Photos of Cork Street / Coombe Bypass a decade ago.

Photos of Cork Street / Coombe Bypass a decade ago.

Postby exene1 » Mon Dec 19, 2011 12:14 pm

For Dublin heritage junkies. It’s hard to believe this is only a decade ago. The photos were taken in 2000 and 2001, except where marked ‘2011’.



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The old Cork Street. In case you're too young to remember, in order to get to town, you went down as far as the Georgian house, turned left onto Ardee Street, then right onto the Coombe. Whereas now the road just goes straight through and comes out near St. Patrick's Cathedral. The old zig-zag route was ancient, appearing on the very earliest maps of Dublin.




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This boozer, Gaffney's, had to go for the road widening.




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A '70s view of it from the DCC Libraries website.
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Re: Photos of Cork Street / Coombe Bypass a decade ago.

Postby exene1 » Mon Dec 19, 2011 12:19 pm

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With back against the wall on Ardee Street, looking up the old Cork Street.




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Same general scene today.




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This is early 2001, with an archaeological dig going on at the corner of Ardee Street and Cork Street prior to laying of the road.




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The road was originally scheduled to plough through the Georgian house on the right - No. 10 Ardee Street - but after a campaign in the 1980s the route was changed to veer left. But other interesting fabric was lost here.



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When the route was being readied, billboards that had faced up Cork Street here for decades were removed, uncovering the remains of a Georgian house. I half hoped it would be seen to have some contextual value with the main house and pulled back from the brink, haha.




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Also of interest was this truncated warehouse on the corner of the former Ardee Row. It was all brewery / malting buildings around here. Very atmospheric area. It's sad that more of its fabric could not have been brought into the current era.




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The dig at the corner of Ardee Street and Cork Street (Cork Street in the background).




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Same view in the opposite direction. The foundations seen there are not belonged to the artisan houses seen nine pictures ago but to a large brewery house on the corner which can be seen on Rocque's map 1756 and described in Peter Pearson's 'Heart of Dublin' book as belonging to "Mr. Thwaites".
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Re: Photos of Cork Street / Coombe Bypass a decade ago.

Postby exene1 » Mon Dec 19, 2011 12:22 pm

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Same location today. The Georgian buildings there - Nos. 4, 5 & 6 Ardee Street - were refurbished and retained within new development.




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Before & after.




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You have to go around the corner into Weavers Close to glimpse the rears of the Georgians now.




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St. Luke's Church & its alms house. The story there is well known: The congregation of the church declined and it closed in the '70s. A fire in the '80s burnt it out. The Coombe bypass was driven across the former tree-lined avenue between the church and alms house at the entrance, destroying its historical setting.

The Widows' alms house has been restored and integrated within that new development on the corner. The church awaits reuse.




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They plastered over the calp side elevation of the Widows house.




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Ardee Street, ancient route out of the city. The white car in the distance is turning into the old Cork Street.
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Re: Photos of Cork Street / Coombe Bypass a decade ago.

Postby exene1 » Mon Dec 19, 2011 12:34 pm

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Ardee Street, with the turn for the Coombe on the left. The main stone warehouse seen here was refurbished in conjunction with that new development, but there were several other brewery buildings behind it. Could / should more of this complex have been retained? It all went to appeal at the time.



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All of these were demolished:

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Taken individually:

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Ardee Street from the other (south)end.




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The old Cork Street.



The Corpo said the new road would enhance the area. A bit like saying we’re going to amputate your foot to help you walk. They said it would be a “lively mixed-use attractive and safe urban street”. Tall order for 4-lane traffic corridor driven through a complex historic quarter of the city. Increasing traffic in such an area was at odds with trends everywhere in Europe where the brakes were being put on traffic.

There is some new development of note. The Timberyard by ODT is one of the few good buildings built in Dublin in the boom. It looks good from any angle. How did they manage that?? Granted a site fronting a new bypass road was a relatively blank canvas for the form of it. But it does pick up on the area well.

You've got that McCullough Mulvin school with its architectey opes in the wall fronting the road, and some historic buildings got refurbished along the route. But really it's hard to escape the feeling that Dublin needed another big road near its centre like a hole in the head. Why did the Corpo go ahead with it given that their policy had already changed away from roads by 2000 and were by that time trying to take traffic out of the centre? Should the Coombe not just have been traffic calmed instead and let other traffic go round the canals?

