cork quays

Wow that O’Callaghan development is sizeable!

any idea what the story is with Howard and this court case re Coventry Airport?

any scans of the proposal?

Check the rte website: http://www.rte.ie/business/2008/0721/ocallaghan.html

there was a pcture in either yesterday’s Herald or Yesterday’s Indo can’t remember which one

I’m confused as to why this project (Anderson’s Quay) is gaining such national publicity (Independent, RTE, etc.). Its a very middle of the road proposal in terms of scale and design.

@mickeydocs wrote:

Check the rte website: http://www.rte.ie/business/2008/0721/ocallaghan.html

I can’t figure out the image shown – isn’t that Kennedy Quay?

(Very interested in this development – it’s likely to fill my front window!)

@Radioactiveman wrote:

I’m confused as to why this project (Anderson’s Quay) is gaining such national publicity (Independent, RTE, etc.). Its a very middle of the road proposal in terms of scale and design.

It’s atracted national atention because it indicates that there is still some life in the building sector

It’s no longer “hip” to forcast a crash in the property market, so journalists will now be keen to report on the prospect of any reasonable development, and look upon it as the green shoot of recovery. Likewise, any small to medium sized job creation will assume greater significance by the media than is warrented.The race is on to be the next george lee (albeit in reverse) and predict the next boom. But like george and the stopped clock they will be right someday, but not before many a false dawn. Developers willing to proceed in these dire times should be applauded and treated as national heros, but we must learn from the past and not allow another “merchants quay” to emerge, with the excuse that it is the only show in town. The propsed development, to my eyes at least, looks refreshing.

@cgcsb wrote:

It’s atracted national atention because it indicates that there is still some life in the building sector

There seems to be plenty, in Cork.

Between the Cornmarket St. centre, the Academy St. centre, the new Dunnes Stores, the Elysian, the new 5-star hotel on Parnell Place, new hotel on Fr. Matthew Quay, new office developments at Clarkes Bridge and Fr. Matthew St., plus the ambitious new Atlantic Quarter, Port Quarter and government buildings proposals; and that’s just in the city centre alone.

@who_me wrote:

There seems to be plenty, in Cork.

Between the Cornmarket St. centre, the Academy St. centre, the new Dunnes Stores, the Elysian, the new 5-star hotel on Parnell Place, new hotel on Fr. Matthew Quay, new office developments at Clarkes Bridge and Fr. Matthew St., plus the ambitious new Atlantic Quarter, Port Quarter and government buildings proposals; and that’s just in the city centre alone.

Fair comment, but the projects listed above were concieved in the heyday of the property market when interest rates were low and the banks were rolling out the red carpets.I agree that we are fortunate to have the momentum of those projects behind the city,but I hope that encouragement stems from government by way of incentives and support to avoid any further inertia in the docklands,and those who are brave enough to proceed with development are assisted .

@the hawk wrote:

Fair comment, but the projects listed above were concieved in the heyday of the property market when interest rates were low and the banks were rolling out the red carpets.I agree that we are fortunate to have the momentum of those projects behind the city,but I hope that encouragement stems from government by way of incentives and support to avoid any further inertia in the docklands,and those who are brave enough to proceed with development are assisted .

Well, the Atlantic Quarter, Port Quarter and government building proposals were certainly put forward after the property market went belly up.

The Academy St., Dunnes Stores and – to a lesser extent – the Cornmarket centre hadn’t really started when the market crumbled; though the investment was probably such that it made more sense to continue rather than back out at that point.

We are lucky to have some new quality developments coming online at a time when optimism, buyers and credit are drying up!

Though, the little evil voice in my head has been praying that a few developments could go “to the wall” without me losing any sleep. Such as the Crosses Green hotel – now business centre. I even thought if the Half Moon St. development didn’t go ahead, it opens up some nice views up to Shandon and the North Cathedral. Would make a great park! :p (and no, that wasn’t a serious hope!)

@who_me wrote:

Well, the Atlantic Quarter, Port Quarter and government building proposals were certainly put forward after the property market went belly up.

when you say government buildings here are you on about the plans for the tax office or is the government planning on doing decentralisation properly and giving a boost to the docklands!!

