Car free cities

I noticed this also in Italy when everyone took their holidays together in August. At last in the city I am in, it was possible to cross the road without having to do a sort of improvised dance through the throng of cars and vespas. However at the end of the holidays here, there were 18 million cars on the road in Italy all trying to return home and most of the roads were at a standstill resembling something out of REM’s ‘everybody hurts’ video. However at the same time the city felt dead largely due to lack of people, but the cars too give life to a city.
Who can think of New York, Rome or London without cars? I’d have to say if there were no cars in the centre of Dublin I would miss the mental satisfaction of flying past the miles of gridlock from the canal to the liffey on my bicycle.

dan, dan, dan, you really shouldn’t rise people who actually drive. dublin is absolutely crazy to drive in, so i only envy you for being able to cycle. new york, where i am at the moment is very different to dublin. if you stay out of midtown, then you can mostly avoid bad traffic. at night the traffic is worse, in my opinion. the horns only really get going after 11. i can’t explain this but i would just say that public transport is very efficient, so that minimises the need for cars. also parking in the city is unbelievably expensive.

p.s yes, you do know me dan.

Friends of mine who work outside the city centre here, loved this morning, no traffic beeping horns at them as they cycled to work.

As a cyclist I say long may it continue.

There’ll be another chance to savour the pleasure in Dublin later this month, on Sept 22nd or 23rd: European day for car-free cities. Details from the Corpo.

Hear, hear to all that – I just spent the last 6 days in Amsterdam doing a lot of cycling. Bikes, as you all know, have primacy there and the feeling was grand. Aaahhh, if only we could be no.1 in Dublin as well.

Some times that I had loved living in Dublin

– Tour de France start, centre of town car free

– occassional street festivals, again streets car free

the human scale of the city really comes out when we dont have everything clogged by buses and cars and as a walker, you notice more, you see the details of the buildings, and learn the way streets intereact and possible reasons why they connect in such ways…. you learn about the city

I’m afraid Dublin is a S***hole.

Reeking of piss, Strewn with litter, Splattered with vomit, and totally congested with noisy traffic. It’s doing my head in…

I can only agree that banishing all non-corporation/Authority/non-delivery vehicles will be a HUGE step in the right direction.

People will have a shorter working week, be less stressed, more pleasant, and perhaps tend not to contribute to the state of affairs listed at the top of this note.

I don’t suppose it will happen though – seeing as our politicians are so spineless and terrified of upsetting ANYBODY. Especially the new ’80’s style, acquisitive BMW driving types who they seem to think are driving this economy.

J

Hi John,
Welcome back.
Couldnt agree more with the sentiments expressed, Dublin has become the most depressing kip – just wondering how this clean up of the square mile between O’Connel and Amiens street will go – good luck to them.

How about banning private transport within the canals and having free public transport within the canals instead. It’s a start!!

Rory W

PS adding 1,000 cars per week to the roads is just plain nuts. Well done Eoin Keegan for cycling in to work, its the sort of top down leadership needed (Now just make the government do it)

Hiya Rory

A pleasant greeting in response to a depressing & angry post! It’s nice to be back – I’ll try to be more positive.

I’ll try…

Cheerio
John

car free day in helsingborg, sweeden

yesterday went well in helsingborg
there were a lot of events going on to raise awareness
i was there on a field trip with lund university to get people to fill out questionaires and get feedback

there were still cars in the city but this was the first time this event happened there.
it is amazing to see how organized the swedes are, all kinds of groups got involved together, kids plays, actors kidnapping the minister of environment, rock bands playing in the train station, jazz bands in the 16th century churh, electric cars on show, free bus passes for the weekend, car drop areas outside the city, etc

the plan there is to work on things for next year and so on

i hope dublin went well, i think it might not have been so organized and i also think that people dont think these issues are too important.

I run another general entertainment site p45.net which as very busy chat boards. All smart young people, with good jobs and tech savvy, mostly living in London and Dublin. All the Dublin posters were anti-car free day, ranting about having to take the bus with the proletariet etc…..

Smart, but still require education

What a bunch of arseholes!

No wonder Dublin is so horrible to work in.

Aaahh, yes… once again I’m reminded of the rise and fall of the Roman Empire in Microcosm. Nice to know that when the country’s economy goes down the tubes those people, accustomed to having towels handed to them by black people in the toilettes of their trendy bars [like Fireworks for example]will HAVE to take the bus!

That’s if they have a job to go to that is…

HA HA HAAAAAA

Arseholes.

