Beamish

[bosco]

According to the newspaper reports, the brewery is to cease production in May (2 months late). This is to be followed by the dismantling and disposal (by sale or otherwise) of plant and equipment, and eventually the sale of the site, perhaps in 18 months time. Wonder what the market will be like in late 2010?

[kite]

I must say that i am suprised at the stance that Heineken is taking on the Beamish & Crawford site.
Having UCC on board with the National Conservation Group to set up a National research centre on site should be a win win suitation for all?

http://www.corkindependent.com/local-news/local-news/heineken-rule-out-micro%11brewery/

[Radioactiveman]

Agreed, Heineken would want to 'cop-on' to themselves if they think they can strip the brewery of assets and then dump it on the market without any sort of support for a future public use. Shame on them.

[Radioactiveman]

I used to live around the corner from the Beamish & Crawford brewery for a number of years. When the wind came from the east, the smell from the brewery would be almost unbearable.

I grew up next to Murphy's Brewery. That smell needs getting used to but certainly isn't unpleasant.

Cork's population has a very high incidence of candida, this is due to the high yeast content in the air from our city breweries and distilleries coupled with the fact that the city is surrounded by hills.

This is hilarious. Yeasts are naturally occurring. Even if you swam in the stuff every day it wouldn't increase the rates of candida.

The gigantic silos standing sentry at the city's historical south gate are an absolute eye sore.

These are no more an eyesore than the silos at the south docks. They're a part of Cork's industrial heritage. Any replacement apartments would be much more obtrusive to the views of St. Finbarre's.

The water colour in the river Lee is very different downstream of the brewery than it is upstream, the reader can draw their own conclusions here.

This is just not true.

With sensitivity shown to the more historical components of the brewery, for all of the above reasons I would like to see redevelopment here.

Now, this i can agree with - but with a small micro-brewery in place it could please everyone.

[kite]

The National Conservation and Heritage Group and UCC have no interest in the silos as far as I am aware.
The proposed micro brewery, national brewing research unit (UCC), and heritage / museum should have no need for the silos.
Remember the slogan O’Brien Crane Hire had on its trucks; ’Where O’Brien Goes, Prosperity Follows’
The same could be said for UCC, if Heineken allowed a brewing research unit as proposed by the NCHG it would attract high-end jobs to the area and as a result would increase the site value.

[Radioactiveman]

Absolutely, the silos arrived in the early 90's as far as I'm aware. Although an integral part of the brewing history, there's no argument for keeping them. I would question whether UCC has the cash to be splashing round on such a venture at the moment, but It would certainly make sense.

[Pug]

thats the risk of a public post i think, i'm not a referee but radioactive mans probably over the top but thats that persons views. I think the site should be developed into something other than boring residential, i think a little micor brewery/tourist attraction would be brilliant and theres no reason why UCC cant get involved with that, they could use some of their government funding on it.

[rumpelstiltskin]

This site is frequented by people who think they're all really insightful, but are in fact just good old-fashioned Irish curmudgeons with longer words. Nothing whatsoever that gets said here, or gets built in Ireland, is free from criticism. It's a serious national problem.

[Radioactiveman]

My views are as insightful and/or as full of bullsh*t as anybody else's on this discussion board. You don't have to agree with me (I don't even agree with myself when I read back some of my old posts), but in answer to your question, yes it is normal to have your posts discussed openly. Its a discussion board and not a blog. The point is to create discussion, not to post one point of view and not to expect to see it challenged, fiercely at times.
I'm robust in my criticism but we all have to be robust in receiving criticism of our points of view.

[Pug]

well, lets get back to the point and when all the local councillors call to your door, ask them what they propose to do with the Beamish site and why they havent been knocking at heneikens door morning noon and night to figure out whats happening and have they engaged Cork Chamber of Commerce to get their network up and active,

the good news is that no one will want to build residential on it with the lack of market thats there at the moment, even o callaghans want to build a private medical facility instead of apartments at the jurys site

[Radioactiveman]

Personally, I wouldn't have a major problem with some residential, commercial or office development on the site, as long as the 'front-of-house' was given over to heritage and micro-brewery type functions. The brewery/heritage uses will greatly enhance the marketability of the new developments. What Heineken fail to realise is that there is a solution here where everybody wins!

