Bridges & Boardwalks

Postby urbanisto » Fri Feb 06, 2004 3:37 pm

Im reserving final judgement until they are finished but on first impressions they seem very obtrusive. Its odd though: they look different from Capel St (very in your face) to Parliamnet St (much easier on the eye).
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Postby phil » Fri Feb 06, 2004 6:11 pm

StephenC, that is probably because on Parliament Street (correct me if I am wrong here) you can view them from higher up than you can from Capel Street. Parliament Street is also wider than Capel Street which would make a difference i think.
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Postby Zap » Fri Feb 06, 2004 7:44 pm

I was very surprised when I saw them during the week. beforehand I thought they had done an excellent job on the bridge, making a open and clean space. Now it appears this things are very obstrusive on what what i thought was a well done public space. I'll wait to see them when they're finished to make my mind up but at the moment I'm wary. I imagined something different when they mentioned a book market - something more in the line of the book market in Temple Bar rather kioskville - but I suppose it is more in line with Europe where the kiosk predominates.
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Postby GrahamH » Fri Feb 06, 2004 8:52 pm

Once they are open perhaps they will become more transparent - although, there's no provision for windows to the rear.

For once, pedestrians have been given precedence over motorists with the kiosks looking much better from the pavement.
What they look like from the road or from the other side mustn't be too pleasant.
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Postby Genevieve » Sat Feb 07, 2004 4:14 pm

Thanks for enlightening me re Grattan Bridge works.
While I think they look pretty ugly, I'm hopeful it will be different when they open , as I love what the boardwalk has done for the way I experience the city.
It didn't even cross my mind that it would be a book market. I though maybe a flower stall and a newspaper kiosk from the look of them.


Anyway looking forward to seeing how this evolves :D
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kiosks

Postby jupiter » Wed Feb 11, 2004 4:03 pm

were the new kiosks specifically designed , and if so by who?
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kiosks

Postby jupiter » Wed Feb 11, 2004 4:04 pm

does anyone know if the kiosks were specifically designed for grattan bridge, and if so, by who?
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d'oh

Postby jupiter » Wed Feb 11, 2004 4:06 pm

oops
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Postby emf » Fri Feb 13, 2004 10:21 am

From todays Irish Times:

Liffey kiosks are 'visual vandalism', council told
Frank McDonald, Environment Editor



The architect of a planned European-style book market on Grattan Bridge has appealed to the public to suspend judgment on the project until it is finished.

Capel Street art gallery owner, Mr Gerald Davis, has complained to Dublin City Council that four new kiosks intended as elaborate book stalls were "totally out of place" and amounted to "visual vandalism" of views of the Liffey.

However Mr Dave Richards, of Gilroy McMahon architects, said the kiosks were "like a piano with its lid down" at present. "They have to be seen with their panels opened out and awnings down."

Mr Richards said he was "pleasantly surprised" by the reaction so far, even from wisecracking Dubliners. "In general, people are delighted to see this type of thing happening here."

The kiosks were prefabricated in Spain as part of a €2 million project to turn Grattan Bridge, which links Capel Street with Parliament Street, into a contemporary version of an inhabited bridge, such as the Ponte Vecchio in Florence.

City architect Mr Jim Barrett said the proposed book market on Grattan Bridge was the latest phase of the city council's plan to enable people to enjoy the river.

The €2 million budget included a major reconstruction of the bridge deck, new granite paving for the footpaths and a set of benches with wooden seats and toughened glass backs.

The kiosks are due for completion by St Patrick's Day. The first one to open on a pilot basis will be a book sales outlet for the Hugh Lane Gallery.

Mr Richards said the idea was to recreate something which the city used to have - the bookstalls on Bachelor's Walk and Wellington Quay which brought a touch of the Seine to the Liffey.




© The Irish Times
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Postby Paul Clerkin » Sat Feb 14, 2004 6:06 pm

Predestrian side

Image

Image


Roadway side

Image

Image
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Postby garethace » Sat Feb 14, 2004 6:40 pm

Nice one Paul!

How about one of these:

http://www.dezain.net/2003/scape/25.jpg
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Postby urbanisto » Mon Feb 16, 2004 10:55 am

We've already got one. Its called the James Joyce bridge
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Postby GregF » Mon Feb 16, 2004 11:07 am

I think the kiosks look a bit cumbersome, resembling pre fabs or cargo boxes, giving a cluttered effect on the briidge. Maybe they should have been installed at the time the bridge was revamped, would have avoided this reaction now. But we should give them a chance however.
In hindsight, It's good to see that the Liffey boardwalk has been a good success however despite all the initial nagative talk from An Taisce and the like etc..... Maybe Cork, etc ....could have the same.
O' Connell Street will prove to be a success too, despite the negative talk from the Green Party etc....
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Postby garethace » Mon Feb 16, 2004 11:53 am

null
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Postby garethace » Mon Feb 16, 2004 11:55 am

I am a fan of the boardwalks myself, but lets get one thing straight here.

Originally posted by GregF
In hindsight, It's good to see that the Liffey boardwalk has been a good success however despite all the initial nagative talk from An Taisce and the like etc.....


