Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby kite » Mon May 29, 2006 10:41 pm

Peter FitzPatrick wrote:ah yes, the tread can finally be put to bed ...

Mansfield's giant heap of crap is not to be :D :D :D

Is that definitely it now ?? no appeals, no come back ?


:rolleyes: I hope so, but, MONEY dear boy, MONEY, the Mafia and money rules, dont hold your breath?
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby lisam » Tue May 30, 2006 1:35 am

we could do with the likes of jim mansfield down in cork, there are no major concert venues down here. There is a lot of talk (the last 5 years) but no action as of yet!! I know he hasnt done everything by the book but neither have a lot of other developers.

Architecturally his proposed convention centre would have blended in with the existing hotel and leisure complex on the site, No building looks well during the construction stage, all steelwork is ugly but you have to make sure the building will not fall down
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby Peter Fitz » Tue May 30, 2006 11:14 am

architecturally his convention centre would have been embarrassing, cow shed with tacked on mock georgian front. wow.
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby GregF » Tue May 30, 2006 11:25 am

Maybe they should have let him build it after all .....ahem!.......it is a much needed facility. That giant neo georgian pastiche cow shed could only be a giant neo georgian pastiche cow shed, so to blend in with the rest of the disneyland ensemble. Anything contemporary would just look odd. Besides most of the suits who attend these functions would probably think it lovely. Ah sure bless 'em all!
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby daveydoris » Wed May 31, 2006 11:29 am

Hi All,

I've just moved into the area ( Saggart) in question and am delighted with ABP's decision to block Mansfield's CC...BTW, there's a development of what looks like mixed retail\residential units that has gone up between CW Hotel and Carrigmore....does anyone know what the deal is here? Its been lying empty since I've moved to Saggart anyway ( Dec 05)

:confused:
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby GrahamH » Wed May 31, 2006 10:01 pm

A picture in the paper this morning :eek:

Image


Heheh - went looking for one on the internet, and found this :D

http://images.google.ie/images?hl=en&q=conference%20centre%20citywest&sa=N&tab=wi
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby Peter Fitz » Thu Jun 01, 2006 12:38 pm

wow, the oppulence ... I take it all back ! ...

NOT. :D
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby jdivision » Thu Jun 01, 2006 4:33 pm

Anybody see the crap about it in The Freeman section of the Indo business section today?
[quote]
PROPERTY developer and entrepreneur Jim Mansfield is inclined to play ducks and drakes with the planning laws, but few can deny that his facility at Citywest is first class. So he has every right to feel aggrieved that An Bord Pleanala has blocked his expansion plans, for the very flimsiest of reasons.

Mansfield's vision for Citywest was ahead of its time. He correctly foresaw that there was demand for a hotel and golf facility that served the big industrial base around the Naas Road and the M50, positioned five minutes from Newlands Cross.

Before he built his conference centre, Dublin was ill-served with such facilities. The RDS has upped its game since Mansfield came along, but it's in an area where traffic access is now a daily nightmare.

Harry Crosbie's Point Theatre has never caught on as a venue for commercial events and there are traffic problems there, too.

Since 2003, Mansfield has been endeavouring to construct Citywest 2, which would add 6,000 capacity to the 4,000 already there. The expansion was enthusiastically endorsed by both officials of South Dublin County Council and the councillors.

However, An Bord Pleanala has ignored this expression of local democracy and refused permission to make the Citywest centre any bigger. The board decided that a centre like Citywest should have "full access to supporting recreational, accommodation and cultural facilities".

However, Fianna Fail Ard Fheis delegates want a bed, a drink and a meal. Citywest has all those. They don't want to visit an art gallery anyway.

The board also decreed that such a major facility "should be located in a core commercial area, such as city centre or major town centre, in order to avail of a range of public transport options".

Because the proposed convention centre would be "reliant primarily on private transport", it would contravene the policies set out in the regional planning guidelines to reduce the growth in demand for transport.

Again, this is a load of tosh. The issue of public transport doesn't concern organisers of events in Citywest. They recognise that people who want to attend a property exhibition don't mind hopping in their cars to get there.

Harry Crosbie objected to Citywest's expansion - yet more than a decade after the Point opened, the venue still isn't served by a regular Dublin Bus service.

In any event, the State has recently invested hundreds of millions in both the M50 and widening the N7. Citywest's location on the city fringe is much better suited to traffic modalities than the national convention centre that has been earmarked for Spencer Dock.

Mansfield knows that the Spencer Dock centre is coming down the tracks. Yet he was willing to risk his capital to take it on. It's a shame that his enterprise has been stymied by ivory tower inhabitants. [\QUOTE]
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby PVC King » Thu Jun 01, 2006 8:46 pm

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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby jdivision » Fri Jun 02, 2006 11:32 am

Thomond Park wrote:http://www.multimap.com/map/browse.cgi?client=public&X=-717500&Y=7002500&width=500&height=300&gride=&gridn=&srec=0&coordsys=mercator&db=&addr1=&addr2=&addr3=&pc=&advanced=&local=&localinfosel=&kw=&inmap=&table=&ovtype=&keepicon=&zm=0&scale=10000&down.x=189&down.y=7

Hmm Garter Lane hardly representative of World class access

I wonder exactly how much of that article Freeman wrote himself unless Freeman also moonlights for a PR agency

