Coup d’Etat in An Taisce?

News Desk you are most generous in elevating An Taisce to the level capable of suffering a Coup d’Etat.

But I must disapoint you on your rumour, by stating that the only function in Tailor’s Hall tonight is a private function.

So if I am really nice to the hosts of this retirement party I might even get a free drink.

The organisation has not been so united behind its chairperson in ten years. That previous Chairwoman is now the director.

So rest assured it is unfounded rumour, on the same scale as the supreme novices hurdle on the first day of Cheltenham.

sounds a bit suspicious to me Diaspora.

“retirement party, eh? “private function”,eh?

“unfounded rumour”eh? ” free drink”, eh?

What’s really going on in Tailor’s Hall that you can’t admit to?

All above board, A tax collector is retiring, they normally use Dublin Castle but with the presidency the Castle is in use.

Reading your book is about the sum total of unusaual activity afoot here.

By the way congrats on the Bewleys Nottingham hotel, a bloody good job.

Thanks Diaspora,

Is that the latest Harry Potter you’re reading then?

Quotes 22Jan2004
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At page 104

Out of Scotland “Bewley’s Nottingham Commissioned 1999 “Bewleys asked gm+ad to come up with proposals for a number of hotels in the UK City Centres of Nottingham, Leicester, Newcastle and Manchester. The proposed 350-bedroom hotel in the city centre of Nottingham was to produce a marker building in a city without many distinctive buildings”.

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Yeah, apologies. I hit the submit button before I realised.

It’s been so long since anyone at An Taisce was nice to me………. it took me completely by surprise.

Ach…..now I’ve come over all paternal……..does An Taisce take Scotsmen. Want to give something back, think it’s only fair. What ya doing for Christmmas by the way….been anywhere nice for holiday.

James……………. I think you’re still a bit whacky though, sorry.

I never said you couldn’t design buildings,

Where I would agree to disagree with you is on the listing of buildings.

I don’t think either of us is going to change our minds, so there is little point in talking about it.

We have some Scottish members and could do with more members from all the Celtic clans.

Excellent – that would really reaffirm in the average Irish person’s mind that An Taisce was furrinners and big house folks talking down to them.

I dunno Scots or Welsh,

The tams can be a bit irreverent at times but hardly dogmatic and condesending.

I just don’t buy the anti-An Taisce spin of O’Cuiv et al.

I am also surprised that so many have.

I did a quick calculation of the staff of An Taisce prior to Christmas, only two out of 14 were from Dublin. Of the staff still remaining there is one sole Dub.

After listening to Ger Colleren of the Star on Mondays Questions and Answers I am of the strong belief that it is a contrived mindset.
Playing to the gallery for quick cheap kicks.

A very small minority of self appointed ‘rural protectors’

hmmmmmm!!!!!!!

and who listens to ‘ cuiv!!!! he is a muppet! ooops duno if i can say that but it’s my personal view..i have a stronger one but shall not express it.

Maybe someone could set up “AnTaisceseek”…?

An Taisce has a website, if you want to join the organisation there are monthly meetings.

http://www.antaisce.org

Good for the site traffic on this site all the same.

Archeire does a better job on discussion forums because it has a wider group of computer literate users. Everyone from save it all Devin to pile it higher Stira.

Fin,

As in our previous discussions I am not saying that An Taisce has handled its PR perfectly. Simply that it failed to get its message accross clearly and that O’Cuiv and Cowley and a number of clientist politicians capitalised on this to develop their own support base.

A little like a lot of talk about all the various European Referanda,

In 1986 ‘Ireland would be part of NATO’ according to some it never happened.

In 1992 ‘Ireland was going to dissapear economically and we’d all be on the dole’

For monertary union the currency was going to fail. For Nice we were back to losing neutrality again.

All emotive arguments with no factual basis

An Taisce in contrast has three physical programmes,

Education

Planning submissions

Properties

In addition to it’s advocacy of policies which are reached by quorum not on the back of a major box whilst parked at traffic lights on the way to Montrose.

😀

indeed!

Heh heh heh

This is getting scary,first you start chatting with Fin Diaspora, and now the unthinkable – alan d!
What next – a box of Roses for Devin?!

And why can’t a member of An Taisce hold a civilised conversation with talented architects.

We may disagree on particular issues, but is finding common ground not what the key to everthing in life?

There are plenty in this Country that could be termed me feiners. (there should be a fada or two in that)

If you read what I said on the other thread myself an devin have very similar views on modern design.

Leave me out of this

if an taisce has a right to bar members whose opinions and motives differ vastly from that of the core members, then surely a progressive architectural website like this can ban an taisce stalwarts. bus?

scary isn’t it!!! 🙂

But you wouldn’t want to ban anyone.

Banning only comes in when there is a conflict of interest between the objectives of the site/organisation and an individual.

I would suspect that anyone who holds a reasoned argument could only be good for the site. As it increases site traffic which is extremely important to all ambitous internet sites.

Even arguments such as Sam Stephonson being “auwful” and not progressive are I suspect welcome.

