New Advertising in Dublin

Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby Smithfield Resi » Tue Feb 24, 2009 8:14 am

Does anyone have other examples of permitted advertising in Z9 areas?


2541/01 - Z9 (Newcomen Bridge - those massive scrollers)

Application for retention is 2129/09
LOCATION 1, Newcomen Avenue, Dublin 3
Retention of 2no. scrolling advertising structures

Last date for observations is 26th Feb (hint ;))

http://137.191.231.240/swiftlg/apas/run/WPHAPPDETAIL.DisplayUrl?theApnID=2129/09
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby publicrealm » Tue Feb 24, 2009 4:36 pm

Smithfield Resi wrote:2541/01 - Z9 (Newcomen Bridge - those massive scrollers)

Application for retention is 2129/09
LOCATION 1, Newcomen Avenue, Dublin 3
Retention of 2no. scrolling advertising structures

Last date for observations is 26th Feb (hint ;))

http://137.191.231.240/swiftlg/apas/run/WPHAPPDETAIL.DisplayUrl?theApnID=2129/09


I think 2129/09 is a toss up between Z1 and Z9 - with the Z1 being most prominent.

I have been digging and found 4 to 5 DCC 'metropole' grants in Z9 locations. Of course they might maintain that footpaths are unzoned (techniclly arguable) - but I think it is reasonable to argue, when the footpath ajoins a public park/playing pitches etc, that Z9 zoning should apply.

I'm trying to get my hands on a copy of the "Zones of Advertising Control" map presented by DCC at the Oral Hearing into the metropole saga (referred to in the Board Inspector's report. Anyone know where to get it 9no luck with the DCC website, amazingly)
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby Smithfield Resi » Tue Feb 24, 2009 7:03 pm

The map of "Zones of Advertising Control" or 'Zones where we would like to put advertising' as it should really be known, was published in Plan Magazine recently. It won't be on the DCC website as councillors have not seen it nor approved it. Drop me a PM and I'll see if I can help further.
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby Paul Clerkin » Tue Feb 24, 2009 7:14 pm

publicrealm wrote:I'm trying to get my hands on a copy of the "Zones of Advertising Control" map presented by DCC at the Oral Hearing into the metropole saga (referred to in the Board Inspector's report. Anyone know where to get it 9no luck with the DCC website, amazingly)



This one?
http://ireland.archiseek.com/news/2008/000134.html
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby publicrealm » Tue Feb 24, 2009 9:19 pm

Smithfield Resi wrote:The map of "Zones of Advertising Control" or 'Zones where we would like to put advertising' as it should really be known, was published in Plan Magazine recently. It won't be on the DCC website as councillors have not seen it nor approved it. Drop me a PM and I'll see if I can help further.


SR and Paul -

Many thanks - I couldn't find it anywhere - not even on the Board's paper file.

The way the whole affair was set up really brings planning into disrepute (in my opinion) and is very demoralising.

I look forward to reviewing the map.

P.
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby newgrange » Tue Feb 24, 2009 10:03 pm

Smithfield Resi wrote:2541/01 - Z9 (Newcomen Bridge - those massive scrollers)

Application for retention is 2129/09
LOCATION 1, Newcomen Avenue, Dublin 3
Retention of 2no. scrolling advertising structures

Last date for observations is 26th Feb (hint ;))


I've put in an observation on this and a later one (2224/09) they have applied for at the same site.
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby newgrange » Fri Feb 27, 2009 7:01 pm

From a thread on boards.ie:
Image
Image
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby Smithfield Resi » Sat Feb 28, 2009 4:52 pm

Ah...beat me to it!!

This one has more ironing* than than a laundry....I spotted this outside the Dept of Transport on Nassau St.