I think it's a pseudonym an I'm pretty sure I know who wrote it. I suspect it's the same person to whom Mansfield leaks a lot of his stories
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby StephenC » Fri Jun 02, 2006 1:57 pm

It almost brings a tear to my eye...poor John...and poor cultureless Fianna Fail delegates.....
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby kite » Wed Sep 27, 2006 7:52 pm

Poor Mr.Mansfield back in the news again this evening.
RTE reports that his private jet was borrowed without his knowledge and hired to another who then flew to Belgium to pick up 10 million euro worth of heroin.
When you luck is out!!
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby ctesiphon » Thu Sep 28, 2006 12:47 am

Presumably thought he didn't need permission.
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby KerryBog2 » Fri Sep 29, 2006 7:02 pm

ctesiphon wrote:Presumably thought he didn't need permission.

LOL, but it is quite a scary event. Were it to have been a suicide bomber instead of a dope runner, we could have been looking at a smoking hole in Sellafield. That, 'cos of the increase in private plane and helicopter ownership, has been a security worry for a long time.
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby PVC King » Tue Apr 24, 2007 11:55 am

Citywest lodges fresh centre application
Tuesday, 24 April 2007 12:00
Citywest Hotel, owned by developer Jim Mansfield, has lodged a new planning application to build a 4,000-seat convention centre at the hotel in Saggart, Co Dublin.

The proposed centre became a source of controversy three years ago when a steel frame and part of the roof were built without full planning approval.

An Bord Pleanála has twice refused permission for the development, and Citywest has been granted leave to pursue a judicial review of the decisions.

AdvertisementBut in a statement, the company said this was a lengthy procedure and the hotel was eager to expand its events facilities as quickly as possible.

It said the new application followed changes to transport infrastructure in the area, including the widening of the N7 and confirmation of a Luas line extension to Saggart, partly funded by Citywest.

Mansfield Group chief executive Bernard O'Byrne said the new centre would generate around €50m a year for the economy.



Has the steel frame come down or is this retention mark 2?

Conference activity would generate €50m for the economy if sited at City West but probably €75m - €100m at Spencer Dock; a retail impact assessment on the Dublin conference market should be submitted.
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby Peter Fitz » Tue Apr 24, 2007 12:14 pm

ah ye beat me to it :D

steel frame is gone as far as i know. It seems his proposed shed will accommodate 4k, whereas the national at spencer dock can cater for just 2500 in the main auditorium (but 8k in the building overall) ... perhaps the competition will be healthy. Reckon his chances are better this time with luas, improved N7 etc.
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby PVC King » Tue Apr 24, 2007 12:27 pm

Can't see it; a one hour plus Luas Journey through the industrial metropolis of Dublin 10 and Dublin 12 just doesn't constitute good transport links. Is the 65B quicker?

Sheds beside protected astructures rarely clear the bord
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby Peter Fitz » Tue Apr 24, 2007 12:38 pm

Is the 65B quicker?


Outside rush hour(s), absolutely !

not normally that cynical but with mansfield stumping up a good amount of the cost for luas extension, i wonder. He can already accommodate 3k in the hotel, not sure if the return on investment will be worth it when set against the ncc & its city centre location, prestige, spec etc.
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby PVC King » Tue Apr 24, 2007 1:08 pm

Thats the worry and what happens next?

Point depot type events in an area that does not have the capacity to accomodate concerts.

This is what many suspect he has been after for a long time.

The Luas will work once it serves City West Business Park and Saggart and the sporadic nature of his complex would have little impact on its ongoing revenue streams but would have the capacity to create chaos at particular times.

The more I think about it the Bord got it right in 2000 granting permission for Specncer Dock to be the National Conference Centre.
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby Peter Fitz » Wed Jul 23, 2008 8:46 am

So it looks as if the saga has come to an end ...

[quote="The Irish Times"]
Mansfield's Dublin convention centre gets the go-ahead

AN BORD Pleanála ended a four-year planning battle yesterday by giving permission to developer Jim Mansfield to go ahead with his controversial €]

Can't wait :rolleyes:

Image


Image


Ok so its not the issue it once was with the NCC & Point mid way through construction but its disappointing to see practically no
mention or direction from ABP on the intended architectural profile of this thing.
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby StephenC » Wed Jul 23, 2008 9:31 am

Fianna Fail love it...thats all that matters.
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby kefu » Wed Jul 23, 2008 10:23 am

And don't forget the "exceptional circumstances" as I'm sure the Citywest Hotel is probably struggling in today's uncertain times.
An Bord Pleanala have in the space of one short week turned themselves into a joke.
We're now back at a stage where developers will just go ahead and start building and then hope for planning permission later on in the process, citing the possibility that they'll go bust.
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby wearnicehats » Wed Jul 23, 2008 10:36 am

second high profile scheme in a week to overturn the inspector's report. Makes you wonder why the inspectors bother
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby GregF » Fri Jul 25, 2008 9:37 am

Gas, for al the foot dragging by the government about conference centres years ago, we are now getting them all over the place! There must be a recession on!
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Re: Citywest : Mansfield's giant heap of crap

Postby kefu » Fri Jul 25, 2008 11:00 am

The ironic thing is that it will probably be the Mansfield one that does better business.
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