Smithfield, Dublin

Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby FXR » Mon Nov 21, 2011 9:32 pm

Smithfield 21 November 2011

http://youtu.be/xdWNEozWxqw

It looks as if no expense will be spared to kill the horse fair once and for all. The tree planters I presume will be arranged to restrict access to the centre of the square or at least what's left of it when the building work is complete. Is there any way to find out how much all this is costing? I've tried the DCC website but I can't find anything.
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby StephenC » Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:36 pm

Some recent snaps taken down Smithfield way where the public realm works are substantially completed. Recent developments such as the reopening of The Lighthouse and the new Generator Hostel are to be welcomed. Hopefully the area can start turning the corner. There's a long way to go though.

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Some issues of course...the all important red line boundary means that this whole section remains unresolved. Quite when this (potentially attractive) lane will get some improved paving and lighting is open to question.

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Last edited by StephenC on Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby StephenC » Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:38 pm

The view down New Church Street – smart but a little sterile perhaps. I think more trees would have helped here. The cobble setts set so firmly in cement have lost all their charm and colour in my view.

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The welcome return of a little curiosity

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Planting on the square to be provided by these guys....beech hedges in concrete pots. There's loads of them...must have cost a fair packet. They are currently arranged rather haphazardly pending completion of works.

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The 'competed' section of the square is looking a bit worse for wear in places. These bollards were unsuccessful.

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The grassed terrace at the northern end of the square. The terrace of 4 Georgian houses languishes in the background.

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Another one of those forgotten streets – with the attractive name Friary Avenue. The housing here is starting to look like a ghetto.

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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby StephenC » Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:39 pm

Smartened up again on the connection through to Church Street. Getting people moving through from Capel Street to Smithfield is all important. Dont get me started on those bollards though...

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Presumably a NAMA property, this building has been vacant since its completion. At the very least the railing surrounding it could be removed.

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The before image from Google Maps http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Smithfield,+Dublin,+Ireland&hl=en&ll=53.348026,-6.276022&spn=0.000937,0.002411&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=40.59616,79.013672&oq=smithfield+dub&hnear=Smithfield,+County+Dublin,+Ireland&t=m&z=19&layer=c&cbll=53.348026,-6.276022&panoid=XrzM6VT0X0QMIzDg9uSGvA&cbp=12,80.83,,0,5.61
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby gunter » Sun Feb 05, 2012 1:29 am

what the fuck is this?

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are you telling me they've taken up the cobbles and put down grass?

grass?

on Smithfield?
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby Punchbowl » Sun Feb 05, 2012 2:52 am

The whole gig has been to make the horse fair more difficult, create obstructons etc. Unfortunately Horses have a thing for grass.
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby Adolf Luas » Thu Feb 23, 2012 3:27 pm

Unfortunately this patch of grass is full of dog shit.
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby StephenC » Thu Feb 23, 2012 4:31 pm

gunter wrote:what the fuck is this?

Image

are you telling me they've taken up the cobbles and put down grass?

grass?

on Smithfield?


Yup. Its already looking a bit peaky. This will be battered earth by summer's end, in much the same way as Jervis Park went. But they wont be told.
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby Service charge » Fri Mar 02, 2012 10:27 pm

Holy crap, wasn't this suppose to be the city's grand open space? They had finished the bloody thing, and they change their minds. I get the whole horse fair problem, but if cobbles stones didn't stop them grass surely won't.

I suppose the braziers have been replaced 100 watt light bulbs from the spar shop?
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby Service charge » Fri Mar 02, 2012 10:46 pm

Anyone know what is happening with the chimney btw? The elevator shaft seemed to be collapsing last time I was up that way.
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby StephenC » Sat Mar 03, 2012 1:50 am

Service charge wrote:Anyone know what is happening with the chimney btw? The elevator shaft seemed to be collapsing last time I was up that way.