To think if decentralisation actually was done properly the docklands of both cork and limerick would get a much needed boost, galway possibly around the train station and waterford along the quays!! Squandered opportunity!!

@who_me wrote:

Well, the Atlantic Quarter, Port Quarter and government building proposals were certainly put forward after the property market went belly up.

The Academy St., Dunnes Stores and – to a lesser extent – the Cornmarket centre hadn’t really started when the market crumbled; though the investment was probably such that it made more sense to continue rather than back out at that point.

We are lucky to have some new quality developments coming online at a time when optimism, buyers and credit are drying up!

Though, the little evil voice in my head has been praying that a few developments could go “to the wall” without me losing any sleep. Such as the Crosses Green hotel – now business centre. I even thought if the Half Moon St. development didn’t go ahead, it opens up some nice views up to Shandon and the North Cathedral. Would make a great park! :p (and no, that wasn’t a serious hope!)

If by “put forward” you mean the date of the planning application then you are correct, but the point i was making was that these projects were concieved in better times. The date of the planning application is the culmination of many months, and in bigger developments many years, of due dillagence and planning preparation.Funding would have been allocated for these developments, though this is not to say that any project will be completed . Encouragement and incentives are needed now to maintain the momentum.

Images of the OCP development proposed for Anderson’s Quay:

@Radioactiveman wrote:

Images of the OCP development proposed for Anderson’s Quay:

I thought it was a photo of Dresden around 1989.

How many floors will be chopped off ?

Bland facades beyond belief and anything that makes the bus station look good must be wrong ?

I had braced myself for the worst. This is fine. The only issue really is that is quite a big development and as such goes against the granularity that currently exists in the area, but obviously this is the way this part of the city will be going in years to come.

Where is that office developement designed by Wilson’s that got the go ahead a while back? It had a curved quayside facade and was to be located somewhere opposite this site. I know it’s referenced somewhere ont his thread…

Where is that office developement designed by Wilson’s that got the go ahead a while back? It had a curved quayside facade and was to be located somewhere opposite this site. I know it’s referenced somewhere ont his thread…[/QUOTE]

I think you are talking about Paul Kenny’s Treasury Building on (I think) Penrose Wharf. Planning for that must be at least 3 years old. Last I heard that was going ahead alright but who knows….

bit of digging yields this…

Personally, I hope they do tweak the design somewhat, it is a bit bland (which seems to be what the city planners want these days). For purely selfish reasons, I wouldn’t mind if they lopped a floor or two off it either (live right across the river from it and don’t want to be en-shadowed! :p)

I have very mixed feelings about the Treasury building. It has a very nice river-side facade, but the rest of it is very meh… Plus, with the incorporation of the older facades, it’s a compromise that falls between two stools.

A nice design, but should be build elsewhere, IMO.

@d_d_dallas wrote:

bit of digging yields this…

This has to be built 🙂

Hi all,

As I am new to this site im not too sure if im posting this in the right place???

I have a question concerning Cork Bonded Warehouses, well basically the whole site at custom house quay. Does anyone know what the situation will be for it when the Port of Cork move out and when development begins for the docklands area? Will Cork Bonded Warehouse, the company, remain tenants?

rumour was that o callaghans bought it and there was brief mentions of plans for little wine bars/restaurants etc

Port of Cork wont be moving for a good while yet

oh right thanks, bars/restaurants really wouldn’t do the site justice. Such a shame!

@goose_25 wrote:

Hi all,

As I am new to this site im not too sure if im posting this in the right place???

I have a question concerning Cork Bonded Warehouses, well basically the whole site at custom house quay. Does anyone know what the situation will be for it when the Port of Cork move out and when development begins for the docklands area? Will Cork Bonded Warehouse, the company, remain tenants?

There is a thread on the Bonded Warehouses on Custom House Quay here

https://archiseek.com/content/showthread.php?t=6058

@goose_25 wrote:

oh right thanks, bars/restaurants really wouldn’t do the site justice. Such a shame!

Ya Wha! Such a shame???

