intervention, etc.
@lawyer wrote:
Would anyone estimate the number of developments that would have taken place in Cork during the boom years if not for the intervention of that faceless body An Taisce?
The question should be how many more ghost estates would have been built in Cork if not for the intervention of An Taisce and CSD. 🙂
The thing that I find funny is – many people (including myself) mocked the government for not keeping up to speed with all the new developments; not having the roads, transport options, schools, utilities and all amenities and infrastructure etc. in place when the developments were completed.
Yet, imagine just how worse a state the economy would be in now if beside every ghost estate around the country, there was an empty school, and unused stretch of motorway, a half-finished light rail line, an empty hospital etc. ?
i think your points re transport options etc next to estates was right so i wouldnt agree, i think you (and me and many others ) were absolutely dead right to mock the government as to the building of estates without any infrastructure. I think your original point was more that infrastructure should have been in place, of a size, which corresponded to the population estimates of whatever new estates etc had been put in place nearby. Which blatantly wasnt done. Put it this way, I live in carrigaline, population has exploded in recent years. No changes to transport so when the traffic from dunkettle is bad, it backs up the N28, which wasnt designed to cope with the level of cars, so it takes an hour or more some mornings to get in to Cork City. Which is stunningly appalling. Whats being done about it? Nothing. A study was done in 2007. Still no action.
I see your point but look at it this way – Like you said – this infrastructure should have been in place before this stuff was built – if this had been adhered to then maybe the government and local authorities would have realised the absolutely unsustainable folly our planning system allowed (perhaps that should be encouraged?).
So I reckon we were right to shout. Pity they didn’t listen. 🙁
I think you’re having a ‘chicken-and-egg’ debate here. Good planning is not predicated on having all the infrastructure in place before development, but it does depend on having at least the skeleton of the infrastructure in place and in making developers conform (by and large) to an agreed planning scheme.The infrastructure can go in incrementally and organically, but where it is supposed to go and on the timetable agreed. The problems of traffic congestion in (e.g.) Carrigaline may have more to do with the lack of something as simple as bus provision rather than some sophisticated roads network (if everyone wants to drive their car to work, they have to live with the consequences).
As far as ‘ghost estates’ are concerned, has the number of units been quantified? I doubt if it’s anything more than a very small proportion of the total housing stock. Looks to me like a solution (in part) to social housing needs just waiting to happen.@johnglas wrote:
I ….. Looks to me like a solution (in part) to social housing needs just waiting to happen.
Makes a nonsense of the idea of Part 5 of the P&D Act seeking social integration.
Better left as ghost estates than forming new ghettos.@johnglas wrote:
I think you’re having a ‘chicken-and-egg’ debate here. Good planning is not predicated on having all the infrastructure in place before development, but it does depend on having at least the skeleton of the infrastructure in place and in making developers conform (by and large) to an agreed planning scheme.The infrastructure can go in incrementally and organically, but where it is supposed to go and on the timetable agreed. The problems of traffic congestion in (e.g.) Carrigaline may have more to do with the lack of something as simple as bus provision rather than some sophisticated roads network (if everyone wants to drive their car to work, they have to live with the consequences).
As far as ‘ghost estates’ are concerned, has the number of units been quantified? I doubt if it’s anything more than a very small proportion of the total housing stock. Looks to me like a solution (in part) to social housing needs just waiting to happen.i think you are right to some extent, it is a chicken and egg debate. I dont think anyone would say all the infrastructure should be in place before an estate or houses go in, but you are dead right, it should go in organically and incrementally. Either way, the country has been failed in terms of that infrastructure as the planning wasnt done to go along with those estates.
As for carrigaline and the traffic, i disagree fundamentally with you on that one, we are back to the chicken and egg situation i believe as a) all the people use their cars because there ISNT an adequate bus service, in 2002 Carrigaline was recognised by the CSO as the most car dependent town in the country. Its 2010. Nothing much has changed. B) The reason people use the cars is they cant rely on the bus as it would simply sit at a standstill in traffic because of an inadequate road network, which has, no bus lane.
The n28 from carrigaline to cork new route has even been decided, its on the NRA website, even looks as if it makes sense but no money is forthcoming to build it.
As for unused houses to be used for Part V, i dont understand why this option hasnt been taken long long ago. The less well off are crying out for accomodation and there is a stack of empty houses around the country. Go figure. The minister for housing is probably on holidays with noel dempsey.
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