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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby Service charge » Sat Mar 03, 2012 3:01 pm

The Generator Hostel website seems to indicate it is up and running again? It is a real shame if it isn't.
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby FXR » Sat Mar 31, 2012 9:31 am

They light them up at night but it still does little to relieve the slightly oppressive atmosphere.
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby StephenC » Sat Mar 31, 2012 11:56 am

I was down in Smithfield last night. There is just a small section of Haymarket to be completed (with cobbling) and some minor fixing up about the square and yet huge sections still given over to the work site. Its dragging on now just a tad. Lets just get the work finished and start building life and business in the area DCC. The newly repaved streets look great and I think the area will start to lift. Generator is a great anchor for the square and the Lighthouse is holding its own, what with another new cinema opened at Point Village.
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby thebig C » Mon Apr 02, 2012 12:15 pm

I don't know....some of the new paving is actually very good quality. However, what we see today really isn't anything like the great open European Piazza we were promised.

The pace of development has been labouriously slow, what was built took extraordinarily long (thanks in part to our old friends the serial objectors) and some projects haven't even comensed like the redevelopment of Irish distiller, the Georgian buildings at the head of the Square, the unsightly derelicting in front of the Glass House and of of course the huge excavation between Phoenix House and the Four Courts. All add an air of drabness and cessation.

Needless to say, mistakes of the past are still haunting the Square. I am speaking about the "Childrens Court" and its attendent retenue of intimidating gurriers and the toytown like 2/3 storey pastiche Council houses at the Northern end.

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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby StephenC » Wed Apr 04, 2012 11:08 am

And here is another Facebook-led campaign for a public realm project...this time on that strip of wasteland beside the Luas line between Smithfield and Queen Street

http://www.facebook.com/arttunnelsmithfield

Interestingly the site is owned by the Bargaintown owner according to the blurb. The campaign is now seeking €5,000 funding to realise the garden/installation. I am sure RPA must be able to stump up something! Dice Bar and new businesses on Benburb Street are also contributing.

I think its a great idea....beats the buddelia.
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby Cathal Dunne » Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:56 pm

I read on thejournal.ie that there's to be 17 new stalls permitted around Town with the change in the bye-laws of Dublin City Council. Do archiseekers know if any of these are to be located in Smithfield? It would be good as it could act as a further catalyst to bringing footfall through the area and promoting a vibrant, attractive community.

Also, the Smithfield fruit market needs the cash for its long-mooted redevelopment which should begin and be completed this year. Having the Smithfield fruit market up to the same standard as the English Market in Cork in terms of being a destination for locals and tourists alike would provide another boost to the area and support cafés and restaurants in the area.
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby StephenC » Fri Apr 06, 2012 8:39 pm

Doesnt look like Smithfield is included in this list http://www.dublincity.ie/RecreationandC ... fault.aspx but there is already a small market on Smithfield and its not as if there are no vacant shop units that need filling. I'm not really sure stalls will help. I think stalls need anchor shops to attract footfall.

Smithfield Fruit Market...would you call it that. I always think of the Markets area as separate from Smithfield. Preliminary works have already begun on the Market Hall. Interesting collection of images here http://www.dublincityarchitects.ie/?p=98#more-98

Public realm is a key to the success of the Markets I would think. Its is uniformly awful in this part of the city. Perhaps this might help http://dubcitybeta.wordpress.com/
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby Cathal Dunne » Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:57 pm

StephenC wrote:Doesnt look like Smithfield is included in this list http://www.dublincity.ie/RecreationandC ... fault.aspx but there is already a small market on Smithfield and its not as if there are no vacant shop units that need filling. I'm not really sure stalls will help. I think stalls need anchor shops to attract footfall.


Well I'd certainly agree with that - anchor shops are certainly more attractive than stalls to people but given the overall slump in fortunes experienced by Dublin and Ireland it's not likely that we'll see too many of them, therefore we're left with the likes of stalls to generate business. It might be a good idea also to put in a couple more Dublin Bikes stands when the next round of expansion starts with that. Incidentally, I remember reading that fastfood places and phone shops are really footfall-leeches rather than footfall generators in themselves.