What would you put there a Tesco or some low rise yuppy apartments?

I can wait till that place is done. Just imagine yourself on a summers evening outside on the terrace having a beer by the water looking down the quays at the Howard Holdings towers. I can’t think of anything better suited for such a place. It will be a huge benefit for tourism and locals alike.

Fanueil Hall in Boston or Darling Harbour in Sydney springs to mind, definitely think it is most suited as a restaurant/bar area.

While we are on the subject it is a shame that up around the Shandon Bells hasn’t been done up properly, There is only one restaurant up there, and around that open area beside the Butter Museum and at the back of the Firkin Crane Centre would make for a nice area with a few restaurants to bring a buzz around the place.

@Bourgeoise wrote:

Innovation ?
As the Port of Cork Bonded Warehouses slowly decay the cobblestone yards in this prime double waterfront location in the heart of Cork City are used as a………………..car park.

its just how to separate the rowing area from the ferry or can one work alongside the other. It involves someone making a decision. Which is difficult it seems. Cue Bord Pleanala.

the docklands forum people have already been to Bremen and Hamburg to see what they did for the docklands and from a recent trip, my eyes were also opened to Oslo (fabulous newish docklands area called Akker Brygge) and Copenhagen, which has been making use of its waterfront for a while by the looks of it, their Opera House is brilliant looking.

The trip also reinforced what a shambles the public transport is in this country, trains from Norway to Sweden to Denmark, all booked from my house on the net, reserved seats, went on time, train staff had perfect English, made sure all the passengers knew where and when to change, lockers in the station to leave your bags for something like 4 or 5 euro, loads of little shops and restaurants in the train stations and trams everywhere in the cities – amazing

Just reinforces the point that Cork is miles and years behind and far too dependent on Dublin funding. I will summon every ounce of positivity I have and say at least they are doing something about it now though.

And yes, I agree with yourself and the brilliantly named Green Jesus that to sit outside the bonded warehouses, just like loads of other cities in Europe, would be pretty cool.

@green_jesus wrote:

Ya Wha! Such a shame???

What would you put there a Tesco or some low rise yuppy apartments?

I can wait till that place is done. Just imagine yourself on a summers evening outside on the terrace having a beer by the water looking down the quays at the Howard Holdings towers. I can’t think of anything better suited for such a place. It will be a huge benefit for tourism and locals alike.

How very narrow minded of you to think the only alternative to ‘bars/restaurants’ is ‘Tesco or some low rise yuppy apartments?’ My idea for the site reaches far beyond the drinking and eating habits of Cork’s locals and tourists. I was thinking the best use would be a museum, which would take up 75% of the space while the rest be devoted to one off shops/workshops giving opportunities to local artists and crafts men/women to work and sell their products. Generating tourism and revenue, while further enhancing Cork’s cultural spirit! Of course there would be a cafe/bar incorporated into the museum to increase its revenue, so you can still have your beer gazing down the quays!! But there would be a further dimension to it.

This way the site would not be lost to a string of bars/restaurants that would eventually become tired and outdated (as they all do) but it would be preserved and given back to the people of Cork.

@goose_25 wrote:

How very narrow minded of you to think the only alternative to ‘bars/restaurants’ is ‘Tesco or some low rise yuppy apartments?’ My idea for the site reaches far beyond the drinking and eating habits of Cork’s locals and tourists. I was thinking the best use would be a museum, which would take up 75% of the space while the rest be devoted to one off shops/workshops giving opportunities to local artists and crafts men/women to work and sell their products. Generating tourism and revenue, while further enhancing Cork’s cultural spirit! Of course there would be a cafe/bar incorporated into the museum to increase its revenue, so you can still have your beer gazing down the quays!! But there would be a further dimension to it.

This way the site would not be lost to a string of bars/restaurants that would eventually become tired and outdated (as they all do) but it would be preserved and given back to the people of Cork.

Boring!!! That sounds like the Cobh Heritage centre to me.

i often wondered about Cobhs heritage, one of the main bits is the history of the emigration from there, to show how people left the country in droves and the other is a former prison.

