Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby Morlan » Fri Jul 02, 2010 8:22 am

Here are a collection of photomontages and renders produced by the RPA for Luas and Metro.

Iarnród Éireann will be publishing their Railyway Order for DART Underground in the next week or so, so I will post any renders here, too.

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Alignment of Luas BXD and location of Metro station

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The tram traverses O’Connell Bridge in a south to north direction only. By locating the poles in the central median, the wirescape is considerably reduced, as a single arm cantilever only is required. The poles are sited to acknowledge but not compete with the formal setting of the 3 no. five arm Victorian lampstandards on the median. The median itself is widened and matches that of O’Connell Street. The relationship of the poles to the kerb edge is consistent with that for O’Connell Street and introduces the theme for accommodation of the OCS on O’Connell Street.

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OC Bridge

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OC Bridge - Metro station (not showing Luas BXD)

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Luas BXD alignment

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GPO - Luas BXD alignment

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Upper OC Street - Luas BXD alignment - Central median will be reduced


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Parnell - Luas wirescape

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Marlborough Street - Luas BXD alignment

tbc..
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby Morlan » Fri Jul 02, 2010 8:24 am

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Westmorland Street - OC Bridge Metro station

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College Green


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At College Street and Westmoreland Street a series of single track cantilever poles are proposed. Between stops, the poles are placed a consistent 450mm approximately from the kerb edge. These poles follow the strategy used at O’Connell Street and O’Connell Bridge, where there is a similar consistency in the use and setting out of poles. The extent of cabling is thus minimised at these locations.

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College Street
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby Morlan » Fri Jul 02, 2010 8:24 am

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From Fusiliers’ Arch to the corner of Dawson Street, a series of cantilever poles are proposed. This is in accordance with the architectural design strategy, and minimises the extent of cabling at the periphery of St. Stephen’s Green.

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Dawson St.

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Dawson St.

More info http://www.dublinluasbroombridge.ie/
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby johnglas » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:43 pm

I know I must be missing something in all this, but what was (is) the objection to running the LUAS line on either side of the median in O'C St? Why go to the bother of invading a much narrower street like Marlborough and building yet another bridge over the river? The present alignment on O'C St looks very lopsided (and the poles which 'acknowledge but not compete with the formal setting of the 3 no. five arm Victorian lampstandards' are so hamfistedly wrong in this context).
Is this another example of the febrile ravings of the traffic engineers? Is it too late to call a halt (pardon the pun)?
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby kefu » Fri Jul 02, 2010 1:06 pm

On the contrary, why not go down Marlboro Street completely. It is hardly used by cars anyway and might breathe new life into what has become - in large chunks - a very shabby street.
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby johnglas » Fri Jul 02, 2010 2:19 pm

And just as the Palestrina breaks into the sublimity of the ' Ave Verum' two trams lumber by... Kefu; where's your soul?
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby cgcsb » Fri Jul 02, 2010 2:49 pm

It seems to me that the turn from O'Connell st onto Parnell street is far too sharp, I would've prefered if

a) both tracks used O'Connell Street
b) they turned into the site of the, no demolished Royal Dublin Hotel and emerged on Parnell st. That way it would be a broader curve, allowing trams to go faster.
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby Frank Taylor » Fri Jul 02, 2010 2:49 pm

Looks like the taxi rank on OCS will have to go :-)
There will be only one lane left for northbound traffic: will this be a bus lane? If so that means no cars going north on OCS from Westmoreland street or turning left from Bachelor's Walk.
Where will a bike lane fit in on OCS?
Should we buy the Bordeaux-style ground level power supply instead of overhead catenary? The French seem to have had teething problems but maybe they're resolved now.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ground-level_power_supply

Last thing we need is a load more poles.
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby hutton » Fri Jul 02, 2010 2:52 pm

Many thanks Morlan for posting the photomontages - you have done the site some service.

Why oh why do the RPA insist on using out-of-date technology by erecting utterly unnecessary poles, cables, and other clutter in what is supposed to be our areas of finest architecture - ie College Green, O'Connell Street, Westmorland Street, Dawson Street, and outside the Rotunda Hospital?

Other progressive cities on the continent have long since dropped the use of cable clutter in their central areas in favour of cable free technology, be it by APS ground supply in Bordeaux - or by battery power in Nice:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ground-level_power_supply

Once again the RPA are proposing to create unnecessary expense and delays by inserting cobble lock where it simply is not needed, and where tarmac would work perfectly fine. Over engineering for the point of it. The RPA previously did this along the Red Luas line where their pinnacle achievement in terms of folly is cobble lock on the section between Church Street and Queen Street, the insertion of granite pavement either side, topped off by small barriers with signs indicating that said pavements are not supposed to be used by pedestrians.