Smithfield Fruit Market...would you call it that. I always think of the Markets area as separate from Smithfield. Preliminary works have already begun on the Market Hall. Interesting collection of images here http://www.dublincityarchitects.ie/?p=98#more-98

Public realm is a key to the success of the Markets I would think. Its is uniformly awful in this part of the city. Perhaps this might help http://dubcitybeta.wordpress.com/


Well the place it's in is called Smithfield on ratemyarea.com so there's some argument for it being called that! However, I feel the main thing is for the place to be developed, regardless of what it's called. I'm delighted to hear that preliminary works have (finally) commenced. Hopefully they'll be ready to go for Christmas this year. It would be another driver of business in around that part of Dublin 1.

Thanks for the link to the blog with the photos of it being built in the first place. Often with these older buildings you think of them as being a permanent feature on the landscape and forget that once, they too, were new constructions. I wonder did they have to deal with an Bord Pleanála back in their day? :-)
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby exene1 » Mon May 21, 2012 12:58 pm

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The finished lower end of the plaza - nice job!!!!!!! Skateboard rats are the main activity so far.

That 'Glass House' office infill worked out quite well ..... apart from the lack of office tenants, lol.




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Now all that's needed is development of the two sites on the west side on each side of Luas. There were two pisstaking Tiger applications for these sites in the late noughties.



Timeline:


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First off was a redevelopment of the buildings on the Smithfield / Haymarket site with a monster 9-storey block, in the centre, above. This was granted permission with no volume changes by Dublin City Council - 2776/07 - and refused outright by An Bord Pleanala on appeal - PL29N.226444. The architects were trying to do some trendy Stockholm-Barcelona building with "woven steel mesh" instead of actually trying to repair some of the damage done to the coherent historic scale of the area by Smithfield Market.

In the appeal, the applicant argued, inter alia, that the location of the site at the junction of Luas and Smithfield warranted a large building such as that proposed. The appellant argued, inter alia, that the site should be seen in the overall context of Smithfield and the appropriate thing to do here was mediate in scale between Smithfield Market to the north and the traditional city scale of the Quays to the south.

While the Haymarket site was still under appeal, a 10-storey building was lodged for the Smithfield / Coke Lane site next door to the south, on the left above - 2012/08




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The Coke Lane proposal was redesigned and scaled back by the time of its approval by the City Council, then was further reduced and turned around by 180° on appeal - PL29N.232346

Following the initial Haymarket appeal refusal, a revised 7-storey block was permitted by the City Council - 3045/09 - then reduced to 6 storeys on appeal - PL29N.234398.

So the desired transition in scale between Smithfield Market and the Quays was eventually achieved in the permitted buildings. But there's no consistency to the City Council's decision making; they granted permission for the two successive Haymarket applications more or less without any changes, but granted a massively reduced version of the Coke Lane proposal.

I recall during the boom that when Adamstown Town Centre in west Dublin was being created, there were strict briefs by South Dublin Co. Co. which the various architects involved had to follow and they all knew exactly what type and size of building was required in each location. Yet a major Dublin-city-centre civic and historic plaza like Smithfield had no guidelines about how its remaining gap sites should be developed, about what type of buildings the City Council wanted to see there ...... so you got this tomfoolery nonsense of applicants coming in with obviously ridiculous proposals out of proportion to the location, with the City Council usually just throwing permission at them ..... hopefully it'll all be cleaned up on appeal. Crazy.

It's all a bit much when you read the reams and reams of waffle in the new Dublin City Development Plan under headings like "shaping the city" and "spatial structure of Dublin" (just open it here and start reading anywhere). The sham that's been called "planning" in Dublin city centre for the past decade cannot hide behind this wall of bluff.
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby StephenC » Mon May 21, 2012 1:48 pm

I met a DCC planning colleague recently who is stressed out working on LAPs for areas such as Pelletstown and North Fringe...but this area (previously designated as HARP) and the Liberties must surely be the development priorities for the city as confidence returns to the construction sector. I am not talking about wholesale landbanking, demolition and shite rebuild as shown in your post exene1 but rather something approximating to regeneration that maintains and restores the essential character and quality of the area. Yet, to my knowledge the Forward Planning team in DCC don't have this area on its radar. The Liberties has its unimplementable LAP of course (after a suggested €1m spent devising it!) but as yet there is no up to date 'action plan' for Smithfield. Things will just happen as they will. A h.uge amount of NAMA sites around here I'd warrant
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby StephenC » Mon May 21, 2012 2:41 pm

Okay, so perhaps somewhat on the radar :eh: :eh:

DUBLIN CITY COUNCIL PLANS TO CREATE JOBS AND NEW HOMES ON VACANT SITES IN THE CITY.