Image



*irony..(ahem)

I also spotted more variations;

GIVE US PLANNING PERMISSION OR THE KITTENS DIE and (my favourite)
ENJOY YOUR INVISIBLE SHIT-A$$ BIKES
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby lostexpectation » Sun Mar 01, 2009 6:21 pm

well as pointed out before the latin motto on the lamppost already says

'The obedience of the citizens produces a happy city'
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby Figlen » Tue Mar 03, 2009 12:48 pm

My apologies if this is not the place for this message but I am quite new to this issue and trying to get a handle on where exactly it stands at the moment.

If people could just let me know whether the points listed below represent a reasonable representation of where this stands at the moment, I would be extemely grateful.

-JCD may be starting to build the bike stands this month

-a few of the metropanels have been removed or moved due to safety concerns (but nowhere near the number that had been flagged as dangerous)

-none of the existing 48 panel billboards that were supposed to have been removed as part of the deal have been removed

-safety concerns about the placement of backlit, moving advertising in the sightlines of drivers have not been effectively addressed.

-wayfinding systems and toilets that were to be part of the deal have been dropped

-original proposed numbers of bicycles has been reduced, as have the number of metropoles/metropanels

-safety issues of metropanels being unsafe for blind pedestrians have not been addressed

-the contract that DCC have with JCD is still under wraps, so we still don't really know what DCC stands to get from it.

-the localised cityscape that features at the bottom of the metropanels seems to be the same for all of them (dome + some other blocky buildings)

-concerns that some people have about the over-saturation of advertising in public spaces have not been addressed

By the way, I am not a journalist!
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby gunter » Tue Mar 03, 2009 1:50 pm

Figlen wrote:-none of the existing 48 panel billboards that were supposed to have been removed as part of the deal have been removed


Somebody will know if this is true or not. I have to say that this, rather than the bikes, would be the key for me.

I could begin to tolerate the additional clutter at street level, if this DCC / JCD billboard initiative were to begin to break the link between street advertising and the blank bits of peoples' walls and buildings, and not just add another host location into the mix.
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby ctesiphon » Tue Mar 03, 2009 4:42 pm

Hello Mr(s) non-journalist. I can answer some of your questions:

Figlen wrote:-JCD may be starting to build the bike stands this month

Locations are decided; I understand that the bikes are due by June/July, so presumably the stands are coming pretty soon.

-a few of the metropanels have been removed or moved due to safety concerns (but nowhere near the number that had been flagged as dangerous)

True. Dorset Street and Rathmines Road were both definitely removed, possibly more. hutton should be able to throw more light on this?

-none of the existing 48 panel billboards that were supposed to have been removed as part of the deal have been removed

I believe that thay claim to have removed some. I know that some of those nominated for removal were hard to identify due to mistakes (mistakes?) with the locations. In addition, it would be worth finding out if the ones slated for removal were already illegal. An Taisce produced a dossier at the Oral Hearing regarding JCD's history of compliance (or not) with Enforcement proceedings.

-safety concerns about the placement of backlit, moving advertising in the sightlines of drivers have not been effectively addressed.

True. Road safety was the backbone of the DTO's argument at the Oral Hearing. All of the large roadside panels that were appealed were refused PP by the Board. You could possibly infer from this that, had all of the roadside panels been appealed, they all would have been refused.

-wayfinding systems and toilets that were to be part of the deal have been dropped

True. There are details in the earlier pages of this thread, but if I remember correctly, the 'contract' was re-negotiated after the ABP Oral Hearing- bike numbers reduced, wayfinding dropped, etc.

-original proposed numbers of bicycles has been reduced, as have the number of metropoles/metropanels

Some of the panels were dropped at the Planning Application stage (due either to Invalidation of the Application or on the advice of DCC [usually conservation/heritage grounds]), others fell at ABP Oral Hearing stage. The number of bikes was reduced only after the Hearing, with JCD arguing that fewer signs permitted resulted in fewer bikes, despite the supposed existence of a 'contract', and the repeated assertions from DCC et al that the signs and the bikes weren't directly related.

-safety issues of metropanels being unsafe for blind pedestrians have not been addressed

True, I think. NCBI certainly aired concerns when the panels were unveiled, and the grounds for those concerns haven't gone away.