@green_jesus wrote:

Boring!!! That sounds like the Cobh Heritage centre to me.

So uncouth!

@green_jesus wrote:

Boring!!! That sounds like the Cobh Heritage centre to me.

I think it’s a decent idea. As it is, visitors have to out of their way to find the museum in Fitzgerald’s park, the opening hours aren’t ideal for the wandering tourist, and though I admit I haven’t been there since I was a kid, I’d imagine much of the exhibits wouldn’t be of the type to engage children or young adults.
Found the opening hours here:

Monday to Friday: 11 a.m. – 1 p.m., 2.15 p.m. – 5 p.m.
Saturday: 11a.m. – 1 p.m., 2.15 p.m. – 4 p.m.
Sunday: 3 p.m. – 5 p.m. (April to September).

Some kind of museum or cultural centre would be ideal on that site, along with a few cafes and restaurants. I could imagine a place where visitors could learn about Cork’s history, maritime traditions, the role of the river Lee in the city (and county) throughout the ages etc. Some kind of aquarium (think Boston, Melbourne, Sydney) or maritime museum (think Sydney) (but obsiously on a smaller scale in all cases) would be more engaging for younger people. They could also have a space set aside for civic purposes and even occasional art exhibitions or small performances. I’m picturing a tourist office, visitor centre, city museum, maritime museum, aquarium, civic office, art gallery, exhibition centre, performing arts theatre, cafe terrace, cruise terminal and more, all operating on this site (so as to enable year-round, all-day activity) rathre than… an ugly, out of place car park.

It really is a fantastic site for this kind of venture, with it’s location at the merging of the branches of the river, and would be easy to find with or without a map. It would be staring in the face of those arriving by train or by bus, and would also help to draw tourists and locals alike from the existing city centre east to the nascent docklands precinct.

River taxis (flying pigs?) or tourist-oriented small cruise boats could depart from there, and if the DDDA hadn’t snapped up the Jeanie Johnston she’d be a great asset to have at the site.

I’d be happy to see the local authority invest public money as long as it was done properly, and preserved the character of the original structure. Is there any way for Joe public to increase awareness of this site and its present condition, to encourage those in power to do something about it and to encourage the people who elect them to let them know it’s a major matter of concern to them? Whinging about it on this site isn’t going to get anything done.

And to avoid pissing off the admin it might be wise to continue this discussion in the thread about the site here:
https://archiseek.com/content/showthread.php?t=6058

They are already putting a museum in the Odlums building.

What a waste it would be to turn this site into some romantic time capsule that you might visit once every few years when stuck for something to do when entertaining guests from abroad.

Why not rejoice in this place give it to the people instead of closing it off again.

(ok moving to other thread)

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2000/en/act/pub/0030/sched4.html#sched4 See sections 20 and 21.

if you cannot reach the above the planning and development 2000 can be found at http://www.environ.ie. The section is contained in the fourth schdule.

@Steady wrote:

There is a boardwalk planned between the Nano Nagle bridge and the first building to the east of it, similar to the one outside the Clarion. It may be that once the boardwalk is in place, the concrete beam will not be visible.

I’m afraid I’m very pessimistic about how this boardwalk is going to work out. I used to live on the other side of the river and crossed the Nano Nagle bridge every day on the way to work. That was one of the few areas in the city where the quayside wall was intact and the original railings were present and in good condition.

Since then:
– They installed a large PVC pipe along the quay wall, including a riser which is well up over even high tide.
– The stone wall began collapsing behind the pipe (I don’t know if this was due to the installation of the pipe).
– They’ve knocked the original railings.
– They’ve cemented over much of the stone work.
– They’ve plonked a concrete beam over the stone steps, burying them away from public access.

And now they’re going to build a boardwalk which is likely to obscure what’s left of the stone work.. I don’t really know what the point is in putting a boardwalk that short is, but anyway..

I do admit, the park looks really well, but they are taking the concept of being sensitive to the location/context, and wiping their bums with it and flushing it down the toilet. 🙁

I’d have thought it’d be ideal location if Union Chandlery wanted to relocate across the river. That way it would retain some connection to the sea/sea faring. That, perhaps a small museum… and lots of bars and restaurants and I’d be happy! 🙂

@who_me wrote:

Ah, is that going ahead? Presumably with the regulation 1/2 floors knocked off.

