Lansdowne Road Stadium

[jimg]

GregF, I guess it's a matter of priorities. I couldn't care less if foreigners "scoff" or go ooh-ah. I couldn't care less whether it's a good place for office christmas parties. I have no particular sentimental attachement to the place either; the east stand (my favourite bit) is relatively new. I just want to be able to get tickets to watch international rugby matches.

The single biggest and most obvious flaw with the Lansdowne FOR IRISH RUGBY SUPPORTERS is simply not being addressed by this re-development.

Also, I think you're sadly mistake with the hope that they'll be able to sneak an extra 20k seats into the place. The planning system doesn't work that way.

[aj]

[quote="Thomond Park"]The general area has flooded twice in the last 20 years once in 1985 and the last time in 2002]

here is and idea sink it 20-30 feet.. sure if it floods we can rename it the new National Aquatic Centre, maybe this one wont leak so much

[PVC King]

But would that be deep enough for International dive competitions?

[GregF]

[quote="jimg"]GregF, I guess it's a matter of priorities. I couldn't care less if foreigners "scoff" or go ooh-ah. I couldn't care less whether it's a good place for office christmas parties. I have no particular sentimental attachement to the place either]

Your entitled to your opinion, but its worth listening to other peoples opinions now and again and it isn't a bad thing to consider johnny foreigner s opinion of our housekeeping here on the Emerald Isle now and again. There's always room for improvement and raising the bar setting higher standards whether in life, sport etc....

I'm sure the new Lansdowne Road will more than cater for the need of the REAL IRISH RUGBY SUPPORTERS too.

[Paul Clerkin]

or at least the CONTINUITY IRISH RUGBY SUPPORTERS

[GregF]

ha ha,.......na, they disbanded after the last 6 nations disaster.

[PVC King]

Or were they not banished to their clubhouses after the clubs starting selling the tickets as corporate packages for 500 quid a pop

[Rory W]

If you want tickets join a club (one of the ones that doesn't sell them to a corporate) and you'll get tickets most of the time - if not go to some of the pubs and ask does anyone have a spare ticket. Anyone (genuine fan) with a spare will usually sell it face value. I've got tickets like that on plenty of occasions and never payed over face for them.

But can you imagine Ireland V Scotland, Wales and Italy in the 6 nations in Croke park - the place will look half deserted - I think 50K is an OK size for Lansdowne

[burge_eye]

[quote="jimg"]Building out-of-town stadia went out in the eighties. It's a terrible idea as the pre/post match atmosphere is generally dire. Many people drive so cannot drink and just disappear after the game]

There's decent arguments on both sides for the "out of town" debate. There's no doubt that having a stadium in the city itself is an ideal scenario - cardiff itself is a bit of a kip but the fact that the stadium is right slap bang in the centre makes up for it. The key with Cardiff, however, is that they went the whole hog - an absolutely cracking stadium with a huge capacity. Murrayfield is also a great ground and you can still walk to it from town. Twickenham is a pain in the arse to get too but the stadium makes up for it. I went to the World Cup semi-final in Sydney and that ground is amazing but it's a 3 day camel ride to get there.

In Belfast they are talking about building a new 30,000 seater stadium as part of the regeneration of the Maze prison. I think that's just too far away but the idea of using a stadium for regeneration isn't a bad one per se - take the Telstra Dome in Melbourne. They have, however, undertaken to play at one Ireland international there which would be great news for the north.

I think the point I'm trying to make is that there are 2 choices and if it's going to work it has to be all duck or no dinner. You either build a state of the art stadium with a minimum 65,000 capacity in town or outside town with decent transport links. A half-arsed redevelopment of Lansdowne will benefit neither the ardent rugby fan (who still won't be able to get tickets) not the city itself. In its current form it's a big silver elephant.

[dodger]

exactly, at least when the GAA swapped their crumbling patchwork of a stadium for new shiny plastic seats at a cost of several hundred million they also actually added 20,000 to the capacity.

I've said it before - this stadium is so constrained by its location and perceived threats posed by residents to be very unambitious.

Finally when you spend 300- 400 million on a astadium and don't increase capacity it can only mean one thing - higher ticket prices.

[GregF]

Heres a good link to check out folks.....http://www.worldstadiums.com

Check out the stadia in Ireland and the UK. Note the capacity of each stadium too.
Currently Croke Park is the largest by holding more people out of all the stadia in Ireland and the UK.
Sadly, the new Wembley will take the honour when it opens next year.

[PVC King]

Sadly, the new Wembley will take the honour when it opens next year.

Does the fact that a stadium is the biggest in this part of Europe really important?

Whilst Croke park has an impressive capacity is it not a combination of the design and the unique games that it showcases not its strongest selling points. The all time World Cup attendance record is held by a Stadium in Montevideo from a final in the 1930's when over 140,000 people crammed into a stadium which would today have a seated capacity of 50-60,000; scale is hardly everything me thinks.

It is a sad reality that the IRFU and fai are forced to build an inferior venue; but in my opinion an inferior venue in a Central location is vastly superior to a second Croke Park outside the M50 to my mind. Croke Park is almost unique in that one gets the Edge City Stadium and the inner City location to provide atmosphere for the City as well as attendees.