BROWNFIELD REGENERATION EUROPEAN EXPERTS COME TO DUBLIN WITH EXAMPLES OF EUROPEAN BEST PRACTICE

From Monday May 21st to Thursday, 24th May, Dublin City Council will lead planning experts from eleven European countries who are in Dublin on a series of professional workshops on how best to regenerate “brownfield” lands in the City; abandoned or underused industrial and commercial facilities available for re-use, including derelict sites, sites left empty as a result of businesses moving out of premises, in-fill sites that would improve the local area if they were developed sensitively and public spaces that would benefit an area if they were regenerated. Dublin City Council is a working with partners from 11 different countries, including Northern Ireland, Spain, Italy, Germany, Poland, Lithuania, Finland, Hungary, Czech Republic and Austria, in a 3-year Interregional Cooperation Programme Interreg IVC Brownfield Convention project. The overall objective of the programme is “to improve regional policies influencing Brownfield redevelopment through transfer of best practice”.

According to John Tierney, Dublin City Manager, there are an estimated 200 or more “brownfield” sites between the canals of all different shapes and sizes “There is a necklace of underutilised sites along the LUAS Red Line alone, extending from the inner city as far out as the Naas Road”, he said, “and there are enormous opportunities for developing innovative policies on brownfield development and re-use throughout the city”.

Prominent brownfield sites in the city include CIE site opposite the Jervis Centre, the Fishmarket at Mary’s Lane, an OPW site at Hammond Lane, the former Distillers Premises, Smithfield, and the former Dulux Factory on Davitt Road. Newmarket in the Liberties is a public space in need of regeneration and one that the European experts will visit and give any insights they have, as a result of similar successfully regenerated sites in their cities. The City Manager is convinced that “the successful turnaround of brownfield sites depends on a buy–in, with the owners, with local businesses and with local people to see if there are opportunities to move ahead with improving or regenerating any of the sites”.

“With regeneration comes possibilities for increased investment in infrastructure in the city and associated job creation opportunities”, noted John Tierney. “The successful and sustainable turnaround of Brownfield sites is vital to the creation of a quality European City. This EU programme is one where Dublin can contribute to and learn from our European colleagues”.

Of special interest to Dublin is its partnership with Belfast City Council, and their recent successful experience in Brownfield regeneration, with the Titanic Quarter.

Dublin’s Lord Mayor Andrew Montague is firmly of the view that Dublin will learn from each of our E.U. partner’s successes and experiences, which will influence, and improve the City Council’s policies on tackling some of the more difficult, long-term derelict and vacant sites.

“The visit by the eleven European experts this week presents an opportunity to examine how our Brownfield lands can be integrated with surrounding local infrastructure, such as public transport, schools and public parks,” says Lord Mayor Andrew Montague. “The workshops will analyse some of Dublin’s more successful Brownfield renewal projects such as Temple Bar in the 1990’s and Dublin Docklands, which now includes a new residential quarter, and landmarks such as the Bord Gais Energy Theatre, the Samuel Beckett Bridge and Google HQ.

“Following exposure to Dublin’s Brownfield Sites, the EU partners will act as a think-tank in workshops, to set forward innovative ideas and best practice examples which could be transferred to Dublin’s study sites. As a consequence, Dublin City Council aspires to transfer the relevant data into future Brownfield regeneration projects, ultimately resulting in the creation of jobs and new homes in the city, and also reducing the pressure for unsustainable sprawl outside our city” the Lord Mayor concluded.

ENDS

For further information

Dublin City Council Press Office T. (01) 222 2107,
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby StephenC » Tue May 22, 2012 12:24 pm

And reported in today's Irish Times

COUNCIL TO ACT ON 200 DERELICT SITES

AN INITIATIVE to put some 200 vacant, abandoned or derelict sites in Dublin city back into productive use is being developed by Dublin City Council.

Planning experts from nine different European countries are in Dublin this week to advise on how best to address the capital’s growing numbers of “brownfield” sites which have become a blight on the city.