I also made a quick visit to p45.com, what a bunch of shitwits. Immature, cocieted and ill educated. These are the type of people I have aspired not to be. They say they dont want to take the bus with the proletariats. They are the ****ing proles, the proles of 2000AD. Working for the ‘boss’, trying to get a raise, shafting collegues & all the time, making someone they dont even know, extremely rich. The only difference with these plonkers is that in 1984 (the book), the proles knew who they were, these guys dont realise they are.

Oh MK! Don’t be silly. Of COURSE they know who they are.

It’s defined by their choice of sunglasses, cars, favourite bars and tech stocks.

To be honest – I hate using public transport at rush hour too but mainly because of congestion. Funny, often the most offensive people are the types we’re talking about with their stinking aftershave, horrible nose-picking, mobile-phone-yelling and snott snorting.

I prefer to cycle to and from work. Keeps me fitter, lowers stress and is very enjoyable especially with the addition of cycle lanes. I’m also fortunate in being able to cycle along the coast for much of it.

Why would I want to blow my hard earned savings on a silly 00 BMW?

Oh JOYOUS indeed!

These are the exact same people who no doubt pay a weekend visit to Temple Bar, drink a lot of alcohol and at the end of the night unable to hold their liquor spew the contents of their guts over the pavements or urinate in doorways as they wait for taxis…..our wealthy young educated professional working classes.As Oscar Wilde said they know the price of everything and the value of nothing.

We might be going a little of the point here in our mutual disregard for the above.
The question is, how can we reduce traffic in Dublin. Make it a pedestrian friendly city?
Will there be more cycle lanes?
Can a citywide ban of even and odd registration No.s on every other day be implemented.
Can we teach our young go-getters to respect the enviornment & each other?
Is it possible for us (anyone who gives a damn) to improve our cities & the air we breathe. I dont want to hear verbal masturbation, just constructive & possible suggestions to a better urban enviornment.

well with cars sales soaring, reaching all time records it look as if the battle with the automobile is lost with regard to us Irish. Roads are too narrow for cycle and bus lanes and with the lust of everyone wanting to possess their very own car it looks as if there’s no way back… maybe a crash at the stock exchanges would help. Sorry folks but I am joining the masses too, well with all the bus strikes that time and the general poor standard of public transport I’ve decided to purchase my very own Honda Prelude,sporty red with white alloy wheels, sunroof and all electrics………….VROOOOOOOM!

Good Boy,
Next please

In issues like car ownership and public transport, people often fail to distinguish between two very different concepts. Car ownership is not the same as car usage. In Ireland car ownership is increasing but still remains relatively low, compared to our neighbours in Europe. We often buy cars, and believe they are the sole means to transporting us, everywhere, work, school, shopping leisure activities. In many European countries cars are used far more efficiently, not to sit in traffic going to work, not for dropping kids to school, usually for evenings and weekend use instead. Admittedly, their alternative of public transport is usually more attractive than ours, however I do believe that they do not share the snobbery a lot of Irish have towards it. There are many many sad people in Ireland who would prefer to sit in a car, in traffic, pay high prices for these cars, ridiculous insurance figures, and high fuel prices, become stressed, believe their status symbol actually means something, impresses others etc., and watch buses fly by in designated bus lanes…… and still they think it is worth it, not to travel on public vehicles. This idea of the status symbol of the car is still powerful,but if u look at the U.S. situation, where the cult of the car originated, it has destroyed cities eg. LA, Phoenix. On the other hand, look at New York, a vibrant, 24hr., city(more European than American), suits and homeless people share subway carriages.They will not think of driving into work. Why?? Our attitude to public transport is the problem, as is the system itself. to all those who are ‘unfortunate ‘ to have to use the buses, keep waving at the lucky drivers as you pass them. Sorry about the length.

Obviously the solution to the traffic problem lies with the government. They have under funded public transport for years which has led to the chronic problem that we have today.They have stalled the development of the LUAS too. However the government encourages car ownership today as it creates huge revenues for them in the form of various taxes. They will not jeopardize this source, will they. Also many new suburban developments be they housing estates, shopping malls, industrial estates are so remote and off the beaten track and served by an unreliable public transport service that it is a necessity for a person to have a car. For example, look at Blanchardstown, Clonee and surrounding areas,it resembles LA. Besides it’s not a crime either for anyone to possess a car of their own, and why not,if they have worked hard enough, they’ve earned it and especially too if the public transport system is an ill performing undependable mess. After years of bussing it,the hours of waiting and getting wet in the rain I am glad to say now that I enjoy driving my own car; an Audi TT hi-tech modern machine, architecture on wheels. No insulting comments please!