Or was it a case of, as a consultant is quoted as saying on page 52 of the 1989 book 'Saving the City' in relation to the Inner Tangent, "the demolition of buildings along this route, as well as the road works already finished 'is probably beyond a point where anything useful could be gained in an environmental sense by not completing the remaining sections'"?

More importantly though, could the historic industrial character of the area have been better preserved within road regeneration?
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Re: Photos of Cork Street / Coombe Bypass a decade ago.

Postby thebig C » Mon Dec 19, 2011 3:25 pm

Thanks for that post Exene1!! It brings back some memories. In particular I can vividly recall the two sharp turns onto Ardee Street and The Coombe.....several times the 56A didn't manage it necessitating the driver to back up and have another go!:)

I have to say that whilst it is a pity that some of the historic fabric of the area was destroyed, Cork Street to my eyes has never looked better. For most of my childhood through the 1980s/1990s it was completely derelict. In fact my father remembers the Corporation for begining to CPO properties in the 1960s and it went into a gradual decline from there. Although, I do remember seeing some 1970s photos in a book in Rathmines Library and it still looked like a fairly busy neighbourhood.

I think the restored Historic buildings on the Ardee street corner (incorporated into a new development) may be the way to go in the future. Indeed much the same was proposed for the Georgian townhouse on the opposite side of the bypass but the recession stopped that scheme in its tracks. Thats my one regret, there were several more proposals that would have filled in the toothless gaps in the streetscape and given Cork street a completed look that it hasn't had in years. In particular, its a shame that the Donnelly Centre is still there. It was this development (along with the hospital) which kickstarted the process of pushing the line of the buildings right back. The factory itself is somewhat symbolic of the area in that just a short time after opening it suffered a serious fire and the company was forced to close. The ugly buildings remained derelict for years afterwards.

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Re: Photos of Cork Street / Coombe Bypass a decade ago.

Postby StephenC » Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:54 pm

Great collection of photos. I particularly like the lovely country lane up to St Lukes Church. What a shame.
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Re: Photos of Cork Street / Coombe Bypass a decade ago.

Postby exene1 » Wed Dec 21, 2011 10:51 am

The bypass road - 'St. Luke's Avenue' - is named after the church whose curtilage it destroyed, lol.
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Re: Photos of Cork Street / Coombe Bypass a decade ago.

Postby gunter » Fri Dec 23, 2011 2:10 am

Excellent photographic record of Cork Street there exene, I see the remains, in one of the shots, of the culvert that replaced the open water course that Rocque shows running down the west side of Ardee Street.

Here's just a few pics taken from Cork Street of the demolition of the Chamber Street flats in Nov. '08

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looking south up Ormond Street towards Weavers Square
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Re: Photos of Cork Street / Coombe Bypass a decade ago.

Postby exene1 » Sat Dec 24, 2011 1:46 am

The demolition of the flats has produced a huge levelled area around Chamber Street, Ormond Street and Weavers Square - some which is now in vegetable allotments - but a plan is needed for how the area is going to be handled eventually. Newmarket, Chamber Street and Weaver Square were mercifully missed by the Cork Street / Coombe bypass highway and also largely missed by development in the boom. McCullough has done a lot in his Urban History book to highlight the significance of the street plan here. It need to be carefully treated. Already a rotten quality building has been built on one side Weavers Square.

Photos of the flats from 2000:



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Looking west on Chamber Street.




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Looking northeast across Weavers Square.




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Looking southwest across Weavers Square in 2000.




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Same scene now. Buildings in Dublin don't come much cheap & nastier than that yoke there.



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Looking cute on Rocque.




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At the other end of Chamber Street, there were two appeal overturnings of Dublin City Council decisions to grant permission for redevelopment on opposite corners within a year of each other.

First, their decision to permit replacement of the 19th century Ardee House pub with another Cork Street apartment block (permitted at 5 storeys) was overturned in January 2009 - http://www.pleanala.ie/casenum/229648.htm




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Then the decision to give permission for this scheme on the site directly across the road was overturned in January 2010 - http://www.pleanala.ie/casenum/234567.htm. Agreed vision for the area 'n all that.