OF COURSE…

Originally posted by Diaspora
…………….I would suspect that anyone who holds a reasoned argument could only be good for the site……………

thats my point

Kinda lost the thread of this arguement but in the words of my mentor Grouch Marx whatever it is, I’m against it.

Yep Graham, it’s spooky alright…first Fin then moi. Wonder if he’ll let me call him Di in future?

on prime time last night a big discussio on an taisce. but i fear the picked the wrong people to argue the president of an taisce..can’t remember his name… they some hippy who only said 1 intelligent thing all night and some people who really hadn’t a clue. a planner who didn’t say much and o’cuiv..absolute muppet who talked around every subject. i suppose he tried his best to sound intelligent but came off sonding like a moron who is only there because of his questionable lineage. there was a guy there which they didn’t tell u what he did.. but he was trying to comment on inaccuricies with an taisce’s policies(regarding planning cos i know disapora that ye do more stuff) and was quite rudely shouted down several times. seems like the president didn’t want that aired that they seem to have no cohesive stragety towards this subject and can’t handle the justified critism and questions involved in making this public.

Quote “but he was trying to comment on inaccuricies with an taisce’s policies(regarding planning cos i know disapora that ye do more stuff) and was quite rudely shouted down several times”

The bloke who kept on going on about the website?

http://www.antaisce.org/campaigns/policy_statements/rural_built_environment.pdf

Above is the An Taisce rural development policy.

The contentious point was the following “statistics compiled by the DOE from ESB connections indicate theat we are now (foisting) errecting 50 new houses in the countryside per day. 36% of new housing is now in the countryside. Of this 80-90% is one off”

Quote ” Of this 80-90% is one off”

Therefore I suggest that our archeaolist freind Mr Caulfield dig a large hole for himself and cover it until he learns how to read english.

Apart from that I thought it was a good program, the farmer from Ballyhaunis did very well as did the planner and Our own Frank Corcoran.

But Caulfield and The rep from the sustainability something really displayed how much more mature this debate has come in recent years.

And O’Cuiv complimenting Ashling and the Blue flag scheme wonders will never cease!!!!!!!

yeah! she was away with the fairies..the girl form sustainability something… probably lives in leitrim and dreams of catching clouds!!!!! the guy didn’t have much to say other than the web-site in fairness…. kinda of a no brainer..and an archeologist…it didn’t say i think… i wonder how frank corcoran would do if there were actual architect’s etc people there and not for the most part dimwits…

Quote “… probably lives in leitrim and dreams of catching clouds”

Talking about lotto ads get herself and yourman in the ad featuring the punter in the jeep who wants to develop ‘carparks’ together for a debate it would make great television 😉

lots of tv’s would probably be shot…. jeez she was bad and as i said earlier she said one interesting point and that was to rebuke o’ cuiv…

She didn’t get a chance to develop any of her points, except when she was rebuking O’ Cuiv that time.
Frank did well, much better than last time, although as usual there wasn’t enough time to develop points, he spent most of it simply trying to clear up statistical issues rather than putting AT’s policies across. In fact, I don’t think in th whole half hour did he have a chance to put forward an AT policy and explain it.
O’ Cuiv – what a fool, he makes me boil with rage “Oh well we keep building more roads and infrastructure in Dublin & the East and are getting nowhere so I think it’s time rural Ireland got the resources for improved infrasructure”
???? YOU’RE THE ONES IN GOVERNMENT! YOU’RE THE ONES NOT GETTING US ANYWHERE IN THE EAST!
And that most ludicrous of remarks I’ve ever heard in my life – one he’s made before – in relation to the fact one off housing generates car dependancy “Well Dublin is choked with cars with wall to wall traffic, so we in Dublin aren’t ones to talk”
Oh of course, so rural Ireland has some catching up to do has it?
How pathetic.

As usual Prime Time failed miserably in the presentation stakes – I was wondering as I watched how many of the 400,000 viewers or so had any idea of what a one-off house is, what it looks like, or indeed what a septic tank is, and the effects they have, esp when not working.
These issues should have been cleared up at the start with an explanitary report. Television is a visual medium, something RTE have yet to cop on to. The debate may have well as been on radio.

Taisce did well on PT, for the first time in a long while, (i) by being courteous (ii) speaking in non-doctrinaire tones and (iii) reminding the folks at home that Taisce supports policies actually adopted by govt and local govt.

For the first time I thought that the thin argument arguing for Lego dwellings partout had been exposed.

Agreed.

Six people was too many though, four contributors would have allowed for a more comprehensive and focused debate, and considering anyone with the slightest interest in this issue was largely concerned with what Frank had to say, it was a shame he didn’t have enough time other than to largely defend AT.

If householders were still paying rates, this issue would be a lot different – the idea that people would be paying for the supplying of water and maintance of roads for others to live in their ‘fancy piles in the hills’ would get the rent-a-crowd and bin charges lobby out like a shot.

And many of these one-off people are the same ones complaining about the centralisation of hospital services and centres of excellence, and how difficult it will be to get to them.
If people were living reasonably close together, infrastructure servicing these areas could be improved dramatically.

I agree entirely.

People can be very shortsighted. They are paying for it in income taxes.

What were the tax rates before residential rates were abolished by CJ in 1977?