-the contract that DCC have with JCD is still under wraps, so we still don't really know what DCC stands to get from it.

Definitely still under wraps. I think a committee (Councillors and members of the DCC executive?) was established to examine the contract, bit I don't think they've reported back yet.

-the localised cityscape that features at the bottom of the metropanels seems to be the same for all of them (dome + some other blocky buildings)

It is the same for all, and lacks the 'Dublin specific' design that we were told we'd get.

-concerns that some people have about the over-saturation of advertising in public spaces have not been addressed

Metropanels or not, many people have had these concerns for a long time. This scheme might (might!) result in the replacement of big ugly signs with these flashy new yokes, but to what end? There's still no reduction in number, and the new signs are generally far more visible than the ones they'll (supposedly) replace.

By the way, I am not a journalist!

Neither am I!
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby gunter » Tue Mar 03, 2009 6:39 pm

ctesiphon wrote:Figlen quote: By the way, I am not a journalist!

Neither am I!


Are journalists in the dog house too? . . . I thought it was just bankers!
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby Figlen » Wed Mar 04, 2009 2:50 pm

Thanks for the comments ctesiphon. Gunter, I'm not a banker either!
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby gunter » Wed Mar 04, 2009 3:41 pm

Figlen wrote: I'm not a banker either!


You're in the clear so!

Actually, serving in McDonalds, could be one of the more respected professions by the time this is all over.
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby ctesiphon » Wed Mar 04, 2009 5:33 pm

gunter wrote:Are journalists in the dog house too? . . . I thought it was just bankers!


I've nothing against journalists! Of those I know, one has a good handle on the planning and development game (;)) and the other two ride bikes, so they're all alright by me.

If you want to see a conflicted ctesiphon, put a banker on a bike.
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby newgrange » Mon Mar 23, 2009 6:04 pm

Plan No.: 2129/09
LOCATION: 1, Newcomen Avenue, Dublin 3
Retention of 2no. scrolling advertising structures


RETENTION PERMISSION REFUSED


Condition(s) and reason(s) FOR condition(s)
1. Having regard to the location and residential zoning of the site and to Development Plan policies to promote the development of underutilised infill sites it is considered that the retention of the advertising structures would not make full use of the development potential of the site and would, therefore be contrary to the proper planning and sustainable development of the area.

2. Having regard to the specitic standards and guidelines set out in the Development Plan to be applied to Outdoor Advertising and to the scale and prominence of the forty-eight sheet panels it is considered that the proposed development would be contrary to the guidelines, would seriously injure the visual amenities of the area and of property in the vicinity and would, therefore, be contrary to the proper planning and sustainable development of the area.


Date of decision: March 18th, 2009.
Appeals to be submitted within four weeks.


JC Decaux have another application in for this site 2224/09 which involves some 'Metropoles'.
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby newgrange » Thu Apr 02, 2009 9:49 am

newgrange wrote:
JC Decaux have another application in for this site 2224/09 which involves some 'Metropoles'.


This has been granted permission with the following condition regarding the 'metropoles'.

2. One of the proposed Metropole advertising structures shall be omitted from the development, the details of which shall be agreed in writing with the Planning Authority. Prior to the commencement of any works on site, the applicants shall remove the existing billboards and supporting structures from site and no further billboards / advertising signs are to be erected without as prior grant of planning permission. The erection of the proposed metropole shall be erected after the comprehensive redevelopment of the site. Reason: In the interests of residential amenity and the visual amenities of the area.

What is wrong with DCC? Answers on a very large postcard please.

The Metropoles that were appealed to ABP were all rejected and now DCC go ahead and grant permission to stick one closer to the protected structure of Newcomen bridge than the one that was rejected across the road.

I suppose another €230 will have to be forked out to get ABP to (presumably) reject this crap again.
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby newgrange » Fri Apr 10, 2009 8:35 pm

I intend appealing this to ABP.
It makes a mockery of their decision to refuse permission the other side of the road only a short while ago.