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This '60s photo from the DCC Libraries site shows that the non-descript looking former pub on Newmarket at the corner of Brabazon Row is actually a full historic building, with top floor windows blocked up and roof and chimneys replaced. When something comes to be done with Newmarket eventually I think it’s really important that this building be kept cos there’s so little left on Newmarket.
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Re: Photos of Cork Street / Coombe Bypass a decade ago.

Postby Doug C » Tue Oct 29, 2013 9:25 pm

On the issue of the Chamber Street site, forum members might be interested in a community campaign to convert that site into a public park (sketch design produced by ourselves for the community group is attached).

Here's the campaign page
http://www.facebook.com/CorkStreetPark?fref=ts

As a result of the campaign a DCC Motion on the site is upcoming:
"Considering the severe lack of green and park space in the South West Inner City, City Council agrees that the derelict site on Chamber Street should be turned into a park for the community good, with some more allotments provided there."
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Cork Street Park Campaign.jpg
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Re: Photos of Cork Street / Coombe Bypass a decade ago.

Postby Fabash » Sat Dec 14, 2013 12:05 am

Would anyone have any information on this building?
Seen from the yard of the garden centre on Cork Street. I was told that Dublin city council, water department are demolishing it to make way for a car-park. A lot of progress was made over night, I'm afraid it will probably be no more come Monday.
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Re: Photos of Cork Street / Coombe Bypass a decade ago.

Postby StephenC » Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:31 pm

Mr Clerkin was foaming at the mouth yesterday at the sight of the (permitted) new distillery centre for Teeling Irish Whiskey to be located on Newmarket. The new building will be located at the corner of the square and Mill Lane, and is one of two new working distilleries planned for the area (the other being in a former warehouse on Mill Street)

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The building received planning permission earlier this month with little or no public comment. The architect is George Boyle, formerly of MOLA.

Personally, I quite like the building. Is it theme-parky? Perhaps, but I think that suits the use. I just dont see it as being 'horrendous'. Newmarket is a sad space to be honest. A lost area of Dublin, greatly unloved. I think the two new distillery's, combined with the existing flea market and co-op will reinvent this place and will definitely attract new uses to redevelop the ugly warehouses that crowd around the periphery.

It seems design is very subjective in this instance. Frank McDonald yesterday called for a 'modern' building - but what does that mean? I don't see this as pastiche. I see it as rustic inspired and in many ways it reminds me of the approach taken to the Jameson distillery building in Smithfield.

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Interestingly the planning report on the building made very little reference to the masterplan for the square contained in the Liberties LAP - surely proving to be the most useless and unrealisible planning document. The LAP has a sketch of Newmarket with big 5/6 storey blocks of apartments/offices whatever. Is that a better approach for the site?

Something that also came up yesterday was this McMullough Mulvin concept for the site. Utterly hideous in my view.

http://mcculloughmulvin.com/projects/Newmarket.php

I do seem to recall a Dublin City Council masterplan for the square...in the mists of time.
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Re: Photos of Cork Street / Coombe Bypass a decade ago.

Postby exene1 » Mon Feb 03, 2014 10:24 am

StephenC wrote:
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Personally, I quite like the building. Is it theme-parky? Perhaps, but I think that suits the use. I just dont see it as being 'horrendous'. Newmarket is a sad space to be honest. A lost area of Dublin, greatly unloved. I think the two new distillery's, combined with the existing flea market and co-op will reinvent this place and will definitely attract new uses to redevelop the ugly warehouses that crowd around the periphery.


Yes I don't see a problem. It's a bit 'Galway style' but if it fits their need it's not an objectionable building.

Have you seen the new Dun Laoghaire library? A godawful box in the same modernist rut all irish 'name' architects (and college faculties for that matter) are stuck in for years, the kind of building the public hate and architects give each other awards for.
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Re: Photos of Cork Street / Coombe Bypass a decade ago.

Postby StephenC » Mon Feb 03, 2014 12:12 pm

A bigger challenge will be to get people to feel safe wandering down to Newmarket past the myriad of vacant sites that line Cork Street. Its going to be very difficult to get people to feel they are heading to a 'destination attraction'.
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