Brownfield lands – commercial and industrial sites which have fallen into disuse or become derelict – had become a major problem in the city up to the 1980s when tax incentives were introduced for their redevelopment.

Such incentives were instrumental in the renewal of Temple bar and the Dublin Docklands. The economic boom years also increased development of former industrial sites in the centre of the city.

However, the abrupt end to the boom has left a legacy of new brownfield sites as properties were bought and often demolished by developers who then ran out of money to build on the land.

City planner John O’Hara said site owners and the council needed to take a step back from the grand projects of the boom which were no longer practicable and look at realistic short and medium-term uses of the land.

“We have seen the large plots that were granted permission in the excitement of the boom that are now vacant or underused sites. In places where le grand project has fallen flat on its face everything has ground to a halt.”

The larger the site the bigger the problem posed as banks were unlikely to release substantial funds for their redevelopment. However, smaller-scale uses were an option for these sites such as “hot desking”, where sole traders and start-up businesses can rent short-term office space, or the use of vacant plots for markets or arts and events spaces.

“The idea is to keep an area buoyant, to put a space back on people’s mental map, maybe through small-scale shops or residential use. It’s not to say that all big projects are bad, but we need to kick-start the use of the land if confidence is to be restored. And that includes the confidence of the banks,” said Mr O’Hara.

The council would be approaching the owners of all 200 sites and offering to write design briefs for them, with which they can then approach banks or estate agents.

The council had fallen foul of the hubris of the boom with grand plans which were no longer achievable.

“Newmarket Square is a failure. The Liberties Local Area Plan had in mind offices and a hotel and residential development for the square. That isn’t going to happen now, at least not in the immediate future,” said Mr O’Hara.

However, he added that the square did offer opportunities for smaller more considered development, such as the Sunday flea market which had already started, and potential for collaboration with the nearby National College of Art and Design.

The square is one of the brownfield sites which the European planners will be asked to consider this week.

Other prominent locations identified as needing intervention include the former CIÉ site on Upper Abbey Street, the Fishmarket at Mary’s Lane and an Office of Public Works site at Hammond Lane.
Irish Times


I wonder if the 100 buildings at risk mentioned last week are included in this list? Or is there some overlap at least? What do you reckon our planner cousins from Europe will think of the declining quality of Dublin city centre?
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby StephenC » Sun Jun 17, 2012 10:17 pm

Smithfield almost complete....

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Still faffing around with the services pavillion thingy but otherwise the space has been returned to the city albeit now surrounded by these swanky new beech hedges in planters.

Annoyingly, you can wander about and spot plenty of small patches of tarmac or missing pavoirs in the original section. A bit of snagging wouldn't have gone amiss.

In addition to the southern section of the square, a number of the adjoining streets such as Haymarket and New Church Avenue have been cobbled and repaved.

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The scheme extends down May Lane towards the City Markets area (hopefully next on the list)

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This London-style rank of pointless bollards unfortunately left in place. And that bloody fencing.

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I like the new LED lights here.

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The new Generator Hostel on the square was buzzing this afternoon. Seems to be doing a roaring trade. Unfortunately, tourists from the hostel are the main footfall on the square. Hopefully that will change....lots of empty shops to fill.
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Re: Smithfield, Dublin

Postby StephenC » Sun Jun 17, 2012 10:28 pm

Tesco have just been granted permission from Dublin City Council for a new store on the square at Units 18-19...formerly The Complex. The decision awaits a final grant.

http://www.dublincity.ie/swiftlg/apas/r ... ts%3C/a%3E

The off-licence of the store element was removed.

I love this 'unambiguous' condition

7. Security roller shutters and their casing, if installed, shall be recessed behind the perimeter glazing and shall be factory finished in a single colour to match the colour scheme of the building. Such shutters shall be of the ‘open lattice’ type and shall not be used for any form of advertising, unless authorised by a further grant of planning permission Reason: In the interests of visual amenity


Its obviously up to you guys whether to create a dreadful dead frontage at night.

Details of the proposed signage and frontage http://www.dublincity.ie/AnitePublicDocs/00370038.pdf
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