It is kind of a pity the mural is gone. I guess they didn’t think the building would go ahead so soon!

As far as I’am aware CCC did grant planning permission with a one floor reduction but the developer got this reinstated through a Board Planneala appeal.

An image of Origin Enterprises’ Kennedy Quay development which is due for decision by CCC on the 24th. In my opinion, it is a missed opportunity of a development. The plans make no effort to conserve the office building to the west of the site and make token, almost insulting, efforts to conserve minute portions of the R&H Hall Silo buildings. The image is from the Bonded Warehouse site.

@Radioactiveman wrote:

An image of Origin Enterprises’ Kennedy Quay development which is due for decision by CCC on the 24th. In my opinion, it is a missed opportunity of a development. The plans make no effort to conserve the office building to the west of the site and make token, almost insulting, efforts to conserve minute portions of the R&H Hall Silo buildings. The image is from the Bonded Warehouse site.

Very bland, reminds me of the IFSC.

Yet more “copy and paste” architecture, Cork City Council could not give a damm as long as the development levies are suitably large but the design team should be ashamed of themselves for allowing that square featureless monstrosity see the light of day.

McCarthy Developments seems to have suffered a set back with their Jacobs Island scheme. They applied to increase the heights of the previously permitted Apartment blocks 3 + 4 thus increasing the density from 57 units to 106 units for both. These blocks were to be at the tunnel end of the site, The council however under the new application refused permission for Block 3 and want the new proposed height of Block 4 reduced by one story. This now leaves the developers with less apartment units for this section than originally granted.

Origins planning application for the R&H Hall site has been requested for Further Info

Murrayfordes plans for Kyrls Quay have been given the go ahead conditionally, the application was for a 7 storey hotel with pool and 8 storey building with 80 apts

Port of Cork, the owners of one of the finest heritage buildings in the Country that is falling into disrepair (Bonded Warehouses, Custom House Quay) the same Port of Cork Company that has its begging bowl out looking for a digout from the taxpayer to relocate downriver to allow for Docklands regeneration, the same company that has sitting and former councillors on its board have objected to Origin Enterprises plans for the R&H Hall site.:o

Kyrls quay architects website. A few good renders and other interesting developments.:cool: http://www.jla.ie

Atlantic quarter website- great landmark development
http://www.atlanticquarter.com

@johnny21 wrote:

Atlantic quarter website- great landmark development
http://www.atlanticquarter.com

Excellent website, fair play to Howard Holdings for their vision.

Howard Holdings seem to have put up a new website in the past few weeks with some good info on schemes / CGI’s etc…… just in case no one has seen it!!

http://www.howardholdings.com

Sorry, try this link: Kyrls Quay

It’s been a quiet couple of weeks here. Today I noticed they seem to be making a start on that boardwalk by Sullivans Quay. See attached poor quality images from an old camera phone.

Also nice to see workers powerwashing the national monument, whether that’s the ideal way of cleaning the stonework or not.

It seems that the boardwalk (or river platform or whatever) will be very short, from Parliament bridge to Nano Nagle bridge. I wonder would there be any problem with extending it to the South Gate Bridge, and perhaps even all the way along the edge of the brewery site to Lancaster quay? It would do wonders for this neglected part of the river (and this part of the city as a whole).

Also, once this work is completed, the only remaining eyesore on the Grand Parade will be the former Grand Parade hotel and neighbouring sites. Does anyone know what’s the current status of the porject(s) proposed for these sites?

Wow things are moving on since i’ve been away. how are the cafe pods faring? complete yet?

The new board walk at the Grand Parade end of the South Mall is taking shape, it’s going to be fairly short but guess that was as much as it was possible to do.

See the boardwalk opposite tax office is finished.
The ACC building at the end of boardwalk really stands out.
Great potential once vacated by acc. Potentail for Bar/cafe. South West facing aspect. Not many bars in the city where you catch the sun when sitting outside.