Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby shadow » Wed Apr 21, 2010 9:51 am

22 million..........?

I am astonished

Perhaps someone could enlighten me as to how this cost this much, presumably this includes rail lines and other infrastructural costs..
shadow
Member
 
Posts: 313
Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2001 1:00 am

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby tomtdowling » Wed Apr 21, 2010 10:14 am

shadow wrote:22 million..........?

I am astonished

Perhaps someone could enlighten me as to how this cost this much, presumably this includes rail lines and other infrastructural costs..


I read that in the Times on Monday http://bit.ly/b2bIvY.......there is something seriously wrong here. The new Grand Canal Theatre which was a very complex and sophisticated build cost €80million and a merger little Dart station cost €22million!!

Can some one please tell me what I'm missing here?
tomtdowling
Member
 
Posts: 14
Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2010 12:34 pm
Location: West Dublin

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby reddy » Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:02 am

Perhaps public sector pay can account for the rest?

Seriously though, its hard to see where this could have been spent.

I suppose the fact that it was constructed over the fully operational rail line will have increased costs dramatically but this figure seems massive.
reddy
Member
 
Posts: 313
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2005 11:03 am
Location: Dublin

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby MethylRed » Wed Apr 21, 2010 12:55 pm

The Phoenix Park rail station cost 7m to construct less then two years ago.

Maybe they included a shed load of access roads, paths and car parks in that figure.

22 millions seems huge though.
MethylRed
Member
 
Posts: 4
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:02 pm

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby markpb » Wed Apr 21, 2010 1:04 pm

MethylRed wrote:The Phoenix Park rail station cost 7m to construct less then two years ago.

Maybe they included a shed load of access roads, paths and car parks in that figure.

22 millions seems huge though.


PPR station only has 2 platforms, I think Clongriffin has 4. The extra platform, stairs, lifts would add a bit. It might also include extra signalling equipment as well.
markpb
Member
 
Posts: 95
Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2006 5:23 pm

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby PVC King » Wed Apr 21, 2010 1:29 pm

It was paid for by Ballymore and Gannon Homes so one would imagine it included all accessways from the developments as well; add to that operational constraints of having to do much of the work out of hours and it would not be likely tobear relation to building elsewhere. I'd be interested to see the variation in Spons table of costs for rail stations versus say sports pavillions
PVC King
 

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby tomtdowling » Wed Apr 21, 2010 2:05 pm

Nobody has yet come up with how Clongriffin cost €22 million.

I have just checked out the cost of building Adamstown Station which has 4 platforms, all auxiliary facilities including a Park & Ride facilities, came to €12.5 Million in April of 2007 (station costs amounted €10million)

I am completely baffled how Clongriffin costs could be as high as €22million, no matter what auxiliary works you include?? There is a porky being told, why?
tomtdowling
Member
 
Posts: 14
Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2010 12:34 pm
Location: West Dublin

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby mp » Wed Apr 21, 2010 2:06 pm

Pretty poor effort for 22 million too. Architecturally speaking.
mp
Member
 
Posts: 16
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2008 1:12 pm

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby MethylRed » Wed Apr 21, 2010 4:59 pm

mp wrote:Pretty poor effort for 22 million too. Architecturally speaking.


I have yet to see a decent picture of the station. All of the pictures in the media seem to only show small portions.
MethylRed
Member
 
Posts: 4
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:02 pm

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby Paul Clerkin » Wed Apr 21, 2010 5:01 pm

User avatar
Paul Clerkin
Old Master
 
Posts: 5431
Joined: Wed Mar 03, 1999 1:00 am
Location: Monaghan

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby Global Citizen » Wed Apr 21, 2010 5:03 pm

markpb wrote:PPR station only has 2 platforms, I think Clongriffin has 4. The extra platform, stairs, lifts would add a bit. It might also include extra signalling equipment as well.


The added bit in question is €15m.
Thats more than twice the cost of the new station in Phoenix Park.
Quite a bit for an extra couple of platforms.
I'd love to see a breakdown in the costs involved for both stations.
Global Citizen
Member
 
Posts: 197
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 3:23 am
Location: Global

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby tomtdowling » Wed Apr 21, 2010 5:15 pm

Global Citizen wrote:The added bit in question is €15m.
Thats more than twice the cost of the new station in Phoenix Park.
Quite a bit for an extra couple of platforms.
I'd love to see a breakdown in the costs involved for both stations.


