The Opera Centre

[PoxyShamrok]

I think we should start a thread on The Opera Centre so we can keep up with the latest news concerning this Development

[ShaneP]

I guess this is of some relevence. What are your thoughts on the whole thing PoxyShamrock?

http://www.limerickpost.ie/dailynews.elive?id=7479&category=Daily-Thu

[PoxyShamrok]

Does anybody know when Construction will start on the Opera Centre? I cant even find who the building contractors are. I read that its a belfast firm called Regeneration Developments but i cant find anything about them on the internet! anybody know anything?:confused:

[PoxyShamrock]

Worrying times for the Opera Centre, and I must admt the picture in the post was fairly hideous.


Opera centre backers express concern at start-up delay


THERE is growing concern that the investors behind the proposed m200 euro Opera Shopping Centre at Patrick Street/Rutland Street, might be discouraged from proceeding because of the start-up delay imposed by a planning objection to the project.

Limerick auctioneer Pat Kearney, who spent three years putting the package together, this week told the Limerick Post that they were already running well behind time.

"One local person has cited objections to the proposed development in a lengthy submission to An Bord Pleanala, and a decision is not expected until late October, and even then there are no guarantees.

"It is not for me to discuss the merits or otherwise of the objections raised, but what I will say is, that all connected with the project are becoming frustrated. "The developers had set a timeline of 2007 for the grand opening, but now we are looking at well into 2008.

"We had to negotiated with something like 40 clients in putting the entire deal together and they are looking for their money. All is now in the lap of the gods. There are some crucial weeks ahead.

"The danger is that retailers who had expressed an interest in locating at the Opera Centre might be having second thoughts because of the delay. Take Debenhams, for example. It is known they had shown an interest in becoming an anchor tenant, but they have since leased the Roches Stores property”.

Mr Kearney, in calling for a review of the planning process, pointed out that the developers were not in a position to draw down finance until such time as the path had been cleared to commence demolition work on the existing buildings.

"We are talking in terms of a multi million euro investment-this will be the biggest inner city development of its type in Limerick and let’s hope it will be resolved as soon as possible”.

[Paul Clerkin]

Ahhh, the old FUD technique to try and scare the council....

[ctesiphon]

FUD?
I'm not familiar with this acronym.

[Paul Clerkin]

Fear Uncertainty Doubt - coined by IBM execs I think, as a way of encouraging people to buy IBM in the 80s

[ctesiphon]

Thanks, Paul.

[Dan Sullivan]

I'm hearing rumours that approval may have been granted, no word on conditions as yet.

[CologneMike]

€350m Limerick centre gets go-ahead

KATHRYN HAYES



PLANNING PERMISSION has been granted for the largest shopping centre in the midwest.

The €350 million Opera Centre in Limerick city is expected to create over 300 jobs during the construction phase and a further 800 jobs when completed.

The 38,500sq m facility will consist of two anchor units and 38 other retail units, as well as a basement car park with 505 spaces.

Construction is expected to take over two years to complete, but a start date for the massive project will be subject to approval from An Bord Pleanála.

Limerick City Council confirmed yesterday that planning permission had been granted for the multimillion euro development.

The local authority has already acquired a large number of plots of land and properties in Limerick city in order to pave the way for the construction of the centre, which was first mooted in 2005.

New plans lodged last May incorporate six additional buildings, including the Granary and the old Town Hall which are protected structures and are to be preserved.

The approved plans will also preserve the original home on Patrick Street of Limerick-born soprano Catherine Hayes, which will be refurbished and handed back to Limerick Civic Trust.

Mayor of Limerick John Gilligan said it was a vote of confidence in Limerick city but warned that was just the beginning of the process.

"I'm delighted, particularly with the news that so many jobs will be created, jobs which will be high quality and sustainable in the long term," he said. "However, this is not the end of the process. I hope there will be discussions with the sitting tenants who will be affected by this development and we can do everything we can to facilitate them," he said.

Pat Keogh, the project manager for Regeneration Developments Ltd, said he welcomed Limerick City Council's decision to grant planning permission, adding that the company was still considering the conditions the council had attached before making any further comment.

An Bord Pleanála meanwhile is due to rule later this month on an objection to a compulsory purchase order by Limerick City Council of a small plot of land needed to facilitate the development.

The local authority wants to gain title to Bank Place, which is less than 100sq m in size, but Trinity Rooms nightclub, which is located beside the site, has objected to the compulsory purchase order because it claims it will put the future of the nightclub at risk.

At a recent oral hearing, Limerick City Council senior planner Dick Tobin, admitted that revised plans for the Opera Centre development could put the nightclub's future in jeopardy.

However the local authority had to "weigh carefully the opportunity to create 1,000 jobs with the temporary displacement of 100 jobs at Trinity Rooms".

In a statement issued after the hearing, Pat Barry, managing director of Trinity Rooms, claimed this was "an appallingly cavalier attitude" to the jobs and livelihood of his workers.