The use of public transport does not automatically mean that you are banned from owning your Audi quattro. It does not mean that all those who want to help our enviornment can never drive again. What it does mean is that less fossil fuels will be used, air will be cleaner and the impending demise of our global biosphere will remain at bay a little longer. Could you please try and use a little more grey matter before ranting about the right to own a car. Earning the right to own a car, very commendable, how about the rights of our childern to live in beautiful clean cities, without car crazed rednecks insisting on bringing their inefficient expendable toys everywhere they go, burning fuel & poisoning our skies. Its quite strange that a nation that has been so dependant on the land for so many generations, now has no regard for that self same land.
Also, all those planning to write in about ineffective public transport or the absolute necessity of using their cars daily, please dont. There are always exceptions to the rule and compromises will have to be made by all if we are to achieve a better enviornment for all.

Hmmm, we have the lowest % subsidy public transport system in Europe and we have the worst public transport system in Europe. I see a link forming here!!! In fact most people realise this, except the government, who all go in there ministerial mercs every day. True Public servants would use public transport. But they dont – because as we are seeing the people in government are only there to serve themselves and their cronies, not the public. They have their heads so far up there own arses that they will do nothing about the gridlock until its too late. As can be seen from the taring over of Leinster Lawn – we have a car based government. And one that gives in to the AA and the SIMI about absolutely everything, for god’s sake they are only pressure groups.

THE GOVERNMENT ARE PATHETIC

Rory W

It seems that their is an unwarrented underlying resentment or bitterness from MK regarding car usage, note the perpetual sarcasm ie ‘rednecks’and other such digs. I take it that you do not drive yourself. It is great to take the stereotypical high moral stand and indeed it would be ideal if we could all live in a world full of peace with exotic flowers and trees and cities of wonderous architectural delights whom all could gaze at in awe…..but sadly not so, especially here in Ireland. The Stepford Wives, Shangri La, Elyseum……all stuff of escapist fiction. Human beings en mass are prone to failure despite the guidence of an ‘individual’s’ great ideological views of how we should all live and share this blue planet. But realistically, if you consider economic history any country that became considerably wealthy, car ownership grew expediently, ie look at the USA and Europe after WW2, the cadilacs,the autobahns…etc. But it’s because Ireland was way behind the rest of the western world that such a boom in car ownership as well as everything else is only occurring now and we can’t seem to cope with it. It’s because we have had inadequate governments with inadequate think-tanks and worthless solutions and policies that such chronic traffic problems as well as others exist today. The problem lies with the government who make and who supposedly enforce the laws that govern the land for the betterment of the people and society.How can car usage be moderated when the government creates a climate that encourages car usage……..it’s hypothetical.

The resentment is not unwarranted, if people cant get over their own selfish desires on this issue, then the change will never come about. Thank you for the brief synopsis of the Irish Automotive Post War Psychology.
So what!
Is our intellect so restrained that we are not aware of the damage and inconvenience we cause each other. People who buy cars are not (I hope not) inncoent children. If everyone is so aware of the damage caused to cities like LA of Athens, then why continue down that same path. It does not make any sense and that is irrefutable.
Also, Im not looking for the ever elusive Nirvana, no need to turn into a drama queen over that, all we need is a small concerted effort from everyone.
The government, we elect them, there not omnipotent beings, if they are incompetant, dont elect them again, write to you local TD or the relevant Minister, (for Transport par example). The government represent US, they reflect what we are willing to tolerate. Their power stems from what we let them have.

Well I can honestly say that I do my best for the environment.As a former horticulturist I recycle my waste, organic matter goes on the compost heap for my lush garden, I recycle my glass when ever I can find a bottle bank. I would’nt dare think of driving a car; what an expensive device, when a bicycle a bus or walking is sufficient. I am energy conscious in the home conserving electricity and heating energy, who needs a telly when a good book with recycled paper does. I limit the use of non bio-degradable products and use organically grown food stuffs, no genetically modified food for me. Microwaves are definitely out as well as mobile phones.Who knows what damage they cause; cancers and tumours. OK you may say it’s a frugal life, I may live like a member of the Amish community but I do my best for the environment. I would only hope everyone followed suit too and as Louis Armstrong sang ‘What a Wonderful World it would be.’