A dog on the street can see there is something wrong with the costs, as I said previously Adamstown Station looks similar in size and has 4 platforms with Park and Ride about 600mts of covered walkway from car-park to station, covered bicycle rack for 100 bikes, Bus stop, Taxi rank ect total cost €12.5million of which 10million was the station.

How the hell could a similar station cost almost twice that 3 and half years later. I welcome seeing a breakdown too.
tomtdowling
Member
 
Posts: 14
Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2010 12:34 pm
Location: West Dublin

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby Paul Clerkin » Wed Apr 21, 2010 6:05 pm

It seems steep. But it probably includes the cost of the roadway outside which is essentially a bridge, and whatever other civil works were done around it.
User avatar
Paul Clerkin
Old Master
 
Posts: 5431
Joined: Wed Mar 03, 1999 1:00 am
Location: Monaghan

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby C Flower » Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:38 pm

Another ludicrous vanity project ? Essentially, a ticket booth and a bus shelter.
C Flower
Member
 
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2010 9:48 pm

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby alonso » Wed Apr 21, 2010 9:24 pm

does the cost include the 400 space underground park and ride facility?? That'd cost a fair whack. Plus the contracts could have been signed at the height of the madness.

And to call a DART station in a new town that will evetually house 25,000 people a "vanity project" is bloody ridiculous, especially in a forum where everyone is admittedly typing in the dark with no idea of the actual details
alonso
Senior Member
 
Posts: 975
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 9:33 pm

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby GrahamH » Thu Apr 22, 2010 12:51 am

For €22 million, and for a designed-from-scratch station, the result is more than just a little chaotic doncha think? My head hurts just looking at this.

Image

Why on earth are the overhead cable gantries not incorporated as part of the overall station design? And throwing a designer curvy roof over the whole lot does not diminish the crude engineering forms of the majority of the station.

It's a decent effort to the public street, but the part the majority will be standing gawping at for 10-20 minutes every day, the interior platform area - from the photographs at least - seems very poorly expressed. Simplicity and clarity should be the middle name of this project, but it already looks like a 1980s station with two decades of tactless accretions.
GrahamH
Old Master
 
Posts: 4592
Joined: Tue Oct 15, 2002 11:24 am
Location: Ireland

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby missarchi » Thu Apr 22, 2010 4:10 am

white doesn't age well... track layers get paid 3 times what architects get paid here...
missarchi
Old Master
 
Posts: 1796
Joined: Sat Dec 08, 2007 7:53 pm

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby shytalk » Thu Apr 22, 2010 4:02 pm

GrahamH wrote:For €22 million, and for a designed-from-scratch station, the result is more than just a little chaotic doncha think? My head hurts just looking at this.

Image

Why on earth are the overhead cable gantries not incorporated as part of the overall station design? And throwing a designer curvy roof over the whole lot does not diminish the crude engineering forms of the majority of the station.

It's a decent effort to the public street, but the part the majority will be standing gawping at for 10-20 minutes every day, the interior platform area - from the photographs at least - seems very poorly expressed. Simplicity and clarity should be the middle name of this project, but it already looks like a 1980s station with two decades of tactless accretions.


Rubbish.
It's not bad at all. Try to get out more often into the real world.

And just in case you come up with one of your smart alecky ripostes..............bear in mind that this location is a lawless tribal area Hooliganistan and design has to accomodate this.

If if was designed as one of your fancy prepost modern follys, why the staff alone would trash it before the hooligans even got their spray cans open.
shytalk
Member
 
Posts: 47
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:53 pm

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby shytalk » Thu Apr 22, 2010 4:03 pm

missarchi wrote:white doesn't age well... track layers get paid 3 times what architects get paid here...


The special composite used in the roof actually gets cleaned and becomes more white on interaction with dirt.
Should be OK.
shytalk
Member
 
Posts: 47
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:53 pm

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby tommyt » Thu Apr 22, 2010 4:50 pm

shytalk wrote:The special composite used in the roof actually gets cleaned and becomes more white on interaction with dirt.
Should be OK.