Landsdowne is the correct call and I really hope that the planners will be in a position to grant permission without too many modifications.

[GregF]

[quote="Thomond Park"]Does the fact that a stadium is the biggest in this part of Europe really important?
QUOTE]

Well ermmm, I was only stating a fact.......and sure why not that it is?

Does the fact that we don't have a decent national stadium really important?

[SeamusOG]

The all time World Cup attendance record is held by a Stadium in Montevideo from a final in the 1930's when over 140,000 people crammed into a stadium which would today have a seated capacity of 50-60,000]
[Pedantry]To my knowledge, the largest attendance at a world cup finals match was at the deciding match of the 1950 world cup between Uruguay and Brazil. This was at the Maracanã stadium in Rio. It had been built for the world cup - 10,000 people were involved in its construction! When finished, the capacity was 43,000 higher than that of the previous record holder, Glasgow's Hampden Park. The official attendance at the final was 174,000 although some sources put the real attendance at up to about 220,000.[/pedantry]

Landsdowne is the correct call and I really hope that the planners will be in a position to grant permission without too many modifications.

I agree. It is a pity that they couldn't have turned the pitch around and made the capacity a bit bigger, but the two clubs have a lease on the back pitch which they were unwilling to give up. There was also a report done several years ago which concluded that the only circumstances in which the Irish soccer team would need an 80,000 capacity ground would be for a competitive qualifying match against England. Whether this is still true, and what the situation is with demand for big rugby matches, I do not know. The ratio of corporate seats to total capacity is also comparable to that of the new Wembley (about 19,000 out of 90,000)

The north stand would also seem like a suitable place to dedicate for away fans for a big soccer international against any of our neighbours.

[PVC King]

[Pedantry]

Discussing facts gleaned from the back of a beer mat can never be considered pedantic

I totally agree on the lost opportunity of turning the pitch 90 degrees as the gain of a significant potential set aside on the northern side could I thought have been used as a buffer zone to protect both the height of the overall design and the houses on Havelock Square.

[Maskhadov]

Personally I think its a great design even if some people refer to the north end as a bus shelter. It will defintely soak away all the atmosphere but its better than nothing I suppose.

There are lots of plus points if you can forget about the bus shelter. Its a orginal design which matches this nation in that we are european but different to the rest of the bland continental stadia. Thank god its not like the sometimes darn ugly anglo saxon stadia.

Its great that we put it smack bang in the middle of the city. It will be a wise decision in future years. The north's stadium plans in the Maze are nothing short of a diaster. There will be absolutely no atmosphere whatsoever.

[t.scott]

i think the design is great and 50,000 is a good number of people to have in a ground. if all goes well this will translate really well into reality. i doubt if the envelope will be pushed by attemting to ammend the application if it appears likely to pass by increasing capacity to 60 or 75g. i'll be grateful to see irish soccer and rugby get a great home and the continued use of the oldest rugby ground in the world assured (apparently anyway) so if it takes until 2009 so be it...lets just hope it gets built!!!

[Maskhadov]

hypotetically.. say the IRFU bought all those house that are complaining about the sunlight not getting in , could they extend the stadium around to cover all four sides ?

[Devin]

Nice design...as the poll says wrll make a good counterpoint to the angular Croke Pk.

[GregF]

True, it will make a superb contrast to Croker. 2 great stadia in the city centre.

[jppcollins]

Maybe not as good as Munich's Allianz Arena but still lightyears ahead of any other stadium ever built in this country.

[PVC King]

Personally I prefer Croker

[PVC King]

Developers insist plans for Lansdowne still on target
Archiseek / Ireland / News / 2006 / June 8
The Irish Times

The €365 million redevelopment of Lansdowne Road as a 50,000 seat stadium is still "completely on schedule", with construction expected to start early next year, the chairman of the company behind the initiative has claimed. Despite the fact that Dublin City Council planners earlier this year requested detailed information on 43 points relating to the proposed development, Philip Browne of the Lansdowne Road Stadium Development Company claimed the request was "very much the norm" for a project of its size. Mr Browne was speaking after it was confirmed that the development company had lodged its response to the additional information sought by the council.

F.I. seems to be the norm in all projects these days regardless of size; which is not a bad thing

[d_d_dallas]

Yes,
however given that this will more than likely go to AnBP the whole point of the FI will diminish and serve to lengthen the planning process as ultimately the Board will make their own call/revisions.

[publicrealm]

[quote="Thomond Park"]F.I. seems to be the norm in all projects these days regardless of size]


It is absolutely the norm and it would have been extraordinary if a request for further information had not issued in such a complex project. What I find depressing is the tabloidisation of the Irish Times: "Developers insist plans for Lansdowne still on target " is a pejorative headline. The reality is that, if anything, the project is ahead of schedule - with a complex RFI responded to very rapidly. Yet the headline suggests the opposite - 'yet another public infrastructure fiasco - despite what the developers say'. (But we in the IT know better). They don't even know the basics of planning.

Bring back Douglas Gageby and Kevin Myers!