Can we have a few more (anti) pedestrian galvanised steel barriers please, such as the crap (anti) "pedestrian pens" that they erected around Beresford Place, outside the Custom House for the Red Luas? I am sure the boys will feel they'll have done their job when thats in place :rolleyes:

Why do we have to have such aesthetically illiterate slobs let loose to visually vandalize the most important areas of our city? It doesn't happen in other continental cities. In Nice there is frequently grass as the primary surface for the median into which the rails are set, and as said, no cables - this creates a very ambient pleasant atmosphere. Yet in Dublin we insist on doing it our own way, to pointlessly and expensively create harsh hard surfaces for the sake of it, so that presumably we can show the world that we too can have the civic standards of a provincial Brit city :(

One final point re Marlborough Street - I actually do think that what is proposed here makes sense, in that when political demonstrations / commemorations occur outside the GPO, the Marlborough Street line can be used as a bypass for trams going each way. So credit there where its due.
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby hutton » Fri Jul 02, 2010 3:00 pm

Frank Taylor wrote:Looks like the taxi rank on OCS will have to go :-)
There will be only one lane left for northbound traffic: will this be a bus lane? If so that means no cars going north on OCS from Westmoreland street or turning left from Bachelor's Walk.
Where will a bike lane fit in on OCS?
Should we buy the Bordeaux-style ground level power supply instead of overhead catenary? The French seem to have had teething problems but maybe they're resolved now.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ground-level_power_supply

Last thing we need is a load more poles.


Ha! Great minds think alike!

Agree re taxi rank going; the opportunity there is to now remove it to Cathál Brugha Street beside the Gresham Hotel, as previously identified on this site as preferred, where the taxis can wrap around red brick Romanesque Revival style church :)

The buses and Luas should share the same space - it is madness not to, and as proposed will only lead to major objections from Department store owners and other vested interests. I never get the RPA's allergy to the concept that the Luas tracks can actually accommodate other traffic without the world coming to an end :confused:
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby hutton » Fri Jul 02, 2010 3:03 pm

hutton wrote: The buses and Luas should share the same space - it is madness not to


Actually I suppose it would miss out on the opportunity to have a good old fashioned turf war between two state agencies, just like what happened between CIE and RPA regarding the Broadstone - Liffey Junction line :rolleyes:
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby hutton » Fri Jul 02, 2010 3:06 pm

cgcsb wrote:It seems to me that the turn from O'Connell st onto Parnell street is far too sharp, I would've prefered if

a) both tracks used O'Connell Street
b) they turned into the site of the, no demolished Royal Dublin Hotel and emerged on Parnell st. That way it would be a broader curve, allowing trams to go faster.


Afraid I have to disagree - see my above point re Marlborough Street, and also I would not at all be in favour of introducing an unnecessary permanent gap, breaking up the integrity of the boulevard that should be O'Connell Street. Don't be giving them ideas! :mad::p
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby hutton » Fri Jul 02, 2010 3:15 pm

Morlan wrote:Image
OC Bridge - Metro station (not showing Luas BXD)


Oh dear, John Gormley's plastic poles cycleway disappears with that plan - he won't be liking that.




Not that he'll be Minister when it opens. Or even a TD :)
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby lostexpectation » Fri Jul 02, 2010 5:19 pm

thanks Morlan
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby cgcsb » Fri Jul 02, 2010 8:06 pm

hutton wrote:Afraid I have to disagree - see my above point re Marlborough Street,


what about Marlborough street? seperation from road traffic is ideal for rail services from a transport engineering point of view. At present the luas will share space with cars on lower O'Connell st.

hutton wrote: and also I would not at all be in favour of introducing an unnecessary permanent gap, breaking up the integrity of the boulevard that should be O'Connell Street. Don't be giving them ideas! :mad::p


Dublin central is going on that site anyway. It wouldn't be a gap, developers can build around it.
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby Bago » Fri Jul 02, 2010 8:42 pm

Hopefully the paving pattern around stephens green is just a mock-up. Looks very nasty, zero artistry.
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby missarchi » Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:42 am

It seems from the video that the interiors of Christchurch, Pearse & inchichore reference the new Carlow art gallery exterior. I think it's great we have 3 stations that look the same as a famous art gallery this will truly be award winning architecture at its best.

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In addition the exterior of Christchurch references Operation Overlord with an enclosed auditorium which ties back to the other aliases associated with this fine civic space.

http://www.rpa.ie/en/news/Pages/1,000FreeLuasticketstotheKingsofConcreteFestival.aspx
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby Morlan » Wed Jul 07, 2010 12:58 am

It was reveled yesterday that the government has axed many of Transport 21's projects due to no cash (quelle surprise!).

It would appear that Luas BXD will not go ahead any time soon, HOWEVER, Metro North will, and enabling works for BXD will go ahead alongside the construction of Metro North - no point digging up College Green twice.

Metro North and DART Underground will go ahead as planned.

The DART Underground Railway Order should be online over the next week or so, and hopefully there will be a few renders and montages for us, which I will post here.


hutton wrote:Many thanks Morlan


lostexpectation wrote:thanks Morlan


No probs!


johnglas wrote:what was (is) the objection to running the LUAS line on either side of the median in O'C St?


From what I have read on other forums, johnglas, Dublin Bus may have been the reason for the route change. :rolleyes:


cgcsb wrote:I would've prefered if they turned into the site of the now demolished Royal Dublin Hotel and emerged on Parnell st.