If anyone has any further insights or information they feel might be useful for me to include in the appeal, please PM me.
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby lostexpectation » Mon Apr 20, 2009 3:58 am

Council forced to apply for planning on advertising signs
http://www.dublinpeople.com/content/view/1809/57/
DÚN Laoghaire Rathdown County Council has been forced to row back on plans it had to erect up to 80 advertising structures across the county without planning permission.
But a number of local politicians who pressured the council into the u-turn are still unhappy as officials want to apply for permission to erect the units through a specific procedure that cannot be appealed to An Bord Pleanála.

n February, councillors voted to accept a deal with outdoor advertising company, Clear Channel Ireland, that would involve the council erecting 60 on-street advertising ‘six sheet’ structures all over the county.
Under the initial deal the local authority will be paid e10 million over a 10-year period for the sites. But management recently reduced the number of sites to 47.
Two weeks ago it emerged that the council had also signed a deal with another outdoor advertising firm, JC Decaux, to erect a further 30 large ‘metropole’ advert structures, measuring 16 sq mt, in various locations around the county.
The local authority has not revealed how much they will receive from the JC Decaux contract.
The council had originally said it would not have to apply for planning permission for each individual advertising structure as developments under a threshold of e126,000 are deemed to be exempt from requiring planning permission.


The council has now confirmed that the proposed outdoor advertising contracts with both JC Decaux and Clear Channel will be subject to the planning process, which will involve a Part 8 approval being granted by the council for each of the proposed advertising structures,“ a spokeswoman said.
Part 8 planning applications are those made by a local authority to councillors for works such as roads and community centres.
Following consideration of submissions received from the public, the county manager presents a report to councillors for the approval of the scheme.
Councillors can then decide to accept or reject the proposed development, with or without variations or modifications.
However, decisions made by local authorities under the process can’t be subsequently appealed to An Bord Pleanála.
...
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby jdivision » Mon Jun 01, 2009 11:41 pm

From the Tribune:
Advertising company JC Decaux has asked the council to include recognition of the "potential to generate revenue streams from existing facilities which could fund other public-realm enhancement programmes". The company's controversial deal with DCC to provide bikes and other facilities in return for advertising is cited as an example of this. "We feel there could be potential scope for further public-realm enhancement schemes which could be self-funded through utilitising existing DCC resources," wrote Julie Mulleady, business development director at JC Decaux, which also wants the question posed of a potential expansion of the bikes for hire scheme which might be deemed or considered appropriate.

Dublin City Business Association, however, said that once deals such as the one with JC Decaux are agreed, they are locked off and no longer commercially sensitive so therefore DCC should make them available for public inspection. "The unpopular contract agreed by city officials with advertising firm JC Decaux has done a great deal of damage to the good reputation of the local authority – but in particular, by virtue of the council withholding on releasing the contract after it had been agreed," it said in its submission.

It also said the council should be clear when a CPO is being moved or threatened and that councillors should be made aware of this prior, and during the process. "Dublin City Council must avoid being brought into situations where the authority's reputation can become tarnished by suggestions of unfair deals," it wrote.

Finally, Dublin Port said it was a matter of great concern to them that "some council officials have advocated the closure of the port in favour of property development".

http://www.tribune.ie/business/news/article/2009/may/31/development-from-the-lobby-up/
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby newgrange » Mon Aug 17, 2009 11:10 am

The latest decision by ABP on the Newcomen bridge structure and the proposed Metropole is due this week.
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby Smithfield Resi » Tue Aug 18, 2009 11:34 pm

Any word on Dun L's deal?
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby newgrange » Thu Aug 20, 2009 10:08 am

Haven't heard anything on Dun Laoghaire.
Newcomen bridge decision put back til 15th October.
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Re: New Advertising in Dublin

Postby StephenC » Thu Aug 20, 2009 3:24 pm

More to the point does anyone know of any instances where JC Decaux panels have been taken down in accordance with the original deal. I cant say I have noticed any big changes.
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