cork busarus

cork busarus

Postby notjim » Tue Feb 25, 2003 3:26 pm

i see the cork busarus is getting a facelift, thank god, it is in a terrible state, it reminds me of being in vilnius. what's the story with the building, it was probably very nice once.
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Postby Papworth » Tue Feb 25, 2003 3:48 pm

Bus station getting a lick of paint at last , Patrick St. being regenerated - looks like all of Cork are getting ready for the arrival of Mr Supersaint the one and only Pat Dolan he is one great guy, I hope he leads Cork City to the promised land and that's from a St. Pat's supporter.
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Postby StephenC » Tue Feb 25, 2003 4:09 pm

Who?
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Postby d_d_dallas » Tue Feb 25, 2003 6:01 pm

Basically one of the big points behind the whole city plan was that the bus station was going to be moved behind City Hall (site of the post sorting office) and the train station was going to be turned "around" to face the city rather than hide as it does at present. So that is why both stations were left untouched and not polished up ala Heuston and Connolly. But of course both stations are at the mercy of a *well run efficient semi state*, CIE - so for many many years noise was made and nothing apparently happened. Then CIE announced that they were not going to bother moving the bus station to the new site, and so far have taken FIVE years just to pick a developer they are willing to talk to about the POSSIBILITY of developing the train station. Someone in the Docklands Dev office obviously had a seizure as the new bus station was supposed to kick start that whole plan - this also neatly ties up with Cork in 2005 as Euro City of Culture - and this is currently being used as the excuse to finally push some plans through in Cork (example three major new hotels are mooted in the city centre).

Anyway - it's all a cover up just to have something that looks semi decent in time for 2005 - the station buliding itself will remain untouched (structurally) and some fancy looking canopies are being put out in the loading area - nothing more.
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Postby Paul Clerkin » Tue Feb 25, 2003 9:26 pm

can we please not call it cork busaras as even that tenuous a link is insulting to the Dublin building.... ;)
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Postby CiaranO » Wed Feb 26, 2003 3:20 am

....
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Postby CiaranO » Wed Feb 26, 2003 3:26 am

apologies for the last post.

I think Cork needs a lot more regeneration than DUblin will ever need. I was there in December for the first time in my memory and was wholly underwhelmed, part of this was the Bus Aras (literal meaning of course) and I think everyone will welcome the overhaul it will receive. Any images of the planned changes online?
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Postby Andrew Duffy » Wed Feb 26, 2003 8:21 am

The development plan is available online:
http://www.corkcorp.ie/development/index.html
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Postby StephenC » Wed Feb 26, 2003 11:10 am

I agree Ciaran. I was there last year for the first time in years and I was amazed at how little they seem to have been touched by the property boom of the last few years.
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Postby roskav » Wed Feb 26, 2003 11:27 am

Paul, I like the thought that the Cork bus station is a little offshoot of Busaras - much in the same way a strawberry plant will send its tendrils elsewhere to flower...
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Postby Niall » Wed Feb 26, 2003 11:38 am

I find Cork city a depressing place, it needs a little tlc, proper development and investment not stupid 'thingys' on Patrick Street or endless development plans.
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Postby Paul Clerkin » Wed Feb 26, 2003 11:58 am

I agree Niall. Was in Cork at the weekend and it was depressing. I know the weather was bad, but the buildings all need some tlc.
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Postby StephenC » Wed Feb 26, 2003 12:06 pm

It needs a purpose doesn't it.... I think thats is its problem. Dublin has its status as capital, Galway has made a good stab at bieng a culture centre, but Cork seems to have languished around without any direction for a long time. It needs a proper defined role.
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Postby Niall » Wed Feb 26, 2003 12:15 pm

It could do with a catalyst, i.e. a cultural quarter, or a drinking bit to bring in the English money, it is lucky to have a good airport...... It certainly doesn't need loads of plans. I was in Cork in 1988, 1992 and about six months ago.... nothing ever changes and the city centre is rough.

Might I suggest also that the National Conference Centre and possibly a big government department and a few headquarters be located in the centre of town?
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Postby d_d_dallas » Wed Feb 26, 2003 12:29 pm

Cork is the second city - and none of the above has ever happened - why should it happen now? The government basically takes Cork for granted and ignores it wholesale. Example the redev of the School of Music. I aggree with everything said above about Cork being in need of TLC. Some backwater with a cute hooer TD is more likely to get a decentralised government department.
There's great potential for the place - it has great history, the food, the interesting location of being on an island etc... all underused.
Cork as a whole has kept up with Dublin in terms of the "Boom" - but this came at the expense of the city centre - there are more and better shops and offices in the suburbs. There's a constant battle between Local Authorithies for commecial rates etc. This is only going to get worse with the Owen O'Callaghan's massive Mahon Point Dev.
There's a palpable sentiment in the city these days that enough is enough, and even the City Council recognises where it went wrong. I think there is/will be movement to redress issues in the coming few years.
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Postby Niall » Wed Feb 26, 2003 12:55 pm

Few suggestions for Cork (Ireland's 3rd city)..

Isn't Michael Martin, Minister for health, why not move his department to one of the quays in the centre along with say Department of the Marine or Social and Community affairs?