[bunch]

if i were to advise a potential buyer of the beamish site in terms of its development potential - i would have to mention the serious development constraints as follows;

- protected structures in centre of site afaik - seriously restricts site developemt capacity and redevelopment options overall
- protected views to st finbarrs also constrain scale and site coverage - need to maintain certain key views as per the views and prospects policy in the cdp
- proximity to south gate bridge and historic quayside setting restricts the level of development in taht location
- lack of significant footfall on south main street, poor retail potential, secondary location in retail/commercial terms
-long list of ready-made objections ready to be submitted - the public are sore at heineken's actions - what is generall yperceived as plundering a key part of the city's indiustrial and cultural heritage
- archaeology will be a huge issue - under and overground

imo, it is not a particularly good development site but a hugely important urban opportunity for the city - could be exactly what the city centre needs in terms of tourist/cultural/research oppportunities - part of extended food/drink heritage trail - english market - park- brewery link. city should consider purchase of the site (cpo). i honestly think if heineken were to put it on the market tomorrow, it would fail to attract huge interest - too messy.

i actually quite like the tanks - no real conservation interest but very interesting visually at that location

[Leesider]

if i were to advise a potential buyer of the beamish site in terms of its development potential - i would have to mention the serious development constraints as follows;

- protected structures in centre of site afaik - seriously restricts site developemt capacity and redevelopment options overall
- protected views to st finbarrs also constrain scale and site coverage - need to maintain certain key views as per the views and prospects policy in the cdp
- proximity to south gate bridge and historic quayside setting restricts the level of development in taht location
- lack of significant footfall on south main street, poor retail potential, secondary location in retail/commercial terms
-long list of ready-made objections ready to be submitted - the public are sore at heineken's actions - what is generall yperceived as plundering a key part of the city's indiustrial and cultural heritage
- archaeology will be a huge issue - under and overground

imo, it is not a particularly good development site but a hugely important urban opportunity for the city - could be exactly what the city centre needs in terms of tourist/cultural/research oppportunities - part of extended food/drink heritage trail - english market - park- brewery link. city should consider purchase of the site (cpo). i honestly think if heineken were to put it on the market tomorrow, it would fail to attract huge interest - too messy.

i actually quite like the tanks - no real conservation interest but very interesting visually at that location

I would agree with all of the above, on what grounds could the city cpo it?? Cork really needs something more to attract tourists. The Shandon area has so much potential but has been neglected, I can see the same happening here!

[kite]

The Shandon area is indeed a disgrace; it is nothing more than a derelict site.
Walked there last week with a group of six tourists from Reno Nevada who were touring Europe.
The World tour guide that they looked up online to plan their itinerary recommended a visit to Cobh Cathedral, Blarney Castle, a tour of Beamish & Crawford / South Gate area, and Shandon.
Beamish & Crawford was closed (thanks Heineken !!) and the dirt and vomit on the streets was disgusting.
The “new” pedestrian areas in the Shandon were a danger to walk on due to sinking and broken pavers.
Thankfully the visit to Cobh and Blarney proved a success.

The city council pumped millions of Euro into the Shandon area over the past 10 years; they may as well flushed the money into our overpriced main drainage system for all the good it did for the area, the words ‘hole’ and ‘black’ spring to mind.

At least one city Councillor who is backing the National Conservation and Heritage Group’s efforts to save Beamish had the balls to insist that measures be put in place to ensure the further cash injection for the Shandon area as passed by CCC last year be used to “get it right this time round” , hope he is proved right?

I for one will boycott Heineken products for as long as they insist on ignoring our heritage.

[Radioactiveman]

I for one will boycott Heineken products for as long as they insist on ignoring our heritage.

Now, now, lets not get carried away

There's certainly very strong feelings towards Heineken on this one. I don't think purchase by the city will help matters. Just take a look at ChristChurch across the road from the brewery...its been closed off for more than a year. Nothing being done, and in my view the security of the building itself is threatened. We were promised a music venue as an addition to the Triskel. In who's lifetime is this going to emerge??
I don't want to see Beamish going the same way.