A lot lower than after 1977 I’d imagine.

Not that property taxes are a good thing, but subsidising one particular group in a way that doesn’t deliver societal or economic benefits isn’t very well thought out.

Section 23 and section 27 were great because they directed investment into the places where investment was most needed.

If someone said in 1977 that McCann Fitz would be moving from Amiens St to JR quay, they’d have been committed to Dundrum.

Yet some would argue that an equivelent number of urban dwellersa should be subsidised to build trophey homes in the sticks each week.

Fin said: “on prime time last night a big discussion on an taisce”

Get your act together Fin!! Thursday’s Prime Time was a special on one-off housing, featuring a report, followed by a studio discussion with a panel of six people, one of whom was from An Taisce.

Yes, the usual bungalow defenders (O’Cuiv, Caulfield) didnt come off very well this time. They tried the usual tactics against An Taisce, attacking “its” policies, but Frank Corcoran just calmly and clearly reiterated that An T. simply apply Government policy (contained in the National Spatial Strategy) and that – he was trying to get this in but Miriam O’Callaghan kept talking over him – Government policy is in turn based on European environmental legislation that Ireland has signed up to.

Rachael Kenny (former IPI president) is now a senior planner in Meath County Council so she probably wasn’t the best person to be there for obvious reasons (you can be sure she was told what she can and can’t say).

Emer O’Siochru (somebody described as a hippy) is a well-respected architect who’s been working in the area of built heritage for many years.

As for that guy from ‘Council for the West’ (another IRDA by the sound of things), what can you say? There’s no problem with what’s happening to the countryside as far as these people are concerned, and the already lax rules on the plonking of large pattern-book bungalows everywhere should be completely relaxed.

I wonder if he saw the piece in the Irish Independent on the 2nd of Janary titled ‘Top composer decries new plans to allow one-off houses’?

It said:

‘Composer Andrew Lloyd Webber, who has a home in this country, has criticised government plans which will allow thousands of one-off houses to be built in the countryside.

The composer of Cats and Phantom of the Opera told the Irish Independent that Ireland’s landscape was already marred by some of the most “hideous and inappropriate housing anywhere in the world” and that he was “gobsmacked” that regulations would be changed to allow thousands of one-off houses to be built.

Mr Llyod Webber said he realised there were few things more infuriating than “some outsider pontificating about the affairs of another country. But I plead a huge affection for Ireland and it grieves me to see such a special landscape besmirched by houses that have absolutely no sympathy for local vernacular architecture whatsoever”, he said yesterday……’

Originally posted by Devin
Get your act together Fin!! Thursday’s Prime Time was a special on one-off housing, featuring a report, followed by a studio discussion with a panel of six people, one of whom was from An Taisce.

well i am sorry. i shall try to get my act together in the future…. and really give a crap.

Originally posted by Devin

Yes, the usual bungalow defenders (O’Cuiv, Caulfield) didnt come off very well this time. They tried the usual tactics against An Taisce, attacking “its” policies, but Frank Corcoran just calmly and clearly reiterated that An T. simply apply Government policy (contained in the National Spatial Strategy) and that – he was trying to get this in but Miriam O’Callaghan kept talking over him – Government policy is in turn based on European environmental legislation that Ireland has signed up to..

were watching the one on rte 1 ????? if so i must have seen a different one.

Originally posted by Devin

Emer O’Siochru (somebody described as a hippy) is a well-respected architect who’s been working in the area of built heritage for many years…

i have never heard of her…well-respected where???? and i called her a hippy because she came across as one.

Originally posted by Devin

Mr Llyod Webber said he realised there were few things more infuriating than “some outsider pontificating about the affairs of another country.

is not the spokesman for an taisce(definately here anyway) not of similiar heritage as loyld webber? and yes there is nothing more infuriating

Originally posted by Devin
But I plead a huge affection for Ireland and it grieves me to see such a special landscape besmirched by houses that have absolutely no sympathy for local vernacular architecture whatsoever”, he said yesterday……’

from his large mansion no doubt.

oh! i found this and thought of you….

Fin,

Should that image not be titled ‘ignoring sustainability in the sticks?’

Just to reiterate, Prime Time last Thursday week was about one-off housing, not An Taisce. That’s important.

Don’t shoot the messenger.

Just to reiterate, Prime Time last Thursday week was about one-off housing, not An Taisce. That’s important.

Don’t shoot the messenger.

Just to reiterate, Prime Time last Thursday week was about one-off housing, not An Taisce. That’s important.

Don’t shoot the messenger.

Edit: ‘I’ve no idea why this post appeared 3 times, I must have pressed something by accident – Devin’ :end edit.

so there was a coup after all?

Originally posted by notjim
so there was a coup after all?

In the spelling department?

minister of env giving out about you lot again disapora…what did you do now?

i’m dyslexic, what can you do?

Originally posted by FIN
minister of env giving out about you lot again disapora…what did you do now?

I really don’t know I’m on to a new asignment but I’d say at a guess that Cullen was on about the third of four motorwars scheduled to cross Co Meath. I think ur man had an italian name vincenzo s… something or other.