Tipperary Venue

Re: Tipperary Venue

Postby Bren88 » Mon Nov 15, 2010 6:05 am

There is no such thing as a casino licence in ireland. And, there isn't actually any need for them to list it in the description.
The casino would be, I imagine, a part of the hotel building. So that's all they need to mention, it just becomes an area in the hotel, and wouldn't be listed, like the restaurant for example. It would obvious shown on the plans, but I doubt it called casino anywhere, cardroom or members club would be most likely (as that is what it would be from a legal standpoint). Slots or anything like, might be a licence, but that would be no different to a games arcade getting through the process.
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Re: Tipperary Venue

Postby PVC King » Mon Nov 15, 2010 7:55 am

I like the way the UK deals with Casinos; there is a twin track aproach firstly a finite number of licenses and secondly a planning use called Sui Generis which in practice means it is a unique consent without a presupposed bundle of normal terms and conditions; the onus is on the applicant to prove the case as opposed to the obligation to prove compliance with a development plan. The Casino operators are in the right locations able to demonstrate that a specific location has economic benefits that outweigh local impacts.

There is a market for a few prestige casinos in Ireland to leverage the very strong sporting tourism market; I'm just not sure if bringing tourists there by monorail is ideal.
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Re: Tipperary Venue

Postby tommyt » Mon Nov 15, 2010 11:29 am

There's a handy solution to all these megalomoaniacal projects;

Declare a massive area around Shannon Airport a free trade zone and stick your White House Casino, Athlone Chinese super trading hub and Dundalk ski slope all in this zone- no visas, duty free booze and fags etc. Not necessary to leave the zone- it'd be a Guantanamo- tastic location for gambling, ski jumping and buying xmas decorations in bulk.

Move Bunratty brick by brick to this zone and chuck in those replica high crosses from Collins Barracks and have ' de memeries of oireland' super exhibition.

No need for new airports in Arklow or Tullamore.

Job's oxo.
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Postby KerryBog2 » Sat Dec 18, 2010 11:31 pm

Stumbled across this recently. Interesting perspectives.
http://outofthestormnews.com/2010/09/22 ... want-them/

K.
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Re: Tipperary Venue

Postby PVC King » Thu Dec 23, 2010 8:39 am

Tougher regulation urged for super casinos

Wednesday December 22 2010

Any plans for Ireland to have its own Las Vegas-style development were dealt a blow today as it emerged the country is too small to support it.

But proposals to overhaul Ireland's historic gaming laws found a super casino resort and leisure complex could create thousands of jobs and top up dwindling state coffers.

The consultation paper, Options for Regulating Gambling, added any development would be subject to strict regulation from a new independent body and on-site regulation.

The report, published by Justice Minister Dermot Ahern, said resort casinos would generate large-scale employment during construction and operation, when it could house up to 1,500 gaming machines, live entertainment, dining and refreshments spread across some 5,000 square metres of floor space.

They should also provide a high return to the state in terms of licensing fees and gambling tax revenue, it found.

Mr Ahern said his wish was to protect the vulnerable while laws are brought in to the 21st century.


"Our existing laws regulating gambling are not fit for purpose in this age of mass global communications," said Mr Ahern.

"It is my wish that gambling regulation should be brought into the 21st century and that means improved protection for minors and vulnerable adults, more transparent operations by gambling providers, and more effective measures against fraud and illegal gambling and criminality".

Ambitious plans for a super casino, sports complex and entertainment resort near the village of Two-Mile-Borris have already been approved by North Tipperary County Council.

The €460m project features a 6,000sq m casino, a replica of the White House, a 500-bedroom five-star hotel and an entertainment complex.

However changes are needed to the Gaming Act for the casino to obtain a licence to operate.

The project has been openly backed by Independent TD Michael Lowry - who maintained he made no demands on the issue when he agreed to back the Government's controversial €6m budget.


Those in opposition fear gambling will rise, hitting the poorest communities hardest and spiralling more people in to debt. Members of organised crime will also have a means to launder money, it is claimed.

Other measures in Options for Regulating Gambling propose that responsibility for all gambling activities fall under a new unified regulator for gambling, headed by the Department of Justice, with local authorities having powers over planning and licensing arrangements.

Remote gambling over the internet, phone, and interactive TV should also be regulated under strict licensing conditions, irrespective of whether the product is offered from within Ireland, or from off-shore, it added.

Press Association



How could the support ofa clientist parochial pariah for a mono-rail style project, result in a usually balanced minister coming up with a throw the baby out with the bathwater type comment like the above. There is a future for Casinos in Ireland; just not because idiots like Michael Lowry lobby for them to be built in the wrong place. Given the difficulties being experienced by the horse racing industry why aren't realistic locations like Leopardstown and Limerick being considered for a five year trial.
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Re: Tipperary Venue

Postby tommyt » Thu Dec 23, 2010 12:35 pm

D. Ahern has his own pet project with 'Altitude' having a tack-on casino in Dundalk.

http://www.louthcoco.ie/ePlan41/FileRef ... LASiteID=0

A Letter of support on ministerial note paper is in the appendices of the EIS last time I checked.
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Re: Tipperary Venue

Postby Paul Clerkin » Fri Mar 11, 2011 4:44 pm

Hotel dependent on casino, says promoter

THE HOTEL element of a €460 million sports and leisure complex planned for a rural site in Co Tipperary will not go ahead if a proposed casino is not allowed, promoters have said.