Surely not, cgcsb! :)

Frank Taylor wrote:Looks like the taxi rank on OCS will have to go :-)

:)
Frank Taylor wrote:There will be only one lane left for northbound traffic: will this be a bus lane?

Yeah, only one lane northbound on OCS Lower for buses and taxis, two lanes northbound on OCS Upper with Luas eating into the central median there.
Frank Taylor wrote:Where will a bike lane fit in on OCS?

There is room on OCS Lower northbound for a bike lane beside the bus lane.
hutton wrote:Why do the RPA insist on using out-of-date technology by erecting utterly unnecessary poles, cables, and other clutter in what is supposed to be our areas of finest architecture

I would agree with that, but the RPA haven't mentioned anything about ground supply. They don't want to give it as an option, for budgetary reasons. They would if there was enough pressure from the likes of ourselves!
hutton wrote:cobble lock where it simply is not needed, and where tarmac would work perfectly fine.

Agreed. While it looks nice, the tramline should also be used as a bus lane for Dublin Bus. Remember, these are two different State companies competing with eachother, and we have no central transport authority for Dublin.. yet!
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby cgcsb » Wed Jul 07, 2010 1:51 am

Morlan wrote:.


Surely not, cgcsb! :)


surely, yes, sharp corners are the reason for the long journey times on the red line, I'd prefer if the same were not repeated, and sharp corners were minimized.

Morlan wrote:Yeah, only one lane northbound on OCS Lower for buses and taxis, two lanes northbound on OCS Upper with Luas eating into the central median there.



It is my understanding that the luas will share with private traffic on lower O'Connell street. If that were'nt the case as you suggest, there would be no point in a private traffic lane in upper O'C because the only way to access the northbound carriageway of O'C is via O'Connell Bridge and a left turn from the quays onto O'C(soon to be banned by city council)
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby PVC King » Wed Jul 07, 2010 8:21 am

Morlan wrote:It was reveled yesterday that the government has axed many of Transport 21's projects due to no cash (quelle surprise!).

It would appear that Luas BXD will not go ahead any time soon, HOWEVER, Metro North will, and enabling works for BXD will go ahead alongside the construction of Metro North - no point digging up College Green twice.


Seems Dempsey remains in a different reality to the rest of the World; no Luas link up but Metro North and a Motorway now extended from Waterford to Letterkenny are prioritised. Ireland is doomed with leadership like that........
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby OisinT » Wed Jul 07, 2010 1:54 pm

Morlan wrote:It was reveled yesterday that the government has axed many of Transport 21's projects due to no cash (quelle surprise!).


I'm not saying that you're incorrect, but the article is clear that:

"No projects have been cancelled and Transport 21 continues to provide the strategic framework for capital spending on transport infrastructure into the future."

"Government sources confirmed vulnerable projects included four Metro/Luas schemes -- Metro West, Luas lines from Cherrywood to Bray, Lucan to the city centre and St Stephen's Green to Liffey Junction."

This indicates, to me, that while 4 of the projects are vulnerable either some or all may not be cancelled.

The only projects that have actually been cancelled so far are the:
"Nine new motorway rest areas planned for the M7 (Limerick), M8 (Cork), M9 (Waterford), M3 (Cavan) and N11 (Wexford)"


The announcement as to what projects other than the rest areas that are actually cancelled will be announced next week, but I definitely believe it would be insane to build the MN without doing BXD at the same time. Postpone the other projects, but at least get the BXD as far as DIT/Grangegorman.
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby OisinT » Wed Jul 07, 2010 1:59 pm

Frank Taylor wrote:Looks like the taxi rank on OCS will have to go :-)
There will be only one lane left for northbound traffic: will this be a bus lane? If so that means no cars going north on OCS from Westmoreland street or turning left from Bachelor's Walk.
Where will a bike lane fit in on OCS?
Should we buy the Bordeaux-style ground level power supply instead of overhead catenary? The French seem to have had teething problems but maybe they're resolved now.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ground-level_power_supply

Last thing we need is a load more poles.

I'm assuming they are not using the ground level power because the BXD will be connecting to the existing luas line. Why they didn't use this in the first place is a good question - obviously it's to do with cost.
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby Morlan » Wed Jul 07, 2010 2:32 pm

Renders from the DART Underground Railway Order

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Stephen's Green station

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Stephen's Green station

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Pearse station

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Pearse station

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Pearse station

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Pearse station

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Docklands

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Docklands & "Station Square"

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Docklands
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby Morlan » Wed Jul 07, 2010 2:32 pm

Image
Inchicore station

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Christ Church

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Christ Church


They is more but the site went down when I was downloading the PDFs.
http://www.dartundergroundrailwayorder.ie/
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Re: Luas, Metro and DART - Drawings and Photomontages

Postby cgcsb » Wed Jul 07, 2010 3:03 pm

It appears for the Pearse st enterance that the sky bridge and that trinity owned building will be demolished, is this the case?
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