As well as pointing out the serious damage excessive car use does to the environment and to people with breathing related conditions (pedestrians, cyclists, and drivers), it is worth pointing out to people who become hysterical about the absolute right to ‘own’ a car(another great Americanism)that more people in this century have died at the hands of automobiles, than have died in W.W.I., W.W.II., the Korean, and Vietnam wars combined.Ignoring these types of statistics is not too different to Charlton Heston in the U.S. defending the principle of the right to ‘own’ a gun after schoolchildren were shot dead in shool classrooms. I am not oversimlifying here, nor do I suggest banning cars, I am merely saying that the disadvantages of cars are numerous and are easily, and conveniently ignored, by car enthusiasts. e.g. Some people on this post have written in to describe their new cars, fair play, well earned I’d say. “Just watch me rev. her up, put on my shades, and sit in traffic, what a car”. “it’s a six speed Alfa, I’ve only used three gears” etc. I’m not being facetious here, you must admit, it is pathetic.

I must say – I’d love to have a car. It’d be useful on Sundays for excursions out of Dublin etc. That’s probably all I’d use it for really – so it’d be a waste of money.

If you live in the country I suppose it is vital. Cars are brilliant – let’s just seriously ask ourselves: do they really belong in cities to they extent that they do at present?

The odd/even numberplate idea is the type of idea that does work. In Florence for example, I’ve seen the wardens standing at the entances to the city centre checking on the the stickers displayed in windscreens. Green for odd dates red for even I think it goes. The outer city of Siena area is mayhem – hell on earth with traffic [don’t ever try to visit by car – we failed and had to return the next day by train!] but the inner city is beautifully quiet and very lively – full of contented people walking it’s streets in peace and quiet.

Doesn’t the Irish government have a huge amount of money left over from last year that they aren’t spending? That’s what I’ve heard. What’s going on?

Yeah! you guys are right ‘Cars’ should be banned, full stop and i’m not being sarcastic. I mean what benefits have automobiles given us in the 20th century, absolute zero, would you say, think about it! Bicycles are the way to go and to add, how about doing away with other modes of mechanical transport; aircraft, look at the detrimental pollution they produce.How about heavy industry too. We could all live in adobi mud huts, natural and environmentally friendly. Why not? Half the world who’s living in poverty does.I mean look at the massive damage the building industry causes to the environment, well with the cement and stone quarries, the large felling of trees and forests, the loss of fine agricultural land to building etc….and these inane fashion conscious architects using the products of such industries…the use of steel, glass etc.. all products of an industry that rapes , plunders and scars the land. Maybe I’m going too far you say now, but if you’re really concerned about the environment it is the only way for the world to heal itself, is it not. Do you object now because you’d forfeit your cosy little centrally heated homes, your appliances that make life so easy, your foreign holidays, your massed produced food and clothing, your entertainments and luxuries which is so convienient. What’s so ironic too is the hypocritical outcry on this forum over the demolition of Archers garage,a tribute to the car and a symbol of the ‘great’ automobile age when at it’s peak.

Ray, your a drama queen, a sensationalist & I presume an all round panic merchant of a pessimestic diposition. I have no intention of getting involved in a mud(adobe, not adobi) slinging match with someone of questionable intellect. The title of this debate is ‘Car Free Cities’ & you seem a little off the mark. Cross pollination between subjects is always inevitable sometimes a great thing, but your alarmist nature takes it to the extreme. We are trying to discuss one aspect of urbanism & how to improve it, with respect to automotive traffic.
How pointless it is to discuss the possibility of car free cities whilst also pondering all other aspects of the worlds problems. Small steps in any better direction are a far greater addition to mankind than your fatalist nonsense.
Basically, grow up and try to contribute in a positive manner so we can all benefit, or else, **** off

For the record, I don’t have a car either but would like one, like John, for leaving the city at weekends. The ease of travel is something that we do take for granted nowadays and its not a right that will be removed easily. Far better an approach like the “odd / even days” mentioned here.

Can I also say, and I think I speak for most here, that I would prefer if the posts didnt get personal. Attack the idea constructively, not the person.

It’s especially easy to do that when not using your real/full name!

Re: Duncan and the Swedes. Yes, Sweden is organised, green, healthy and puts the Irish to shame, but it is one of the most boring countries in the world! So much is regimented, controlled. Dublin: unorganised, dirty, unhealthy, but young Swedes love it!

I think the solution to the transport problem/traffic chaos has been raised here a few times which some people have failed to see but have resorted to personal insults. To repeat what I can gather, the problem lies clearly with the successive governments who have failed over the years to fund public transport and this has led to the car culture that we have today. This is re-iterated especially when one see that the government yesterday is finally addressing the problem overall …..One hopes!

As this is and architecture/design website, is there a design angle on this (i.e. some way design/ers can contribute to improving the situation)?

As this is and architecture/design website, is there a design angle on this (i.e. some way design/ers can contribute to improving the situation)?

Not really, more practical solutions are needed here, the ones that can be done with the stroke of the pen. But how about the design of bus shelters, bollards, paving patterns, a big one ……bridges, roads etc…..