[kite]

Now, now, lets not get carried away

There's certainly very strong feelings towards Heineken on this one. I don't think purchase by the city will help matters. Just take a look at ChristChurch across the road from the brewery...its been closed off for more than a year. Nothing being done, and in my view the security of the building itself is threatened. We were promised a music venue as an addition to the Triskel. In who's lifetime is this going to emerge??
I don't want to see Beamish going the same way.

Point taken; we elect out Councillors, who in turn support any rubbish the city manager proposes...we get what we deserve i suppose?

[kite]

The Examiner reports today that the fight to save Beamish & Crawford is being taken to Heineken HQ in Amsterdam by the National Conservation & Heritage Group.

Posters to this forum will know from my past posts that I had little time for Mick Murphy and his Communities for Sustainable Development group, but now I have to admit that he was proved right with regard to apartment development in Bishopstown and other suburban areas of Cork, many of which are lying empty.

I wish him and the NCHG the very best of luck in their efforts to save the Beamish & Crawford brewery.

[kite]

Most of the press report the last day of Beamish & Crawford today.
Feck Heineken NV and their Irish puppets in Murphy's brewery.
I will never drink a drop of Heineken slop again.

[rumpelstiltskin]

:(Most of the press report the last day of Beamish & Crawford today.
Feck Heineken NV and their Irish puppets in Murphy's brewery.
I will never drink a drop of Heineken slop again.

You better stay away from Amstel, Bulmers, and Strongbow while you're at it. And of course, you must never attend Oxegen or watch the Heineken Cup. Good Luck!

[kite]

You better stay away from Amstel, Bulmers, and Strongbow while you're at it. And of course, you must never attend Oxegen or watch the Heineken Cup. Good Luck!

Ah Jeesus, don't tell me that those Orange feckers brew Bulmers as well?
Just tried a pint bottle of that and thought i had found a 'new home'!!

[opus]

Another new quarter for Cork it appears! Glad to hear there's some plan for the site in any case.

Dutch courage: Plans for €150m Brewery Quarter

A €150-million Brewery Quarter tourism and cultural investment is planned for the heart of Cork city, on the four-acre site vacated in 2009 by the historic firm Beamish and Crawford.

http://www.examiner.ie/ireland/dutch-courage-plans-for-150m-brewery-quarter-139495.html

[Paul Clerkin]

‘Brewery Quarter Scale Model’: Pictured is David Forde, Managing Director of Heineken Ireland, and Theo Cullinane, CEO of BAM Contractors, reviewing a model of the proposed €150 million Brewery Quarter development in the foyer of Beamish & Crawford. This model will be on public display in Beamish & Crawford from mid January onwards.

Brewery Quarter Scale Model.jpg (116.88 KiB) Viewed 3271 times

Night South Gate Bridge CGI.jpg (85.33 KiB) Viewed 3271 times

Counting House Plaza CGI.jpg (110.32 KiB) Viewed 3271 times

http://archiseek.com/2010/plans-submitt ... wery-cork/

[Paul Clerkin]

Got to say that the "counting house" looks like a dollshouse tacked on to the front of that scheme. Really want to see the drawings to judge this better as the renderings are overly slick and cliched - whats the red neon stripe on the river side view?

[rofbp]

an events centre doesn't make any sense on this site.

commercially, i assume it would depend on drawing crowds from the whole munster region. most of these customers will drive there. the site is a disaster to access for cars, and there is nowhere to park. nearby streets such as south main street and barrack street will be overwhelmed.

most importantly, i cannot see how such substantial develop can proceed without destroying the archeology under the site. i'd love to see if there are any reactions to this proposal on any archeology forums.

can we please just have one events centre in the city. o'callaghan applied for permission 2 or 3 weeks ago for his scheme on albert quay. god only knows what is happening to the proposed centre at the atlantic quarter, which is the location and design i prefer

btw, i cannot see the link for attaching photos to posts anymore. does it still exist? i can see the IMG button, but that doesn't work for my own photos?
i have a photo of the echo's story on the matter

[Paul Clerkin]

upload attachment tab is under the main text box