A “resort casino hotel” with up to 500 bedrooms is part of the “Tipperary Venue” earmarked for an 800-acre site at Two-Mile-Borris near Thurles.

While gambling legislation is currently being reviewed by the Department of Justice, the venue’s architect said yesterday the hotel and the casino “are effectively one” and dependent on each other.

The Tipperary Venue also includes turf and all-weather horse racing tracks, a greyhound track, a 15,000-capacity indoor entertainment venue, a golf course and an equestrian centre.

Businessman Richard Quirke is behind the venture, while Independent TD Michael Lowry has been a keen supporter. They say about 1,000 jobs will be created during construction of the venue, while 1,350 full-time jobs would be in place when complete.

Architect Brian O’Connell told the third day of a Bord Pleanála hearing into the project the hotel/casino “is predicated on the licensing regime” and would depend on the Government’s decision regarding casino laws.

“There’s a new economic opportunity within the market for providing conference facilities within a casino hotel,” he said.

“The one wouldn’t proceed without the other.”

However, he said this would not affect the rest of the proposed complex.

The horse-racing aspect of the project is supported by Horse Racing Ireland, which invited expressions of interest for the development of an all-weather track in the Munster region some years ago.

Existing tracks in Thurles and Tipperary (Limerick Junction) are expected to close if the Tipperary Venue gets the green light.

During questioning by sustainable planning expert and barrister James Nix for An Taisce, Mr O’Connell said the urban locations of venues such as the O2 in Dublin and the Odyssey Arena in Belfast were “inappropriate”. This was because of the influx of large numbers of people into an urban setting in a short period of time.

There was a “strong argument” for building such venues outside city locations.

North Tipperary County Council granted planning permission for the project last year but the case was appealed to the board by some local residents and An Taisce.

Concerns include the level of traffic which would be generated by the venue, along with noise, carbon emissions, helicopter use, its distance from public transport and the sustainability of such a large-scale development.

The hearing concluded yesterday, and a decision is due at the end of this month.
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Re: Tipperary Venue

Postby teak » Wed Mar 16, 2011 2:42 pm

A lot of posts with comments of all kinds.
Yet to me this is not really an architectural issue at all.
I see this thing as simply an issue of social morality.
That is, people want to allow society to go this way --
allowing people to make profits from glamourised gambling
and all that comes in its wake -- or people do not want to
allow society to go this way.

Personally, I do not.
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Re: Tipperary Venue

Postby Bren88 » Thu Apr 07, 2011 2:17 am

teak wrote:A lot of posts with comments of all kinds.
Yet to me this is not really an architectural issue at all.
I see this thing as simply an issue of social morality.
That is, people want to allow society to go this way --
allowing people to make profits from glamourised gambling
and all that comes in its wake
-- or people do not want to
allow society to go this way.

Personally, I do not.


That's non-sense. Watching too many films.
Gambling is huge in Ireland. This proposal will have any mojor effect on it.
There are a huge amount of bets placed at horse and dog tracks on a daily basis. There are bookies in everytown, and they are taking a reasonable amount of money.
There are currently casinos and cardrooms in every city and large town in the country.

The proposal is nothing that isn't happening here already on a daily basis
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Re: Tipperary Venue

Postby Paul Clerkin » Thu Apr 07, 2011 3:52 am

Video of scheme
http://youtu.be/DcxjPazFB2w
You have to watch it to hear the last couple of lines of voiceover - the hubris
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Re: Tipperary Venue

Postby Frank Taylor » Thu Apr 07, 2011 4:36 pm

The promoter's son, Andrew Quirke, has produced a tasteful video tour of his father's house.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzIN_u8hkFA
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Re: Tipperary Venue

Postby teak » Tue Apr 26, 2011 12:38 pm

No way is Quirke capable of funding this thing.
He is getting help from experienced gambling resort moguls thar lear, I believe.
Specifically who ?

Read this for a cute little mention of a meeting with the chief planner by
the Tipp Gomorrah's new champion . . .

http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0405/monaco.html

Wouldn't it be cute if for the sniffable cost of a bi-annual fellowship to
Trinity (I make that around €50,000 every 2 years), Prince Albert got
what he was after . . .
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Re: Tipperary Venue

Postby teak » Mon Jun 13, 2011 5:16 pm

The gombeens have turned Bórd Pleanála.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/bre ... ing23.html

Only a High Court challenge can now stop them.

Best investment of €50,000 that Prince Albert ever did. :sick:

Hot Springs here we come.
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Re: Tipperary Venue

Postby KerryBog2 » Tue Sep 27, 2011 1:49 pm

I'm surprised that this thread has not been resurrected, given that the recent announcement of proposed changes in the Gaming laws has nailed its coffing shut. I always thought it rather strange that the media objections tended to be moral, rather than based on financial viability, and that neither side was less than opaque on the financial backing and viability.
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Re: Tipperary Venue

Postby teak » Thu Sep 29, 2011 12:47 am

The crass-scaled casino has been nailed shut.
But the other quite worthy and appropriate aspects of the project like the racetracks and the equestrian centre
are free to go ahead.
And I belive that they will go ahead since the land has been bought and the sellers have no doubt spent a good lot
of the money by now.
Then there's the usual clamour from local contractors, hostelries, businessmen etc to go ahead with any new big
project that may benefit themselves.

If some of the big horse industry people support it financially as well as vocally it may have a good chance to
succeed without the casino.
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