:D:D:D No doubt like untreated timber that ages to a lovely 'silver' colour over time as some spoofer told me once:p
tommyt
Member
 
Posts: 455
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 7:39 pm
Location: D5

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby Global Citizen » Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:20 pm

shytalk wrote:The special composite used in the roof actually gets cleaned and becomes more white on interaction with dirt.
Should be OK.


Del Boy would be proud of that comment. :rolleyes:
Global Citizen
Member
 
Posts: 197
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 3:23 am
Location: Global

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby GrahamH » Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:22 pm

shytalk wrote:Rubbish.
It's not bad at all. Try to get out more often into the real world.

And just in case you come up with one of your smart alecky ripostes..............bear in mind that this location is a lawless tribal area Hooliganistan and design has to accomodate this.

If if was designed as one of your fancy prepost modern follys, why the staff alone would trash it before the hooligans even got their spray cans open.


Are you having a laugh? You can call me many things, but smark alek ain’t one of them.

Your petulant response is sadly typical of parts of the architectural profession – little attempt to engage with criticism, just rude diatribe uttered on the offensive.

The central criticism of the above has nothing whatever to do with “fancy prepost modern follys”, rather it’s about clarity of design. This can derive as much from a handful of steel sections bolted together as it can from an effortfully contrived construction composed of multiple materials. Indeed, the former could very satisfyingly have been achieved here purely on a crisply utilitarian basis.

Instead, we have a carefully contrived roof structure and isolated elements of beauty such as the staircases, stranded amidst what looks like (from the photographs) an incoherent scheme that fails to gel its constituent parts. The staircases are wonderfully robust, the roof has substance, even the bridge has a certain strength of character, but all the flimsy bits n bobs confuse matters unduly.
GrahamH
Old Master
 
Posts: 4592
Joined: Tue Oct 15, 2002 11:24 am
Location: Ireland

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby shytalk » Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:31 pm

GrahamH wrote:Are you having a laugh? You can call me many things, but smark alek ain’t one of them.

Your petulant response is sadly typical of parts of the architectural profession – little attempt to engage with criticism, just rude diatribe uttered on the offensive.

The central criticism of the above has nothing whatever to do with “fancy prepost modern follys”, rather it’s about clarity of design. This can derive as much from a handful of steel sections bolted together as it can from an effortfully contrived construction composed of multiple materials. Indeed, the former could very satisfyingly have been achieved here purely on a crisply utilitarian basis.

Instead, we have a carefully contrived roof structure and isolated elements of beauty such as the staircases, stranded amidst what looks like (from the photographs) an incoherent scheme that fails to gel its constituent parts. The staircases are wonderfully robust, the roof has substance, even the bridge has a certain strength of character, but all the flimsy bits n bobs confuse matters unduly.


Don't tempt me.

btw, hotchpotch is the new black. Or white in this case.......................
shytalk
Member
 
Posts: 47
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:53 pm

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby GrahamH » Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:37 pm

I must remember that.
GrahamH
Old Master
 
Posts: 4592
Joined: Tue Oct 15, 2002 11:24 am
Location: Ireland

Re: Clongriffin Station by Iarnród Éireann Architects

Postby saintleger » Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:45 pm

GrahamH wrote:Instead, we have a carefully contrived roof structure and isolated elements of beauty such as the staircases, stranded amidst what looks like (from the photographs) an incoherent scheme that fails to gel its constituent parts. The staircases are wonderfully robust, the roof has substance, even the bridge has a certain strength of character, but all the flimsy bits n bobs confuse matters unduly.


The staircases I don't like. I think the finish is good, but the form puts me in mind of an M C Escher drawing. I googled to see if I could find the one I was thinking of, but I think it's a composite image in my head.

Is this the new thing now, you're only allowed have 6 steps before you have a landing? Will we never again get a decent flight of stairs that goes all the way to the top? And yes, I realise I sound like a Daily Mail reader whining about elf n safety gone mad.
saintleger
Member
 
Posts: 52
Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2009 3:52 pm

Next

Return to Ireland