A cultural quarter with a national museum of something... The national conference centre, call the opera house, the national opera house? How about an aquarium etc....? I'm thinking Malmo or Gothenburg here, examples of real decentralisation

Take complete advantage of tax breaks/urban renewal etc..

Very important is a focal point a la Spire for city centre, say a sculpture, architectual competition, remember an EIS this time.. Take complete advantage of the island thing, paved the roads a different colour, red or green to define it as a place apart

And finally and most importantly clean the place up and clamp down on the scum giving the place a bad name!
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Postby ew » Wed Feb 26, 2003 1:00 pm

I agree that Cork seems to be a little lost at the moment. I cringe when I hear people use pathetic terms such as the "real" capital. Thinking about what StephenC said - I think the defined role could be food capital. The city could build on the reputation of the county for having some of the best restaraunts and local producers. Cork's also at the lead of the slow food movement (such as it is ) in Ireland. Good market in Cork too.
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Postby Rory W » Wed Feb 26, 2003 1:42 pm

Anybody got a picture of this appearently hateful building?
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Postby d_d_dallas » Wed Feb 26, 2003 2:20 pm

Cork - 3rd city??? If we're talking the island of Ireland then yes fair enough, but I wasn't.
The food angle is a good one to take. The opera house should be promoted more and not a mere venue for hire as it is these days.
As for cringeing at the "real" capital... I only cringe more when I hear the condescending pathetic ignorance Dubs exhibit to the rest of the country.
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Postby StephenC » Wed Feb 26, 2003 2:54 pm

dallas... its like this everywhere, in every country. People in capital cities always have this sense of being superior to the rest of their country and to the second city in particular. It just one of the quirks of the human condition.

I hope that the Capital of Culture moniker proves to be the boost to Cork that it was to Dublin (together with the 1988 Millennium). Its a great opportunity and I hope the CC make as much out of it as they can. They are fortunate that it takes place at a time when there is more moeny and more optimism about than there was in 1988 and 1991.
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Postby notjim » Wed Feb 26, 2003 2:55 pm

the cork bus station was clearly influenced by busarus. when was it built, who designed it, does anyone know?
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Postby d_d_dallas » Wed Feb 26, 2003 3:21 pm

StephenC - your optimism rocks!

I don't know who designed Cork Bus station, I think CIE have their own architects, and then get someone in to tart up their designs for actual construction (ala Tara Street)
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Postby bunch » Thu Feb 27, 2003 10:35 am

i agree with a lot of what has been said about the city. It does need a lot of T.L.C. I'm not sure that it lacks a role or a purpose as was suggested though. Lets be honest, what is a cultural quarter? And what would it do for a city. If Temple Bar is a model, then I think, Cork should avoid it at all costs. The city will be a good test of the implementation of the National Spatial Strategy although I think that Cork, and other Irish 'provincial' cities should not merely rely on central govt. to secure future development.

There are signs of significant changes for the city. New transport infrastructure for instance, new airport development beginning in April, bus station, and public-private partnership development for the railway station which is a v. large scale mixed dev. which may be a catalyst for Docklands. These three developments should impact on visitor's impressions and improve the image of the city. There is also a significant level of development pressure in city centre and on quaysides, where a few major devlopments are in, and through planning process. There are some interesting projects on the way.

The city has a very strong identity, i do not think it needs to manufacture one. Culturally, the city is extremely healthy, but this doesnt translate into tourist numbers or an international profile, yet. What Cork will need more than anything else, in order to become a thriving second city (regional capital not real) will be critical mass to underpin growth prospects, development and generate demand for changes.
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Postby pvdz » Fri Feb 28, 2003 1:15 pm

Cork does have a strong identity but as a Corkperson I find it really dissapointing that this identity is really only a big chip on its shoulder against Dublin. 'The real Capitol', 'Peoples republic of Cork' ---lets hope city architect Neil Hegarty does build the planned millenium bridge and these irritating people get over it!!

Cork is definately not culturally healthy though and while the cultural Capitol opportunity will give Cork a new Gallery in UCC by O'Donnell and Twomey, possibly a music school by Murray O'Laoire and an uneeded 'millenium' bridge, unfortunatly I think the Cultural capitol will generally be quite an embarrasment for all concerned.

Also on the point of promoting the Opera house, the Arts Councils budjet was recently slashed by the government and the pres. was recently speaking to Marianne Finoucan on how we now have too many performance spaces in this country in relation to the amount of actual travelling productions which are available to theatres to show. So while we now do have an audience for arts in this country we do not have any performers to watch! This is an embarrasing symptom of erratic government spending on the arts. They may be able to find the cash for a few buildings when there is a boom but are not prepaired to make a long term commitment to the arts.
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Cork bus station

Postby crc » Thu Mar 06, 2003 8:00 pm

why is the bus station not being not being incorporated into the redesigned train station??

what people want is to be able to change transport modes easily. I'm glad the An Post site is no longer being used, but I really hoped that they'd combine the bus and rail stations.
The location in Parnell place is too cramped - there's no way the bus station could ever be adequately redeveloped on that site.

In Leuven, Belgium there is a wonderful example of a combined train/bus station, as is Great Victoria Street in Belfast.

-------------------------------

I'd also like to see them take measures to stop cars from entering the city centre - its a fairly small centre and it can be walked accross in 10mins. This could be done by allowing cars an easy way to go around the centre but not into it.
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