© 2008 The Irish Times

[PoxyShamrock]

Are the two images in the above post images of the same part of the centre or is the first image the Ellen St/Michael St entrance?

[Tuborg]

The top image is the proposed entrance at the corner of Ellen Street/Michael Street, not very inspiring is it? Unfortunately the developers think its an appropriate replacement for the historic buildings on Ellen Street!:rolleyes: The corner feature will be accomodated anyway, regardless of whether the buildings are retained or not as the site is vacant between Quins pub and the street corner!

There are 18 conditions attached to the grant of permission, Dan have you recieved any information on these?

[shanekeane]

The top image is the proposed entrance at the corner of Ellen Street/Michael Street, not very inspiring is it? Unfortunately the developers think its an appropriate replacement for the historic buildings on Ellen Street!:rolleyes: The corner feature will be accomodated anyway, regardless of whether the buildings are retained or not as the site is vacant between Quins pub and the street corner!

There are 18 conditions attached to the grant of permission, Dan have you recieved any information on these?

Considering what's there right now, I don't think anybody could complain about that corner entrance to the Opera Centre!

[KeepAnEyeOnBob]

shanekeane:

Really? What about the Ellen Street side just past the corner entrance? The mockup is nice blue sky and sunny, but will the bland side facade there (which will not look white in dull Limerick weather) really look better than the brick buildings along the street at present? Sure the old AIB building is an eyesore, but I think the development will just change Ellen Street from a rundown brick facaded street to a modern faceless alley.

[shanekeane]

shanekeane:

Really? What about the Ellen Street side just past the corner entrance? The mockup is nice blue sky and sunny, but will the bland side facade there (which will not look white in dull Limerick weather) really look better than the brick buildings along the street at present? Sure the old AIB building is an eyesore, but I think the development will just change Ellen Street from a rundown brick facaded street to a modern faceless alley.

Ok, hang on. The corner of Ellen Street and Michael Street? That is currently boarded up, was until recently a surface car park. Actually it wasn't, it was just a piece of tarmac across the road from the Watergate flats with broken glass all over it that people used as a car park. I'm not saying that this is magnificent, but it will surely look better than that.

I can't see from the picture how far this goes down. Does it take up the whole of Ellen Street? I actually quite like Ellen Street. It has old antique shops and shopfronts and if it were cleaned up and pedestrianized it could be quite quaint. I certainly don't agree with knocking the Georgian buildings, but I think that picture shows what will be on the corner part which is just tarmac.

[KeepAnEyeOnBob]

Sorry, I was referring to the second image, the corner of Patrick/Ellen St.

[jimg]

I'm gutted. Limerick takes a step closer to being Ireland's answer to a soulless, UK provincial town; Swansea - anyone?

Horrible, horrible. Arthur's Quay on steroids.

There's so much brownfield in Limerick why destroy a huge chunk of historical stock? It can only be justified by a hatred of Georgian and historic buildings as none of these buildings are derelict given they are in active use (or were up to a year ago or so). The current terrace from the bridge to Ellen St. will be missed. It's the same idiocy which welcomed the destruction of the old Cannocks building (and most of that block), championed the Sarsfield St. Dunnes, the creation of Liddy St., Arthur's Quay, etc.. And no, a single restoration along with fascade retention (an 80s concept which at this stage would be laughed at by any enlightened planning dept) does not imply anything but the meanest lip-service to respecting Limerick's historic structure. This developing is so dated in concept and execution it's laughable.

Mark my words, in less than 20 years time, people will look at "old" photos of Patrick St. and Ellen St. as they are now and wonder wtf were people thinking?

[shanekeane]

I'm gutted. Limerick takes a step closer to being Ireland's answer to a soulless, UK provincial town; Swansea - anyone?

Horrible, horrible. Arthur's Quay on steroids.

There's so much brownfield in Limerick why destroy a huge chunk of historical stock? It can only be justified by a hatred of Georgian and historic buildings as none of these buildings are derelict given they are in active use (or were up to a year ago or so). The current terrace from the bridge to Ellen St. will be missed. It's the same idiocy which welcomed the destruction of the old Cannocks building (and most of that block), championed the Sarsfield St. Dunnes, the creation of Liddy St., Arthur's Quay, etc.. And no, a single restoration along with fascade retention (an 80s concept which at this stage would be laughed at by any enlightened planning dept) does not imply anything but the meanest lip-service to respecting Limerick's historic structure. This developing is so dated in concept and execution it's laughable.

Mark my words, in less than 20 years time, people will look at "old" photos of Patrick St. and Ellen St. as they are now and wonder wtf were people thinking?

I absolutely agree. Why couldn't they just leave the georgian buildings alone and buy out all that tat which is on the other side of michael st.? When they come to knock down Arthur's Quay, you can bet that those georgian facades still attached to it will go aswell, so that the illusion that there was any retention of the georgian buildings will be exposed for what it is, a lie. When they knock down the Opera Centre, somebody will point out that all that remains are facades, so there's no point in keeping them.