Architectural isuues do not mean that you make a beeline for the mayline. Design is nearly all discussion and refinement of an idea. In solving the problem of traffic and polluted air, the magic pen will not suffice. Design is debate and discussion.
What do you think separates great designers from the mediocre. Its their ability to discuss problems concerning design on their deepest level, not gloss over the top.
In architecture, to solve difficult problems, all avenues must be explored.
A new bollard or bus shelter will not make a car free Dublin, maybe a prettier Dublin(which is a good thing), but not a car free Dublin. Bjorn, do young Sweedes like grimy Dublin like our Students like to visit Asia, go once, be amazed & invigorated by what you seen, then leave & return to your better, fairer world.
Grimy Dublin may be a romantic fantasy for 6 months, but something has to be done to clean it up. Large scale public opinion must be swayed, a government with the balls to make radical changes, even at their own political detriment, must do so, transport must be provided.
Also, I would like to apologise for the personal insults. I had a certain dread that the debate was going to turn very silly, & all that was being discussed in a constructive manner was going to be lost in a sea of nonsense, as has happened before on this site.

Hi Mk, When I stated that traffic problems can be solved with the stroke of the pen I was referring to the government who has the power to implement the policies to create a more ‘car free city’. Such a climate has to be created first so as everything can then follow suit. You seem to realise this when you refer to a government with balls…..

Sorry GCC,
I reread & my mistake, indeed changes must be made from the top, we need our leadership to lead by example, but all we seem to get is the opposite. Most people see what our leaders do, and then know that by doing the exact opposite, they will be ethically correct

Sorry GCC,
I reread & my mistake, indeed changes must be made from the top, we need our leadership to lead by example, but all we seem to get is the opposite. Most people see what our leaders do, and then know that by doing the exact opposite, they will be ethically correct

Sorr GCC.
I misinterpreted what was said by reading too fast. Indeed your right, where to from now?

Firstly, I don’t live in Ireland anymore. I was back for two weeks a couple of months ago, and was once again (with difficulty) using a sub standard public transport system to travel from one part of Dublin to another. So if anything I’m saying is out of date, I apologise in advance.
There are a couple of basic changes I would like to see to make the public transport system easier to use.

1. Standard tickets. These could be used both on Darts and Buses. The same zones and fares should apply. I would like to see the return of the ten journey bus ticket, since a two journey ticket is a pain for frequent travellers. If you have a journey that involves Dart and bus every day, you need two different types of ticket and a lot of patientce.

2. Timetables. Accurate bus departure and arrival times, as far as that is practical, and minimum and maximum waiting times so you can decide if you want to wait fourty minutes, or not. There are certain buses (I can’t think of any specific numbers off hand) that run two times a day, and not at all at the weekend. What is the point? Can these routes not be expanded or integrated with another route?

3. Bus maps. Every stop should have a map indicating the route to be taken and all stops on it, not just the major five stops on a route with fifty stops. These maps should also be in the buses. At the moment, if you can find the bus stop (some chance after dark), you have to hope the driver both knows where you are going, and remembers to stop the bus for you.

4. Frequency. There should be more Darts and Buses at all times of the day, but certainly at peak times. Darts should have more carriages (this probably means extending some of the station platforms) and buses more standing room and better ventilation. The final Dart of the day (at an unfeasibly early 11:15) is full at Tara street and only has two Carriages. Why?

5. Integrated systems. Things seem a little out of control. We already have frequent flyers, imps, airport buses, nightlinks, standard buses, darts, trains, and now we’re going to have luas and a metro? How are all these systems supposed to work together? Are we going to need a ticket for Luas, one for Dart, etc. etc.? And Is everything going to be painted that sickly green colour?

6. Bus shelters (featuring maps as described before) at every stop. The weather is pretty horrible a lot of the time, and waiting in the rain for a bus that may or may not turn up is not a good way to start the day.

7. Later running times. Public transport should run until at least 1 am every night. nightlinks once an hour after 11 are not good enough, in my opinion. And the nightlink needs yet another type of ticket.

Even tiny things would help, for example indicating stopping points at dart stations so the elderly don’t have to run after a dart with two carriages that stops at the far end of the platform, or people being polite enough to allow passengers on the Dart to get off before they force their way on.
I think that making the system more user friendly would (hopefully) encourage more users, and thus reduce car traffic. This has little to do with design, and everything to do with effective operation. But i won’t hold my breath. I hope someone in power is going to have a look at how the public transport systems operate in other European cities (Paris and Berlin spring to mind) before decisions are taken about the operation of luas and a proposed metro.