Let us be fair here, some people are of the opinion that Dublin city council, like to be seen as their own bosses in everything, the heros. Which often has the negative impact, that they do not always bring in the ideas and people who could really do a much better job in some cases. Of course Dublin city council have a huge bargaining chip with developers, as witnessed by that pedestrian bridge, over to Abbey street rubbish then have just completed. But the insight and understanding they display every time they try to use that bargaining chip, is very suspect in my opinion.

I think that developers are far too savy, and the Dublin city council far to naive in 2004. Frank McDonald painted a very rosy picture of Dublin city council last week, and while in large part it is true - they still don't always get it right by any manner or means.
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Postby garethace » Mon Feb 16, 2004 12:15 pm

If you get a chance paul, point that camera of yours down to the building, at the pedestrian crossing from teh new ped bridge.

I have visions of 'John Wayne' lasso-ing one of those columns some day and allowing his horse to give it a good thug, wild west fashion.

Worst 'muck' design I have seen in a while, and yet another obviously statement, that architectural technologists/tossers in DCC are still doing the architecture all along dublin's quays.
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Postby Paul Clerkin » Mon Feb 16, 2004 12:22 pm

Here ya go

Image

Image
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Postby garethace » Mon Feb 16, 2004 12:32 pm

Well so much for the idea of buying a good digital camera to record my impressions of what I experience in architecture! Even though they can be useful for some kind of record, or places abroad etc, etc.

Ya know what guys, I am going to level with you all straight up here - and admit, that I have loads more brushing up to do on my discursive abilities and skills, compared to much of the fine discussion and debaters here at Archiseek. It has always been my biggest single reason for failure at various endeavours related to architecture. So good discursive abilities are key to sucess in most lines of work I think.

However, I think I have a pretty keen eye when it comes to smelling a real turkey in real world architecture, and you cannot actually tell from the above images what I am talking about. In some odd way, those photographs actually make the thing look good! Yet, when I walk around and through that area of town, I know deep down the thing is a complete 'kick for touch' in terms of architectural design. I have spoken here in support of the new rendering technologies available to architects - which produce photographic images.

But whoever, doesn't believe me should actually go and visit this place in question. It is a clear example of where the developer produced maybe a couple of nice 3DS VIZ images, that looked okay, and decided well let's just do it. And that is the whole point, looking at those images, the development looks fine. But in reality, you just know it isn't, strange. So people don't judge how bad the development really is, just by those photographs - rather go and experience it and report back please.
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Postby Paul Clerkin » Mon Feb 16, 2004 12:45 pm

Its both a good development and bad architecture. It opens up a new route and uses the land efficently but the architecture sucks donkey balls. The bottom picture shows the horrendous join of the new building to the old facade which is terribly crude. Recessing the shopfront behind the original facade is badly thought out - it now provides a great public urinal. And as for the tower....
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Postby garethace » Mon Feb 16, 2004 1:29 pm

It goes way beyond sucking any balls at this stage in Ireland Paul, it passed that stage back around 1999/00 as I recall correctly. Think of dentists when they qualify usually go to some other country for a while and work at very cheap rates in order to 'get practice'. (I.e. Get all the real baddies out of their system) While some poor guy over in unemployment England is left holding his jaw for the rest of his life. This is an example of that in architecture.

The boss architects in this country should begin realising this, and take their heads out of their BMW catalogues and golfing magazines long enough, just to see what their latest recruit from Eastern Europe is doing with his/her cracked copy of 3DS MAX. :)And perhaps give a job to someone like myself, who cannot afford to make these kinds of balls jobs in the same country that I wish to live/work in.
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Postby Genevieve » Mon Feb 16, 2004 4:42 pm

I can put up with the river side, it's not that offensive. However what about the other side of this development , on Abbey street. It is the 1960s concrete look , so ugly.
The path for pedestrians should be wide, instead it feels closed in with a concrete overhang and obstructed by large concrete pillars. What a pity

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Postby garethace » Mon Feb 16, 2004 4:44 pm

Anyone care to do the Group 91 bridge anecdote here? I am tired of typing. :)

Anyhow, I will just cross link this here:

http://www.archiseek.com/content/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2744

Carlisle Pier thread.
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Postby dc3 » Mon Feb 16, 2004 9:23 pm

Now it just came to me what these new kiosks resemble.

Huge scaled up versions of the huts for the car park attendants at BCP car parks in the UK.
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Postby Andrew Duffy » Tue Feb 17, 2004 11:40 am

Isn't the Abbey St. side actually a 60's building called Chapter House? Also bear in mind that the extremely bleak Wast facing wall is soon to be covered up by whatever CIE is building on its former depot.
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Postby urbanisto » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:39 pm

Chapter House was only completed last year. Is it all part of the one development. I have to be honest and say that I dont really find this scheme as awful as the rest of the thread. I agree its hardly inspiring architecture but then we never really see alot of that these days do we.

Capel Ste is another example. Theres another bland and boring box being constructed on the corner of Marys Abbey and Capel and another planned for opposite. Together they will both dramatically chnage the appearance of a virtaul intact Victorian commercial street. They are completely inapproriate.

Capel St is great. It has hung on in there despite the death of streets and shops like these in 1980s. All it needs is some judicious urban planning and it could become a great thoroughfare again.
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