Limerick City Council is, by any standards, the worst city council in the history of the world. They have presided over the destruction of the historic georgian city of Limerick. It makes me want to retch in my dinner that these criminals and buffoons are getting paid out of our taxes. They should be tarred and feathered and hunted out of Limerick. They're a bunch of incompetent, parochial, fat, pasty, peanut-brained, overpaid assholes, with brains the consistency of green, spinach-tainted messy shit. There are no words in English strong enough to express my contempt for them. They should be fed to the radioactive fishes.

[Dan Sullivan]

The top image is the proposed entrance at the corner of Ellen Street/Michael Street, not very inspiring is it? Unfortunately the developers think its an appropriate replacement for the historic buildings on Ellen Street!:rolleyes: The corner feature will be accomodated anyway, regardless of whether the buildings are retained or not as the site is vacant between Quins pub and the street corner!

There are 18 conditions attached to the grant of permission, Dan have you recieved any information on these?

Hadn't checked in since I got the letter about the permission, the 18 conditions are the usual run of the mill sort of thing you'd get with any large development. I think the removal of the Ellen st. facades is purely a delaying tactic to ensure they don't have to start work straight away. They want it to go to ABP in my view.

[Tuborg]

Even by Irish standards, the handling of whole opera centre project has been an absolute joke! It has lurched from shambles to shambles over the course of the last three years and theres definitely more to come!

Theres little chance that the Council have ordered the retention of the Ellen Street buildings so that means an appeal to ABP, which will add another year at least to this sorry saga! In fairness they'll have no one to blame but themselves, how they would allow buildings of character to be sacrificed for this rubbish is just totally beyond me!

The developers have constantly moaned about the difficulties in retaining these buildings, whinging that they have to be pulled down due to their internal condition. This has already been shown to be absolute rubbish and anyway modern engineering techniques would take care of this no problem if needed! Looks like the planners have been made to have bend over yet again with worrying ease!:(

Im getting tired of saying it but these buildings have to be retained not only to protect the character of the street but also to minimise the effect of this mammoth new build on the area. We are already going to be left with a blank wall spanning Michael Street down as far as the granary! Allowing a similar situation on Ellen Street would be a catastrophic mistake!

[Tuborg]

Hadn't checked in since I got the letter about the permission, the 18 conditions are the usual run of the mill sort of thing you'd get with any large development. I think the removal of the Ellen st. facades is purely a delaying tactic to ensure they don't have to start work straight away. They want it to go to ABP in my view.

I think you're right Dan, they know the history of the previous application where the demolition of the Ellen Street buildings was appealed and subsequently overturned. Also with the length of time its currently taking ABP to sort out its workload, they'll probably be in a position to ride out the current economic difficulties!

All this of course means we're going to be left with an ever worsening eyesore for a good while yet!:o:mad:

[shanekeane]

http://www.archiseek.com/content/attachment.php?attachmentid=7925&d=1218657464

what have those fuckheads done to our city?

[CologneMike]

Fight over plaza could halt €350m shopping centre plan

A SMALL disputed plaza could jeopardise the future of a proposed €350m shopping centre development .

The Bank Place plaza, at the entrance to Trinity Rooms nightclub in Limerick, is the subject of a compulsory purchase order by Limerick City Council.

The order has been appealed to An Bord Pleanala by operators of the popular nightclub.

Bord Pleanála decision on Limerick compulsory purchase order has been delayed.

Monday 22 September 2008 (Live95fm)

A ruling on Bank Place outside the Granary was expected today, but has been delayed as the Board has not yet seen the report. It’s understood the file is still with the inspector.

The delay will further stall the 350 million euro Opera Centre.

Limerick City Council says the CPO is a vital part of the Centre development while Management at Trinity Rooms is objecting to it, saying it will lead to the closure of their business

A spokesperson for An Bord Pleanála says the matter is at a very advanced stage.

It’s now unclear when the decision will be reached.

The Opera Centre should keep An Bord Pleanála busy until the property market picks up again.

[Tuborg]

An Bord Pleanala have announced that it will now be the end of October before a decision is made on the dispute over the Bank Place CPO.

Decision on future of Limerick Opera Centre to be known in late October

A decision on the future of the Opera Centre in Limerick will not be known until the end of October.

Limerick City Council is waiting for An Bord Pleanála to rule on the compulsory purchase of a small plot of land outside the Granary known as Bank Place.

A spokesperson for the planning board said today it will be late next month before a decision is made on the CPO.

This will further delay the start of the redevelopment of the Patrick Street - Ellen Street area which was initially mooted in 2005.

Link

[dave123]

Why be pathetic

Why wait and be pathetic?

An bord an pleanala. You are being pathetic. If there was a genuine reason for the wait fair enough. But, waiting another month? What's the point of it. Oh god I dunno.......